hiruzen is not the strongest hokage... proof

[Unbiased]

Oh really? It'd be nice if you can post the pages which state Kabuto has full knowledge on all his summon's abilities.



I never said he got killed by a Rasengan. I said he failed to dodge/overcome that jutsu.



Zabuza only used his hidden mist jutsu. His fighting style is based around this one jutsu and silent killing. You're suggesting that instead of having an Edo Itachi spam Susano'o, he'd make him use bunshin feints and finger genjutsu all day long.

1-I never said he got killed by a rasengan either xd but the third's fighting style was nintaijutsu where he utilized ninjutsu within his taijutsu fighting style. The 3rd Raikage would of had to use long range ninjutsu (which until stated otherwise he doesn't have) in order to beat Sage Mode Naruto.

2-I'm not suggesting anything that kabuto would do. I'm not Kishimoto so don't ask me what kishimoto would do. Needless to say I'm only proving that they retain their unique fighting style. 3RD raikage is also another prime example, along with Pakura and that magnet user that can attract anyone who touches his shurrikens.

 

[TrollingSage]

Bold part, not at all. The life and death was directed to Hiruzen, when it stated that the deciding factor was his age. It clearly implies that, they would've traded places if this happened 10 years before

Well seeing as oro was impossibly hard to kill, maybe young hurizen would have a tbb to finish him off. And then seal the kages with a youthier seal which doesnt kill him?
In any case that incident doesnt reflect the real shodai and nidaime battle outcomes accurately i do believe!

 

[Unbiased]

Well seeing as oro was impossibly hard to kill, maybe young hurizen would have a tbb to finish him off. And then seal the kages with a youthier seal which doesnt kill him?
In any case that incident doesnt reflect the real shodai and nidaime battle outcomes accurately i do believe!

May I ask your logic on how it doesn't reflect the real ones? Just curious. I haven't really been paying attention to your debate but focusing on my own.

 

[OnPoint]

1-I never said he got killed by a rasengan either xd but the third's fighting style was nintaijutsu where he utilized ninjutsu within his taijutsu fighting style. The 3rd Raikage would of had to use long range ninjutsu (which until stated otherwise he doesn't have) in order to beat Sage Mode Naruto.

2-I'm not suggesting anything that kabuto would do. I'm not Kishimoto so don't ask me what kishimoto would do. Needless to say I'm only proving that they retain their unique fighting style. 3RD raikage is also another prime example, along with Pakura and that magnet user that can attract anyone who touches his shurrikens.

You mean, this type of long ranged Ninjutsu? [

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].

You can continue believing that the Hashirama Orochimaru was controlling was the same one which managed to defeat EMS Madara & the Kyūbi. The same one who supposedly makes the current Gokage's power look like 'nothing' when a comparison is made. It's clear to me that a suppressed summon will never be as effective as the original. Give them free will and they're an upgrade. Take it away and you've got yourself a problem.

 

[Urda]

SMH. Blaze and Owaji should both know that Hurizen wasn't called the strongest Hokage. After all those scans, I remember all by memory and to well. Shame. SMH

It is fact that Hurizen is called God of Shinobi. It is also fact Hurizen was called strong. However, many interpreted it wrong.

1. .... said to possessed superalive strength, even compared to the other Hokage. -Iruka

2. ... We took on the Hokage fully knowing his reputation as the strongest leader of the five principal territories. - Kabuto

- The mistranslation occur in "unpaid" Manga, but corrected in Viz. Translation. If you contiue on to read, you would understand the what many call hype as today.

3. ...simple because he is named Hokage (Qouted something along those lines). - Kabuto

 

[NinjaTendo 64]

Well i guess this explains why he wanted to know every jutsu in the world.

Good work bro plus rep

 

[Unbiased]

You mean, this type of long ranged Ninjutsu? [

You must be registered for see links

].

You can continue believing that the Hashirama Orochimaru was controlling was the same one which managed to defeat EMS Madara & the Kyūbi. The same one who supposedly makes the current Gokage's power look like 'nothing' when a comparison is made. It's clear to me that a suppressed summon will never be as effective as the original. Give them free will and they're an upgrade. Take it away and you've got yourself a problem.

1-Forgot about that. Regardless Sage Mode can sense danger better and faster so it really wouldn't of made much of a difference besides taking away his ability to be harmed.

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2-No proof whatsoever your just ignoring the manga and making up stuff.

 

[Blaze Release]

Well seeing as oro was impossibly hard to kill, maybe young hurizen would have a tbb to finish him off. And then seal the kages with a youthier seal which doesnt kill him?
In any case that incident doesnt reflect the real shodai and nidaime battle outcomes accurately i do believe!

I shouldv'e taken a hint from your name. Again it directs to hiruzen.
Orochimaru can be killed, true we do not know what abilities Hiruzen has, however the person who does is kishi and he claims the outcome would've been different.

Since you are trolling abit, i might return the favour. You say he would seal the kage's with a youtheir seal. Nah, he was able to lay explosive tags on them. What is stopping him laying sealing tags on them instead .

Any case i agree with your last sentence. The battle didn't reflect their true potential but at the same time that can be said about Hiruzen. But Hiruzen was still at the disadvantage

• Edo tensei grants infinite chakra. Fact
  
• The hokage brother's were brought back in the youth, most likely their time of death. FACT
  
• It was a 3 vs 1 scenario. Fact
  
• Hiruzen's reserves along with his strength was said to have diminished due to old age. Fact
  
• He was past his prime. Fact
  
• He was facing 3 kage level ninja's. Fact

 

[Owarij]

1. .... said to possessed superalive strength, even compared to the other Kage. -Iruka

2. ... We took on the Hokage fully knowing his reputation as the strongest leader of the five principal territories. - Kabuto

I don't see your point.. I'm fully aware of the viz and normal lines for these scans...... 1) Still says he had greater strength than the hokage

2) still says he was the strongest kage

 

[Unbiased]

SMH. Blaze and Owaji should both know that Hurizen wasn't called the strongest Hokage. After all those scans, I remember all by memory and to well. Shame. SMH

It is fact that Hurizen is called God of Shinobi. It is also fact Hurizen was called strong. However, many interpreted it wrong.

1. .... said to possessed superalive strength, even compared to the other Hokage. -Iruka

2. ... We took on the Hokage fully knowing his reputation as the strongest leader of the five principal territories. - Kabuto

- The mistranslation occur in "unpaid" Manga, but corrected in Viz. Translation. If you contiue on to read, you would understand the what many call hype as today.

3. ...simple because he is named Hokage (Qouted something along those lines). - Kabuto

Do you have any scans of those?

 

[zesto]

he's a fodder and i hate him. end thread

 

[The Alchemist]

Kabuto did that to psyche out the shinob who knew the dead.

 

[Urda]

I don't see your point.. I'm fully aware of the viz and normal lines for these scans...... 1) Still says he had greater strength than the hokage

2) still says he was the strongest kage

I edited it. Not really good at debates. >_>

1. "Compared".

2. Only because he is/was named Hokage.

I can't post links to support my claims. So yeah.... Useless. >_>

 

[OnPoint]

1-Forgot about that. Regardless Sage Mode can sense danger better and faster so it really wouldn't of made much of a difference besides taking away his ability to be harmed.

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2-No proof whatsoever your just ignoring the manga and making up stuff.

As if the manga has outright claimed that all Edos are at maximum potential even if they're being controlled. That's something you've concluded on your own. I don't know how but that's what you seem to think. Your mind is part of your power. If that's wiped, and instead replaced by someone who has possibly never even seen you fight, I guess, for you, you're still at your maximum potential. I wonder how much weaker someone like Kakashi would be in the hands of Kabuto, with his intelligence removed and all.

Hiruzen 'God of Shinobi'. So powerful they needed to give him Rikudō Sennin's nickname. 'Strongest Hokage'. Believable. Hashirama, weaker than Hiruzen. Unbelievable. The man was 'weaker' yet the people chose to disregard his strength as a fairytale? They had no trouble accepting Hiruzen's 'God of Shinobi' might as true? People would believe that Usain Bolt can run 100m in 9.58s but wouldn't believe that a man 100 years earlier ran it in 11.00s? Crickey. That's some flawless logic for you right there.

 

[Urda]

Do you have any scans of those?

Naruto Chapter 140 Page 3. Can you post for me?

 

[TrollingSage]

Oh hey I went on the internet and found this

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[Unbiased]

As if the manga has outright claimed that all Edos are at maximum potential even if they're being controlled. That's something you've concluded on your own. I don't know how but that's what you seem to think. Your mind is part of your power. If that's wiped, and instead replaced by someone who has possibly never even seen you fight, I guess, for you, you're still at your maximum potential. I wonder how much weaker someone like Kakashi would be in the hands of Kabuto, with his intelligence removed and all.

Hiruzen 'God of Shinobi'. So powerful they needed to give him Rikudō Sennin's nickname. 'Strongest Hokage'. Believable. Hashirama, weaker than Hiruzen. Unbelievable. The man was 'weaker' yet the people chose to disregard his strength as a fairytale? They had no trouble accepting Hiruzen's 'God of Shinobi' might as true? People would believe that Usain Bolt can run 100m in 9.58s but wouldn't believe that a man 100 years earlier ran it in 11.00s? Crickey. That's some flawless logic for you right there.

1-They can use all their original jutsu. It has also been shown that whether or not they are under full control they can utilize all their original jutsu's. They have unlimited chakra. They are beyond their maximum potential as they have unlimited chakra, are immortal, and can use all their jutsus. Point and case.

2-Your stating that sharing the same nick name of The Sage of Six Paths who is a fairy tale is downplayed by being called a fairytale? Nice logic there.

 

[Unbiased]

Naruto Chapter 140 Page 3. Can you post for me?

Sure by all means. Although I don't think narutobase uses viz translations..I'll ask Ira.

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Oh hey I went on the internet and found this

You must be registered for see images

I'm not really sure what that has to do with anything. If anything it just downplays the hokage's. Hiruzen in his prime was known as the God of Shinobi and the professor for being able to use all 5 elemental releases. In his prime he was considered the strongest hokage as well.

 

[SasukeCurse]

Sasuke>oro>Hiruzen, Sasuke Solos Hiruzen nuff said so much for the hype on the "god of shinobi" And if Hiruzen was so good why did Minato have to stop the Ninetails and not Mr Hiruzen him self?

 

[OnPoint]

1-They can use all their original jutsu. It has also been shown that whether or not they are under full control they can utilize all their original jutsu's. Point and case.

That means you believe Minato's bodyguards can use Hiraishin as effectively as the 4th. That means you believe everyone's use of Kage Bunshin is the same, no-one can use the technique more effectively than others. For you, giving Konohamaru Mokuton would mean that he could immediately rival Hashirama in a fight of Wood Release.

2-Your stating that sharing the same nick name of The Sage of Six Paths who is a fairy tale is downplayed by being called a fairytale? Nice logic there.

I don't think you understood a word I said. I wrote for you, in words, what you believe when you say Hiruzen is the strongest Hokage lol.