[Discussion] What is a Swordsman in One Piece?

[Punk Hazard]

So if that thing is now called a sword then it means it is a sword now.

That's not what happened. The THING didn't go from being called a pole-arm to being called a sword. The pole-arm is still a pole-arm. An alternate word for that thing eventually started being used to refer to a SEPARATE thing from the original. The term glaive originally referred to pole-arms, and then it also started being used to refer to swords. That doesn't make pole-arms and swords the same thing(though they are weapons that are considered both, which the Bisento doesn't appear to be).

I don't see a problem here. Glaive originally originated from various names of sword and finally people have again put it into the same category from which it originated.

An English word being derived from a foreign word doesn't mean that the English and foreign word refer to the same thing. The word "Avocado" comes from a word in Aztec that means testicle; are avocados and testicles the same thing? The word quarantine comes from a French word that means 40; are they the same thing?

Another thing is that there is no record of bisento used in history. It's closed cousins Nagamaki is also consider as sword and Naginata in 10th- 12th century was also called Long Sword. Later it's definition changed.
Note: Both Nagamaki and Naginata are pole weapons used in Japan and was consider as sword even before people used Glaive.

They aren't the same weapon though. This started because you C/Ped a description that said a bisento LOOKED LIKE a glaive, not that it was considered a glaive, which I pointed out.

 

[Dannie]

WTF how can you have so much patience! When someone denies Shanks has shown nothing to prove he's > WSS as manga stated he shall remain a swordsman henceforth weaker than Mihawk. That's common sense, whew DO NOT REPLY TO HIM! THE THREAD IS FINISHED, IT'S PURE DENIAL AT THIS POINT.

Well at least he is actually making good arguments unlike you. And no, I am not shitting on Mihawk. I am just trying to understand the logic from both of you.

Okay, so the main argument is that since Shanks has not shown anything to put him above Mihawk, while Mihawk is WSS, that automatically places him above Shanks, but I am trying to understand how you can come to this conclusion when even Mihawk has not SHOWN anything featwise either to put him above Shanks, and not even knowing WHEN he became WSS after their duels, that you can wholeheartedly stick to this so easily.

You are sticking to the one thing that you are getting on me about, which is neither of them showing anything above the other, and not even knowing the timeline of when he received said title to become the WSS, which would put him above Shanks.

You are missing a lot of variables here while trying to act as if it is really obvious. I am pretty sure that most people would agree that Kaido is the strongest man or beast in OP. Why? Well because Oda outright stated that this man is the most powerful beast in OP.

People questioning the WSS title not because to discredit Mihawk, but because it is outdated and we don't even know when he obtained it, while at the same time have seen how ferocious the Yonko are that would make it really dumb to just place Mikawk above one of these 4 emperors when we don't even know the last time he fought against Shanks or when he became WSS.

This is probably gonna be last reply to Dannie lmfao

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[HashiraMadara]

Well at least he is actually making good arguments unlike you.

And I command him for going to such lengths to prove a ridiculously plain fact. If the Manga owner says you (A) are a swordsman, then B is a swordsman and you are the strongest swordsman. By default you A > B until B proves he is no swordsman or beats you. I won't dig manga for "good points" to show such a simple shiet!

 

[Skull Knight]

...

So u are basically saying Glaive should be used as Spear since 14th century Englishmen used to say so but we shouldn't acknowledge it as sword since it is more like an alternate word which people later started to refer as sword.
I gave you Naginata example and you understand nothing. Naginata itself was considered as Long Sword before it's description was changed to Pole arm. If we go by traditional definition then weapons like Naginata should be consider as Long Swords even though they are pole arms.

Now here are more evidence that Glaive was originally meant to be a sword not spear:

Old French

Alternative forms
-gladies (10th century)
-gleve
-gleyve
Etymology
Probably from an original *glede (from Latin gladius) with influence from Gaulish gladebo (“sword”). Both terms are ultimately from Proto-Celtic *kladiwos (“sword”). Alternatively, the d in *glede that had come to be pronounced as /ð/ in Old French may have been fronted to /v/ (perhaps with the additional influence of the aforementioned Gaulish term.)

Noun
glaive (oblique plural glaives, nominative singular glaives, nominative plural glaive)
-sword

circa 1170, Wace, Le Roman de Rou:
Son glaive i a li Dus lessié
The Duke left his sword there.
French refered Glaive as sword not in last century but for a long period of time as it was given in the previous link.

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Poets used Glaive as sword in 15th century.

Even English meaning of Glaive is now a)Spear b)Sword. They adopted the real meaning of the word late not Frenchmen who were using it for a long period of time.
Etymology
Borrowed from Old French glaive, from Latin gladius (“sword”).

Pronunciation
enPR: glāv, IPA(key): /ɡleɪv/
Rhymes: -eɪv
Noun
glaive (plural glaives)

1)A weapon formerly used, consisting of a large blade fixed on the end of a pole, whose edge was on the outside curve.

2)A light lance with a long sharp-pointed head.

3)(poetically or loosely) A sword.

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[Punk Hazard]

So u are basically saying Glaive should be used as Spear since 14th century Englishmen used to say so but we shouldn't acknowledge it as sword since it is more like an alternate word which people later started to refer as sword.
I gave you Naginata example and you understand nothing. Naginata itself was considered as Long Sword before it's description was changed to Pole arm. If we go by traditional definition then weapons like Naginata should be consider as Long Swords even though they are pole arms.

That is not what I'm saying. I made a point of this in my very first reply: What is classified as a "sword" has changed throughout history during time period and geographical location. So saying "A long time ago they called a bisento a glaive" or whatever isn't a good argument. I point this out by showing that "Glaive" has been used to refer to pole-arms as things that aren't swords, and things that are swords; the way glaive had changed is an example.

I also made it a point to say that we SHOULD use modern definitions...and by modern definition, a bisento wouldn't be considered a sword. That's why the example you brought up said it RESEMBLES a glaive, and isn't actually a glaive.

Now here are more evidence that Glaive was originally meant to be a sword not spear:

Old French

Alternative forms
-gladies (10th century)
-gleve
-gleyve
Etymology
Probably from an original *glede (from Latin gladius) with influence from Gaulish gladebo (“sword”). Both terms are ultimately from Proto-Celtic *kladiwos (“sword”). Alternatively, the d in *glede that had come to be pronounced as /ð/ in Old French may have been fronted to /v/ (perhaps with the additional influence of the aforementioned Gaulish term.)

Noun
glaive (oblique plural glaives, nominative singular glaives, nominative plural glaive)
-sword

circa 1170, Wace, Le Roman de Rou:
Son glaive i a li Dus lessié
The Duke left his sword there.
French refered Glaive as sword not in last century but for a long period of time as it was given in the previous link.

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Poets used Glaive as sword in 15th century.

Even English meaning of Glaive is now a)Spear b)Sword. They adopted the real meaning of the word late not Frenchmen who were using it for a long period of time.
Etymology
Borrowed from Old French glaive, from Latin gladius (“sword”).

Pronunciation
enPR: glāv, IPA(key): /ɡleɪv/
Rhymes: -eɪv
Noun
glaive (plural glaives)

1)A weapon formerly used, consisting of a large blade fixed on the end of a pole, whose edge was on the outside curve.

2)A light lance with a long sharp-pointed head.

3)(poetically or loosely) A sword.

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[/QUOTE]
None of these things actually contradict what I said. In fact, it shows you haven't been paying attention. The word "glaive" was derived from a French word meaning "sword." That doesn't mean the glaive was in reference to a sword. Just as I pointed out that the English took the Aztec word for "testicle" and created the English word for "avocado," you can take a term for one object in another language, and create from it a term for an entirely different object in your own language. This is done ALL the time. The word "clue" came from a word that meant "a ball of string." I even pointed this out to you when I mentioned that the French word for "40" is where the word "quarantine" comes from.

The sources you pulled from noted that the word "glaive" was created to refer to spears a century before the word was changed to refer to swords. Your last definition even shows this by displaying that "glaive" refers to BOTH a pole-arm and a sword. It originally meant ONE thing(spear), and a hundred years later, people started using it to refer to a SECOND thing(sword). That doesn't mean those two things are the same thing.

Once again, just to make it perfectly clear: English people saw the French word for "sword" and thought "That's pretty cool" and made up their own word. They then applied this word to SPEARS. Later on, they decided to also apply it to SWORDS. A spear and a sword still aren't exclusively the same thing.

Okay, so the main argument is that since Shanks has not shown anything to put him above Mihawk, while Mihawk is WSS, that automatically places him above Shanks, but I am trying to understand how you can come to this conclusion when even Mihawk has not SHOWN anything featwise either to put him above Shanks

Mihawk achieving the title of WSS is the feat that puts him above Shanks.

and not even knowing WHEN he became WSS after their duels, that you can wholeheartedly stick to this so easily.

LMAOOO Dannie, this shit is sad man. I knew you were gonna find a way to avoid addressing it, but I'm not letting it slide: You YOURSELF noted that Mihawk and Shanks DON'T have to directly fight each other. The world can look at what Shanks can do, compare it to what Mihawk can do, and go "What Mihawk did was better." YOU said this yourself. Now you're ALSO banking on the argument that Mihawk's title doesn't hold up because they didn't fight.

Pick one and exactly one.

You are sticking to the one thing that you are getting on me about, which is neither of them showing anything above the other, and not even knowing the timeline of when he received said title to become the WSS, which would put him above Shanks.

It doesn't matter when who became what. The fact that Mihawk still holds the title of WSS shows that Shanks has never done anything to warrant switching the titles

You are missing a lot of variables here while trying to act as if it is really obvious. I am pretty sure that most people would agree that Kaido is the strongest man or beast in OP. Why? Well because Oda outright stated that this man is the most powerful beast in OP.

And yet Oda outright stating Mihawk is the most powerful swordsman is being doubted. Your argument looking like swiss cheese rn.

but because it is outdated

There is nothing in the manga that acts as a basis to support this statement. The manga has never protrayed the title as something that becomes outdated.

while at the same time have seen how ferocious the Yonko are

This is why I originally wanted not to reply again. You bring up points like these, and when they're refuted, like when I brought up that Mihawk showed more ferocity by creating slashes bigger than BM's and her waves, you slickly try to quote a different post and reply making the same argument that you were just unable to defend as though we were just not gonna notice.

 

[LBeezy]

And I command him for going to such lengths to prove a ridiculously plain fact. If the Manga owner says you (A) are a swordsman, then B is a swordsman and you are the strongest swordsman. By default you A > B until B proves he is no swordsman or beats you. I won't dig manga for "good points" to show such a simple shiet!

Manga scan where Oda specifically calls Shanks a "Swordsman" ?

 

[Dannie]

I have pretty much given up on the whole "Is Shanks a swordsman?" thing. While I do agree that Shanks has displayed some degree of swordsmanship, like with matching blows with WB's staff and defending off against Akainu's magma fist with just his sword, plain and simple, he is still a yonko.

>WB acquired the quake quake fruit and has tremendous power. He wasn't just an ordinary man with a staff. He had one of the most dangerous DF powers in the OPverse.

>BM can take people's life span, and put her soul into objects, not to mention she has inhuman durability and resistance. She is not just an ordinary woman. She's practically a monster

>Kaido has been hyped up to be the worlds strongest creature and was even hyped up by another devasting yonko, Big Mom, which adds more to this guy having some insane ability or DF power.

>Blackbeard has 2 of the most OP devil fruits in the OPverse, not to mention that this guy is special and can take devil fruits and acquire more than one for himself. Some people are even making theories that he might be a D.

What sense would it make for Shanks to be just a swordsman, or for Shanks to just implement his haki with his swordsmanship, when we have seen all these other yonko display feats and hype that a far more devastating, when Shanks have barely even lifted a finger or gotten serious? So Oda is just saving this man just to not show us anything that would put him on the same league as Big Mom or Kaido? Ridiculous.

Everytime I bring up Shanks matching blows with WB or him confronting Kaido, people dismiss it and act like this is not a big deal.
Everytime I bring up how Shanks appeared in MF and easily blocked Akainu's magma punch with just his sword, people dismiss it.
Everytime I bring up how Shanks just so happen to have appeared out of nowhere without anyone noticing(another theory) people dismiss it.

For some reason, people don't like the hype that Shanks receives, and trying to make his hype and feats seem lesser or equivalent to Mihawk throwing a couple of slashes on Vista and Jozu, commanders of a yonko, while this man have already clashed with two other yonko as if he was just having another day drinking saki.

The way you people think on here is unbelievable.

 

[-Akuma-]

Are people actually trying to argue that WB's polearm is a sword in order to prove the Mihawk's title is bullshit? The OP section is nearind NDS levels of bad.

 

[Skull Knight]

I have pretty much given up on the whole "Is Shanks a swordsman?" thing. While I do agree that Shanks has displayed some degree of swordsmanship, like with matching blows with WB's staff and defending off against Akainu's magma fist with just his sword, plain and simple, he is still a yonko.

>WB acquired the quake quake fruit and has tremendous power. He wasn't just an ordinary man with a staff. He had one of the most dangerous DF powers in the OPverse.

>BM can take people's life span, and put her soul into objects, not to mention she has inhuman durability and resistance. She is not just an ordinary woman. She's practically a monster

>Kaido has been hyped up to be the worlds strongest creature and was even hyped up by another devasting yonko, Big Mom, which adds more to this guy having some insane ability or DF power.

>Blackbeard has 2 of the most OP devil fruits in the OPverse, not to mention that this guy is special and can take devil fruits and acquire more than one for himself. Some people are even making theories that he might be a D.

What sense would it make for Shanks to be just a swordsman, or for Shanks to just implement his haki with his swordsmanship, when we have seen all these other yonko display feats and hype that a far more devastating, when Shanks have barely even lifted a finger or gotten serious? So Oda is just saving this man just to not show us anything that would put him on the same league as Big Mom or Kaido? Ridiculous.

Everytime I bring up Shanks matching blows with WB or him confronting Kaido, people dismiss it and act like this is not a big deal.
Everytime I bring up how Shanks appeared in MF and easily blocked Akainu's magma punch with just his sword, people dismiss it.
Everytime I bring up how Shanks just so happen to have appeared out of nowhere without anyone noticing(another theory) people dismiss it.

For some reason, people don't like the hype that Shanks receives, and trying to make his hype and feats seem lesser or equivalent to Mihawk throwing a couple of slashes on Vista and Jozu, commanders of a yonko, while this man have already clashed with two other yonko as if he was just having another day drinking saki.

The way you people think on here is unbelievable.

Mihawk's best feat pre TS was to cut the Ice mountain.
Shanks best feat was to cut the clouds. Heaven split attack was far more impressive than Cutting Ice Mountain thing.
Even Oda hyped Shanks at some interview that if Shanks was in FI he would have knocked all 100000fishmen(some even assumed Hody was included). That's the hype Shanks got with Haki. But people will even dismiss that. They already dismissed Yonkos Hype(4 most powerful Pirate Captain). Even though one has casually took down Capone with few punches whereas other one has destroyed Kid and his alliance.

Are people actually trying to argue that WB's polearm is a sword in order to prove the Mihawk's title is bullshit? The OP section is nearind NDS levels of bad.

Just check the wiki before sprouting non-sense.
A bisentō (眉尖刀 brow blade) was a pole weapon used in feudal Japan. The bisentō has various descriptions,
"a double-edged long sword with a thick truncated blade",
"a spear-like weapon with a blade at the end that resembles a scimitar",
"a polearm resembling a glaive, with a long, heavy haft and a heavy, curved blade".

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Description given in wiki indicates:
1)It is a sword
2)It is part sword part Spear
3) It's a spear or Sword

 

[HashiraMadara]

Manga scan where Oda specifically calls Shanks a "Swordsman" ?

I like how you use the word "specifically".

To counter this, show me a scan where Shanks abides or is about to abide into combat without involving his Sword.

Thanks in advance

 

[HashiraMadara]

Just check the wiki before sprouting non-sense.
A bisentō (眉尖刀 brow blade) was a pole weapon used in feudal Japan. The bisentō has various descriptions,
"a double-edged long sword with a thick truncated blade",
"a spear-like weapon with a blade at the end that resembles a scimitar",
"a polearm resembling a glaive, with a long, heavy haft and a heavy, curved blade".

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Description given in wiki indicates:
1)It is a sword
2)It is part sword part Spear
3) It's a spear or Sword

Despo level 9000.

 

[Skull Knight]

Despo level 9000.

Yeah right next time show scans which put WSS above Yonkos.

 

[HashiraMadara]

Yeah right next time show scans which put WSS above Yonkos.

Utter denial of stupid levels. Yonko captains MAY be > Mihawk but until Shanks disproves the notion set by Oda of Mihawk being WSS. Have fun crying in the corner with your Shanks fanboyism.

 

[Skull Knight]

Utter denial of stupid levels. Yonko captains MAY be > Mihawk but until Shanks disproves the notion set by Oda of Mihawk being WSS. Have fun crying in the corner with your Shanks fanboyism.

Shanks is one of the Yonko captains.
Stay in denial that Yonkos are 4 most powerful Pirate captains who reigns like Emperors.

 

[chopstickchakra]

You people claim a swordsman is more than just someone fighting with a sword it's a mentality in order to deflect from Kizaru or Aokiji entering the discussion because the significant majority feels either would beat Mihawk in a fight(despite losing at the swordplay part of the battle).

Yet, you claim Shanks is definitively a swordsman because he's used a sword in the limited instances we've seen him clash(never a full fledged fight I might add) despite him having not shown a swordsman mentality so you can use this title which others have noted can stick to a person longer than the skills that earned said title to "verify" Mihawk>Shanks. Shanks doesn't have the personality of the other swordsmen in OP so which is it, sword use or mentality?

Others have already acknowledged BM as a swordsman so if she is a swordsman then how can Mihawk be WSS unless you believe he'd beat her in a fight?

 

[Punk Hazard]

Manga scan where Oda specifically calls Shanks a "Swordsman" ?

Manga scans where Shanks engages in battle with anything that's not a sword?

I have pretty much given up on the whole "Is Shanks a swordsman?" thing.

We can tell. Not only are your arguments getting worse and worse, you're specifically avoiding quoting and replying to posts that have refuted old posts so you don't have to confront having holes in them pointed out and you're repeating them. Disappointed tbvh cause you usually debate better than this, but this thread you've been weak af.

While I do agree that Shanks has displayed some degree of swordsmanship, like with matching blows with WB's staff and defending off against Akainu's magma fist with just his sword, plain and simple, he is still a yonko.

I'm gonna love shitting on this argument below.

>WB acquired the quake quake fruit and has tremendous power. He wasn't just an ordinary man with a staff. He had one of the most dangerous DF powers in the OPverse.

>BM can take people's life span, and put her soul into objects, not to mention she has inhuman durability and resistance. She is not just an ordinary woman. She's practically a monster

>Kaido has been hyped up to be the worlds strongest creature and was even hyped up by another devasting yonko, Big Mom, which adds more to this guy having some insane ability or DF power.

>Blackbeard has 2 of the most OP devil fruits in the OPverse, not to mention that this guy is special and can take devil fruits and acquire more than one for himself. Some people are even making theories that he might be a D.

What sense would it make for Shanks to be just a swordsman, or for Shanks to just implement his haki with his swordsmanship, when we have seen all these other yonko display feats and hype that a far more devastating, when Shanks have barely even lifted a finger or gotten serious? So Oda is just saving this man just to not show us anything that would put him on the same league as Big Mom or Kaido? Ridiculous.

Because Shanks can match their feats with swordsmanship. You keep saying it's "just a sword," and yet swordsmen in One Piece are capable of doing crazy feats.

You mention Big Mom's homies. The two biggest feats Big Mom has done with her Homies are the wave she created and the Almighty Nation attack. The wave she created was dwarfed by either of the waves Whitebeard created with his Devil Fruit.

Using "JUST A SWORD", Mihawk created a slash on par with Aokiji's DF and Whitebeard's by slicing through not just one of those waves, but one of those waves while they were under the effects of Aokiji's Devil Fruit.

Using "just a sword," Mihawk casually put himself on par with Whitebeard and Big Mom, two of the Yonko.

Using "just a sword," Zoro cut through mountain level structures. With his sword and DF, Law cut through an entire actual mountain, and Mihawk's capabilities are even greater than that, even as a DF-enhanced swordplay.

Mihawk can CASUALLY do

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, and you wanna talk about using a sword as though it's weak? You're clearly reading a different manga or you're retarded as all hell.

Everytime I bring up Shanks matching blows with WB or him confronting Kaido, people dismiss it and act like this is not a big deal.

Here you go shooting yourself in the foot and looking like a fool again. Shanks matched blows with Whitebeard using, as you put it before, just a sword. Shanks did this[

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] using a sword, and you wanna say using a sword is weak.

This just highlights how god awful you are debating this topic. In one part of your post you say that Shanks is one of the Yonko, so him using just a sword doesn't fit with his title. And then in another post, you say "here's an example of what the power of the Yonko REALLY is," and in your example, it's Shanks using "just a sword."

So which one is it, Dannie-boy? Is using just a sword too simple for the title of Yonko, or is the feat Shanks did using just a sword an example of the power of the Yonko? You get to pick one, and only one. Either way, you'd be shitting on your argument.

Everytime I bring up how Shanks appeared in MF and easily blocked Akainu's magma punch with just his sword, people dismiss it.

Here you again. You even highlight the retardness yourself. You bring up Shanks blocking Akainu's magma punch as a big deal and an underrated feat(Yeah, because Shanks of all people is underrated lmfao), but then you fall back on "Shanks has to have more than just a sword," despite the fact that this big feat was done with just a sword.

Akainu's magma attacks were capable of matching Whitebeard's Quakes. The fact that Shanks blocked Akainu's magma attack shows his Haki+Sword is on par with the crazy thing you highlighted as being part of Whitebeard's display as one of the Yonko.

You've defeated your own argument by saying "The Yonko all have these crazy abilities that set them apart, Shanks has to have a crazy ability aside from swordsmanship to match them," and then showing examples of Shanks ALREADY MATCHING THEM with his sword. You're usually better than this, I think your Shanks' fanboyism is affecting you.

Mihawk's best feat pre TS was to cut the Ice mountain.

Which puts him on par with Big Mom(her attacks have been much smaller), Whitebeard(he created the wave and Mihawk was able to create a slash big enough to match its size), and Aokiji(his DF powers froze the wave, so his slashes are powerful enough to break through them).

Trying to downplay this feat is asinine.

Shanks best feat was to cut the clouds. Heaven split attack was far more impressive than Cutting Ice Mountain thing.
Even Oda hyped Shanks at some interview that if Shanks was in FI he would have knocked all 100000fishmen(some even assumed Hody was included).

He said the same thing about Rayleigh, someone who was losing to at his own game to Kizaru.

That's the hype Shanks got with Haki. But people will even dismiss that. They already dismissed Yonkos Hype(4 most powerful Pirate Captain). Even though one has casually took down Capone with few punches whereas other one has destroyed Kid and his alliance.

You can't dismiss something Oda never wrote. You sucking the Yonko's **** hard as hell if you're actually salty that people are going by original wording over a mistranslation because it doesn't fit how you want them to be.

Just check the wiki before sprouting non-sense.
A bisentō (眉尖刀 brow blade) was a pole weapon used in feudal Japan. The bisentō has various descriptions,
"a double-edged long sword with a thick truncated blade",
"a spear-like weapon with a blade at the end that resembles a scimitar",
"a polearm resembling a glaive, with a long, heavy haft and a heavy, curved blade".

You must be registered for see links

Description given in wiki indicates:
1)It is a sword
2)It is part sword part Spear
3) It's a spear or Sword

Already refuted this nonsense.

 

[Punk Hazard]

You people claim a swordsman is more than just someone fighting with a sword it's a mentality in order to deflect from Kizaru or Aokiji entering the discussion because the significant majority feels either would beat Mihawk in a fight(despite losing at the swordplay part of the battle).

Describing it is a mentality isn't really accurate anymore. While I've admittedly said so before, that doesn't sound like the best way to word it(will explain more below). Determining what a swordsman is in One Piece means looking at people who are classified as swordsmen and seeing what they have in common. The main thing that sticks out in swordsmen in One Piece is that swordplay is a primary part of their arsenal, meaning:

1. They regularly and consistently resort to swordplay
2. None of their other fighting styles exceed their swordplay in full capabilties

This holds true for all swordsmen in One Piece so far, so this is the criteria we use.

Yet, you claim Shanks is definitively a swordsman because he's used a sword in the limited instances we've seen him clash(never a full fledged fight I might add) despite him having not shown a swordsman mentality so you can use this title which others have noted can stick to a person longer than the skills that earned said title to "verify" Mihawk>Shanks. Shanks doesn't have the personality of the other swordsmen in OP so which is it, sword use or mentality?

We definitively call Shanks a swordsman because Shanks has only been portrayed as a swordsman. Also, when we used "mentality" before, we definitely weren't talking about having the same personality. That's stupid. We were talking about the fact that their swordsmanship was never exceeded by any of their other abilities, showing a discipline towards using swordplay. "Mentality," as in, they didn't focus on another thing over their swordplay so much that their swordplay was secondary. That was obviously too misleading, since you think it meant "They're the same person," which is why I said above that it seems too inaccurate to say now.

Others have already acknowledged BM as a swordsman so if she is a swordsman then how can Mihawk be WSS unless you believe he'd beat her in a fight?

Because he would.

 

[Skull Knight]

Which puts him on par with Big Mom(her attacks have been much smaller), Whitebeard(he created the wave and Mihawk was able to create a slash big enough to match its size), and Aokiji(his DF powers froze the wave, so his slashes are powerful enough to break through them).

How does that put him on par with BM??? You are only measuring BM swordplay with Mihawk's but She already shown a variety of attacks where she doesn't even use sword.
Same goes for WB. His best attack never reached to WB pre TS.

Trying to downplay this feat is asinine.

Where did I downplay his ice cutting feat???

He said the same thing about Rayleigh, someone who was losing to at his own game to Kizaru.

What Conquerors Haki has to do with Rayleigh n Kizaru fight???

You can't dismiss something Oda never wrote. You sucking the Yonko's **** hard as hell if you're actually salty that people are going by original wording over a mistranslation because it doesn't fit how you want them to be.

It's funny how you are saying Yonkos hype is not what it was meant to but both Anime and Manga clearly said Yonkos are 4 Powerful Pirate Captains. Even wiki acknowledge them as 4powerful pirate captains. It's you who is in denial and doesn't wants to acknowledge that Yonkos > Mihawk.

Already refuted this nonsense.

You only refuted the last description not the middle one which still says it's part spear part sword.

 

[Punk Hazard]

How does that put him on par with BM??? You are only measuring BM swordplay with Mihawk's but She already shown a variety of attacks where she doesn't even use sword.

None of which were anymore destructive than her other attacks.

Same goes for WB. His best attack never reached to WB pre TS.

Not entertaining this nonsense argument again.

Where did I downplay his ice cutting feat???

By saying it's inferior to Shanks' sky splitting feat, when in reality it's superior.

What Conquerors Haki has to do with Rayleigh n Kizaru fight???

You hype up Shanks' Haki as a means of putting Yonko on a pedastal by saying he could knock out all 100,000 of the Fishman Pirates army. The problem with this is, so could Rayleigh at his current stage. Also at his current stage, Rayleigh was losing to a Kizaru in a sword fight, and Kizaru doesn't even use a sword primarily. If Rayleigh this weakened stage could do it, then it's not really anything special. Especially not when commanders were capable of standing up to the guy that was beating Rayleigh.

It's funny how you are saying Yonkos hype is not what it was meant to but both Anime and Manga clearly said Yonkos are 4 Powerful Pirate Captains. Even wiki acknowledge them as 4powerful pirate captains. It's you who is in denial and doesn't wants to acknowledge that Yonkos > Mihawk.

If you want to go by "Pirate Captain," then the Yonko title=superiority still doesn't apply to Mihawk because Mihawk isn't a captain and doesn't have a crew.

Secondly, the originally Japanese text that Oda wrote this did not say "Four Strongest Pirates," but "Four Great Pirates." Meaning that the Yonko being the strongest pirates is a mistranslation. In cases such as these, original text supercedes English mistranslation. So the hype was never there.

I also like how you say "even the wiki," as if the wiki is a credible source.

You only refuted the last description not the middle one which still says it's part spear part sword.

I have though. A bisento is not part sword given that it doesn't meet the modern definition of a sword.

 

[HashiraMadara]

Because he would.

The shade XD

You people claim a swordsman is more than just someone fighting with a sword it's a mentality in order to deflect from Kizaru or Aokiji entering the discussion because the significant majority feels either would beat Mihawk in a fight(despite losing at the swordplay part of the battle).

Yet, you claim Shanks is definitively a swordsman because he's used a sword in the limited instances we've seen him clash(never a full fledged fight I might add) despite him having not shown a swordsman mentality so you can use this title which others have noted can stick to a person longer than the skills that earned said title to "verify" Mihawk>Shanks. Shanks doesn't have the personality of the other swordsmen in OP so which is it, sword use or mentality?

Others have already acknowledged BM as a swordsman so if she is a swordsman then how can Mihawk be WSS unless you believe he'd beat her in a fight?

Man I stopped bringing points when I saw nothing other than "feeling" makes you guys continue to argue. It doesn't sit well in you that a "shichibukai" may be > Yonko captains and you have many expectations on Shanks. To push these notions, the more ridiculous "haki beast" puns was even formed lol.

Shanks may well be > Mihawk but until that is disclosed or written by Order he remains a swordsman henceforth below Mihawk