Tsukuyomi overrated and hyped up

[sagemode jinchuuriki]

Huh...cute thread.

Your first fallacious point lies in what you say about Sasuke. While it's true Sasuke used Tsukuyomi on Killer Bee, he only broke out of it as Sasuke's Tsukuyomi and Genjutsu in general is inferior to Itachi's. Namely, that Sasuke cannot manipulate time in his, which brings me to my next point, that Sasuke's is not instant. This was something that was attested by Tobi in Sasuke's bout with Danzo. [

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With the above in mind, Itachi's Tsukuyomi is instant, as described on two canonical occasions. [

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] [

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] Kakashi also claims that there is no cancelling the effects of it. This is because Itachi's Tsukuyomi and I will repeat again for those who cannot comphrenend this simple fact, that it is Itachi's Tsukuyomi which cannot be broken by normal means, unless you're an Uchiha; something which was proven when Sasuke broke out of it in their destined battle. Additionally, Kakashi did not survive Tsukuyomi himself; Tsunade healed him. And this was because Itachi went easy on Kakashi, like Kakashi himself stated: "He could have killed me if he wanted to..."

Riddle me this: how can you break a technique that affects you in an instant? To put the conjecture forward that:

• One must recognize the Genjutsu.
• Then one must cancel it's effects before an instant has occured. :|

Makes no sense...

Like Kakashi said, it's effects cannot be cancelled. And to break a technique faster than an instant makes absolutely no sense.

Thus, to use Sasuke as an example is completely illogical and fallacious. Though, like I said, cute thread.​

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When you said that Sasuke genjustu is weaker than Itachi well this link shows Itachi using his genjustu on Killer Bee. Eight tails was able to snap him out of it.

 

[Owarij]

When you said that Sasuke genjustu is weaker than Itachi well this link shows Itachi using his genjustu on Killer Bee. Eight tails was able to snap him out of it.

3tomoe genjutsu, Not Tsukyomi.... He has the ability to manipulate the victims perception of time in Tsukyomi

 

[sagemode jinchuuriki]

True even with that Itachi's genjustu still hit at an instant and is by far better than Sasuke's

 

[Abura Malakinos]

1. Has he tried it?no

2. having it long enough doesn't mean anything, when you don't have experience with genjutsus in Sage mode.



Tell me why Sasuke was able to break out of it.. And please don't give me Itachi's answer.

And you're saying that he can? It hasn't been shown. (Bold part...)

 

[Owarij]

True even with that Itachi's genjustu still hit at an instant and is by far better than Sasuke's

^More than just far better, danzo stated it was as far as the sky to heaven....aka incomparable

 

[KingHashirama]

Your original premise is false by making the assumption that Sasuke's tsukyomi is even remotely comparable to Itachi's, and thus your outcome conclusion was fallacious

Tsukyomi is instant in the real world but feels like days in your head... according to asuma's description, While itachi was talking, kakashi just collapsed.. This isn't a normal genjutsu that can be broken by cancellation effects, as Kakashi said...

Let me explain this carefully mate. 3 day in tsukuyomi do not = 1 second of real life.

1 second = Instant.

Kakashi collapsed , but who said the Genjutsu was over at that moment? Where does it state you cannot break out of tsukuyomi during the genjutsu.

SASUKE BROKE OUT OF ITACHI'S DUE TO CHAKRA DISRUPTION.....

And you're saying that he can? It hasn't been shown. (Bold part...)

The bolded part just answered what you posted.. How can something be shown if its not tried.

But breaking Tsukuyomi , due to chakra disruption has already been shown by Sasuke and Killer B.

 

[know it all]

This technique is so hyped up by the fans of Itachi.. why? Cause of the page where Itachi says only the ones who are related to him, can break it.. lmao. So based on that page people basically cut off the "normal way" of canceling a genjutsu, chakra disruption, from the list of ways to stop Tsukuyomi. Which is freaking wrong.


Sasuke Uchiha used Tsukuyomi on Killer B, how was Killer B able to comeback? oh yea, because of Chakra disruption.

Tsukuyomi is a Genjutsu, all genjutsus are the same, they deal with chakra manipulation inside the victim's body. So Tsukuyomi is no different. People like SM Naruto and Jiraya and others who are able to disrupt their chakra and have strong minds (Otherwise it will affect you mentally , like it did to Kakashi) can break out of it.


Stop overrating something, that follows the simple law of breaking a Genjutsu.

Tsukuyomi is nothing special, if your talking about breaking it.

In bold, your statement is incorrect while being correct. While Bee broke the genjutsu with chakra disruption, it was only possible because sasuke's "tsukiyomi" is sh*t. Danzo himself said sasuke's sharingan genjutsu is laughable compared to the real tsukiyomi. I would agree that it is overly hyped up, but I'm not sure you totally appreciate how powerful it really is.

 

[insid3rkil3r]

Killer B broke out of it once he was caught in the genjutsu... not before..... You can speak in a genjutsu.. its not a big deal. By your definition of instant genjutsu.. Itachi's genjutsu isn't instant either.

Tsukuyomi inside Kakashi's head was still going on during the fight.. it wasn't a 1 second thing.

A person can Disrupt their chakra in Genjutsu.. or even one of their senses.

There is no reversing a genjutsu.. all the things have to do with Chakra disruption.. whether its Itachi and Sasuke breaking out of Kabuto's or Sasuke breaking out of Itachi's. ALL have to do with chakra disruption. Unless you can find where it says , it doesn't.

Chakra distruption should work, but performing to succeed is one thing.

The victim needs to be good enough to break control imposed by the Genjutsu's user, any elite shinobi knows its the key to break a genjutsu... but doing it is an other story.

And breaking the illusion seems to be half of the story.

Example ; Orochimaru falling to Itachi's sharingan genjutsu.

Despite being able to ''break'' out of Itachi's genjutsu, he couldnt move and act fast enough to get himself out of danger... which ended with Itachi cutting his hand off to prevent him to fully break out of it.

Even Naruto, being taught by Jiraiya how to break out of illusion... was pinned down by perhaps Itachi's weakest illusion casted by a 30% clone of himself.... imagine a 100% clone, now imagine a Sharingan genjutsu, then Imagine Tsukuyomi.


Itachi and Sasuke breaking out of Kabuto's genjutsu was easy as it was an outside source that was disrupting their chakra.

But such thing is not possible with Itachi's tsukuyomi, so it comes down to someone's raw genjutsu power, or if hes a perfect Jinchuriki or if he can disrupt his own chakra.

Raw power in this case showcases that only someone with chakra stength comparable to Madara's and eye power that surpasses the user of the genjutsu can break the illusion (Sasuke vs Itachi)

Perfect Jinchuriki still get caught by Sasuke's illusion and Itachi's base genjutsu,,, long enough to put them in a hazardous situations.... Itachi's tsukuyomi would likely deal a fair amount of damage even to a ''perfect'' jinchuriki.

Chakra disruption is one way, but clearly the one bound to be the most unsuccessfull as you need to master it to a very high level....and if you aint efficient a genjutsu, which means aint very efficient a controlling your chakra, controlling your chakra to break yourself out of one aint gonna be a walk in the park either.




Tsukuyomi is only overrated if you fail to see that Itachi's and Sasuke's are different. Sasuke is a ''good' genjutsu user but Itachi's is the benchmark when it comes to genjutsu, he took his to an other level. Danzo himself ****ted himself at the sight of Itachi's ghost in Sasuke's illusion.... i doubt it was due to Amaterasu or Susano.

SASUKE BROKE OUT OF ITACHI'S DUE TO CHAKRA DISRUPTION

No, Sasuke sharingan is stronger than Itachi's. Orochimaru commented on how Sasuke's eyes would surpass Itachi's in part 1. Obito said the same when he and deidara fought Sasuke.

Sasuke is pretty much immune to sharingan genjutsu as he has stronger eyes.

 

[thegame]

Killer B broke out of it once he was caught in the genjutsu... not before..... You can speak in a genjutsu.. its not a big deal. By your definition of instant genjutsu.. Itachi's genjutsu isn't instant either.

Tsukuyomi inside Kakashi's head was still going on during the fight.. it wasn't a 1 second thing.

A person can Disrupt their chakra in Genjutsu.. or even one of their senses.

There is no reversing a genjutsu.. all the things have to do with Chakra disruption.. whether its Itachi and Sasuke breaking out of Kabuto's or Sasuke breaking out of Itachi's. ALL have to do with chakra disruption. Unless you can find where it says , it doesn't.

You cannot distrubt chakra in an imaginary world, where the enemy is in control of everything. You can do it, in the real world, but before you even realize it, you are so deep inside the genjutsu that it will be too late. The jutsu only lasts few seconds in reality.

If you did look thoroughly in the databook, you would see that Tsukuyomi is in fact NINJUTSU, which is why it has physical effects on the mind. It's a ninjutsu within a genjutsu. Thus you cannot "stop" Itachis manipulation of time, nor can you overcome it with normal means.

Whatever you say, your argument is invalid U_U Tsukuyomi isn't underrated, it's a top 5 jutsu in the narutoverse, because of its ability to take out opponents that are much much stronger than yourself.

 

[sagemode jinchuuriki]

^More than just far better, danzo stated it was as far as the sky to heaven....aka incomparable

Well thats the point the manga showed Killer Bee breaking out of the Tsukuyomi from Itachi proving that a normal method like charka disruption works.

 

[iSpeak]

Killer B broke out of it once he was caught in the genjutsu... not before..... You can speak in a genjutsu.. its not a big deal. By your definition of instant genjutsu.. Itachi's genjutsu isn't instant either.

Killer Bee was hit with the genjutsu in the air and broke out a while after hitting the ground. That means that the genjutsu used on him wasn't instant (meaning it didn't begin and end in an instant). Itachi's does, which is why Asuma said it looked like Kakashi just dropped from his perspective. At no point was Kakashi in a paralyzed state like you would normally see in paralysis genjutsu's.

Tsukuyomi inside Kakashi's head was still going on during the fight.. it wasn't a 1 second thing.

This is wrong. The genjutsu inside Kakashi head lasted 3 days... are you telling me Asuma, Kurenai and Kisame were just waiting there for three days for the genjutsu to finish?

A person can Disrupt their chakra in Genjutsu.. or even one of their senses.

There is no reversing a genjutsu.. all the things have to do with Chakra disruption.. whether its Itachi and Sasuke breaking out of Kabuto's or Sasuke breaking out of Itachi's. ALL have to do with chakra disruption. Unless you can find where it says , it doesn't.

Not all genjutsu's give you the option of disrupting your chakra. Toad Confrontation Chant, Izanami and Itachi's Tsukuyomi are examples.

I have already given you an example of the Sharingan reversing a genjutsu... Mirror Heaven and Earth Change and I gave you a discription of it:

"It's a form of illusion reversal, but in order to instantly read through a technique and cast it in return, the Sharingan's power is necessary".

 

[Baka Sennin]

i don't really agree with the points you made, Itachi's Tsukuyomi is over so quick that you don't have time to disrupt your chakra

however, there are many ways to circumvent it.
a. clones. if Itachi uses Tsukuyomi on a clone he's screwed
b. not making eye contact or fighting long range, as Tsukuyomi is a sr genjutsu
c. healing ability or insane durability. the effectiveness of the jutsu is proportionate to i. the days itachi packs into a second and b. the mental resilience of the victim. sasuke fell into a coma after one day, kakashi was still standing for a while after three. which means that guys like jiraiya or naruto can probably tank it, esp naruto with the kyuubi healing him. and tsunade and orochimaru can regenerate from the effects for instance
d. there are a lot of dojutsu wielding people- sasuke, madara, obito, nagato. against all of these tsukuyomi is less than worthless, it causes backlash on itachi and steals a big part of his stamina
e. very simple counters like smoke bombs, hidden mist and dust techniques can both nullify such threats and make the sharingan ineffective in one stroke.

also, given that itachi had to retreat and was close to wiped out after three days of tsukuyomi, i think the claims that he can scale the time inside the genjutsu to weeks or even years ridiculous.

plus the fact that each time itachi uses it he effectively is pushing himself closer to blindness. and the fact that he needs to close his eyes before he does it is another drawback too, same with amaterasu. sasuke managed to put itachi off using amaterasu in their fight.

in short, it's a great genjutsu but there are good and easy counters against it and it has big drawbacks to itachi as well, and it's ineffective and impractical against most of the top tier, although it's awesome at effectively dispatching a weaker shinobi.

edit: upon reading your thread again, i think what you're saying is that the victim can break out of the genjutsu as there are 3 days passing by in the victim's psyche right? this is probably true as it would otherwise be impossible for sasuke to break tsukuyomi. however i think it's only a valid option for a. uchiha b. perfect jinchuuriki c. MAYBE sm jiraiya who's merged with two creatures constantly feeding him sage energy

 

[Captain Jimjam]

The only reason Bee broke out of Tsukuyomi was because Sasuke's version of the genjutsu was much, MUCH weaker than Itachi's. Itachi's could alter the perception of time, and much much more, as Itachi was more adept with it, thus theoretically making it harder to break out of. Additionally, Sasuke's Tsukuyomi, as mentioned, is weaker. This could affect it's ability to be broken. At the end of the day, it really depends on the user. If Sasuke is using it, then yes, it isn't amazingly useful and it is just any old Genjutsu. However, used by the likes of Itachi, it's much more formidable.

 

[3MESSIAH]

even kabuto had to close his eyes to avoid it.so there goes your nature energy>tsukuyomi theory.nothing can break it,apart from a fully trained sharingan

 

[daredevil123]

i stopped reading after u said b broke out with his chakra no the eight tails broke him out that tech wont work on a jinchurki that is pals with their beast because the beast can break the genjutsu unless u can name another person who inst a uchiha or jinchurki u can kiss my ass

 

[Koha]

This technique is so hyped up by the fans of Itachi.. why? Cause of the page where Itachi says only the ones who are related to him, can break it.. lmao. So based on that page people basically cut off the "normal way" of canceling a genjutsu, chakra disruption, from the list of ways to stop Tsukuyomi. Which is freaking wrong.


Sasuke Uchiha used Tsukuyomi on Killer B, how was Killer B able to comeback? oh yea, because of Chakra disruption.

Tsukuyomi is a Genjutsu, all genjutsus are the same, they deal with chakra manipulation inside the victim's body. So Tsukuyomi is no different. People like SM Naruto and Jiraya and others who are able to disrupt their chakra and have strong minds (Otherwise it will affect you mentally , like it did to Kakashi) can break out of it.


Stop overrating something, that follows the simple law of breaking a Genjutsu.

Tsukuyomi is nothing special, if your talking about breaking it.

What makes it much more different than most Genjutsu in Itachi's case it disrupts one's time perception.... Don't use Sasuke's inefficient Tsukuyomi to support an argument.

In any case, Itachi's Tsukuyomi can disrupt the very perception of time, 72 Hours becomes only 2-3 Seconds in reality, MUCH faster than the human body of anyone, even Perfect Jinchuuriki can actually realize. Even if you are a Perfect Jinchuuriki, how will your body actually realize it's trapped in Genjutsu before the Justsu already's finished?

Your body and mind are completely ripped in two different perceptions.

 

[chancek7]

I think it is overly hyped because of how rarely it was used in the series. You only see it a handful of times and when you do people seem to struggle with it... Examples, Deidara, Oro, and Kakashi.

 

[fakka]

listen itachi's tsukyomi plays with time thats why it was dangerous it took him three seconds to bring down kakashi...
so lets take a peek, Killer B stood 6 sec under sasuke tsukiyomi if that was itachi it would have been 2 times 72 hours...
so tell me why his genjutsu is overrated?
its underrated he maniplulates time in it therefor its hella strong...

 

[Koha]

I think it is overly hyped because of how rarely it was used in the series. You only see it a handful of times and when you do people seem to struggle with it... Examples, Deidara, Oro, and Kakashi.

Itachi only used Tsukuyomi on Sasuke, twice, and Kakashi. Well, as far as we know in the series.

Three times I mean xD

 

[KidGamer65]

This technique is so hyped up by the fans of Itachi.. why? Cause of the page where Itachi says only the ones who are related to him, can break it.. lmao. So based on that page people basically cut off the "normal way" of canceling a genjutsu, chakra disruption, from the list of ways to stop Tsukuyomi. Which is freaking wrong.


Sasuke Uchiha used Tsukuyomi on Killer B, how was Killer B able to comeback? oh yea, because of Chakra disruption.

Tsukuyomi is a Genjutsu, all genjutsus are the same, they deal with chakra manipulation inside the victim's body. So Tsukuyomi is no different. People like SM Naruto and Jiraya and others who are able to disrupt their chakra and have strong minds (Otherwise it will affect you mentally , like it did to Kakashi) can break out of it.


Stop overrating something, that follows the simple law of breaking a Genjutsu.

Tsukuyomi is nothing special, if your talking about breaking it.

Its been stated that you need to be Itachi's blood relative and have a Sharingan to break Tsukuyomi, manga fact, if you don't like it oh well, but don't expect anyone to believe the BS in this thread when the manga has already disproved it.

I can't believe you used Sasuke's Tsukuyomi as an example....Itachi's Tsukuyomi>Sasuke's Tsukuyomi.

Only a fool who hasn't been reading the right manga would agree with you.