t's offical, Kakashi and Gai have surpassed the sannin
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ghostsoldier3
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usually I can't find any faults in your posts which is why for the first time I actually have to say something cuz of one minor disagreement I have with your statement...i'd quicker say that they haven't surpassed jiraiya or oro...but I believe they have surpassed tsunade...atleast gai I'd say...between 7 - 8 gates I think he'd send her on a trip with no return ticket...7th gate is a maybe...8 considering the variable increases in power i've seen so far would probably mean...insta-corpse - she'd be outclassed in speed and power. Just my opinion.
Soranokenja
Member
I have to ask, how do you put the full picture/thumbnail of the manga page into a post or thread?
Orochimaru...we never *really* got to see what he can really do. I mean...when he fought Sandaime, we saw him fight pretty well, and I personally believe his pride deterred him from going "all out" because Sandaime was old, and his sensei. Pride, perhaps even a shred of mercy/regret. He did have tears in his eyes... "these are tears of joy!!!" ...BS Orochimaru...come here...that's right...cry it out buddy...it's gonna be ok....:flirty1:
....nothing.
In all seriousness, I don't know about Jiraiya. I honestly believe Jiraiya vs. Pain would have been a muuuuuuch closer fight had he known how his abilities worked (like Naruto did, for the most part). Hell, may have even BEATEN Pain due to knowing exactly where he was. Tallest tower in Ame, right? Plus his imperfect Sage Mode has to count for something in terms of chakra sensing.
Point is, we don't REALLY know how strong Orochimaru truly was, and Jiraiya was at a HUGE disadvantage when he fought at his highest level. Still...Kakashi and Gai are seriously BA...I would not be sure who was the stronger unless I saw them fight.
Kakashi and Gai vs. Jiraiya and Orochimaru... epic fight much?? :shrug:
....nothing.
In all seriousness, I don't know about Jiraiya. I honestly believe Jiraiya vs. Pain would have been a muuuuuuch closer fight had he known how his abilities worked (like Naruto did, for the most part). Hell, may have even BEATEN Pain due to knowing exactly where he was. Tallest tower in Ame, right? Plus his imperfect Sage Mode has to count for something in terms of chakra sensing.
Point is, we don't REALLY know how strong Orochimaru truly was, and Jiraiya was at a HUGE disadvantage when he fought at his highest level. Still...Kakashi and Gai are seriously BA...I would not be sure who was the stronger unless I saw them fight.
Kakashi and Gai vs. Jiraiya and Orochimaru... epic fight much?? :shrug:
Kakashi and Gai certainly have grown and improved since they have been on highly ranked missions all the time, thus being in battle all the time.
Judging by Kakashi's first clash with Zabuza, we can tell that Kakashi fainted after the battle because of using his sharingan to a large extent.
However, when we look at the intro episodes of the shippuden, when he fights Naruto and Sakura for the bells he uses his sharingan an entire day without being severely exhausted let alone collapse. Also at that point Naruto indicates how:
Kakashi's sense of smell is better than Kiba's
Kakashi's taijitsu is better than Rock Lee's
Kakashi is smarter than Shikamaru.
Also, we see that Kakashi has improved a lot over time. When we take a look at him and Naruto chasing Deidara, Kakashi manages his own Mangekyou Sharingan as well as outsmarting Deidara's bombs ultimately removing Deidara's arm and also the Suicide Bombing Clone of Deidara, at this point Kakashi saved Gai's team with his Kamui(Mangekyou Sharingan). After this Kakashi again has reached his limit from the strain of using his Mangekyou Sharingan. But he recovers from this in Konoha.
During the Hidan & Kakuzu battle we see Kakashi using his Sharingan easily without suffering from it's strain as well as doing 5 Raikiri's, this just shows how Kakashi has improved his stamina/endurance or whatever you wanna call it.
Even against Pain, Kakashi stood his ground by taking several of Pain's Shinra Tensei and yet fighting him. In the end his clone was killed but had it not been for Chouji and his dad, Kakashi might have killed the deva path? We don't know but judging from how well Kakashi's sneak attacks and speed are it might have been. Even Tobi hands it to Kakashi stating how fast he is, when Yamato ties him up with his Mokuton.
This all just shows how Kakashi has been improving all the time against stronger opponents, this also goes for Gai because Gai is constantly in training(he got some weird ideologie of training), but he beat Kisame(1 of Sasori's subordinates under Pain's shapeshifting jutsu). Also Gai had shown improvement in episode 251, where he opened the 7th gate and ruthlessly took out Kisame with his Hirudora.
Even in the manga, as stated several times in this thread, Gai and Kakashi fought the 7 Ninja Swordsmen of the Mist and took them out. Having fougth in the 4th shinobi war for 2 days, they go to help Naruto, saving him from Tobi and the tailed beasts. Gai and Kakashi at this point where so determined to save Naruto and take the Jinchuuriki's out that they were willing to sacrifice themselves by unlocking their abilities to their full potential.
It's still unknown whether they are on the Sannin's levels or not, but judging from their growth it is only fair to say that Kakashi and Gai are either close to or on the Sannin's level.
Judging by Kakashi's first clash with Zabuza, we can tell that Kakashi fainted after the battle because of using his sharingan to a large extent.
However, when we look at the intro episodes of the shippuden, when he fights Naruto and Sakura for the bells he uses his sharingan an entire day without being severely exhausted let alone collapse. Also at that point Naruto indicates how:
Kakashi's sense of smell is better than Kiba's
Kakashi's taijitsu is better than Rock Lee's
Kakashi is smarter than Shikamaru.
Also, we see that Kakashi has improved a lot over time. When we take a look at him and Naruto chasing Deidara, Kakashi manages his own Mangekyou Sharingan as well as outsmarting Deidara's bombs ultimately removing Deidara's arm and also the Suicide Bombing Clone of Deidara, at this point Kakashi saved Gai's team with his Kamui(Mangekyou Sharingan). After this Kakashi again has reached his limit from the strain of using his Mangekyou Sharingan. But he recovers from this in Konoha.
During the Hidan & Kakuzu battle we see Kakashi using his Sharingan easily without suffering from it's strain as well as doing 5 Raikiri's, this just shows how Kakashi has improved his stamina/endurance or whatever you wanna call it.
Even against Pain, Kakashi stood his ground by taking several of Pain's Shinra Tensei and yet fighting him. In the end his clone was killed but had it not been for Chouji and his dad, Kakashi might have killed the deva path? We don't know but judging from how well Kakashi's sneak attacks and speed are it might have been. Even Tobi hands it to Kakashi stating how fast he is, when Yamato ties him up with his Mokuton.
This all just shows how Kakashi has been improving all the time against stronger opponents, this also goes for Gai because Gai is constantly in training(he got some weird ideologie of training), but he beat Kisame(1 of Sasori's subordinates under Pain's shapeshifting jutsu). Also Gai had shown improvement in episode 251, where he opened the 7th gate and ruthlessly took out Kisame with his Hirudora.
Even in the manga, as stated several times in this thread, Gai and Kakashi fought the 7 Ninja Swordsmen of the Mist and took them out. Having fougth in the 4th shinobi war for 2 days, they go to help Naruto, saving him from Tobi and the tailed beasts. Gai and Kakashi at this point where so determined to save Naruto and take the Jinchuuriki's out that they were willing to sacrifice themselves by unlocking their abilities to their full potential.
It's still unknown whether they are on the Sannin's levels or not, but judging from their growth it is only fair to say that Kakashi and Gai are either close to or on the Sannin's level.
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Totalflash101
Member
If sasuke beat Orochimaru before unlocking MS, Current Kakashi would destroy orochimaru. Granted Sasuke only beat Orochimaru because he had the sharingan, but Current Kakashi's sharingan surpasses the old Sasukes. If sasuke (Hebi) could beat him, MS Kakashi most certainly can.
As for Tsunade, she is fighting Madera, who is the master of the sharingan. If she can SOMEWHAT go toe to toe with that guy, she could probably beat Kakashi and Gai (Provided Gai doesn't go 8th gate, which doesn't really count because he would die to.)
As for the J-man, Kakashi gave pain a much harder time, and given current Kakashi's abilities, Im gonna give it to Kakashi. These are just facts.
As for Tsunade, she is fighting Madera, who is the master of the sharingan. If she can SOMEWHAT go toe to toe with that guy, she could probably beat Kakashi and Gai (Provided Gai doesn't go 8th gate, which doesn't really count because he would die to.)
As for the J-man, Kakashi gave pain a much harder time, and given current Kakashi's abilities, Im gonna give it to Kakashi. These are just facts.
Drakengard
Active member
Well, Jiraiya's ninjutsu seems more well rounded than Kakashi's. Don't get me wrong, Kakashi knows a lot of tactics and ninjutsu himself, but Jiraiya's seems to add more variety. He used a toad to create an entire shop, and used his amazing abilities to fit several things in the mouth of a small toad (what form of S/T trickery is this!?). He transformed people into frogs with a slight touch. It seems that whenever Jiraiya had to face something, he always adapted to suit his needs.
teetooktier
Member
Gai is very under rated. With 7 gates, he's more or less the Raikage, ei he has the same insane speed and strength. I would not put Jiraiya or Orochimaru on their level. Kakashi I'd agree is even with Jman and Oro. If Gai goes 8 gates, he could beat anyone one of the other 3.
The Sage Of 6 Paths
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Ero sennin jiraiya
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eh i disagree maybe against tsunade but i'm not sure with her ridiculous regenerative ability. I say hell no for Orochimaru and Jiraiya though. If I remember right, Jiraiya did much better in his fight against pain than Kakashi did, though they both lost. When it comes to Orochimaru, i think you're underestimating him. During much of the series Orochimaru was in a weakened state. Meaning you never really saw him fighting at his best, except for maybe against the third, a fight he won, but one that also weakened him considerably because of the reaper death seal.
Kakashi and Gai have both improved quite a bit since the beginning of the series, but i don't think they are at oro or JMAN level yet. Pretty sure SM jiriaya could defeat both of them. and oro has a ridiculous number of jutsus he can use. There' a reason why he was so feared and had so many powerful subordinates.
BTW lets not forget that when Itachi and Kisame ran into jiraiya they didnt want to start a fight. they said that even if they were to defeat him, they would probably get killed in the process. (thats kisame and itachi vs. jiraiya....2 on one.) Itachi DESTROYED kakashi in seconds before, but itachi actually feared battle with jiraiya. Now thats not to say the same thing would happen if Kakashi were to fight itachi now, he's definitely improved, but i doubt its enough to beat jman.
Kakashi and Gai have both improved quite a bit since the beginning of the series, but i don't think they are at oro or JMAN level yet. Pretty sure SM jiriaya could defeat both of them. and oro has a ridiculous number of jutsus he can use. There' a reason why he was so feared and had so many powerful subordinates.
BTW lets not forget that when Itachi and Kisame ran into jiraiya they didnt want to start a fight. they said that even if they were to defeat him, they would probably get killed in the process. (thats kisame and itachi vs. jiraiya....2 on one.) Itachi DESTROYED kakashi in seconds before, but itachi actually feared battle with jiraiya. Now thats not to say the same thing would happen if Kakashi were to fight itachi now, he's definitely improved, but i doubt its enough to beat jman.
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GodaimeRaikage
Active member
With the seven gates Gai is nowhere near the raikage? A(Raikage) speed was near Minato's, and A(Raikage)has the chakra level of a tail beast.The eight gates make you strong, but I haven't seen any physical feat from Gai that is on the level of cutting off one of the Hacibi's horns or punching through a Susanoo.
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Seriously dude? The only reason sasuke beat orochimaru is because he was sick. He said it himself. Theres no way sasuke wins if oro is healthy, and there is no way kakashi is winning either. Tsunade got in a few lucky hits imo and i dont see her doing anything else to him from this point on. Tsunade would lose. U think kakashi is going to beat sage mode jiraiya? He nor Gai can beat Sage mode Jiraiya. Kakashi and Gai are still both not at sage level imo.
jesselost05
Member
I don't think they have. The fact that Pain kills kakashi is proof of it. At least master J handled Pain for awhile.
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