Spoiler: Izanagi and Izanami DO NOT need senju dna

[HatakeSakumo]

Something we should also take into consideration about tobi really having the Senju DNA : Madara(having Senju genes) has demonstrated his use of the Mokuton vs 5 kages, Yamato(having Senju genes) has demonstrated his use of the Mokuton vs orochimary etc, Danzou before death(having Senju genes) has showed the Mokuton vs sasuke ... BUT howcome TOBI who claims to have senju dna has not shown this one single time?????

 

[JaXon]

Correct me if im wrong here but arent the uchiha and senju from the same blood-line of the sage of the 6 paths?

 

[~Yubel~]

Reason why kakashi get exhausted and danzo does not is cuz danzou has senju dna.

Uchihas and senju are decendants of so6p so it would make sense for them not to be completely split and it would explain how a senju cold use a sharingan without drawbacks, uchihas have the same bodies as senju, not as strong but they´re up there, that´s why they can use sharingan, i always wondered why using sharingan would take a toll on you when you´re a nonuchiha and now i got the answer.

 

[HatakeSakumo]

just to correct you quick, uchihas and senjus both have great chakra amount but not same bodies as Senjus just like Uzumakis are believed to live for a long time, a reason why Madara might have wanted Hashirama's genes was to enhance his life span aswell

 

[HatakeSakumo]

true, same bloodlines with Uchiha who gained the Visual = Sharingan, while Senjus gained the Body = Endurance ... only thing in common is great amount of chakra, but senjus have greater because theyre believed to live really long quite like uzumakis

 

[NLee]

It makes sense that shinobi of non-Uchiha blood can't use these forbidden techniques without the physical boost in energy from Senju DNA.

Good theory

 

[true enigma]

Very possible, i like the idea

 

[black lightning]

Seems legit bro

 

[Lt Iceman]

Hey Blaze I'll reply to your post,just because it's you,and the presentation of the points was really good....

Izanagi as it was stated is an Uchia technique,as to use it you need the sahringan,and the sharingan only.

The misconception people have is that it needs Senju dna for it's application,which is not baseless on their part but wrong in it's entirety,as the senju dna boost it's effectiveness but aren't a necessary condition for the jutsu to be implemented,the added dna is just a bonus.

As for the Izanami well there's not really much to say about that,as Itachi who doesn't have any senju dna,is capable of using it.

Since we're already on the topic I would want to know what's people's opinion of the Izanami' possible effects

Here's my quote from a similar thread

I believe Izanami to be a technique which effects are similar to it's counter part Izanagi but at the same contrary in it's application(I hope that makes sense )...

In other words if Izanagi allowed the user to bend his own state of existence to the point of avoiding death,my guess is that Izanagi would not bend reality and make it illusion like Izanagi but rather bend imagination and make it reality

That's just my 2 cents,but it's not a stretch to say it could actually turn out like that.If you come to think of it Banbutzu Sozo was the technique the sage used to shape things with his imagination and give them life,and the Uchia's are the clan who inherited the power of the eyes of the Sage,but I guess they're variant would be limited only to the shaping things with imagination and not giving them the lifeforce as they lack it(because it belongs to the younger son's heritage)

 

[Darth Atlas]

I somewhat agree and somewhat dont

 

[sarutobi01843]

True but not only was it called a uchiha forbidden technique because its from the sharigan, but its said even for the uchiha it was banned. Secondly nobody is certain whether tobi is an uchiha or not. What we are certain is that danzo isnt, but also clearly had hashirama's cells implanted in him, yet tobi who said you need both hasnt shown us to have implanted hashirama's cells into his body. So far only edo madara and danzo have shown us this.

So for all you know, tobi might indeed be an uchiha, but lied about hashirama's dna, because until we see hashirama's face on his body, like danzo and madara we cannot fully assume that and go with what somebody like tobi has said

Alright first of all the second hokage at the time was the only one to posses and utilize the abilities to activate edo tensei but they called it a forbidden technique so my guess is somebody took hashirama dna to further there ninjutsu abilty and used izanagi but realized what happens and thats when they called it a forbidden technique remember one ninja can use a technique but based on the side effects of that technique it could be deemed forbidden or not but i agree to disagree cause if your right then ok but if your wrong and tobi is a true uchiha then he needed hashirama dna and what he said is true which the fact that he said it kinda makes me believe him anyway Naruto is the only one to be able to use the rasenshuriken but the fist level rasenshuriken was deemed forbidden because of the side effect

 

[~WastelandSociety~]

Correct me if im wrong here but arent the uchiha and senju from the same blood-line of the sage of the 6 paths?

Kinda,

The Senju clan is descended from the younger of the two sons of the Sage of the Six Paths. He was born with the body of the Sage.

While,

The Uchiha clan is descended from the older brother.He was inherited with the Sage's eyes.

But both are different cause one have powerful chakra and spiritual energy, and the other powerful will and physical energy.
The whole needing the senju dna to use Izanagi is dumb,cause its a "Eye" based move.

 

[jordan1]

I belive izanami is stronger than izanagi

 

[PandaMan.]

I don't fully agree. The manga stated that izanami goes along with izangai. Tobi said danzō's izanagi was not complete. Maybe he required izanami for it to be complete. If theyre opposite forbidden techs than it is very possible that the requirements for having them will ot be exactly the same.

Good job on your research tho

 

[rasengan616]

but what about boss madara,wouldnt he just use the technique to beat the five kages already?since he is part of the edo tensei he could just stab his eye and it would recover back.he even went as far as to show the the first hokage.

 

[CJ Mac]

It makes sense. Plus, Tobi isn't known for his honesty. He has pretty much lied about everything up until this point, he could have lied about Izanagi, too. I guess we'll see in the coming chapters.

 

[Scryed]

It could be that Izanagi was able to be used by Uchiha members for a few seconds and by acquiring Senju DNA, they were able to extend the time Izanagi would be in play furthermore.

So yes, perhaps Izanagi and Izanami do not need Senju DNA but if they were to acquire that Senju DNA, it would increase the effectiveness or time that the techniques would be in play for.

 

[squigles]

This chapter has basically confirmed by beliefs and bare with me ill explain. Izanagi has been explained as a doujutsu forbidden even amonst the uchiha;

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Izanam has been called a pair to izanagi and it would make sense. Meaning its also a forbidden doujutsu even amonst the uchiha and will most likely carry the same drawback which is the loss of an eye;

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Now both have been called forbidden techniques amonst the uchiha which clearly hints that its an uchiha technique that an uchiha can use.

This is the power of izanagi;

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Tobi then explains in detail that for izanagi you need both senju and uchiha, but in the same page he called it an uchiha forbidden technique;

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Tobi then says basically says that danzo was experimented on to increase the time of izanagi, he also said danzo's was incomplete;

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Now alot of people still think you need senju or should i say hashirama dna and that might be the requirements of izanagi only and not izanami, but since they are a pair it would make sense to say that you also need senju dna, but that isnt the case.

Both techniques have been said to be uchiha forbidden techniques which makes sense to assume that they can use it without hashirama dna. The only reason why people think you need hashirama dna is because danzo and tobi needed, but i ask you this, are they uchiha's.?. Danzo for a fact isnt an uchiha, but we still dont know about Tobi and tbh this chapter has hinted that he might not be an uchiha if he needed senju dna to use an uchiha forbidden technique.

I believe a true uchiha with an uchiha body and shairgan can use it without senju dna, whilst people with shairgan's but do not have uchiha blood/body/dna, need senju dna to use it. Example itachi has said that an uchiha blood is what is required for the sharigan to work best;

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This clearly also ties into the fact that a sick itachi spammed ms technique's quiet alot against sasuke and even activated susano's full form. Same as sasuke after spamming several ms techniques, he was still able to activate susano's full form against kakashi whilst kakashi at full health and 100% used one ms technique and this happened;

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What im basically saying is that it could be that only true uchiha's with uchiha body and blood can use their forbidden techniques, whilst outsiders with shairgan need senju dna

I don't agree. Every time we have ever seen 'Senju DNA' mentioned, it's talking about Hashirama's DNA in particular. Not any other Senju. There's a huge difference, because Hashirama was the first and only ninja to be naturally capable of using Wood element release.

That particular power is what enabled Danzou to add 10 Sharingan to his arm and use their powers, as well as increasing the duration of Izanagi. This indicates that Hashirama's DNA enhances the powers of Uchiha jutsu, not enables it.

While your theory is close to correct in that Hashirama's DNA allows Uchiha techniques to become more powerful, it is not the keystone behind being able to use them in the first place for those that aren't Uchiha.

Kakashi has no Hashirama DNA in his body, yet he can use Sharingan and MS, including a space time barrier technique known as Kamui.

There's also no conclusive evidence at this point that proves Tobi isn't an Uchiha.

So while yes, you are partly correct, the real deal is that Hashirama's DNA enhances the powers of Uchiha techniques.

 

[FizzyDrink]

I agree somewhat with Blaze Release. But rememer, Itachi said "It's already prepared", implying that Izanami requires preparation. What kind of preparation? If he were naturally able to use it, he wouldn't need preparation...so could he be implying that Senju DNA needed to be prepared to use it? Just a counterargument I thought of.

 

[Luske Hyuchiha]

To answer some questions about why you need the senju clan DNA because the two clans share one ancestor. The sage of the six paths. He had two sons. One is just like a Senju and the other like an Uchiha.