Rinnegan Madara (or Edo MAdara) Does not exist! We should only Base him off EMS!
- Thread starter Draegod
- Start date
your assuming that you know the full power of both ems and rinnegan madara which you dont, i agree young madara is obviously more mobile but as you saw rinnegan madara was hooked to the gedo so he had a chakra supply and look at nagato he became pain and his actual body wasnt used in battle. im not sayin old ass madara is stronger im just saying theres still alotta mystery about him so its hard to say
edit: and just cause madara hasnts shown all rinnegan techs doesnt mean he cant. he is clearly not fighting seriously
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Q of the Sharingan
Active member
Madara had awakened the Rinnegan through his natural lifespan. He was only able to summon Gedo Mazo after he awakened the Rinnegan.
Madara obviously knows some of the Rinnegan abilities (they are probably on the Uchiha tablet?) since he was able to summon the Mazo and use Preta Path. It isn't farfetched to say that he hasn't masterd them like Nagato however, since Madara hasn't shown many Rinne jutsu.
I agree that Madara never used Rinnegan in his prime but he could have been able to use wood style since he implanted Hashi's cells when he was young. He most likely used wood style to create the Hashi tree, so he had access to it in his lifetime.
Edo Madara was Kabuto's power until he released himself from Kabuto's control. Just like Itachi wasn't considered Kabuto's power when KA was placed on him.
Currently, Kabuto edo army is nothing. It seems that he needs to get the dna for his summons and create the contracts again since he has released the jutsu completely. If that is not the case, then I see no reason for why Itachi let Kabuto live after having him release Edo Tensei. If Kabuto could just summon his Edos again, Itachi would have killed or had Sasuke kill Kabuto after the jutsu was released. Kabuto would escape Izanami eventually.
So if you go by their primes in the overall timeline, Edo Madara would be on top because he is in control of himself or Kabuto because of his full Edo army (minus Madara for this argument).
NarutoKage2
Active member
Good thread. Also, if it wasnt for the senju dna he wouldnt have had a rinnegan. No meteors, no ninjutsu absorption etc. When you add mokuuton jutsus like flower tree world which are again hashi powers your only left with ps, but even that might not be an ordinary ems power.
Agreed, i was saying you were completly wrong because like you said we dont know 100%. But based off what is shown in the manga and hinted, its say to assume ems is when he was at this best when alive.
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Right here leads me to believe he hadnt used Wood style, because he says "I want to try a jutsu" and then uses it. I could be wrong, but just pointing it out.
And about the edo madara part, you still dont get what im talking about. Im saying EDO madara is a product of kabuto no matter how you put it! Because its a fact if Kabuto doesnt
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then madara isnt even a thought! Thats like saying Naruto Clone beating 3rd raikage isnt naruto winning since it is "a product of naruto", or Ma and Pa killing the 3 pains; even though jman didnt use the genjutsu it counts as Jman winning since the Summons were "a product of Jman". etc etcNo matter how you put it, No Kabuto equals no EDO madara! And ppl forget that kabuto chose to keep Edo Madara's sense of mind still in tact like other edos (asuma, hiashi, kingin brothers, sasori, deidara) because he wanted them to do what they do on their own. But kabuto can choose to make them killing machines or mindless auto pilote machines if he chooses.
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This is literally the perfect picture to prove that kabuto can choose to make them think on their own or make them killing machines! Because at first they are mindless zombies then gain senses.
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And right here shows with a simple hand seal he can instantly erase their initial thoughts and make them obedient!
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ANd right here shows him with out them knowing or anything unsummoning them any time he pleases! Remember he is the controler and does as he please with them. The only reason HE couldnt regain Itachi before he went good was because it happened before kabuto even realized what happened (shisu MS was the reason and he didnt see that coming).
So all in all EDO MAdara=Kabuto and thats a fact of the manga.
And also, you take ninjas at their best not when at their worst! Kabuto with full edo army df=efeats everyone basically. If you dont take Kabuto at his best you dont take madara at his best and take him when he has regular sharingan at old age dieing. Hashirama at the point he died fron an unknown reason, Sarutobi at his old age past his prime, Jaraiya when his throat is crushed and arm blown off etc etc. If you dont take them at their weakest point why would you take kabuto at his weakest point??? Thats being hypercritical and obv biased. You either take every ninja at thier best or every ninja at the point they died or current! Simple as that, no other way!
Your logic is flawed if edo madara is simply because of kabuto according to you, I can argue that nagato is simply madara because without his rinnnegan would not have existed either.almost all of nagatos powers are from the rinnegan. Same with obito he would not exist if madara did not give him senju Dna which made him a lot more powerful. He pretty much made both shinobis into the powerhouses they are so kabuto giving madara doesn't count in your world wow that is sure being contradictory powerups from kabuto doesn't count but madara giving others does. Edo Madara does exist lol and now he is independent of kabuto also.
this thread is utter garbage. how do you say edo madara does not exist when the manga clearly shows that he does, kabuto making madara younger does not change the fact that edo madara exists. sure a young rinnegan madara while alive did not exist but saying edo madara does not exist is bs. we have known for a while that madara was old when he attained the rinnegan seeing for the past 6 chapters he was like 101 years old.
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Thnx man!
You dont get what im saying, you are instead beaing a smart ass and trying to twist things to your liking. Edo is a summoning jutsu fact! Madara isnt the reason why nagato is alive, he gave nagato the eyes true but isnt the reason why he mastered the eyes. Thats like Kakashi and his sharingan, even though we know he wasnt born with it and was a "gift" its his because he is the reason why the eyes progressed the level they are now, fact!
Edo madara was completed beyond his prime because in his prime he never had rinnegan. Edo madara exist because of kabuto simple as that, it would be different if Kabuto never worked and enhanced Edo madara, but he did so it is what it is.
Now you can try and make it out to what you believe all you want, fact is edo madara=kabuto!
Kakashobito
Member
lol you forget one thing: kabuto cant control madara with edo tensei cuz madara breaks free hahaha
No i didnt forget that! He broke free because Kabuto wasnt there to control him or instantly unsummon him. Plus the fact that MAdara and him are on the same page so it doesnt matter that he broke free or not, he wouldnt fight kabuto because they already established their on the same page. Anything else?
Dont start that bs again lol look at your title you are saying edo madara does not exist and sure kabuto was the reason edo madara exists there is no one saying otherwise. But the fact is he still apart of the story and is one of the most powerful characters in this manga right now, so your point of him not being real or does not exist is bs. it does not matter if kabuto revived madara not fact is he exists you keep playing the "what if" game he summoned him and thats what happened in the manga you keep trying to deny it.
Obito who is also on your list is alive because madara saved him and gave him hashi's dna that allowed him to be much more powerful. he should have not existed too if i played by your logic but fact is madara saved him and gave him additional powers
nagato also became powerful due to madara and you cannot deny that, madara made nagato that strong similarly how you keep saying the reason madara is so strong due to him currently being a young edo with his rinnegan abilities. nagato never actually should have rinnegan abilities but madara gave it to him so if I play by ur logic rinnegan nagato should not exist either. stop trying to single out your hate on one character and accept what the manga is and in that manga edo madara certainly exists it does not matter what kabuto did or he didnt do.
Your whole logic is wrong it does not matter who saved who and if someone gained powers through another it does not mean that person does not exist lol. edo madara is present and has the powers which most are his but kabuto gave him an edo body+ made him young and enhanced his mokuton
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Quite idiotic if you ask me. you are obiviously a kabuto fanboy you know those guys who were saying kabuto is greater than the sage of six paths.
So you are saying you cannot count edo madara because he never had the rinnegan in his prime and he had no wood techniques but you count kabuto edo summons which is obiviously not his power and all the rest of the abilities he has stolen
Oh and kabuto dosent have DSM anymore and yo so called strongest character got beat by itachi who wasn't even fighting with killer intent
You still dont get what im saying, i know edo madara is Physically "alive" and dominate in the manga with is own free will. I'm saying that He is a product of kabuto and should be judged on that account when it comes to who is the best ever displayed with what they have shown or hinted to have.
Edo anything is a product of its summoner no matter what happens after they was summoned. Example is when naruto first summoned Gamabunta, Gamabunta basically said "**** you" and did what he wanted to, but that still doesnt take away from the fact that naruto had the power/chakra to summon such a boss monster and it is on his side when it comes down to it.
Kabuto is the reason edo madara is even irrelavant. Nagato may have recieved madaras eyes but doesnt mean he owes his knowledge and power control to Madara. NAgato was trained by Jman not madara to become strong, and later trained himself to become godlike!
Its like if a Lt. Sargent gives me a box filled with the tools/materials to make a bomb with no manual, and i then put the bomb together on my on; is it because of the Sargent i put the bomb together? No! He simply gave me the materials, i put it together and did everything on my on! So i recieve all the credit since i was the reason the bomb turned out they way it did even though it originally wasnt my bomb to master.
Kabuto on the other hand saw a bomb already put togather and made additional enhancments to make the bomb something it never was bigger, better, and more powerful. Kabuto then has the option of using the bomb when he likes, and putting the bomb away when he likes. So that makes the bomb kabutos weapon since he is the reason it got so powerful and has so much control over it. Now whether the bomb blows up in his face is irrelevant.lol Its still his bomb! lol
And your one of those retarded uchiha fans who hate to hear manga facts! Uchihas can be beaten, get over it! Kabuto will always have DSM because he himself worked to master it and with juugo's ability can maintain it! That ability isnt because of orus chakra or oru anything! SO get your facts strait and reread the manga!
Edo tensei is a summoning jutsu, nothing more nothing less! Did you even know that???
Doesn't exist? I wouldn't use those words as he clearly exist so I think you're looking for something else. Nobody ever means the Madara that was alive that fought Hashirama and lost. They are referring to Edo Madara hence why they say Edo Madara. He probably copied the hand seals or remembered them from when he fought Hashirama and then for the first time did Wood style in that manga page. And how do you know he couldn't do what Nagato could? He did preta path on Naruto's rasenshuriken as soon as he entered the battlefield.
God your logic makes no sense. U say in your title pretty much edo madara does not count which absolutely makes no sense. Madara is seperate from kabuto now, its a fact deal with it.
So does madara owe to kabuto the fact that he has immense knowledge about his own eyes and hashi's powers, no kabuto merely gave him the tools to be this powerful which is exactly what madara did he gave the tool(rinnegan) that allowed nagato to be so powerful.
Same with obito he is alive because of the fact of madara and is so powerful because of madara that is a fact, so does mean it does not count no of course it does.
kabuto is the same way responsible for madara being a god on the battlefield similar to madara being for obito's powers. And madara also provided nagato with something that allowed him to be so powerful aka rinnegan.
and gamabunta is a separate entity just to let you know it does matter if naruto summons him or not. his powers still can count if he is battling by himself its not because of naruto he has jutsus available in his own arsenal.
U r playing a game of hypothetical situations but get back to the facts kabuto summoned madara, enhnaced him but madara is now independent it does not matter how but its the fact so deal with it. your whole argument is based on a hypothetical situation get back to the facts.
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Im just going to quit talking to you because you clearly dont get anything im saying, not even a bit! If you think EDO MADARA exist with out kabuto and just because he released kabutos control that he isnt a PRODUCT OF KABUTO THEN good for you. We obv are reading too different mangas. You can make what you say seem similar to mines all you want, its clear you are so lost its sad. NEXT!