Zero evidence what now you just denying shit who reached the peak of their speed at 17 years old? no one the prime for ninja's are mid 30s Adult Sasuke is in his mid 30s he's much faster than his 17 year old self. How did you prove me wrong we both agreed on Sasuke shunshin to protect naruto = KM naruto shunshin to dodge raikage meaning they're evenly matched foot speed and shunshin we have no idea how fast kmc minato shunshin is so its all speculation, Base minato has no remarkable shunshin nb4 all his feats he did at War arc it was off screen so irrelevant.
Smh. How did I miss this BS? Go on, tell us how Sasuke intercepting Onmyodon means that he's faster than Ay when even Hiruzen could move a bit before getting hit?
No one ever said Sasuke was faster than Ei he was able to intercept juubito's attack does that mean he's faster than him no so your logic fails Hiruzen being able to move means nothing when he could not dodge shit also if he was getting hit while alive he would not been able to move being edo gave him no pain tolerance.
Except he wasn't near Minato's speed as a teenager. He was reacting as fast as he could in KCM, but that's pretty much it. In all other areas of speed Minato would dominate him. Not to mention this is a Minato with Sage Mode and Kurama Mode. So once again, how was Sasuke near this Minato's speed as a teenager?
He actually was. Him dominating Sasuke in all other areas is a joke his foot speed was not much impressive especially when he could not even dodge a simple jab from juubito in his v2 even with ftg. Sage mode is overrated the only impressive speed feat it displayed was a blitz against asura path getting blitz by a Madara with no eyes bsm kurama shown nothing more impressive than bm and even if it does give you a good boost of speed its certainly not the difference between adult sasuke and teen sasuke moot point is moot.
Wrong. Take away Hagoromo's powers and you get BM Naruto and EMS Sasuke. Not BSM Naruto. I'll explain below. Why don't you actually provide evidence for claims like "Adult Naruto w/o his chakra>BSM Naruto in speed"? Smh. "I'm positive" is not an argument.
That's where I stopped reading. Sasuke's Ameno only works one way when he teleports people or himself. Teleport--->Strike. Plot is not an argument that'll bail you out of every situation you don't like.
You stopped reading they're because you had no counter to my argument just concede already especially concerning this argument im not reposting the scans of something you already know boy. Your the only one using plot as your argument you gave no real counter to this even below your just trying to refute the mechanics of the warp+strike while not even saying how minato does not die by these which he does.
First scan shows Sasuke teleporting in mid air, and then Naruto rams into him and stops. Not to mention it's not an attack, so Sasuke doesn't need to strike. If he teleports and strikes, the striking part gives Minato time to react to him.
Wrong Sasuke stopped Naruto from flying backwards he even tells Sasuke that he cannot stop
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Stop jumping to the conclusion that Minato can still react that is far to close by the time he even know's sasuke is gone its over also why would sasuke strike after he teleports when we've seen he can strike when he teleports making it a no striking speed attack as i explained above someone like juubito can easily react to sm naruto's and tobirama's attack yet was getting blind sided everytime they came at him untill he set up a defense before the warped to him its gg for Him.
Second scan shows him teleporting behind Naruto and then slamming him into the ground with his bow/fist. This clearly shows Sasuke striking, so what in the hell are you even talking about?
Grasping at straws at its finest they're was no striking speed in that attack we've seen Sasuke using a warp then an attack its looks like
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in those scenes Sasuke was shown cocking his arm back and ready to strike not in the scans i posted you trying to walk your way around the manga scan is pathetic as shit just concede already you fool. To further shit on this dumb post ofc Sasuke arm is extended his arm has always been extended but it was extended before the attack making it no striking speed that simple look at what Naruto and Tobirama did to Obito same exact thing arm already extended no striking speed needed quit acting like you do not get it.
How does this help you at all the only reason a warping attack can be countered is because the striking speed of the opponent is to slow to finish the blow but if you attack before you warp that takes out that possibility and if you get this what are you denying here dumbass adding to fuel to the fire thats burning his house down fail attempt at trying to deny the manga leads you in a circle supporting your opposition.
This ain't EMS Madara. This is EMS Sasuke as an adult, with Rinnegan that has no Rikudo Chakra of any kind powering it. Only a fanboy would say EMS Sasuke w/ a Rikudo Chakraless Rinnegan low-mid diffs BSM Minato, but hey...look who I'm talking to. Look at your sig. Day 1 Sasuke fanboy here.
Another post of shit talking please just respond to me and there is a difference between fan and fanboy look it up you worm. EMS Sasuke as an adult > EMS Madara so your right this is not Madara were talking about Sasuke does not need rikudo chakra as long as his tech remain the same he comfortable defeats Minato he does win this low diff look at the arguments your trying to present what a joke.
Wrong. Sasuke told Naruto to aim at him, then they thrust and Sasuke warped him. That's Sasuke warping Madara after he attacks, not warping Madara right onto his attack or at the very moment the attack makes impact. Kaguya reacted to Ameno twice. End of story. Unless you prove that EMS Sasuke's speed is enough to tag Minato before he himself can teleport away, he doesn't blitz. Learn how teleportation works and then get at me.
You trying to make up your own story with how this works and your not making since at all why would Sasuke warp Madara after the attack if that makes sense at all vs him warping him the moment of the attack? Im still baffled on how pathetic you are when trying to cover your tracks how would warping someone after you attack even work? if he were to do that with Kaguya how would it even work when they're done attacking warping someone at the moment of impact gives them no time to counter you at all or react to you all together fail logic fails once more. Everytime he warped Kaguya what happen it was much before his attack right yes and i want you to try and deny logic if Sasuke and Naruto would have assumed this
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now picture that but take Kaguya out now as they draw closer to each other then he decides to warp her what happens it game over right they're and how does Kaguya dodging Sasuke using his ameno before he strikes helps Minato? Teleportation is instant regarless if its EMS Sasuke kid Sasuke or baby Sasuke so its moot and when he can strike then warp or strike at the moment of impact which he does in certain situations it curtains fo Minato. Furthermore the distance between Minato and Kaguya is far larger than the difference between Adult Sasuke (No Hagaoromo chakra) compared to himself that fought her using her as a comparison was terribly flawed on your behalf.
Sensory abilities are irrelevant. If Naruto is dealing with the fireball with his chakra arm, it gets harder for him to react to Sasuke coming. That was the whole point of him using Katon in the first place. Anyone who doesn't read the Manga with their hand in Sasuke's pants would know this. Not to mention you are still saying he was blitzed even though he:
-Sensed him.
-Blocked a hit to his back by turning around and blocking with his left (right?) arm.
So tell me. How is it a blitz if Naruto reacted? Smh.
That would only make since if naruto on had one hand and what would be the point of sensing abilities if when getting your Los blocked makes it harder for you to counter attack? Also its a simple katon Naruto cloaks before the boost tanked a much larger katon then reacted to obito meaning a katon as a distraction plus teleportation is not playing to naruto's weakness especially since at the end of the vote fight when he was in base he shrugged off amaterasu which is much deadlier than a katon without a problem.
Sensing Him only helps my case i hope you know that. im pretty sure he was nearly blitz Madara (If we take out the fact that Madara stiked sai first giving naruto more time to react) and he could sense Madara as well sensing means nothing when you have not the physical prowess to react or evade. Naruto did not block it he just managed to turn around if he would have blocked it he would have not been thrown off his feet by a tech that has no explosive power behind it, We already know what Naruto looks like when he's trying to block a near blitz/blitz and being thrown into the air with his hand loosely flying around his not an blocking attempt sorry.
Hagoromo's Senjutsu didn't overlap the Toad Senjutsu. Naruto w/ Hagoromo's power= Naruto+Rikudo Senjutsu+Yang Kurama+8 pieces of the other Bijuu. Not Naruto+Rikudo Senjutsu+Toad Senjutsu+Yang Kurama+8 other Bijuu. You say "he had BSM before he met Hagoromo" even though BSM isn't an internal power of Naruto's. He gets Sage Mode by taking in Nature Energy from the environment, so why would something external be included in the make up of his new powers? Rikudo's Senjutsu replaced/enhanced the regular Toad Senjutsu. Thus if you take all of Naruto's Senjutsu, you are left with BM Naruto. Not BSM Naruto.
Your not getting the point is RSM Naruto is to what BSM would be vs fighting EMS Sasuke with amenotejikara Kurama cloak + sensing abilities being blitz/nearly blitz in the same thing so when i said you take away the Hagoromo's chakra this is what i was referring to not Hagoromo chakra just adding on more power to his already existing sage mode Nice try though but no. I dont get your gathering of Nature energy part for Bsm Naruto when his senjutsu from Hagoromo worked basically in the same way just gathers much more of it faster considering what he did at VOTE they have the same mechanics one is just more more powerful.
Where was he caught off guard by Tobirama's jutsu? Why are you even mentioning Tobirama when Tobirama himself said that if they keep using Hiraishin Obito will obliterate them from behind. And then Obito displayed that he could react. [
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] The only reason they got him is because it was a surprise attack, not because he couldn't react. Hiraishin attacks are not instant. Ameno attacks are not either. If they were instant, Sasuke wouldn't have gotten his ability laughed at by Kaguya, twice.
I countered what you thought you did above so ill adress the Tobirama part. Tobirama was just being caution they even attacked Obito again and was not hurt at all, That is not a display of reaction that is a display of he already knew what was coming Naruto loudly shouted at Tobirama to use his jutsu Obito knowing what that was just put chakra hands on his back the moment they attacked his back they would ran into chakra hands instead of his actually body if the would have warped to the front of Obito he would have been killed but since he knew they could only go behind him because that's were the seal was he was ready for Sasuke jutsu you could never be ready because he can strike you anywhere at any time. Maybe the time when they got him with Amaterasu it was a surprised attack but Obito knows ftg marking dont fade so why would he just let his guard down completely and if he did he would have enough time to put it up before a striker considering Madara arm fully extended was able to chop Tobirama down obito being faster than Madara would have no problem plus he a juubi jin level sensor surprise attacks are near impossible for people of their level to do on him. Everytime Sasuke used ameno on her it was clearly different than those scans i showed you so keep denying shit not helping you here at all.
Juubito got hit with SM Rasengan because:
-It was a surprise attack.
-Instead of trying to counter he decided to try and use his intangibility
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If he had tried to do anything else Naruto would be in a coffin right now. Like I said above, Tobirama made it clear that if they jump behind him again, he'll
Already countered this for the most part especially that surprise attack nonsense Madara with sm was able to dodge a surprised attack from Tobirama yet juubito would not be able to lets see superior foot speed and sensing the surprise attack nonsense it not going to fly at all. Obito never once tried to use intangibility up until after he was hit why would he need to? he knew he was superior to them and every aspect physically so them being to close for him to react so he would force a kamui would have never came to mind especially since he just got hit by a Enton rasenshuriken and did not think any of their Ninjutsu would work on him anyways that kills your kamui argument. Tobirama only made that clear after he saw obito flare chakra up on his back because i stated above he knew what they're were up to and since he knew that had senjutsu he would have no choice but to resort to his chakra hands like he did against the bm avatars killed this point thank you come again.
Obito gave no ****s about what they were doing because he knows that they can't hurt him with Ninjutsu. He stood there and watched as they charged towards him, because he knew that he'd just call the Gudo Dama, wipe the flame away and then mock their efforts. Then there's the fact that Obito reacted to their Hiraishin attacks after this. Try again pal.
You do know this hurts you right furthermore i posted that more because of him instantly touching obito vs Obito giving a care in the world about dodging so this post is irrelevant No Obito got his back busted open after this he did not even react to ftg when they used the bm avatar's he just counter by using chakra hands before they actually used the ftg you have yet to counter my post but itso okay.
Irrelevant. Sage Mode Naruto=/=BSM Naruto. A Sage Mode boost had Naruto going from getting blitzed senseless by Juubito to being able to track his speed. That's a massive jump. I can already tell the above point is going to be foolish as hell.
Wrong. KCM Naruto and BM Naruto are either the same speed or the difference isn't very small, because BM Naruto has no speed feat that surpasses KCM Naruto's, nor are BM w/o the Avatar and KCM different forms. Databooks refer to both of them as Kurama Chakra Mode.
If they we're the same speed why would his cloak design change? just to look cooler know the difference between their speed is vast like the difference between every tail being grown to add on more power what even makes this claim worst is that KM naruto was only good for dodging Ei and thats using a top speed shunshin why Kakashi a genius and Mianto's student thought Naruto was Minato how fast he swatted the Bijuu damas even Obito was surprised by his speed while he did not show the slight worry about km Naurto's Databook Refering them as kurama chakra mode is right because that is kurama's chakra mode just with more power being used in one because one has the power of Kurama not wanted to help naruto feeling like he's being held prisoner while the other is best friends with kurama allowing him to access its full power a big difference between the two and under any normal circumstances you would agree but not here why because it helps your arguments the inconsistencies in your debate style kills me my dude.
So now you are comparing Rikudo Sasuke's feats to EMS Sasuke w/ Rinnegan's? Smh. Can you stop with the bullshit? Not to mention Madara got stabbed because of Ameno's ability. If Sasuke uses Ameno to warp, he'll have to wait before using it again so he still gets wrecked either way. And once again, RIKUDO SASUKE>>>>>>>>>EMS SASUKE even as an adult. Don't compare the two.
Its more of an ameno feat instead of a rikudo Sasuke's you even admitted that in your second sentence so what is the fuss about and Rikudou Sasuke using ameno is equal to Part 1 Sasuke using ameno why because instant is instant no matter who its coming from unless he used ameno like he used it against Kaguya instead of uses its most efficient way warping at the moment of impact. Not comparing EMS sasuke to rinnegan Sasuke but when they use ameno in a good way its all the same because they only difference would be striking speed and when you take that away from the equation they're is non really so it would not matter what Sasuke would use it as long as he warps minato at the moment of impact to kill him.
Sasuke was only able to react to Juubito's movements mentally, and he had to use Sharingan for that. How the hell is he going to track Minato's strike with Sharingan if it's a back attack? How is mentally reacting to Juubito proof that he can physically dodge BSM Minato's Hiraishin blitz? Lmao. You sound dumb as hell.
This post made no sense you said he was able to track juubito's movements mentally then turn around and say he cannot mentally react to Juubito? what not only has he reacted to juubito he already displayed the speed the force Juubito to block instead of dodge because once you can completely tracked someone's movements you can and a since fight on par with them physically The VOTE fight is an example Naruto was smashing Sasuke but when he turned on his 3 tomoe he got no speed boost yet he started smashing Naruto why because once your mentally tracking someone with 3 and above you have some chance of fending them off i say 3 tomoe and above because we've seen with 2 tomoe it does not work as Sasuke still lost to rocklee. If you read my post carefully you would see him getting behind Sasuke is never happening furthermore he reacted to a much faster juubito with susanoo ameno and his natural speed reacting is no problem at all.
Daft? please use simpler words you know im slow when it comes to complex words. No you cannot definitely not in that scan all the tails looked meshed into one. his tails we're cut go and look at the scan because im honestly tired of reposting literally the same scans for your dumbass.
Naruto never had more then 1 bijuu entity in him at the same time nor did he have enough chakra to whip up more than one Kurama mode when at max he could only make 3 bm clones.
Nice try goes to you because i shitted on all those post. Furthermore even if they were true it would be irrelevant because Sasuke has already shown combination jutsu Enton Susanoo curse mark susanoo.
Except you haven't given me proof. You gave me a wall of bullshit that you call an argument. Don't get pissy when someone asks you to prove your claims. If you don't wanna prove the shit you spew, I suggest you get off the forum and stop wasting my time. It's crazy how you keep talking about that thread, even though it wasn't even a character VS thread, and it was a dumb topic which could easily go either way considering it was Rikudo PS. It's pathetic how desperate you are to beat me tbh.
Wrong. Downscaling shows that BM Naruto would be able to react to Sasuke's Ameno blitz if he didn't have Rikudo's power. You are trying to say that he can blitz BSM Minato before he can warp away with Hiraishin despite BSM Minato being far faster than BM Naruto. You claim this all because you think Sasuke as an Adult's speed has grown so much that he can do so, but you can't even prove that it has.
No he would not he already got blitz in canon if we downscale them read above i already countered your reverting back to bm argument which was shitty as hell. BSM Minato being faster than BM Naruto is fanfic for one considering Naruto bm avatar takes a new design thus more power while Minato does not making him faster right they're Minato's unimpressive ass sage mode does make up for it since its showed nothing better than his base. Blitzing him would be no problem Adult Sasuke without rikudou chakra is rinnegan alive Madara's level which is well above that of bsm Minato also you cannot react to Sasuke using amenotejikara in the way he has used it most efficient. Adult Sasuke is faster why because with no boost Sasuke has gotten faster consistently through the series it would not stop a the young age of 17
EMS Sasuke speed > Hebi Sasuke's > VOTE 1 > CE2 Sasuke > FOD Sasuke > Beg series Sasuke he has consistently got faster yet he wont after 17 what a joke Adult Hashirama > Teen Hashirama in speed Adult Kakashi > Teen Kakashi in speed Adult Gai > Teen gai in speed Shippuden lee > Part 1 lee in speed and so on that logic holds much more water than your that sasuke did not gain a lick of speed over 15 year time span.
Flash BD charges in a matter of seconds. Sasuke's PS doesn't have the feats to reach an altitude that high before Minato lets it loose on him, or are you still giving Rikudo Sasuke's feats to Rinnegan Sasuke w/ no Rikudo Chakra? Like the bold. That's a Rikudo Chakra Sasuke feat. End of story.
Perfect susanoo susanoo slashes explodes it in his face furthermore Sasuke susanoo has insane speed feats if we downscale it to dodges a bijuu dama is not a problem since minato would not be that close unless he wanna get bisected on Sasuke would simply advoid via amenotejikara its not landing that simple i already proved why that is not a feat that should be included to just rinnegan Sasuke read above you joke. Since even in his VOTE fight he was still getting his 6 paths powers we know he has Shira tensei since chibaku tensei is a deva path ability he blows that away. Furthermore Obito notes a flash BD to be slow
You must be really be but hurt huh? I already told you i would take a judges decision L anyday of the week before i take an L saying i cant counter this post any way shape or form so i concede to your Almighty Unorthodox's arguments.
Proof that Adult Sasuke w/o Hagoromo's chakra has chakra comparable to Madara's let alone stronger? Because God knows EMS Sasuke's Susanoo would be stomped by EMS Madara's.
My proof is that can we compare a 17 year old Madara to Prime Madara? no plus Sasuke was barely weaker than ems Madara at 17 he grew alot considering from the last and VOTE his chidori was on a completely different scale take away the chakra its the same thing in the last is only about 3 years after VOTE so imagine what would have happened in 15 years easily above Madara's level.
Can Minato even use 2-3 flash Bijuu damas? furthermore i literally just countered that argument like 3 post ago and i guess Sasuke would just sit there why Minato pumps out Bijuu Dama's nope he warps above him and whops that head tha phuck up or pull the Bijuu damas right into Minato's face with universal pull.
But, I never said Flash BD would one shot Sasuke or Madara's Susanoo, not to mention nothing in the bold would even prove that I'm inconsistent with this logic and my current statement even if I had made that claim. If you downscale RSM Naruto and Rinnegan Sasuke's Chidori BD clash, you come to the conclusion that a STANDARD BDx2 would do minor damage to Sasuke's PS. Flash BD>>>>Standard BD. Why in the **** are you looking at the explosion size of RSM Naruto's BD and RINNEGAN Sasuke's PS Chidori to determine the power of the standard BD of BM Naruto? Smh. Learn how to downscale while you are learning how to read.
I'm only inconsistent to those who try their hardest to make me out to be inconsistent, thus they twist/purposely misinterpret what I've stated so that they don't come out sounding like a retard. It's pretty sad how your obsession with besting some dude over the internet in a debate has led you to constantly twist my logic around to make me sound like you do, dumb as hell.
No your inconsistent because when people can use your own post to counter your agruments your inconsistent as hell then you either say your misunderstanding me or twisting my words or i change my mind how tf that make you look like a joke. No one is obsessed with beating a guy who i just did like 2 days ago i made you concede your below me like a phucking basement.
A floor throwing that by a Juubi Jinchuuriki that created a humongous ass crater in the process. Then there's the fact that PS already failed to hurt Kurama w/ it's sword slashes.
Crater was not even larger than EE shit not big at all. Kurama tails is a different thing his head and body gets shreded with ration running though his perfect susanoo sword or he can just attack Mianto's body no difference.
Minato cannot react to something to Sasuke warping him at the moment of impact so dodges with ftg is irrelevant and where is ftg going to be exactly? PS slashes destroys the whole landscape along with Minato's pointless flash Bijuu damas any ftg kunai is roasted by Sasuke's clowns. Teen Sasuke susanoo did not cut a tail adult Sasuke susanoo with Hagoromo's chakra is much more powerful scale them down same result happens so Minato gets whacked.
You do know what washed up mean right Kifflom beated me when he was a beast now he garbage thats why i said washed up furthermore i had your hatin ass as a judge.
no rikudo chakra makes sasukes PS weak as hell against the senjutsu avatar,
his slashes get blocked by the tails of the avatar with absolutely no damages,
Makes Perfect susanoo weak ass hell against the bm avatar first of all Perfect susanoo is not weak as hell compared to the avatars in the first place secondly a BSM avatar can tank ps attack with zero damage? this is why your washed up Not only did you not read my post which i is not going to post again your just spouting nonsense now the tails are the strongest part of the avatar Ps slashes shockwaves by destructive capabilities is tiers above that puny slam that destroyed a v3 inhance susanoo which has the durability of a bsm avatar by miles so Kurama gets shanked all up.
and scaling down from the battle at VOTE, 2 TBBs from 50% kurama shrugged off the entire side of sasukes PS,
now we add the senjutsu buff, and minatos TBB would damage sasukse PS much worse, flash TBB would bust it open, and leave him a fodder
A senjutsu buff was already added from the vote fight because naruto has his own so that point is stupidly irrelevant. Minato's tbb are never landing to slow or they're thrown right back flash tbb has been countered hard as hell Shira tensei, Ameno can evade it, Perfect susanoo with wings dodges it easily as hell also.
rinnegan techniques are non factor when he cant use preta inside susanoo, amenos physical attacks are tanked, and he has no means of physicallly evading minatos attacks, added with shadow clones and he gets wrecked
He has no means to dodge Minato attacks? what he can phucking teleport your just a bad habit with these terrible claims. he does not need preta inside susanoo he has clowns for that plus do we even know Minato knows how to add senjutsu to his attacks? Ps sword or chidori used on susanoo hand or blades chops kurama up. Minato shadow clones gets raped by Sasuke in a fight at this magnitude clowns are useless to begin with beside cleaning up the dirty work.
I'm impressed at your reply, Nike Air. Not the content, because I didn't read it, but the fact you even replied to all those walls with your own walls. Where do you get the energy and will power? You're on a phone too, correct? Gotta rep a nicca for putting in effort like that.
You do know what washed up mean right Kifflom beated me when he was a beast now he garbage thats why i said washed up furthermore i had your hatin ass as a judge.
Lol it has everything to do with sasuke, keep lying to yourself
Makes Perfect susanoo weak ass hell against the bm avatar first of all Perfect susanoo is not weak as hell compared to the avatars in the first place secondly a BSM avatar can tank ps attack with zero damage? this is why your washed up
whatsoever, now remove rikudo and PS slashes are blocked by BM avatars tails no diff,
now add senjutsu buff to the avatar which results in the avatar being far superior physically and we get to the conclusion that PS slashes are trash, and so is everything else in sasukes arsenal
Not only did you not read my post which i is not going to post again your just spouting nonsense now the tails are the strongest part of the avatar Ps slashes shockwaves by destructive capabilities is tiers above that puny slam that destroyed a v3 inhance susanoo which has the durability of a bsm avatar by miles so Kurama gets shanked all up.
another false analogy in your post,
that V3 boosted susanoo was boosted by well over 6x (3x Yin, 3x Yang + juugos senjutsu) making it physical equals with the BSM avatar, meaning it was actually physically superior to his regular PS,
as for juubitos drop slam being puny? Lol you keep embarassing yourself more and more
this is the crater formed by his drop slam, which is enormous
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A senjutsu buff was already added from the vote fight because naruto has his own so that point is stupidly irrelevant.
It was kurama boosted by rikudos yang, which is six path senjutsu,
without the rikudo yang its just a regular kurama avatar
Minato's tbb are never landing to slow or they're thrown right back flash tbb has been countered hard as hell Shira tensei, Ameno can evade it, Perfect susanoo with wings dodges it easily as hell also.
ST? if he uses them to repel them back then minato has the S/T barrier to throw them back,
meaning that sasuke is not doing shit during his cooldown, and would have to resort to tanking it
ameno is not evading the range of TBB considering how small its teleportation range really is,
PS is too slow to evade them seeing how fast TBB really travel
and if minato has a marking neaar sasuke then he teleports the bomb directly to it meaning that sasuke defnitely gets hit
He has no means to dodge Minato attacks? what he can phucking teleport your just a bad habit with these terrible claims.
He uses ameno, then he is left on cooldown,
minato has superior reactions and has FTG and clones so he iis never teleporting away,
he is far far slower physically so he gets wrecked in a battle without constructs
he does not need preta inside susanoo he has clowns for that plus do we even know Minato knows how to add senjutsu to his attacks?
not only is sasuke having clones out whilst using al of this the biggest fanfic but the worst thing is that this strategy is definitely not happening
if he has a clone out then a singel slash of PS or TBB would wipe them off immediately rendering this strategy moot,
and the funniest thing is that minatos attacks are senjutsu so sasuke gets turned to stone
him absorbing the level of minats attacks falls under no limits fallacy as well
Ps sword or chidori used on susanoo hand or blades chops kurama up.
PS slash canonically failed to put a dent even on regular kurama, let alone a senjutsu kurama
let alone the slash being powerful enoguh to chop kurama up,
and PS chidori is a rikudo sasuke feat, and even if we assume that he can use it here then minato can just evade it since sasuke has to come right up close to land it
Minato shadow clones gets raped by Sasuke in a fight at this magnitude clowns are useless to begin with beside cleaning up the dirty work.
Classic double standard from you
you say sasuke would be swinging his PS blade and absorbing minatos attacks from his clones but now minatos clones are getting caught? Lol
clones are only being used in a battle outside of constructs, never said anything else,
Calm yo ass down you typing like a school girl with a crush.
That's what I should be telling you since you keep coming at me with this BS acting like it's gonna fly.
Zero evidence what now you just denying shit who reached the peak of their speed at 17 years old? no one the prime for ninja's are mid 30s Adult Sasuke is in his mid 30s he's much faster than his 17 year old self.
I never said that Sasuke's peak was his War Arc speed. I said that you have zero proof he's as fast as BSM Minato. That simple.
How did you prove me wrong we both agreed on Sasuke shunshin to protect naruto = KM naruto shunshin to dodge raikage meaning they're evenly matched foot speed and shunshin we have no idea how fast kmc minato shunshin is so its all speculation, Base minato has no remarkable shunshin nb4 all his feats he did at War arc it was off screen so irrelevant.
Niga how stupid can you get? What you saw was your post not mine. I missed it when I was quoting that shit. Not once have I ever agreed to that "Sasuke's Shunshin=KCM Naruto's Shunshin" BS. Get that shit out of here. Feats put KCM Minato in KCM Naruto's league when it comes to reaction speed, thus KCM Minato's Shunshin is just as fast as Naruto's at the very least, and it's most likely that it's faster. Base Minato's speed feats are completely irrelevant when we know he was far faster than Naruto.
No one ever said Sasuke was faster than Ei he was able to intercept juubito's attack does that mean he's faster than him no so your logic fails Hiruzen being able to move means nothing when he could not dodge shit also if he was getting hit while alive he would not been able to move being edo gave him no pain tolerance.
1. Says that he thinks that "Sasuke's Shunshin to protect Naruto=KM Naruto Shunshin to dodge Raikage"
2. Then says that he never said Sasuke is faster than Ay despite saying he's equal in speed to someone who is faster?
Smh. Make up your mind. The bold is irrelevant. Him being able to move means that he reacted, thus he avoided a shot to the head or the chest and took on in the arm. Pain tolerance has shit to do with it when he wasn't hit until after he had already partly evaded. If he can't completely blitz the likes of Hiruzen with Gudo Dama alone, then it's not anything remarkable. That simple.
He actually was. Him dominating Sasuke in all other areas is a joke his foot speed was not much impressive especially when he could not even dodge a simple jab from juubito in his v2 even with ftg.
The wank is so strong. Your beloved Sasuke was getting his ass blitzed by Juubito, and it took a Senjutsu Susanoo for him to be able to react in any type of way that'd let him strike Juubito. All he could do was mentally react at best. Zero proof he'd fare any better. Then there's the fact that Minato w/ Kurama and Sage Mode>>>Minato w/o it. So this point is useless to make anyway.
Sage mode is overrated the only impressive speed feat it displayed was a blitz against asura path getting blitz by a Madara with no eyes bsm kurama shown nothing more impressive than bm and even if it does give you a good boost of speed its certainly not the difference between adult sasuke and teen sasuke moot point is moot.
Learn how Sage mode works, cause you really sound dumb right here. Why are you judging BSM Minato's speed based on SM Naruto's speed feats? Sage Mode enhances Naruto's base. BIJUU SAGE MODE enhances his Bijuu Mode, thus the end result is always going to be greater. Naruto went from getting blitzed by Juubito with zero reaction, to reacting to him and tracking him. Saying that Sage Mode isn't a massive boost to reaction speed is like saying that EMS precog didn't give Sasuke a big boost in reaction speed, when he went from being blitzed and not being able to tag Juubito to being able to tag him. Not to mention revived Madara already
Then there's the fact that Naruto reacted to Blind Madara, who is far faster than 3rd Raikage. Something he can't even do in Base, thus it's a massive boost. Fuk you even mentioning Shunshin speed feats for? Don't give a damn. We are talking about reaction speed.
The fact you've resorted to saying that Sage Mode grants no/negligible boost only tells me how weak your other arguments are.
I will be looking forward to your argument scrum crum.
You stopped reading they're because you had no counter to my argument just concede already especially concerning this argument im not reposting the scans of something you already know boy. Your the only one using plot as your argument you gave no real counter to this even below your just trying to refute the mechanics of the warp+strike while not even saying how minato does not die by these which he does.
That's what I just stated. Thanks for repeating to my argument.
Stop jumping to the conclusion that Minato can still react that is far to close by the time he even know's sasuke is gone its over also why would sasuke strike after he teleports when we've seen he can strike when he teleports making it a no striking speed attack as i explained above someone like juubito can easily react to sm naruto's and tobirama's attack yet was getting blind sided everytime they came at him untill he set up a defense before the warped to him its gg for Him.
How close Sasuke teleports is irrelevant since at the end of the day, he'll still have to strike and he couldn't strike RSM Naruto at VoTE. Take away Hagoromo's power and you are left with BM and EMS Sasuke, and BSM is far faster than BM when it comes to reaction speed, so EMS Sasuke gets reacted to. That simple. Sasuke canonically failed to blitz two vital targets in his goals, but of course, devoted Sasuke fans such as yourself constantly make excuses. I think I'll go with canon thank you very much. At the end of the day, Manga>You.
Wrong. As I've already stated. He did react. He tried to activate Kamui instead of blocking. Set up a defense? Lmao. Stop making excuses and including irrelevant shit to change what happened. Your clown ass is claiming that Hiraishin and Ameno attacks are instantaneous and spawn ON TOP OF THE TARGET. Even though that makes no sense since Obito reacted to a Hiraishin blitz with his chakra arms. Unless his goddamn chakra arms somehow move much faster than instantaneous speed, there's no way that he can block them regardless of whether he's started to guard his back, cause he actually has to activate it first.
Grasping at straws at its finest they're was no striking speed in that attack we've seen Sasuke using a warp then an attack its looks like
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or
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in those scenes Sasuke was shown cocking his arm back and ready to strike not in the scans i posted you trying to walk your way around the manga scan is pathetic as shit just concede already you fool. To further shit on this dumb post ofc Sasuke arm is extended his arm has always been extended but it was extended before the attack making it no striking speed that simple look at what Naruto and Tobirama did to Obito same exact thing arm already extended no striking speed needed quit acting like you do not get it.
So somehow Sasuke produced enough force to knock Naruto out of the air without actually moving his arm to strike? LMAO. You sound extra stupid here. I guess Kishimoto confused the you and the rest of the slow kids since he can't animate the Manga like they do the Anime.
1. What you are saying is impossible. How the hell does Sasuke knock Naruto out of the air without putting force behind his attack? Please don't answer that btw, cause the answer is "he can't" and I already know you're about to give some dumbass answer.
2. Most times there has been a blitz, Kishimoto doesn't show the actual strike of the person doing the blitzing. If I used your shitty logic, I'd be saying that the following had no striking speed involved at all.
-http://narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/638/19/
Guess Obito magically cut them apart.
-http://narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/639/19/
Guess Obito teleported them to his hands.
-http://narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/637/12/
Guess that Magic made Minato's arm swing up/down and cut into Obito's torso. Definitely no striking speed here. Definitely no strike at all.
Because that's how you use Chidori. The only reason you didn't see that shit against Madara is because Madara was too slow to react, thus he got blitzed. The only one trying to walk their way around Manga feats is you. Ameno canonically failed against Naruto. Downscale and it fails again, but this time Naruto is slower than Minato, thus Minato evades it. You keep making these petty excuses, telling me "Ameno is instantaneous striking" Oh wait, "no striking at all". Even though that makes no sense. You can't hurt your opponent unless you strike them, especially since Sasuke's attack works by thrusting his hand at the opponent to do damage. If Sasuke had struck BEFORE Madara was put into place, you would see no impact marks when Madara gets hit, because there wouldn't be force behind his hand to make an impact mark. But of course, keep ignoring Manga. That's what you do best.
Lmao, once again, you sound dumb.
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Not only are there motion lines on Naruto's arm, showing that he did move. How the actual hell is his Rasengan going to put a hole in Obito's back and throw him to the ground if no force was put behind it to begin with? Then once again, we see the same impact marks around the Rasengan when it collides with Obito's back, showing that Naruto put force behind it. Shit didn't just spawn on his body. Lmao. Ridiculous. So:
-Naruto can create craters like that and holes in people's back by simply laying Rasengan on their back?
-Obito can react to instant striking since he confirmed he tried to use Kamui but failed.
Learn how Rasengan and Chidori works. Chidori works by thrusting your hand at the opponent to pierce through them. The less force behind your attack, the less damage. Same with Rasengan. The less force behind Rasengan, the less damage it'll do.
Then there's the fact that if he could've instantaneously blitzed Kaguya both times, he would've done so. If he could instantaneously blitz Naruto, he would've. But he didn't, because he can't. Your inability to read the Manga won't change that.
Keep em' coming. Just keep the dumb shit coming.
I get every word you are saying. It's just among the stupidest things I've read this week. Smh.
How does this help you at all the only reason a warping attack can be countered is because the striking speed of the opponent is to slow to finish the blow but if you attack before you warp that takes out that possibility and if you get this what are you denying here dumbass adding to fuel to the fire thats burning his house down fail attempt at trying to deny the manga leads you in a circle supporting your opposition.
Wrong. The only time the option to be able to counter is gone is if Sasuke were to literally teleport his attack into Minato. He can wait as long as he pleases, but as long as he's teleporting the target before his strike reaches it's position, the target has the chance to evade, especially when they are faster with the ability to teleport with a thought.
It being an attack is irrelevant since these are scans im posting showing Sasuke making contact with the opponent the moment he warps himself.
Another post of shit talking please just respond to me and there is a difference between fan and fanboy look it up you worm. EMS Sasuke as an adult > EMS Madara so your right this is not Madara were talking about Sasuke does not need rikudo chakra as long as his tech remain the same he comfortable defeats Minato he does win this low diff look at the arguments your trying to present what a joke.
There is a difference. I can name quite a few Sasuke fans who don't vigorously wank off to him like you do.
Where is the proof for the bold? Oh wait, you don't have it, just like with the rest of your claims. Lmao. Get this shit out of my face.
You trying to make up your own story with how this works and your not making since at all why would Sasuke warp Madara after the attack if that makes sense at all vs him warping him the moment of the attack? Im still baffled on how pathetic you are when trying to cover your tracks how would warping someone after you attack even work? if he were to do that with Kaguya how would it even work when they're done attacking warping someone at the moment of impact gives them no time to counter you at all or react to you all together fail logic fails once more. Everytime he warped Kaguya what happen it was much before his attack right yes and i want you to try and deny logic if Sasuke and Naruto would have assumed this
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now picture that but take Kaguya out now as they draw closer to each other then he decides to warp her what happens it game over right they're and how does Kaguya dodging Sasuke using his ameno before he strikes helps Minato? Teleportation is instant regarless if its EMS Sasuke kid Sasuke or baby Sasuke so its moot and when he can strike then warp or strike at the moment of impact which he does in certain situations it curtains fo Minato. Furthermore the distance between Minato and Kaguya is far larger than the difference between Adult Sasuke (No Hagaoromo chakra) compared to himself that fought her using her as a comparison was terribly flawed on your behalf.
I've replied to this shit argument too many times already. Read above. All that needs to be said here. He canonically failed twice against Kaguya and Naruto once. Stop trying to give Sasuke the ability to perform better than he did in the Manga by making up horseshit like "He could've blitzed Kaguya if he wanted to, he just didn't feel like it". Ignoring all the flawed logic, that's essentially what your argument boils down to. Weak. As. Hell.
The bold is irrelevant since I didn't compare Kaguya to Minato.
That would only make since if naruto on had one hand and what would be the point of sensing abilities if when getting your Los blocked makes it harder for you to counter attack? Also its a simple katon Naruto cloaks before the boost tanked a much larger katon then reacted to obito meaning a katon as a distraction plus teleportation is not playing to naruto's weakness especially since at the end of the vote fight when he was in base he shrugged off amaterasu which is much deadlier than a katon without a problem.
Never said that getting your line of sight makes it hard to block. L2Read. I said that being occupied with a Katon is what makes it harder to counter attack. Whether or not Naruto can tank Katon is completely irrelevant since he decided to actively counter it with a chakra arm, which will make it harder for him to react to Sasuke's incoming attack, which is my point. Stop mentioning irrelevant shit.
Sensing Him only helps my case i hope you know that. im pretty sure he was nearly blitz Madara (If we take out the fact that Madara stiked sai first giving naruto more time to react) and he could sense Madara as well sensing means nothing when you have not the physical prowess to react or evade. Naruto did not block it he just managed to turn around if he would have blocked it he would have not been thrown off his feet by a tech that has no explosive power behind it, We already know what Naruto looks like when he's trying to block a near blitz/blitz and being thrown into the air with his hand loosely flying around his not an blocking attempt sorry.
Sensing him doesn't help your case, at all. It doesn't prove that Sasuke blitzed him, nor does it prove that the fireball had no factor in Sasuke even getting as far as he did. Why are you still mentioning Sage Mode Naruto feats? Smh. Ridiculous. SM Naruto=Base Naruto on steroids. BSM Naruto=BM Naruto on steroids. One is obviously stronger than the other.
Bold ends this part of the argument, since you just said that he reacted, which is my point.
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He blocked. Clear as day. If he didn't block his arm wouldn't be up and he would've been hit right in the chest, which he wasn't. Him being thrown backwards is because his block was poor and the force behind the attack was too much, which goes back into his poor guard.
Your not getting the point is RSM Naruto is to what BSM would be vs fighting EMS Sasuke with amenotejikara Kurama cloak + sensing abilities being blitz/nearly blitz in the same thing so when i said you take away the Hagoromo's chakra this is what i was referring to not Hagoromo chakra just adding on more power to his already existing sage mode Nice try though but no. I dont get your gathering of Nature energy part for Bsm Naruto when his senjutsu from Hagoromo worked basically in the same way just gathers much more of it faster considering what he did at VOTE they have the same mechanics one is just more more powerful.
No, it's not. Makes zero sense. Why would it be BSM vs. EMS Sasuke w/ Ameno when RSM and Rikudo Sasuke downscale to BM Naruto and EMS Sasuke? The lack of Sage Sensing is irrelevant when:
1. Sasuke's speed isn't being buffed by any of Hagoromo's chakra either.
2. BM Naruto can still sense chakra, but not as good as Sage Mode.
At best, Sasuke would be able to edge him out a bit due to the lack of Sage Sensing, but give BM Naruto Sage Sensing and he'd easily react to that attack from EMS Sasuke considering once again, they downscale to BM and EMS. Not BSM. Then there's the fact that BSM Minato>BM Naruto in reaction speed.
When do you see Naruto standing still and gathering Nature Energy to enter RSM?
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He enters it without needing to gather Nature Energy. Hagoromo's Senjutsu was given to him, why would he need to gather it from the atmosphere? Better yet, why would Hagoromo's Senjutsu be in the atmosphere in the first place? The only time he ever gathers Nature Energy again is when he's forming his final two RS against Sasuke at VoTE, but that has nothing to do with him entering RSM.
I countered what you thought you did above so ill adress the Tobirama part. Tobirama was just being caution they even attacked Obito again and was not hurt at all, That is not a display of reaction that is a display of he already knew what was coming Naruto loudly shouted at Tobirama to use his jutsu Obito knowing what that was just put chakra hands on his back the moment they attacked his back they would ran into chakra hands instead of his actually body if the would have warped to the front of Obito he would have been killed but since he knew they could only go behind him because that's were the seal was he was ready for Sasuke jutsu you could never be ready because he can strike you anywhere at any time. Maybe the time when they got him with Amaterasu it was a surprised attack but Obito knows ftg marking dont fade so why would he just let his guard down completely and if he did he would have enough time to put it up before a striker considering Madara arm fully extended was able to chop Tobirama down obito being faster than Madara would have no problem plus he a juubi jin level sensor surprise attacks are near impossible for people of their level to do on him. Everytime Sasuke used ameno on her it was clearly different than those scans i showed you so keep denying shit not helping you here at all.
Lmao. Stop making excuses. Tobirama said what he said because it would happen if they had jumped behind him again at that moment in time. The only reason they survived is because Naruto and Minato were in Kurama Mode so Kurama could ward off Obito's attack. Not to mention them getting hurt isn't the point. The point is, Tobirama knows that Obito would be able to react to their next attack, meaning that they did not hit him instantaneously.
-Minato tagged Obito on his neck or his back during their fight.
-Then teleported to his front side and stabbed him with a Kunai.
So no, he can teleport wherever he pleases. Smh. Come on now.
Obito knowing what's coming doesn't change anything unless he prepared his chakra arms before Minato and Naruto and Tobirama attacked, but that's not what happened.
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They teleported, and he reacted with chakra arms. His chakra arms were not up before that strike, nor were they up when Tobirama had teleported the duo, so tell me more about Obito's chakra arms move faster than instantaneous.
Lmao. Him being able to sense is irrelevant when he doesn't know when they'll use Hiraishin. He only knows that they've used it once he feels their presence behind him. Thus it's a surprise attack. Then there's the fact that the Amaterasu business was him giving zero shits about what they were doing since they can't hurt him. The only time he put his guard up is when Tobirama clearly stated that he put his guard up.
@underlined: What are you talking about?
Lmao. There is nothing different besides the fact that one person couldn't react, and the other could.
Already countered this for the most part especially that surprise attack nonsense Madara with sm was able to dodge a surprised attack from Tobirama yet juubito would not be able to lets see superior foot speed and sensing the surprise attack nonsense it not going to fly at all.
What in the hell are you talking about? Those 2 scenarios are completely different. Madara pretty much reacted to Tobirama dashing at him from behind since Tobirama teleported on the Mazo's head, and then dashed at him. We are talking about Naruto teleporting right to Obito's location and striking him with Rasengan. You'd be a fool to try and argue that he got blitzed because he couldn't react when he already showed the reaction speed to react to the SAME EXACT ATTACK, but faster and larger.
Obito never once tried to use intangibility up until after he was hit why would he need to? he knew he was superior to them and every aspect physically so them being to close for him to react so he would force a kamui would have never came to mind especially since he just got hit by a Enton rasenshuriken and did not think any of their Ninjutsu would work on him anyways that kills your kamui argument.
Doesn't really change anything. Obito already showed that he can react to Hiraishin attacks from BM Naruto and BM Minato let alone SM Naruto. And Tobirama already stated that he'd be able to react later on.
Tobirama only made that clear after he saw obito flare chakra up on his back because i stated above he knew what they're were up to and since he knew that had senjutsu he would have no choice but to resort to his chakra hands like he did against the bm avatars killed this point thank you come again.
-What you said above is basically "Obito used chakra arms before they used Hiraishin".
-Do Manga Panels show this?
No. Not even one bit. So all you are doing is providing evidence that Obito can react to the "so called instant" Hiraishin blitz. So either you think Obito's reactions are faster than instantaneous movement, and that his attacks move faster than instant too, which would also mean that you think Kurama moves faster than instant since he slapped away Obito's chakra arms.
Don't know the English term, but I know it's long as hell. Just Google it. Not that serious.
You do know this hurts you right furthermore i posted that more because of him instantly touching obito vs Obito giving a care in the world about dodging so this post is irrelevant No Obito got his back busted open after this he did not even react to ftg when they used the bm avatar's he just counter by using chakra hands before they actually used the ftg you have yet to counter my post but itso okay.
If they we're the same speed why would his cloak design change? just to look cooler know the difference between their speed is vast like the difference between every tail being grown to add on more power what even makes this claim worst is that KM naruto was only good for dodging Ei and thats using a top speed shunshin why Kakashi a genius and Mianto's student thought Naruto was Minato how fast he swatted the Bijuu damas even Obito was surprised by his speed while he did not show the slight worry about km Naurto's Databook Refering them as kurama chakra mode is right because that is kurama's chakra mode just with more power being used in one because one has the power of Kurama not wanted to help naruto feeling like he's being held prisoner while the other is best friends with kurama allowing him to access its full power a big difference between the two and under any normal circumstances you would agree but not here why because it helps your arguments the inconsistencies in your debate style kills me my dude.
Then like I said, the difference isn't that small. It's really that simple. Thanks for not addressing all of the point and crying about my "inconsistent" debate style when in reality it's just you getting upset and throwing false accusations because you are mad you can't beat some guy in a debate over the internet. Lmfao. Not that serious guy. Not that serious. Like I've said before, keep the crying to yourself. I give no ****s about your opinions when you can't even form logical arguments on your own. We could have Kishi sitting right next to you and you'd still be saying stupid shit.
-Being compared to Minato is irrelevant considering KCM Naruto was being compared to that same Minato. So go on, keep on proving my point. That there is no extremely large difference that'd benefit your point here.
-It being Kurama+Naruto=Big Jump in power is true, because
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is far stronger than
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. Once again, does not address speed. Stop trying to attribute the giant jump in power between Naruto's cloaks w/o BM even being a factor.
Its more of an ameno feat instead of a rikudo Sasuke's you even admitted that in your second sentence so what is the fuss about and Rikudou Sasuke using ameno is equal to Part 1 Sasuke using ameno why because instant is instant no matter who its coming from unless he used ameno like he used it against Kaguya instead of uses its most efficient way warping at the moment of impact. Not comparing EMS sasuke to rinnegan Sasuke but when they use ameno in a good way its all the same because they only difference would be striking speed and when you take that away from the equation they're is non really so it would not matter what Sasuke would use it as long as he warps minato at the moment of impact to kill him.
Smh. Regardless of any of this, your strategy doesn't work since Sasuke has to switch with the weapon in question, then that weapon attacks the opponent. Madara's scenario is completely irrelevant here since he was charging at Sasuke, which only made it harder to notice the sword attacking him, or are you going to tell me that it was warped into his chest? Lmao. Not to mention the Kunai, sword and Sasuke will all be in the same area, he can't swap with them regardless.
This post made no sense you said he was able to track juubito's movements mentally then turn around and say he cannot mentally react to Juubito? what not only has he reacted to juubito he already displayed the speed the force Juubito to block instead of dodge because once you can completely tracked someone's movements you can and a since fight on par with them physically The VOTE fight is an example Naruto was smashing Sasuke but when he turned on his 3 tomoe he got no speed boost yet he started smashing Naruto why because once your mentally tracking someone with 3 and above you have some chance of fending them off i say 3 tomoe and above because we've seen with 2 tomoe it does not work as Sasuke still lost to rocklee. If you read my post carefully you would see him getting behind Sasuke is never happening furthermore he reacted to a much faster juubito with susanoo ameno and his natural speed reacting is no problem at all.
The post makes perfect sense. You just don't/can't understand it, even though it's simple logic.
1. Never said that he can't mentally react to Juubito. I said that he was only able to do so because he was tracking him with Sharingan. I hope you aren't implying that tracking someone once is enough to let you react to them regardless of whether or not you use Sharingan again.
2. He displayed the speed to force Juubito to block with a Senjutsu Kyuubi Chakra Enhanced Susanoo. Something that strikes far faster than he does with his own body. So why in the world are you even mentioning this?
Daft? please use simpler words you know im slow when it comes to complex words. No you cannot definitely not in that scan all the tails looked meshed into one. his tails we're cut go and look at the scan because im honestly tired of reposting literally the same scans for your dumbass.
Not even sure if serious. I literally posted scans showing Naruto with all his tails intact, and I posted a scan with 9 boxes around the 9 points of his 9 very intact tails AND I posted scans of what his damaged tails look like, yet you are still coming at me with this horseshit? Lmao. No rebuttal means concession accepted.
i was not going to say but ill agree that the tails took more damage from the juubi laser than from his sword.
Doesn't have jack to do with external abilities such as Raikiri. So now you are attributing a black Rikudo Raikiri with Kamui's abilities to having both MS? Lord, when will you stop grasping at straws.
Those shuriken were susanoo shuriken which he never had in the first place moot point.
Naruto never had more then 1 bijuu entity in him at the same time nor did he have enough chakra to whip up more than one Kurama mode when at max he could only make 3 bm clones.
LMFAO. You stay making petty excuses. Naruto only had tiny pieces of the Bijuu's chakra. They are completely irrelevant. What are you even talking about? Naruto made 4-5 clones when he was distributing his chakra out to the other shinobi.
Bijuu dama rasen shuriken is him taking down one of his gudo damas using them as the black sphere then adding bijuu dama in to it
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Naruto clearly using his gudo dama
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No gudo damas to be seen near Naruto why because they're used to make all those bijuu dama rasenshuriken.
No Gudo Dama here. He used BDFRS w/o a Gudo Dama. So what excuse are you going to come up with this time?
Nice try goes to you because i shitted on all those post. Furthermore even if they were true it would be irrelevant because Sasuke has already shown combination jutsu Enton Susanoo curse mark susanoo.
Both are his Mangekyo techniques. Being able to combine them is completely irrelevant to him being able to combine chidori and PS. Now. When Adult Sasuke w/o Hagoromo's chakra shows any of Hagoromo buffed Sasuke's feats, please get at me. Until then, stop giving Sasuke feats you and I both know that he can't perform.
Why are you insulting to me just try to counter my post little man
No he would not he already got blitz in canon if we downscale them read above i already countered your reverting back to bm argument which was shitty as hell. BSM Minato being faster than BM Naruto is fanfic for one considering Naruto bm avatar takes a new design thus more power while Minato does not making him faster right they're Minato's unimpressive ass sage mode does make up for it since its showed nothing better than his base. Blitzing him would be no problem Adult Sasuke without rikudou chakra is rinnegan alive Madara's level which is well above that of bsm Minato also you cannot react to Sasuke using amenotejikara in the way he has used it most efficient. Adult Sasuke is faster why because with no boost Sasuke has gotten faster consistently through the series it would not stop a the young age of 17
You didn't counter shit. You said what you think it'd downscale to, even though that makes no sense, and provided no reasoning for it besides "Hurr Naruto can sense". Lmao. Go learn how to actually address someone's statements and get back to me.
Rikudo Naruto=Rikudo Sasuke
Subtract the Rikudo power.
Naruto=Sasuke
Naruto has no Senjutsu left over so stop mentioning BSM Naruto.
BSM Minato being faster than BM Naruto is fact. Naruto getting a BM boost is completely irrelevant when SM is enough to let him react to Juubito when before he was getting blitzed with no reaction. Don't give a shit about BM being faster than KCM when the sensing is the reason he was able to react. The rest of that sentence is you crying about how Sage Mode doesn't give a boost even though it's Manga fact that it does. Something you seem to love denying, because you and I both know that the only way Sasuke stomps or even wins is if you ignore Manga Fact.
EMS Sasuke speed > Hebi Sasuke's > VOTE 1 > CE2 Sasuke > FOD Sasuke > Beg series Sasuke he has consistently got faster yet he wont after 17 what a joke Adult Hashirama > Teen Hashirama in speed Adult Kakashi > Teen Kakashi in speed Adult Gai > Teen gai in speed Shippuden lee > Part 1 lee in speed and so on that logic holds much more water than your that sasuke did not gain a lick of speed over 15 year time span.
Never said he didn't get faster. Learn how to read child. I said there is no proof that he's faster than BSM Minato, or BM Naruto or BSM Naruto. That simple. Crying about "adult Sasuke" isn't going to change the fact that you have no evidence. So please get at me when you have evidence. That simple.
Perfect susanoo susanoo slashes explodes it in his face
How about you try proving the shit you spew retard. Lmao. This is getting pretty annoying. Sasuke's Susanoo has no insane speed feat that'd let it dodge a Flash Bijuu Dama. When you can provide them, I'll be here. Until then, you have no point.
since minato would not be that close unless he wanna get bisected on Sasuke
Except Sasuke's PS isn't strong enough to bisect a Sage Kurama Avatar when multiple hits to BM Naruto's tail wouldn't be enough to even damage it.
would simply advoid via amenotejikara its not landing that simple i already proved why that is not a feat that should be included to just rinnegan Sasuke read above you joke. Since even in his VOTE fight he was still getting his 6 paths powers we know he has Shira tensei since chibaku tensei is a deva path ability he blows that away. Furthermore Obito notes a flash BD to be slow
If he evades with Ameno, then Minato simply fires another one, but this time he doesn't evade since his cooldown screws him over. Inb4 "Ameno has no cooldown" or some BS like that.
Smh. That's not flash Bijuu Dama.
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That's flash Bijuu Dama. Why are you making up Manga facts? Smh. Then there's the fact that it doesn't take a genius to realize that Naruto fired that slow on purpose, considering he's fired larger and smaller BD much faster than that.
Pretty sure everyone who is reading this pile of garbage you call a post is waiting for you to do this very thing.
You must be really be but hurt huh? I already told you i would take a judges decision L anyday of the week before i take an L saying i cant counter this post any way shape or form so i concede to your Almighty Unorthodox's arguments.
Compare SM Naruto to Base Naruto. Compare Naruto getting blitzed to Naruto tracking Juubito.
My proof is that can we compare a 17 year old Madara to Prime Madara? no plus Sasuke was barely weaker than ems Madara at 17 he grew alot considering from the last and VOTE his chidori was on a completely different scale take away the chakra its the same thing in the last is only about 3 years after VOTE so imagine what would have happened in 15 years easily above Madara's level.
Smh. You've only proved that he's gotten stronger. You haven't proved that he's gotten stronger than Madara. Bold is speculation with a weak basis. I'm waiting for evidence.
As long as it's within his 8 minute time limit, he can. Unless you are going to tell me that 3 BD>Kurama's chakra.
furthermore i literally just countered that argument like 3 post ago and i guess Sasuke would just sit there why Minato pumps out Bijuu Dama's nope he warps above him and whops that head tha phuck up or pull the Bijuu damas right into Minato's face with universal pull.
No your inconsistent because when people can use your own post to counter your agruments your inconsistent as hell then you either say your misunderstanding me or twisting my words or i change my mind how tf that make you look like a joke. No one is obsessed with beating a guy who i just did like 2 days ago i made you concede your below me like a phucking basement.
This is what you do. You take posts from literally 2 years ago, and try to use them against me as if I haven't changed my mind in the last 2 years due to new feats. Then you cry like a bitch about how I'm inconisent. Grow up kid. It's getting pretty annoying having some annoying guy on the site trying his hardest to:
-Trump me.
-Find contradictions in my posts.
-Use posts from 2-3 years ago against me.
Smh. Moron. What's funny is that half of those times your illiterate ass twists the words I'm saying. Don't cry about it like it isn't true.
When you lie about it, it only makes you look bad. This is why you'll stay a low level poster with low level intelligence.
Crater was not even larger than EE shit not big at all. Kurama tails is a different thing his head and body gets shreded with ration running though his perfect susanoo sword or he can just attack Mianto's body no difference.
Crater wasn't as deep as EE, but far wider. Not like I give two shits how big it is anyway. It wrecked your precious Sasuke's Boosted susanoo, which is on par with PS, and it wrecked Naruto's Avatar, something Sasuke couldn't do at VoTE. Downscale that and you get BIJUU MODE NARUTO WITH NO SENJUTSU AND SASUKE WITH NO RIKUDO CHAKRA. Stop saying stupid shit like this:
A senjutsu buff was already added from the vote fight because naruto has his own so that point is stupidly irrelevant.
When Naruto's previous Sage Mode is irrelevant when he does not take in that energy after gaining RSM. Lmao. I'm probably talking to someone with an IQ of 90 or below here.
Minato cannot react to something to Sasuke warping him at the moment of impact so dodges with ftg is irrelevant and where is ftg going to be exactly? PS slashes destroys the whole landscape along with Minato's pointless flash Bijuu damas any ftg kunai is roasted by Sasuke's clowns. Teen Sasuke susanoo did not cut a tail adult Sasuke susanoo with Hagoromo's chakra is much more powerful scale them down same result happens so Minato gets whacked.
If Sasuke is fighting while flying, how the actual hell is he going to see any Kunai to burn up with Enton? Lmao. Once again, you sound dumb. PS Slash destroys the landscape, but it's not focused enough to do shit to hand sized Kunai. Same reason why Mokuton and pieces of earth were left intact after it's slash. Not to mention this was Madara's, and no one here has proved that Sasuke's PS is as strong as Madara's, you've only proved that it's stronger. Not to mention he had Hagoromo's chakra after the War Arc.
-Teen Sasuke's Susanoo couldn't do shit.
-Rikudo Sasuke's Susanoo couldn't do shit.
-Downscaling proves that Sasuke's Susanoo can't do shit, along with your lack of evidence that his Susanoo got strong enough to do anything you are claiming it can do here, when this is how strong it was while Sasuke was a teen.
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Dat PS tho. Get me proof that he went from that to this:
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Then we can talk about him reaching the level above Madara's. Cause he'd need to be above Madara if he wanted to beat BSM Minato.
There are no implications. You simply don't have evidence for your claims.Not to mention you keep on twisting what Kurama said to try and have your argument connect with your speculation even that's not how it works.
-Stop mentioning sinister and powerful in the same sentence. For the last time they are not the same thing. I don't know how many people have to come here and explain this to you. Sasuke's chakra being sinister means that it's sinister. That simple. Not to mention he never said that his chakra is just as sinister as Madar'as, he said that Sasuke's chakra is more sinister than his own, just like Madara. Meaning that they both have more sinister chakra than Kurama, not that their chakra is comparable. Especially since you claim that their chakra is comparable when Sasuke is in Hebi form and Madara is in EMS form. (which already sounds like BS) Then we have MS Sasuke w/ Armored Susanoo, who's chakra power>>>Hebi Sasuke's. Then we have EMS Sasuke, who's chakra power>>>MS Sasuke's at his strongest. So how are EMS Sasuke and EMS Madara still comparable after all those massive jumps? What's worse is that EMS Sasuke's PS is far weaker than EMS Madara's, showing the gap in power between them despite your claim that Hebi Sasuke's chakra is comparable to Madara's.
-Suppressing Kurama is irrelevant when talking about how powerful his chakra is in comparison to Madara's. It's clear as all hell that you are reaching here.
-Choku Tomoe is irrelevant. Those are abilities. Them sharing an ability only they can achieve doesn't mean that they are destined to reach the same maximum potential strength.
-And Indra's reincarnation is irrelevant. Stop using this poor logic. Naruto and Hashirama are both Ashura's reincarnations, but Naruto can't even hope to reach Hashirama's level without a Bijuu, nor can he even hope to reach Hashirama's chakra amount or the strength of his chakra w/o a Bijuu. Or are you going to argue that Prime Naruto should have chakra on par with Hashirama's just like Sasuke and Madara, based on the fact that they are both reincarnates. Smh.
I'm waiting for you to give me evidence. That simple. This whole post only shows me that you don't have real evidence.
What's funnier is that despite you have no evidence for your claims, I still addressed your arguments. EMS Madara loses, so does Sasuke even if you give him his Susanoo feats.
You clearly missed the scan which states his hatred/evil turns into power [
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]. Sinister=evil/criminal. Hence when Kurama compares him to Madara in that regard he is technically stating they are comparable in chakra quality, imo (not twisting anything here, sinisterness is obviously directly linked to chakra potency). All the boosts that came thereafter are irrelevant. He was being compared, he wasn't his equal yet. Not to mention the chakra quantity Madara can pump into his PS was the greatest difference between the two Susano'o. But Sasuke is implicatively comparable chakra-quantity wise since your spiritual+physical energy increase through experience and physical training, and the result is more chakra. After 12+ years I'd assume his chakra is comparable to Madara's. And no, I don't have real evidence, I only have Kurama's comparison and Karin's statement, both being Indra's reincarnates which should have an impact (since both are Uchiha's unlike Nardo and Hashirama); which imo, is enough.
@Kagutsuchi The speed difference is not negligible since Naruto deflected TBB's with insane momentum with a mere shunshin. If anything his shroud either had more chakra in it and thus would work like Ay's Raiton shroud, where more chakra=greater burst of speed, or he attained a greater chakra control capacity where his Shunshin would improve tremendously. And yes, chakra control does have an effect on Shunshin as shown by Ino being faster then Nardo with the shroud.
You clearly missed the scan which states his hatred/evil turns into power [
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]. Sinister=evil/criminal. Hence when Kurama compares him to Madara in that regard he is technically stating they are comparable in chakra quality, imo (not twisting anything here, sinisterness is obviously directly linked to chakra potency). All the boosts that came thereafter are irrelevant. He was being compared, he wasn't his equal yet. Not to mention the chakra quantity Madara can pump into his PS was the greatest difference between the two Susano'o. But Sasuke is implicatively comparable chakra-quantity wise since your spiritual+physical energy increase through experience and physical training, and the result is more chakra. After 12+ years I'd assume his chakra is comparable to Madara's. And no, I don't have real evidence, I only have Kurama's comparison and Karin's statement, both being Indra's reincarnates which should have an impact (since both are Uchiha's unlike Nardo and Hashirama); which imo, is enough.
No, he said that his hatred boosts his power. Not that his hatred turns into power and not that it makes his chakra stronger. Not to mention Sasuke's hatred and the sinister feel to his chakra are not the same thing at all. Sinister chakra is not powerful chakra. Sinisterness has to deal with the feel of the chakra, not it's power. They are not related. Not even sure why you are still trying to compare Hebi Sasuke and EMS Madara's chakra power when the difference between their Susanoo says enough. Chakra quantity isn't what makes Susanoo as strong as it is. Chakra quality is. If Sasuke's chakra quality was on par with Madara's, then his Susanoo would be on par with Madara's.
Whether or not he was his equal doesn't matter. You are saying that they are comparable. That means the gap is not large, even though it makes zero sense for it not to be large for the reasons I've already explained. If Hebi Sasuke had comparable chakra power to Madara, then EMS Sasuke would have stronger chakra.
Them both being Uchiha isn't enough. Uzumaki are descended from Senju. Not to mention being reincarnates of the same person transcends any blood bond. Yet Naruto's chakra will never reach Hashirama's on it's own.
And Naruto did not deflect Bijuu Dama with pure speed. People need to stop saying that. He used his tails to smack them away.
And what?
s shown by Ino being faster then Nardo with the shroud.
Are you joking? Are you really saying that cloaked Ino has a better Shunshin than Naruto? Because this panel doesn't even show Ino moving and it only shows her using Shintenshin.
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Obviously by "faster than me" he was referring to how she got the Juubi and redirected it's attack before Naruto could act and save Choji. Nothing to do with Shunshin.
1. I've already proven that there was movement. You've just replied with the same thing that I already replied to. Sasuke and Naruto had to thrust their attacks to hit Madara. Sasuke and Naruto hit him hard enough to make impact marks, shown on Madara's sides where he was struck. That's movement. Madara didn't spawn onto their attack. If he spawned onto their attack then he wouldn't have been hit hard enough to actually do that. By this shitty ass logic Konohamaru would be able to blitz Kaguya with Ameno because "she'd spawn on his attack". I guess the Manga being in still picture has really confused people who don't have the intellectual capacity to read it correctly. Smh.
No you didn't prove anything relevant here at all. Just because you twist the Manga to your argument doesn't mean your given a proper counter. Didn't i already explain once he appeared on their attacks them pushed into him. I guess Obito didn't spawn here either because there pushing him back huh.(
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). Quit winning Kishi overpowered Ameno you trying to downplay it isn't going to help your case here when i have provided many Manga scans disagreeing with your bias and idiotic statements. Madara was confused because he was spawn attacked clearly.
2. The bold is another statement with no evidence behind it.
3. Sasuke used Ameno the same way he did against Kaguya in Chapter 683. Yet she escaped. Madara wasn't fast enough to, that's why he got hit. It's really that simple. It's you children who keep making excuses, pretending that Ameno has a hidden function that allows you to spawn your enemy on your attack even though if this function were real, Sasuke wouldn't have gotten his ass dodged by Kaguya twice in the same battle, especially since the second time she was weakened.
Are you implying Hagoromo chakra increased Teleportation speed? L00l now you getting desperate. Actually he didn't spawn her on his attack clearly as you see his arm fully extended plus didn't i literally just counter the exact same argument? Ameno has shown the ability of spawning not once but twice.(
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)-(
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). Sasuke was on the ground when he used Ameno. Madara was still in med air when he was hit with Sasuke's blade therefore it was spawned inside Madara's body plain and simply you claim Ameno moved the sword but i ask you how? So wait he swapped places with his sword and it flew inside Madara's body after that? No. Neither of the times did he spawn Kaguya so irrelevant not sure why you keep bringing that up plus they were in the gravity dimension where they could barely move.
4. If his arm (which is moving downward) was being weighed down by the gravity, he'd actually be approaching Kaguya faster than he normally would. Then there's the fact that she switched dimensions, thus cancelling the gravity effect, and she still managed to evade his attack.
5. Zero proof that Ameno can warp Minato out of his Avatar. Him and his Avatar are connected. Shit isn't like Susanoo. Even if it did, Sasuke can't blitz him. He'd just react and teleport to safety with ease. He can't swap Minato out of his Avatar and use Ameno's sword stabbing function since you need to swap with the weapon for it to work. So if that was what you were thinking, get that thought out of your head. It makes no sense.
Wrong Sasuke not only had to move toward her but she was still out of reach once she switched dimensions and got away. Also please tell me how this relates to spawn trapping? It doesn't so NEXT!!! Ameno doesn't warp and why won't it? It literally teleports any object. Minato can try and hide inside Kurama until he's pulled out. He'll be spawned on a Susanoo blade so teleporting away won't matter if his body is scrambled like eggs. Ameno swapping effect is meaningless since he's done it without any to swap more times than not.(
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)-(
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). So yeah enough that little argument.
Which is irrelevant since Sasuke had already jumped off his platform and was moving towards Kaguya's position at that same speed, yet he couldn't get her before she reacted. Just like he couldn't
Who said that him teleporting is any slower? Smh.
That's Madara. What Madara can or can't do without Hagoromo's power has nothing to do with what Sasuke can do with or without Hagoromo's chakra. Not to mention Madara had to use cores in that situation since he wanted to make over a dozen CT orbs and drop them on the opponent. If he didn't use cores, he'd have to find over a dozen things he can make into the core like Sasuke did, which would be more time consuming and purely idiotic.
Gravity dimension is to blame for this plus once again this has 0 to do with spawn trapping. @Bold- Is this suppose to be your reasoning why basically because he didn't want to do it? Lmao your clearly running out of ideas on how to save your ass l0l. It was a point proven how is he does or doesn't have Hagoromo chakra he'd still can do it simple. Fare point with the time consuming part.
So once again. Get me a panel of Sasuke or anyone using coreless CT w/o Rikudo's Chakra and then we can talk. Until then, gtfo. That simple.
Stop giving a buffed Sasuke's feats to a non buffed Sasuke. That simple.
So he switches places with the Flash Bijuu Dama and it soars past him. Then Minato fires another one and since he can't use Ameno in succession, he gets hit. Failure of a strategy when it comes to the long term battle.
Well considering this is a fanfic Sasuke i think it's pretty useless on saying something like that. Also the same can be said toward you can you accurately prove that Sasuke with Rinnegan but without Rikkudo chakra can't preform the feat? Nope. Stop picking and choosing what is buffed and not buffed to help your argument simple. Uh no once he switches places with it BM Kurama was is then ruined by a Ps blade. Also you have 0 proof that BM Kurama can shoot Flash Bijuudama's in rapid successions.
No shit Sherlock. Care to tell me anything else that is irrelevant?
What are you even talking about? Lmao. You sound mighty retarded here kid. You explained why Bijuu can take their smallest Bijuu Dama and survive. That has nothing to do with BM Naruto being able to take his Flash Bijuu Dama with zero damage. BM Naruto nor BSM Naruto can tank a direct Flash BD with zero damage so why the hell would Sasuke's PS be able to do so? Especially since downscaling from VoTE 2 proves that his PS gets half it's face, a wing and parts of it's torso blown away by the combination of a standard BD and a PS Chidori, which are equal. Take away Hagoromo's power from both, and you are left with:
-EMS Sasuke vs. BM Naruto.
-100% Kurama sized standard BD=PS Chidori.
-PS and BM taking a direct hit lose parts of their body.
Clearly referring to a regular Bijuudama stop acting so clueless. not their smallest but the average bijuudama stop with the non-sense.Flash Bijuu dama is never landing simple. Not the same. Why because Ps runs off chakra so adult Sasuke chakra would def be more potent than teen Sasuke. Also we've already established that his PS will be equal to adult Madara's which you've admitted multiple times would be stronger than BM Kurama so stop with that logic. No since Madara Ps already tanked Kurama's bijuudama with 0 damage. Minato having Senjutsu means nothing when Naruto avatar at the time was basically a BSM Naruto impowered with Rikkudo powers. Do you have any proof that he can shoot multiple flash Bijuudama's?
Flash BD>>>>>Standard BD x2. Thus Flash BD does worse. Multiple Flash BD's rip apart Sasuke's Susanoo. What's worse is that Minato has Senjutsu here while Sasuke doesn't. Thus his Avatar>>Sasuke's Avatar in power.
-States that Minato's Flash BD is swatted away because BM Naruto could swat away Standard BD.
-Implying that Flash BD=Standard BD.
Never did i imply or say any of that use common sense and realize that i was talking about a regular BD.
Smartest thing you've probably said in your whole entire life.
I'm saying he can't perform it because he can't. When you have scans of Rinnegan Sasuke w/o Hagoromo's chakra doing any of this shit, get at me. Until then, keep the whining to yourself. I guess you must've learned how to moan and whine from your buddy 2 pages back, since I almost feel like I'm debating the same person.
But of course dumbed down, assuming that's even possible.
I see what you did there but anyways. You do realize that this is a fanfic Sasuke and yet you constantly scream give me a scan? SMHHHH... Well concede.
We all know who your best bud/other half/friend to the end is. Lmao. I bet you guys are watching Naruto on Toonami right now thinking of ways to come up with even shittier arguments.
Based on what again?
You guys need to learn how Senjutsu works. There is no "Toad Senjutsu+Rikudo Senjutsu". Naruto's RSM is his Toad Sage Mode, but the Senjutsu Chakra he uses is NOT the Senjutsu he gathers from the Earth. It is the Senjutsu Hagoromo gave him. Do you see him sitting there and taking in Nature Energy like he used to? No. Because instead of using that, he uses the power Hagoromo gave him to enter RSM. Hence the lack of pigmentation.
Lmao you in your insults you are getting so mad and im not even sure why? Does Naruto even still come on Toonami l0l we were kids back then but ok. Based on the fact that it's a teleportation ability that requires no seals or anything else. Actually your wrong as hell. He still has his SM eyes.(
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). Yes Kurama did gather the energy like SM Naruto does sitting indian style with there hands together.(
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)-(
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). So yea your wrong. Also the sage chakra is naturally senjutsu since the Juubi's and Kaguya's are and his chakra comes directly from her so gathering more of his chakra isn't/wasn't possible to begin with since he stated he was out of chakra.(
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). and the other half was inside Sasuke.
RSM Naruto=Naruto+Kurama+Half of Hagoromo's Power+8 pieces of the other Bijuu. Not: Naurto+Toad SM+Kurama+Half of Hagoromo's Power+Other Bijuu.
Actually it means the bold since RSM Naruto Kurama avatar is the BSM Avatar and not the BM Avatar.
He warped Kaguya to him the first time they used Ameno, yet he failed to tag her. He warped right to her, yet failed to tag her. End of story. If you are fast enough, Ameno won't blitz you. That's why Naruto didn't get blitzed by Ameno. That's why Kaguya didn't get blitzed either. You fanboys are disappointed with the feats Sasuke has shown, so you ignore every other Ameno instance and then take advantage of the fact that the Manga is in still pictures and say that "he instantaneously blitzed Madara". Even though he couldn't do the same to Naruto or Kaguya.
Because he didn't spawn her simple. Naruto also didn't get spawned trapped he used Ameno to get near him. Because he spawned trapped Madara. Plot restricted them on Kaguya . Also ofc Naruto and Sasuke were both restricted on each other during there fight so the point your trying to make is useless.
Then there's the fact that Hiraishin's teleportation is the same as Ameno's outside the fact that Minato needs a marking, and fans went on saying that he can instantaneously blitz anyone with it since no striking speed is required, but JJ Obito reacted to Hiraishin twice. And both times he was marked. Which should've been an "instant blitz" as we had originally thought, but it wasn't. People only claimed "instant" because Minato was too fast for Obito the first time around. The second time around Obito was too fast for Minato.
Obito was blitzed when he was unaware but due to his sensing and reflexes he was able to counter the next spawn trap via because he already knew where they were going to land/appear with Ameno he can pull you toward him unlike having to come to you which makes it nearly impossible to counter/react.
Once again. I'm going to explain to your unintelligent illiterate ass why Kaguya's reaction speed is irrelevant.
Kaguya's reaction speed is irrelevant. The point is, if what you were saying made any damn sense, then Kaguya wouldn't have evaded him twice. Kaguya did so because she is fast enough to react to Rinnegan Sasuke. Just how Sasuke w/o Hagoromo's power is slower than BSM Minato.
What makes you think the Gab between Sasuke and Kaguya is just a big as the gab between BSM Minato and None hagoromo buffed adult Sasuke? When you have no clue how fast he is at all so your assumption is baseless and bias.
You are literally repeating the same BS as your best friend above, so from this point forward, any repeat points are being ignored. Go counter my counters to the same points I've already addressed.. Not repeating myself.
Wrong Sasuke not only had to move toward her but she was still out of reach once she switched dimensions and got away. Also please tell me how this relates to spawn trapping? It doesn't so NEXT!!! Ameno doesn't warp and why won't it? It literally teleports any object. Minato can try and hide inside Kurama until he's pulled out. He'll be spawned on a Susanoo blade so teleporting away won't matter if his body is scrambled like eggs. Ameno swapping effect is meaningless since he's done it without any to swap more times than not.(
Well considering this is a fanfic Sasuke i think it's pretty useless on saying something like that. Also the same can be said toward you can you accurately prove that Sasuke with Rinnegan but without Rikkudo chakra can't preform the feat? Nope. Stop picking and choosing what is buffed and not buffed to help your argument simple. Uh no once he switches places with it BM Kurama was is then ruined by a Ps blade. Also you have 0 proof that BM Kurama can shoot Flash Bijuudama's in rapid successions.
1. Still not seeing the feats. So no point for you. Stop giving Rikudo Sasuke's feats to Sasuke w/ Rinnegan and no Rikudo Chakra. Nothing has been buffed at all. So what the hell are you even talking about? Lmao. Do NB a favor and smash your PC.
2. Never said Minato would shoot them in succession. Learn how to read before you decide to make a fool of your self.
3. Zero proof PS blade can pierce BM Kurama, while I have scans of Kurama tanking Sasuke's PS blade.
Clearly referring to a regular Bijuudama stop acting so clueless. not their smallest but the average bijuudama stop with the non-sense.Flash Bijuu dama is never landing simple. Not the same. Why because Ps runs off chakra so adult Sasuke chakra would def be more potent than teen Sasuke. Also we've already established that his PS will be equal to adult Madara's which you've admitted multiple times would be stronger than BM Kurama so stop with that logic. No since Madara Ps already tanked Kurama's bijuudama with 0 damage. Minato having Senjutsu means nothing when Naruto avatar at the time was basically a BSM Naruto impowered with Rikkudo powers. Do you have any proof that he can shoot multiple flash Bijuudama's?
I don't give a shit about a regular Bijuu Dama. Never once mentioned here by me so why are you mentioning it? We already established that his PS would be STRONGER THAN Teen Sasuke's. Where the fuck did I say it's on par with EMS Madara's? Cause every single person I've asked for proof never gave any real proof.
Wrong. You and unorthodox need to stop playing the retard and learn how this shit works. RSM Naruto is BM Naruto using Hagoromo's Senjutsu. BSM Naruto is BM Naruto using Toad Senjutsu. Hagoromo's Senjutsu replaces Toad Senjutsu and that's why Naruto doesn't need to take in Nature Energy. Mentioning how EMS Madara's PS can tank a regular BD from Full Kurama with no damage doesn't mean shit considering:
1. This is not EMS Madara.
2. No proof Sasuke's Susanoo is equal with EMS Madara's.
3. EMS Madara can't tank Flash BD with no damage. Which is all I care about.
He has the chakra to do so, thus he can use more than one. At the same time? Nope. Never claimed that he could.
I see what you did there but anyways. You do realize that this is a fanfic Sasuke and yet you constantly scream give me a scan? SMHHHH... Well concede.
Because you seem to believe that it makes sense to give Sasuke+++'s feats to regular Sasuke, so without some form of proof. Don't really care what it is, all your arguments are trash.
Lmao you in your insults you are getting so mad and im not even sure why? Does Naruto even still come on Toonami l0l we were kids back then but ok. Based on the fact that it's a teleportation ability that requires no seals or anything else. Actually your wrong as hell. He still has his SM eyes.(
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). Yes Kurama did gather the energy like SM Naruto does sitting indian style with there hands together.(
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)-(
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). So yea your wrong. Also the sage chakra is naturally senjutsu since the Juubi's and Kaguya's are and his chakra comes directly from her so gathering more of his chakra isn't/wasn't possible to begin with since he stated he was out of chakra.(
Smh. Learn how to read the Manga kid. This is getting pretty ridiculous.
-Having his Sage eyes is irrelevant. He's using Rikudo Senjutsu. Not Toad Senjutsu. Hagoromo's Senjutsu enhances his Sage Mode, which is the Toad Sage Mode, hence him keeping his pattern, because that is his Sage Mode. The only difference is he's using a different form of Senjutsu than the regular one.
-The only time Naruto gathered NE was to make his two attacks. Was he gathering to enter RSM? No. Thus this scan is completely irrelevant. Smh. Not sure why I even had to explain that, probably because of your inability to read the Manga correctly.
-Hagoromo's Chakra being Senjutsu only proves my point. That it replaces the Senjutsu Naruto made by taking in Nature Energy from the atmosphere, and that since Hagoromo's charka is Senjutsu, he doesn't need to gather NE to enter RSM anymore, which is also something that Naruto has shown. The ability to enter RSM instantly. It being Senjutsu also proves that Naruto and Sasuke got an equal Senjutsu boost, thus proving that my scaling is correct and that scaling down to BSM Naruto makes zero sense.
Because he didn't spawn her simple. Naruto also didn't get spawned trapped he used Ameno to get near him. Because he spawned trapped Madara. Plot restricted them on Kaguya . Also ofc Naruto and Sasuke were both restricted on each other during there fight so the point your trying to make is useless.
-Addressed in my post to unorthodox.
-Stopped taking you seriously when you mentioned plot.
Obito was blitzed when he was unaware but due to his sensing and reflexes he was able to counter the next spawn trap via because he already knew where they were going to land/appear with Ameno he can pull you toward him unlike having to come to you which makes it nearly impossible to counter/react.
What makes you think the Gab between Sasuke and Kaguya is just a big as the gab between BSM Minato and None hagoromo buffed adult Sasuke? When you have no clue how fast he is at all so your assumption is baseless and bias.
Never compared Kaguya to any of their speeds, so it doesn't really matter.
Kaguya's reaction speed is irrelevant. The point is, if what you were saying made any damn sense, then Kaguya wouldn't have evaded him twice. Kaguya did so because she is fast enough to react to Rinnegan Sasuke. Just how Sasuke w/o Hagoromo's power is slower than BSM Minato.
Please read this time. The point is, if you can react, you can evade if you can teleport. Kaguya could react to Rinnegan Sasuke. I've already proven that BSM Minato can react to regular Sasuke. I've literally said that shit 3 times now and you still keep coming at me with this "Kaguya reaction speed" bullshit that I really don't care for.
Still waiting for you to prove that the bold is possible, because all I see is speculation.
Well considering this is a fanfic Sasuke i think it's pretty useless on saying something like that. Also the same can be said toward you can you accurately prove that Sasuke with Rinnegan but without Rikkudo chakra can't preform the feat? Nope. Stop picking and choosing what is buffed and not buffed to help your argument simple. Uh no once he switches places with it BM Kurama was is then ruined by a Ps blade. Also you have 0 proof that BM Kurama can shoot Flash Bijuudama's in rapid successions.
1. Still not seeing the feats. So no point for you. Stop giving Rikudo Sasuke's feats to Sasuke w/ Rinnegan and no Rikudo Chakra. Nothing has been buffed at all. So what the hell are you even talking about? Lmao. Do NB a favor and smash your PC.
2. Never said Minato would shoot them in succession. Learn how to read before you decide to make a fool of your self.
3. Zero proof PS blade can pierce BM Kurama, while I have scans of Kurama tanking Sasuke's PS blade.
Clearly referring to a regular Bijuudama stop acting so clueless. not their smallest but the average bijuudama stop with the non-sense.Flash Bijuu dama is never landing simple. Not the same. Why because Ps runs off chakra so adult Sasuke chakra would def be more potent than teen Sasuke. Also we've already established that his PS will be equal to adult Madara's which you've admitted multiple times would be stronger than BM Kurama so stop with that logic. No since Madara Ps already tanked Kurama's bijuudama with 0 damage. Minato having Senjutsu means nothing when Naruto avatar at the time was basically a BSM Naruto impowered with Rikkudo powers. Do you have any proof that he can shoot multiple flash Bijuudama's?
I don't give a shit about a regular Bijuu Dama. Never once mentioned here by me so why are you mentioning it? We already established that his PS would be STRONGER THAN Teen Sasuke's. Where the fuck did I say it's on par with EMS Madara's? Cause every single person I've asked for proof never gave any real proof.
Wrong. You and unorthodox need to stop playing the retard and learn how this shit works. RSM Naruto is BM Naruto using Hagoromo's Senjutsu. BSM Naruto is BM Naruto using Toad Senjutsu. Hagoromo's Senjutsu replaces Toad Senjutsu and that's why Naruto doesn't need to take in Nature Energy. Mentioning how EMS Madara's PS can tank a regular BD from Full Kurama with no damage doesn't mean shit considering:
1. This is not EMS Madara.
2. No proof Sasuke's Susanoo is equal with EMS Madara's.
3. EMS Madara can't tank Flash BD with no damage. Which is all I care about.
He has the chakra to do so, thus he can use more than one. At the same time? Nope. Never claimed that he could.
I see what you did there but anyways. You do realize that this is a fanfic Sasuke and yet you constantly scream give me a scan? SMHHHH... Well concede.
Because you seem to believe that it makes sense to give Sasuke+++'s feats to regular Sasuke, so without some form of proof. Don't really care what it is, all your arguments are trash.
Lmao you in your insults you are getting so mad and im not even sure why? Does Naruto even still come on Toonami l0l we were kids back then but ok. Based on the fact that it's a teleportation ability that requires no seals or anything else. Actually your wrong as hell. He still has his SM eyes.(
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). Yes Kurama did gather the energy like SM Naruto does sitting indian style with there hands together.(
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)-(
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). So yea your wrong. Also the sage chakra is naturally senjutsu since the Juubi's and Kaguya's are and his chakra comes directly from her so gathering more of his chakra isn't/wasn't possible to begin with since he stated he was out of chakra.(
Smh. Learn how to read the Manga kid. This is getting pretty ridiculous.
-Having his Sage eyes is irrelevant. He's using Rikudo Senjutsu. Not Toad Senjutsu. Hagoromo's Senjutsu enhances his Sage Mode, which is the Toad Sage Mode, hence him keeping his pattern, because that is his Sage Mode. The only difference is he's using a different form of Senjutsu than the regular one.
-The only time Naruto gathered NE was to make his two attacks. Was he gathering to enter RSM? No. Thus this scan is completely irrelevant. Smh. Not sure why I even had to explain that, probably because of your inability to read the Manga correctly.
-Hagoromo's Chakra being Senjutsu only proves my point. That it replaces the Senjutsu Naruto made by taking in Nature Energy from the atmosphere, and that since Hagoromo's charka is Senjutsu, he doesn't need to gather NE to enter RSM anymore, which is also something that Naruto has shown. The ability to enter RSM instantly. It being Senjutsu also proves that Naruto and Sasuke got an equal Senjutsu boost, thus proving that my scaling is correct and that scaling down to BSM Naruto makes zero sense.
Because he didn't spawn her simple. Naruto also didn't get spawned trapped he used Ameno to get near him. Because he spawned trapped Madara. Plot restricted them on Kaguya . Also ofc Naruto and Sasuke were both restricted on each other during there fight so the point your trying to make is useless.
-Addressed in my post to unorthodox.
-Stopped taking you seriously when you mentioned plot.
Obito was blitzed when he was unaware but due to his sensing and reflexes he was able to counter the next spawn trap via because he already knew where they were going to land/appear with Ameno he can pull you toward him unlike having to come to you which makes it nearly impossible to counter/react.
What makes you think the Gab between Sasuke and Kaguya is just a big as the gab between BSM Minato and None hagoromo buffed adult Sasuke? When you have no clue how fast he is at all so your assumption is baseless and bias.
Never compared Kaguya to any of their speeds, so it doesn't really matter.
Kaguya's reaction speed is irrelevant. The point is, if what you were saying made any damn sense, then Kaguya wouldn't have evaded him twice. Kaguya did so because she is fast enough to react to Rinnegan Sasuke. Just how Sasuke w/o Hagoromo's power is slower than BSM Minato.
Please read this time. The point is, if you can react, you can evade if you can teleport. Kaguya could react to Rinnegan Sasuke. I've already proven that BSM Minato can react to regular Sasuke. I've literally said that shit 3 times now and you still keep coming at me with this "Kaguya reaction speed" bullshit that I really don't care for.
I'm not sure about that. It had such a big impact on Kakashi that he didn't even finish his sentence as Naruto appeared almost instantaneously appeared in front of him as well as the fact that Naruto deflected those Bijuudama with sheer speed which even Obito was impressed about while he wasn't impressed by Minato's own speed which was compared to KCM Naruto's.
His speed is a part of the impact, but the whole impact is because of the overall feat, not because Naruto is so much faster than he was before. Gai had never witnessed his Shunshin before. So him being shocked when he sees it for the first time doesn't mean that Naruto got a major speed boost. Obito was shocked because he repelled the Bijuu Dama. Which was because of his tails, not his Shunshin.
I'm not sure about that. Both Gai and Kakashi were astonished by Naruto's speed. Gai clearly referred to Naruto's speed first as well as Kakashi who struggled to say, "Sensei!" before Naruto appeared in front of him. The statement, "Sensei," refers to a feat of speed as Minato was praised as the Yellow Flash. Of course, it's a little odd as KCM Naruto was also compared to Minato, but we know that's mainly because both appeared as a flash in front of both Tsunade and Bee.
Yeah, already admitted this. Getting BM increased his chakra control, but chakra control is not related to the process of obtaining it. And KCM Naruto can use Mini Bijuu Dama, so he does have the ratio down regardless of BM.
Actually, KCM Naruto attempted a full-fledged Bijuudama, but ultimately failed against the 3rd Raikage.
Likewise, KCM Naruto cannot release as much Chakra when using a Bijuudama, so even when he can apply the same amount of Spatial Manipulation and raito of Chakra, the amount of Chakra released pales in comparison, so he doesn't have to manipulate as much Chakra in order to use the Bijuudama which essentially means inferior Chakra Control. There's also the fact that Bee stated that you have to enter Bijuu Mode to create a Full-fledged Bijuudama, so KCM Naruto's wasn't complete. It was essentially incomplete like Base Naruto's FRS used on Kakuzu as it was a miniature version of it, and could not be released as projectile.
Was it the reason he made it there in time to deflect them? Yes. Did he deflect them because of his speed? Obviously not. Moving past something is never going to make it go flying that far, especially in all 5 directions. Especially when we are talking about 5 Bijuu Dama here. Not to mention the Manga shows his tails after the fact. He didn't deflect them with speed alone. Not even close.
When he deflected the Bijuudama, both Gai and Kakashi referred to his speed. It was only later that Kakashi referred to the overall power of the Bijuudama. Additionally, we can tell it was a feat of speed rather than his tails deflecting the Bijuudama because of this scan:
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As BM Naruto appeared right before Kakashi, no tails were present. Likewise, we later see BM Naruto forms tails here:
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As a response to the 5 Bijuu charging at him as well as the bottom scans indicating that both Kurama and Naruto were preparing for the combination attack of the Bijuus. So essentially, it was caused by BM Naruto's speed. If it wasn't, then we would've seen his tail's chakra diminish in the previous scan yet that was never indicated, so it was a feat of speed.
lol what? why is there even an argument here? im pretty sure even nagato could stomp BM minato. bijuu chakra binding chains, 6 paths of rinnegan, ameno and PS? minato gets completely stomped out.
You are literally repeating the same BS as your best friend above, so from this point forward, any repeat points are being ignored. Go counter my counters to the same points I've already addressed.. Not repeating myself.
I repeated myself because you didn't give a proper counter to the post above Simple. Also im not reading the arguments you and Nike are bringing up there irrelevant to me. Then simply concede and admit that Minato loses.
Still waiting for you to prove that the bold is possible, because all I see is speculation.
I need less of this and more counters to arguments notice how you went from trying to counter things to insults and now your reverting to im done repeating myself. Your trying to sneak your way out of the debate without actually quiting similar to how you did and the EMS Madara vs 3rd Raikage thread. Because you think about all the BS you spitted just to try and deny 11 manga scans which i've posted toward you and you've denied them all.
Still not seeing the feats. So no point for you. Stop giving Rikudo Sasuke's feats to Sasuke w/ Rinnegan and no Rikudo Chakra. Nothing has been buffed at all. So what the hell are you even talking about? Lmao. Do NB a favor and smash your PC.
This is a fanfic Sasuke please stop asking for scans you damn clown. Unless the thread maker says he can't use Orbless CT then he can simple who are you to selectively choose what can and can't be down without Hagoromo chakra? He said Sasuke with Rinnegan and that is a Rinnegan Sasuke feat inb4 you say no that's a Rinnegan Sasuke feat with Rikkudo chakra there is no Sasuke with Rinnegan that doesn't have Rikkudo chakra. Do me a favor and concede.
Never said Minato would shoot them in succession. Learn how to read before you decide to make a fool of your self.
Zero proof PS blade can pierce BM Kurama, while I have scans of Kurama tanking Sasuke's PS blade.
You did infact say he'd shoot multiple multiple flash bijuudama's. Yea he blocked it with his tails i would like to see BSM Kurama head tank a Ps blade without damage.
I don't give a shit about a regular Bijuu Dama. Never once mentioned here by me so why are you mentioning it? We already established that his PS would be STRONGER THAN Teen Sasuke's. Where the fuck did I say it's on par with EMS Madara's? Cause every single person I've asked for proof never gave any real proof.
So you didn't mention a regular Bijuudama? Let me do my post research here. So adult Sasuke Susanoo would be weaker than Madara's? Based on what? When all of their previous Susanoo's bar v4 was on the exact same tier?
Wrong. You and unorthodox need to stop playing the retard and learn how this shit works. RSM Naruto is BM Naruto using Hagoromo's Senjutsu. BSM Naruto is BM Naruto using Toad Senjutsu. Hagoromo's Senjutsu replaces Toad Senjutsu and that's why Naruto doesn't need to take in Nature Energy. Mentioning how EMS Madara's PS can tank a regular BD from Full Kurama with no damage doesn't mean shit considering:
[BOLD]- I completely shitted on this argument nuff said. Actually it does. That was 100% Kurama standard Bijuudama and Madara Ps tanked 0 diff. Adult Sasuke PS should be if not stronger than EMS Madara Susanoo based off this one facts.
1- There both are a transmigrant of Indra which allows there chakra to be far more potent than others.
Or are you trying to argue that Adult Sasuke Ps is 50% of Madara which is hilarious.
1. This is not EMS Madara.
2. No proof Sasuke's Susanoo is equal with EMS Madara's.
3. EMS Madara can't tank Flash BD with no damage. Which is all I care about.
Doesn't matter if it's him or not there is an Uchiha with a PS = to his that is why he was brought up. You have 0 proof that it isn't as well. Flash Bijuudama is never landing so tanking it is irrelevant here. I want a scan suggesting Kurama can use multiple Flash Bijuudama's in rapid succession.
Because you seem to believe that it makes sense to give Sasuke+++'s feats to regular Sasuke, so without some form of proof. Don't really care what it is, all your arguments are trash.
How can someone provide Manga proof with a Fanfic version of a character? Please explain this to me?
-Having his Sage eyes is irrelevant. He's using Rikudo Senjutsu. Not Toad Senjutsu. Hagoromo's Senjutsu enhances his Sage Mode, which is the Toad Sage Mode, hence him keeping his pattern, because that is his Sage Mode. The only difference is he's using a different form of Senjutsu than the regular one.
Hagoromo chakra is already completely natural energy so why would he need Sage eyes to use his chakra when he already gave it to him? Please explain this? Hagoromo chakra in-hances everything he does trying to single out his sage mode is useless because it's already running through him. Also you've only proved what i've been saying that Kurama avatar was basically BSM not BM.
-The only time Naruto gathered NE was to make his two attacks. Was he gathering to enter RSM? No. Thus this scan is completely irrelevant. Smh. Not sure why I even had to explain that, probably because of your inability to read the Manga correctly.
He gathered more Sage energy quit trying to deny the obvious here. Didn't need to because his SM was already on entering RSM didn't increased his Senjutsu it only increased his bijuu powers seeing as he was only using Kurama fox eye form when he attacked Madara earlier. Again with the insults.
-Hagoromo's Chakra being Senjutsu only proves my point. That it replaces the Senjutsu Naruto made by taking in Nature Energy from the atmosphere, and that since Hagoromo's charka is Senjutsu, he doesn't need to gather NE to enter RSM anymore, which is also something that Naruto has shown. The ability to enter RSM instantly. It being Senjutsu also proves that Naruto and Sasuke got an equal Senjutsu boost, thus proving that my scaling is correct and that scaling down to BSM Naruto makes zero sense.
No it doesn't you fool it replaces there natural chakra. Sasuke using black Chidori is proof. If you needed other senjutsu to gather Hagoromo senjutsu then how would Sasuke be able to preform a black Chidori? Completely debunked the lower half of your post.
-Addressed in my post to unorthodox.
-Stopped taking you seriously when you mentioned plot.
Actually you did. You said what happened with Kaguya doesn't matter because he doesn't have the Sage chakra so Minato will be able to react. But i ask you again what made you come up to the conclusion that Minato speed gap over non Buffed Sasuke is the same as the one Kaguya had over him?
Please read this time. The point is, if you can react, you can evade if you can teleport. Kaguya could react to Rinnegan Sasuke. I've already proven that BSM Minato can react to regular Sasuke. I've literally said that shit 3 times now and you still keep coming at me with this "Kaguya reaction speed" bullshit that I really don't care for.
I understood this the first time what im telling you is this when he's spawned there is no time to react since he's already being hit by the attack/being on the attack.
