Edo Hashirama underrated greatly.

[Multiply]

I agree. Many people assert the claims of Madara because of the overlapping power-ups but fail to address things that will lead to his downfall. I could make a large post that would add more to your OP but I'm lazy right now. It'll be done in an hour.

Thanks for reading, have fun. This took me about an hour too xD

 

[RikudouMadara]

I agree. Many people assert the claims of Madara because of the overlapping power-ups but fail to address things that will lead to his downfall.

I could make a large post that would add more to your OP but I'm lazy right now. It'll be done in an hour.

Hmmm...you speak as though you know exactly what is going to happen. Almost as if you can peer into Kishis mind...as if you have the power of divination....

Regardless...you have most certainly caught my attention....I'm very excited to see this....fact or facts...that will bring about Madaras downfall. I'm most assuredly intrigued....you seem as though you won't disappoint.:yayy::bye:

 

[Transcendence]

Hmmm...you speak as though you know exactly what is going to happen. Almost as if you can peer into Kishis mind...as if you have the power of divination....

Regardless...you have most certainly caught my attention....I'm very excited to see this....fact or facts...that will bring about Madaras downfall. I'm most assuredly intrigued....you seem as though you won't disappoint.:yayy::bye:

I assure you; I won't.

 

[RikudouMadara]

I assure you; I won't.

That's so great to hear! :yayy: I shall await your ascension beyond the Aristotelian categories...I wonder if one should hold his breath for this? I'm just kidding...I'm very patient...or so I'd like to believe.... You strike me(Don't hit me though lol) as the philosopher type... >_O.

 

[Transcendence]

That's so great to hear! :yayy: I shall await your ascension beyond the Aristotelian categories...I wonder if one should hold his breath for this? I'm just kidding...I'm very patient...or so I'd like to believe.... You strike me(Don't hit me though lol) as the philosopher type... >_O.

Where did you get philosophy from me? LOL. I'm more of the scientific type, maybe my vocabulary may strike you as such Lol

 

[RikudouMadara]

Where did you get philosophy from me? LOL. I'm more of the scientific type, maybe my vocabulary may strike you as such Lol

Why do you want to strike me? I hate violence. I'm only poking fun....you believe yourself to hold great knowledge, no? Also...you seem to have a somewhat appealing equanimity about you....philosophers are very calm and rational people...or at least seen as such. >_O I'd say from my perception you are. Do you not consider yourself as such? Even though you are more of a scientist in your way of thinking? XD

 

[Genetics]

How is Edo Hashi underrated greatly? he's #2-3 in the top 10

 

[Transcendence]

To categorize this, we must split it into parts:


Intel

What is undoubtedly the biggest upgrade to Madara and his arsenal is the Rinnegan. And rightfully so. The bevy of power that the user has at there disposal due to the eye is immense and it is not to be taken lightly. What many fans, and in particular Madara fans like to grasp at is that "Hashirama has never fought the Rinnegan" or he has no intel at all on it. This couldn't be farther from the truth.

Look at this scan:

Spoiler

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Hashirama clearly states "Is that Rikudou's Kinjutsu?". There in lies the fact; Hashirama has knowledge of the Rinnegan. Now ask yourself this: If Hashirama has intel on the most secretive tech that the Rinnegan offers, would he not have more info on the Rinnegan? This is open to debate, but I would assert the fact that Hashirama knows more about the Rinnegan than people give him credit for.

If it is true that he has more knowledge than we know, then it almost nullifies the upgrade Madara gained.

Power Scaling

Madara himself, stated in the manga, "witness the full power of Madara Uchiha" when he pulled out his Perfect Susano'o. Looking deeper, he is right. What the Perfect Susano'o offers is more than what the Rinnegan offers.

Asura Path: Madara does not need extra appendages because his Susano'o already has that albeit at a larger scale and more durability.

Human Path: This Battle is a battle of monster scale techniques, much like the last battle. There will almost be never a time where they come close enough for this to be a viable option.

Animal Path: All summonings are fodder in this battle.

Naraka Path: Useless in a one on one battle, especially with two Edo's.

Preta Path: It has been asserted quite handily that Mokuton is LIVING. Therefore, Preta Path cannot absorb it as it would just be absorbing live trees. Don't believe me? The original landscape of Konoha was built by Hashirama and they are constituted as living things, as trees are usually categorized.

Deva Path: The most dangerous of the Paths by far. However, there is something we found out from the Pein Battle that nullifies this path; A stronger force. 6 Tailed Naruto was able to overcome and turn back the force of Deva's Shinra Tensei. It's safe to assume the God of Shinobi possesses techniques that can quantify a large enough force that precedes 6 tailed Naruto Kyuubi form.

With that assessment, more than half of the paths are nullified, and the others are handily taken care of.

Madara's actual "Full Power" is taken down by Hashirama easily. Buddha takes PS+Kyuubi easily, and if it is just PS, the PS won't have enough firepower like before to actually damage the Buddha.

I could write more... But I wanted to rush this because I'm tired.

 

[RikudouMadara]

To categorize this, we must split it into parts:


Intel

What is undoubtedly the biggest upgrade to Madara and his arsenal is the Rinnegan. And rightfully so. The bevy of power that the user has at there disposal due to the eye is immense and it is not to be taken lightly. What many fans, and in particular Madara fans like to grasp at is that "Hashirama has never fought the Rinnegan" or he has no intel at all on it. This couldn't be farther from the truth.

Look at this scan:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

Hashirama clearly states "Is that Rikudou's Kinjutsu?". There in lies the fact; Hashirama has knowledge of the Rinnegan. Now ask yourself this: If Hashirama has intel on the most secretive tech that the Rinnegan offers, would he not have more info on the Rinnegan? This is open to debate, but I would assert the fact that Hashirama knows more about the Rinnegan than people give him credit for.

If it is true that he has more knowledge than we know, then it almost nullifies the upgrade Madara gained.

Power Scaling

Madara himself, stated in the manga, "witness the full power of Madara Uchiha" when he pulled out his Perfect Susano'o. Looking deeper, he is right. What the Perfect Susano'o offers is more than what the Rinnegan offers.

Asura Path: Madara does not need extra appendages because his Susano'o already has that albeit at a larger scale and more durability.

Human Path: This Battle is a battle of monster scale techniques, much like the last battle. There will almost be never a time where they come close enough for this to be a viable option.

Animal Path: All summonings are fodder in this battle.

Naraka Path: Useless in a one on one battle, especially with two Edo's.

Preta Path: It has been asserted quite handily that Mokuton is LIVING. Therefore, Preta Path cannot absorb it as it would just be absorbing live trees. Don't believe me? The original landscape of Konoha was built by Hashirama and they are constituted as living things, as trees are usually categorized.

Deva Path: The most dangerous of the Paths by far. However, there is something we found out from the Pein Battle that nullifies this path; A stronger force. 6 Tailed Naruto was able to overcome and turn back the force of Deva's Shinra Tensei. It's safe to assume the God of Shinobi possesses techniques that can quantify a large enough force that precedes 6 tailed Naruto Kyuubi form.

With that assessment, more than half of the paths are nullified, and the others are handily taken care of.

Madara's actual "Full Power" is taken down by Hashirama easily. Buddha takes PS+Kyuubi easily, and if it is just PS, the PS won't have enough firepower like before to actually damage the Buddha.

I could write more... But I wanted to rush this because I'm tired.

Ah....I see... I was expecting something that was succinct and indubitable. This is mostly a conjectural approach....vs the "will lead to his downfall approach" Nao...as far as possibilities of what "could" lead to his downfall you did not disappoint. Although...how still has me in wonderment....regardless I like it thank you for taking the time. :yayy:

 

[Transcendence]

Ah....I see I was expecting something that was succinct and indubitable. This is mostly a conjectural approach....vs the "will lead to his downfall approach" Nao...as far as possibilities of what "could" lead to his downfall you did not disappoint. Although...how still has me in wonderment....regardless I like it thank you for taking the time. :yayy:

No problem.

 

[Bronze]

i would like to state my own reasons why madara is superior.

1-EMS madara and hashirama were nearly equal but hashirama was just very little stronger.

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. after the their last moments of battle, hashirama and EMS madara were worn out:

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. going by this hashirama was only 1% stronger than EMS madara. not to also mention madara was only fighting to obtain hashirama's DNA and not to kill him:

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.

2-madara with EMS+Mokuton+Rinnegan is beyond EMS+kyuubi and we all know hashirama was nearly dead when he faced them:

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. since madara already has EMS making him nearly equal to hashirama, add mokuton which is = base hashirama who should have all of his techniques apart from those SM, as well as rinnegan the power of SO6P, madara already surpassed hashirama.

3-the fact in the war, madara actually believes he is superior due to wanting to fight hashirama before becoming the juubi jinch.

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.

madara basically has this:

EMS- tskuyomi, amatersu, PS.

Mokuton- jikai kutan, FTW, multiple wood clones, wood dragon. possibly all of hashirama's techniques apart from SM.

Rinnegan- the 6 paths techniques, 5 chakra elements.

with madara's current abilities there is no way hashirama can win at all.

i have given my reasons.

 

[Uchihajin Sasuke]

Edo Madara demolishes, I mean not only he has the Rinnegan, he has the Mokuten techs too.

Top it off with Bijuu pwning meteors, perfect Susanoo and you have the most OP ninja in the history of narutoverse - Edo Madara

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That stance... what a boss he is... clearly lived up to his hype unlike Hashi, Hiruzen etc.

 

[Naijakid]

I agree Hashi>>>>>>>Madara

 

[Transcendence]

I agree Hashi>>>>>>>Madara

I wouldn't go that far if I were you.

 

[Multiply]

i would like to state my own reasons why madara is superior. 1-EMS madara and hashirama were nearly equal but hashirama was just very little stronger.

You must be registered for see links

. after the their last moments of battle, hashirama and EMS madara were worn out:

You must be registered for see links

. going by this hashirama was only 1% stronger than EMS madara. not to also mention madara was only fighting to obtain hashirama's DNA and not to kill him:

You must be registered for see links

. 2-madara with EMS+Mokuton+Rinnegan is beyond EMS+kyuubi and we all know hashirama was nearly dead when he faced them:

You must be registered for see links

. since madara already has EMS making him nearly equal to hashirama, add mokuton which is = base hashirama who should have all of his techniques apart from those SM, as well as rinnegan the power of SO6P, madara already surpassed hashirama. 3-the fact in the war, madara actually believes he is superior due to wanting to fight hashirama before becoming the juubi jinch.

You must be registered for see links

. madara basically has this: EMS- tskuyomi, amatersu, PS. Mokuton- jikai kutan, FTW, multiple wood clones, wood dragon. possibly all of hashirama's techniques apart from SM. Rinnegan- the 6 paths techniques, 5 chakra elements. with madara's current abilities there is no way hashirama can win at all. i have given my reasons.

1. Madara doesn't have ameterasu, or all 5 chakra elements. He has the capability to learn all 5 chakra elements, but doesn't have them all.


2. You should actually read my thread, most of this is addressed.

 

[johnny335704]

Hashirama will give him a very tough fight and Madara can win with only very high difficulty (Thanks to Rinnegan).

Both are Edos so Hashirama doesn't need to use his healing ninjutsu which will save him burden of using chakra for healing.
Madara has only rinnegan extra & still missing Sage Mode.
Apart from that, Madara has nothing new which will really improve his chances against Hashirama. Both have wood style so no use. Madara has no counter yet for Hashirama's Sage Mode.

 

[KidGamer65]

Durability as a value doesnt change but obviously a bigger object of the same durability value will take more punishment, thus get more durable. And as susanoo grows the thickness of ribs, bones, swords, everything gets bigger.

No it won't. PS is not thicker nor does it have more armor. Nor does the armor look any different when equipped onto Kyuubi, its just smaller.. PS was shaped to fit Kyuubi. That made it smaller not weaker. Getting smaller doesn't reduce durability.

The bold is true as Susanoo grows in level. The PS used at VotE and the PS used against the Gokage are the same level. Same durability. Its as simple as that.

For the last time, the bigger of the same has bigger total durability.

Where are you getting this nonsense from. Size never equals durability, ever. Go blow up two of the same balloon. One isn't going to have more durability than the other.

By the time budda bashed madara he had launched 20 TBBs and made 20 new swords. Seeing how budda carries huge arms on its back, my bet is on susanoo in foot speed, in case its needs to keep its distance.

Your bet on Perfect Susanoo's foot speed being able to keep its distance is baseless, especially when it can just charge at him, close the gap, and obliterate Susanoo.

Survived, outlived and got the power up as well as dream on the way, hashi merely died.

Still lost the battle.

 

[Transcendence]

No it won't. PS is not thicker nor does it have more armor. Nor does the armor look any different when equipped onto Kyuubi, its just smaller.. PS was shaped to fit Kyuubi. That made it smaller not weaker. Getting smaller doesn't reduce durability.

The bold is true as Susanoo grows in level. The PS used at VotE and the PS used against the Gokage are the same level. Same durability. Its as simple as that.


Where are you getting this nonsense from. Size never equals durability, ever. Go blow up two of the same balloon. One isn't going to have more durability than the other.


Your bet on Perfect Susanoo's foot speed being able to keep its distance is baseless, especially when it can just charge at him, close the gap, and obliterate Susanoo.



Still lost the battle.

Don't attempt to debate with Alpha. He imagines feats that didn't happen, fanboys and is incredibly stubborn.

 

[H a n]

He underated because he is like 3 generations older then the currents. I am sure he would be a great ninja even in Narutos time span but dang these folks are getting power ups that are suppose to be myths and legends. No one could guess there was a 10 tails from just watching the original Naruto..

 

[blazekev90]

I completely disagree!