Hi Guys,
This is a continuation of my post in the 517 Predictions thread about Madara. Wanted to continue my thoughts and give everyone else a chance to read it as well.
Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 516 Discussion and 517 Predictions
Here is proof that Madara is not a son of the Sage of the 6 Paths.
Just in case anyone is thinking that he is.
Madara's brother was also an Uchiha. Which means his brother is NOT a Senju. The sons of the SO6P were one Uchiha (elder) and one Senju (younger). The cycle of hatred starts here for the Uchiha when the SO6P chooses the younger Senju son to be the next leader.
Here is Madara telling Kakashi and Naruto the story of how the Uchiha Curse of Hatred began with the Sage of the 6 Paths and his two sons. He goes on to say that this curse applies to him as much as to Sasuke and that his own fight with Hashirama was fate.
Here he tells Naruto that even though this is only the second time he has met Naruto he knows that Naruto is Senju...good to know.
And also that Naruto and Sasuke have been fated to clash as well.
Here we get a glimpse of both Madara, and his brothers Mangekou Sharingan eyes.
Here you can see the combined form of Madara's eyes after he takes his brothers eyes and forms the EMS. It is clearly different than it was before, and it is also clearly changed to be a mix of both. Madara's look similar to his before, but now it has the lines going to the edge of the eyes that was the obvious trait of his younger brother's eyes.
By this we can assume that Sasuke's eyes will also look different now that he has transplanted Itachi's.
Here, Itachi explains that the transplant gave birth to an entirely new eye power. He doesn't specify if that new power is a new eye (rinnengan) or if its a new eye power (time space). I believe it to be the later, however I wouldn't be surprised with either explanation. Here we can assume that Sasuke will also develop a new doujutsu because of his transplant with Itachi's eyes...will we Sasuke with a new sharingan, the rinnengan, or even a new totally unknown doujutsu?
Here we see Sasuke show his Mangekou Sharingan in both eyes.
There is some heavy shading in this frame, look at the next page to see a clearer frame shot of one of the eyes.
Here we see Itachi clearly shows his double Mangekou Sharingan.
Will we see a combined form of both MS in Sasuke's new EMS?
What will it be Kishi?
To get back on track with Madara's plan...
This is a great page for Madara info.
It says that Madara's unstoppable power led him to be hailed as the strongest shinobi alive and that he formed an alliance with the Senju that formed the ninja world as we knowit, Leaf. Itachi finishes by saying that he wasn't able to defeat Hasirama in the fight for control but that he is "alive and well" as are his eyes "and their power"
This leads me to believe that although something may be wrong with Madara's as he has told the Kage's (not his whole self), but that he is still ALIVE and so are his eye powers.
Here we learn some truth about Madara and the Sharingan from Itachi.
More to it than being able to control the Kyuubi...EMS.
With EMS, Itachi says that any limits, any ideas of capacity will be gone.
"You and I are each other's spares."
Here Madara explains to Naruto and Kakashi that even though Sasuke knows the truth now about Itachi and everything, he still wants revenge. Naruto accuses Madara of having done it to him. Madara replies, "no, I didnt" "he chose it himself" "i took a gamble not knowing" "he chose revenge" "in his heart he was always 'one of us'."
"Naruto, someday you will have to fight Sasuke."
"Or, rather, I will make you fight Sasuke"
"This fated battle has been long in coming"
Long before Madara tells Konan that he formed Akatsuki, not Yahiko.
Itachi gives Madara credit for it, but then starts bad mouthing Madara.
"Madara is a pathetic form of his former self"
"He's no longer worthy of being considered the greatest Uchiha"
"The only person who can surpass him, surpass the invincible Madara and achieve true immortality is me."
This is Itachi telling Sasuke what he wants Sasuke to believe.
NOT what Itachi really believes...I don't think Itachi wanted to kill his brother and obtain Sasuke's eyes to try and challenge Madara. I think that if that had been his wish, he could have and would have done so.
Since it is obvious that Itachi let Sasuke win, it is equally apparent that Itachi wants Sasuke to feel this way about Madara. Itachi is setting his brother up as the man that can defeat Madara once and for all. Go Itachi! Will it work?
So knowing that Madara will try to use Sasuke against Naruto, as I am sure Madara tried to use Itachi; Itachi is setting up Sasuke against Madara. Using the last few precious moments he has with his brother to build him up against Madara. I believe Madara probably tried to use Itachi to fight Naruto and gain the Kyuubi. He obviously doesn't want to/ or can't/couldn't do it by himself.
However, if he can use Sasuke to gain the power of the Kyuubi and Hachibi, he will be able to restore the power of the Juubi, and then wants to control it to become the most powerful being on the planet and then control the world. This is the path of Uchiha Madara. Who can/will stop him? Only Kishi knows for certain. I can hardly wait for this portion of the story to unfold.
Thanks for reading my posts.
I look forward to your thoughts.
If you really like this breakdown, let me know and i will do another for a different character.
Also...remembered a theory I have about Madara's time-space jutsu.
When he warps himself and or others away during a battle...
I think he is using warping them into a sealed room with 1000+ Zetsus...
"Welcome to Death Row!" or "Welcome to the Hospital"
He could just take them there, and then leave to go back to whatever he was doing.
Confident that the Zetsus would finish the job and kill/record/copy whoever he brings to them.
On the other hand he could warp there, and have the Zetsu's give him more chakra, heal him, replace limbs, cancel a raging case of Ameratsu... ya know, whatever. Its so genius it makes me want to cry. Not sure that's what is happening, but it makes a sick sense.
This is a continuation of my post in the 517 Predictions thread about Madara. Wanted to continue my thoughts and give everyone else a chance to read it as well.
Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 516 Discussion and 517 Predictions
Let's do a little background for Madara...and finish up this thought.My turn! My turn!
Here is some stuff I put together.
I wanted to do more, but just this research and posting took me hours.
I gotta get some sleep...more later.
Madara's Powers:
- Time Space Ninjutsu
- Sharingan
- Rinnengan
- Izanagi
1.) He can make himself invulnerable to any form of attack.
a.) He evades Raikage's Punch
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b.) Naruto tries to blast him, and goes right through him instead.
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c.) Here Sasuke cuts him in half, and he gets up, apparently unhurt.
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d.) Here Kakashi is going to use MS against Madara, and Madara tells him not to waste his energy, because it will have no effect.
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e.) Here he is escaping Shino's bugs and completely blowing the minds of the Konoha peeps.
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f.) Here is is nuked by Ameratsu and then seems fine a few pages later.
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g.) Here he dodges some attacks from Danzo's bodyguards.
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2.) He can warp himself and or others to a location of his choice with our without their permission.
a.) During the Kage Summit, he saves Sasuke from Tsuchikage's Dust Tech.
And warps Karin to him, to heal him, while he talks to the 5 Kages.
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b.) He warps to Sasuke's aid when Zetsu warns him about Sasuke being in trouble.
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c.) He tries to warp the 4th Hokage, but Minato is too fast and escapes.
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d.) He warps himself and Konan away, along with a nice portion of the suicide bombs she was carrying with her.
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e.) Here he shows up at the end of the Itachi-Sasuke fight, and Zetsu accuses Madara of traveling at the speed of light.
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f.) One of Danzo's henchmen down.
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The other quickly follows.
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I'd like to note that you never see them again... LOL.
Where did he take them? I think I know. We'll save that for later.
3.) He has the power of the Sharingan and we know that he dominated the Kyuubi for a short period of time.
a.) Here we see Madara summon the fox into Konoha after releasing it from Kushina's control.
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b.) Here we see the power of the sharingan eye wear off the Kyuubi after Minato owns Madara.
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c.) Here Kabuto and Madara agree to use the Sharingan instead of the Rinnengan to get the answers they need from Yamato.
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d.) Here we see him viewing one of Danzo's henchmen with his Sharingan.
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4.) He now has the Rinnengan and all powers that come with it.
At least to some extent. All that is confirmed FOR SURE is the human realm. But I think its safe to assume he can do any of the realms.
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5.) Izanagi. By combining the powers of the senju and uchiha, Madara can transform his illusion into reality.
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MADARA'S PLAN
1.) The Moon's Eye Plan. (The Infinite Tsukuyomi)
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He has come right out and told the five kage's that this is his plan.
I do not doubt that he is telling the truth. He would gain nothing from lying to them. Not only that, but it seems to fit in with what we have learned. Tsuchikage asks him why he doesn't just use his own powers to achieve his goals, why employ Sasuke? He admits that he has no power himself, but that he has the Bijuu's he has collected, and will use them forcefully if necessary.
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"I'm not a fool to say a thing like this in jest!"
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Proof that he is telling the truth while speaking to them.
He admits to the Raikage that Akatsuki failed to capture the Hachibi.
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Madara also states here that Bee has achieved true perfection as a Jinchuuriki. This is interesting because we see that Naruto has gained a level of power that not even Bee has, which I will get to later.
2.) Becoming the Jinchuuriki of the Juubi.
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Here Madara explains that he will combine all the Bijuus and restore the Juubi and then become its host so that he may implement the Moon's Eye Plan, and control the world.
We learn from Madara that the Rikudou Sage fought the Juubi, and defeated it using a sealing technique that he invented to become the Juubi's Host and the very first Jinchuuriki. He goes on to add that all the tailed bijuus are nothing more than pieces of the Juubi that were split apart at the Rikudou Sage's will upon his death. At the same time, once the chakra was seperated from it's body the Juubi's body was contained/became the moon so that it was too far from it's chakra's(bijuus) to be revived. "The fused form of all the Bijuu"
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Here he explains to Konan as she is dying that with Yin-Yang element, the Rikudou Sage created the beasts from the Juubi, which matches what he told the Kages.
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He obviously intends to use the Heretical Demon Statue (Gedo Mazo) to do this. Akatsuki has been transferring the bijuus into the Gedo Mazo which may or may not be a shell/form of the Juubi itself. It has many similarities and seems to be a fitting container for the bijuus.
3.) Heretical Demon Statue (GEDO MAZO)
There is no doubt that the Heretical Demon Statue is the Gedo Mazo summon that Nagato summoned during his fight against Hanzo, when Yahiko dies.
Here are some images to reference:
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You'll notice the rods coming from its stomach. It is what pierced Nagato when he summoned it. It is also what seems to lead down into Madara's lair to where the Zetsu's were being kept. Hashirama's DNA and now Yamato have both been fused in with the Demon Statue.
Gedo might mean "being outside of and controlling Life and Death".
Mazo might mean "a combining form"
Nagato was Gedo, the 7th Pain according to Konan.
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From this I assume that Gedo Mazo is a "living-dead" "form" of the Juubi used to "combine" all of the Bijuu and restore the Juubi to it's original form.
It seems he fully plans on doing exactly like he said.
Now all he has to do it defeat Bee and Naruto.
I'll try to post on what I think will happen in regards to that part, tomorrow. Man, I sure am excited for this week's chapter.
A couple things I ran into while researching....
Kankuro uses his jutsu to remove the Zetsu's from some of the ninja there at the Kage summit. VERY INTERESTING!
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I posted on Tobi being Madara a while back and made some good references. I thought this was another good page to that effect.
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Here is another for all you "Tobi isn't Madara" peeps out there.
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Here is proof that Madara is not a son of the Sage of the 6 Paths.
Just in case anyone is thinking that he is.
Madara's brother was also an Uchiha. Which means his brother is NOT a Senju. The sons of the SO6P were one Uchiha (elder) and one Senju (younger). The cycle of hatred starts here for the Uchiha when the SO6P chooses the younger Senju son to be the next leader.
You must be registered for see links
Here is Madara telling Kakashi and Naruto the story of how the Uchiha Curse of Hatred began with the Sage of the 6 Paths and his two sons. He goes on to say that this curse applies to him as much as to Sasuke and that his own fight with Hashirama was fate.
You must be registered for see links
Here he tells Naruto that even though this is only the second time he has met Naruto he knows that Naruto is Senju...good to know.
And also that Naruto and Sasuke have been fated to clash as well.
You must be registered for see links
Here we get a glimpse of both Madara, and his brothers Mangekou Sharingan eyes.
You must be registered for see links
Here you can see the combined form of Madara's eyes after he takes his brothers eyes and forms the EMS. It is clearly different than it was before, and it is also clearly changed to be a mix of both. Madara's look similar to his before, but now it has the lines going to the edge of the eyes that was the obvious trait of his younger brother's eyes.
By this we can assume that Sasuke's eyes will also look different now that he has transplanted Itachi's.
You must be registered for see links
Here, Itachi explains that the transplant gave birth to an entirely new eye power. He doesn't specify if that new power is a new eye (rinnengan) or if its a new eye power (time space). I believe it to be the later, however I wouldn't be surprised with either explanation. Here we can assume that Sasuke will also develop a new doujutsu because of his transplant with Itachi's eyes...will we Sasuke with a new sharingan, the rinnengan, or even a new totally unknown doujutsu?
You must be registered for see links
Here we see Sasuke show his Mangekou Sharingan in both eyes.
There is some heavy shading in this frame, look at the next page to see a clearer frame shot of one of the eyes.
You must be registered for see links
Here we see Itachi clearly shows his double Mangekou Sharingan.
Will we see a combined form of both MS in Sasuke's new EMS?
What will it be Kishi?
To get back on track with Madara's plan...
You must be registered for see links
This is a great page for Madara info.
It says that Madara's unstoppable power led him to be hailed as the strongest shinobi alive and that he formed an alliance with the Senju that formed the ninja world as we knowit, Leaf. Itachi finishes by saying that he wasn't able to defeat Hasirama in the fight for control but that he is "alive and well" as are his eyes "and their power"
This leads me to believe that although something may be wrong with Madara's as he has told the Kage's (not his whole self), but that he is still ALIVE and so are his eye powers.
You must be registered for see links
Here we learn some truth about Madara and the Sharingan from Itachi.
More to it than being able to control the Kyuubi...EMS.
You must be registered for see links
With EMS, Itachi says that any limits, any ideas of capacity will be gone.
"You and I are each other's spares."
You must be registered for see links
Here Madara explains to Naruto and Kakashi that even though Sasuke knows the truth now about Itachi and everything, he still wants revenge. Naruto accuses Madara of having done it to him. Madara replies, "no, I didnt" "he chose it himself" "i took a gamble not knowing" "he chose revenge" "in his heart he was always 'one of us'."
You must be registered for see links
"Naruto, someday you will have to fight Sasuke."
"Or, rather, I will make you fight Sasuke"
"This fated battle has been long in coming"
You must be registered for see links
Long before Madara tells Konan that he formed Akatsuki, not Yahiko.
Itachi gives Madara credit for it, but then starts bad mouthing Madara.
"Madara is a pathetic form of his former self"
"He's no longer worthy of being considered the greatest Uchiha"
"The only person who can surpass him, surpass the invincible Madara and achieve true immortality is me."
This is Itachi telling Sasuke what he wants Sasuke to believe.
NOT what Itachi really believes...I don't think Itachi wanted to kill his brother and obtain Sasuke's eyes to try and challenge Madara. I think that if that had been his wish, he could have and would have done so.
Since it is obvious that Itachi let Sasuke win, it is equally apparent that Itachi wants Sasuke to feel this way about Madara. Itachi is setting his brother up as the man that can defeat Madara once and for all. Go Itachi! Will it work?
So knowing that Madara will try to use Sasuke against Naruto, as I am sure Madara tried to use Itachi; Itachi is setting up Sasuke against Madara. Using the last few precious moments he has with his brother to build him up against Madara. I believe Madara probably tried to use Itachi to fight Naruto and gain the Kyuubi. He obviously doesn't want to/ or can't/couldn't do it by himself.
However, if he can use Sasuke to gain the power of the Kyuubi and Hachibi, he will be able to restore the power of the Juubi, and then wants to control it to become the most powerful being on the planet and then control the world. This is the path of Uchiha Madara. Who can/will stop him? Only Kishi knows for certain. I can hardly wait for this portion of the story to unfold.
Thanks for reading my posts.
I look forward to your thoughts.
If you really like this breakdown, let me know and i will do another for a different character.
Also...remembered a theory I have about Madara's time-space jutsu.
When he warps himself and or others away during a battle...
I think he is using warping them into a sealed room with 1000+ Zetsus...
"Welcome to Death Row!" or "Welcome to the Hospital"
He could just take them there, and then leave to go back to whatever he was doing.
Confident that the Zetsus would finish the job and kill/record/copy whoever he brings to them.
On the other hand he could warp there, and have the Zetsu's give him more chakra, heal him, replace limbs, cancel a raging case of Ameratsu... ya know, whatever. Its so genius it makes me want to cry. Not sure that's what is happening, but it makes a sick sense.
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