They also call it using others to fight your own battle.
Feats of current Oro...... Pain is week in front of people like the Raikage.. that is why he was weak in front of SM Naruto.... lol. his weakness is people who are bloody tanks...
It doesn't matter Edo Tensei is apart of his moveset. Also if I were to use your argument summonings are using other things to fight your battles. Um I don't see what your trying to do with the second statement.
I don't get these guys lol they overrate Tsunade. Orchimaru with Edo Tenesi and Wood style>Tsunade with brute strength and regen ablites. Jayria with sage mode>Tsunade. I don't see how Tsuande beats them. I just don't.
I don't necessarily care about the fact that Tsunade is the weakest Sannin. I just don't understand why I should NOT rank her as the worst Hokage. I mean, the only argument I can see is perhaps ranking her above Minato on the basis that Minato's reign was very short. But I would still rank Minato above Tsunade as Hokage.
It doesn't matter Edo Tensei is apart of his moveset. Also if I were to use your argument summonings are using other things to fight your battles. Um I don't see what your trying to do with the second statement.
Feats of current Oro...... Pain is week in front of people like the Raikage.. that is why he was weak in front of SM Naruto.... lol. his weakness is people who are bloody tanks...
That is not his weakness at all, I'm not sure where your pulling this stuff from.
He was "weak" in front of Sm naruto because he wasted 6 paths worth of chakra Blowing up the leaf and deva path need to recharge his powers and he had no intent to kill naruto at all.
She still failed. The Hokage's core duty is to defend and protect the village. The only time she actually had to do that, she failed. It was the first time Konoha was levelled, and it occurred on her watch.
Hashirama had to deal with Madara and Kyuubi. Tobirama with the Second Shinobi World War. Hiruzen with the rest of the Second Shinobi World War and the Third Shinobi World War. Minato had to deal with Obito and Kyuubi.
Yes, he's the Child of Prophecy. It still doesn't mean that Tsunade is excused from her blatant failure at doing her job. What did she accomplish as Hokage? It's not a rhetorical question, I'm genuinely curious because I can't seem to remember anything as such that stands out.
Yes, she failed. However, that only shows how strong the enemy is, not how weak Tsunade is. I dunno, it all depends on one's viewpoint. It's whether you think positively or negatively. There is no right or wrong opinion in this. My point was, don't use Naruto as a basis to gauge Tsunade's strength. He clearly has gone beyond the levels of the standard kage.
It's his fault because he let Danzo have free reign to do his power hungry treacherous crap. Danzo helped Hanzo kill Yahiko. This set into motion the events that turned Nagato into Pain. If this didn't happen. He'd have been an ally of the leaf.
Ally of the Leaf is exaggerating. Don't forget that Obito was manipulating them from the beginning. Hanzo would have found a way to kill Yahiko, Danzo or not. Danzo's help just made it occur earlier than it would have otherwise.
Nagato himself said that he got manipulated by Obito. Him not turning into Pain was very unlikely.
In any event, Hiruzen himself has a lot to be blamed for, agreed. But the manga clearly implies that Danzo did not have Hiruzen's approval in what he was doing in Amegakure.
It's his fault because he let Danzo have free reign to do his power hungry treacherous crap. Danzo helped Hanzo kill Yahiko. This set into motion the events that turned Nagato into Pain. If this didn't happen. He'd have been an ally of the leaf.
Yes, she failed. However, that only shows how strong the enemy is, not how weak Tsunade is. I dunno, it all depends on one's viewpoint. It's whether you think positively or negatively. There is no right or wrong opinion in this. My point was, don't use Naruto as a basis to gauge Tsunade's strength. He clearly has gone beyond the levels of the standard kage.
Eh, I wouldn't say SM Naruto was beyond Kage level. Nevertheless, I think you misunderstood my point. I was saying that Naruto had to do Tsunade's job for her, not because she ordered him to or whatever, but because, in the hours (or whatever) preceding it, she had shown that she was incapable of dealing with Pain.
That is not his weakness at all, I'm not sure where your pulling this stuff from.
He was "weak" in front of Sm naruto because he wasted 6 paths worth of chakra Blowing up the leaf and deva path need to recharge his powers and he had no intent to kill naruto at all.
Apparently you don't know what Edo tensei is...... Edo tensei is bringing back dead shinobi , and who have the power to do anything with them......that is EDO TENSEI..... however, that doesn't mean your not getting help from other people.
Why was Obito affected? Because rin died. Why did Rin die? Because Hashirama's orders weren't followed through, of kids not going into wars. Aka Hiruzen's fault.
Why was Madara turned Bad? Tobirama
Hashirama failed to kill Madara? You should start reading the manga, when it obviously states , that Madara escaped death. If Hashirama had purposely not killed Madara then you have the right to blame him. =].
Madara gave Nagato the rinnegan = Good
Why did Nagato turned bad? Yahiko's death
Who was behind Yahiko's death? Danzo and Hanzo
Why was Danzo so high and might powerful in the village? due to Hiruzen
You misunderstand. You're thinking the same way as me. I'm just supporting a guy who's statement I believe to be that it's not as simple that Tsunade failed. Things happened. It's not necessarily anyone's exclusive fault.
True facts are excuses? mk, if thou likes to be in denial then so be it.
Uh.. then we clearly aren't reading the same manga.. Everytime Naruto defeated a pain, it had to do with his Rasenshuriken or immense strength.
3rd Raikage >> 6POP easily. Whether you would like it or not.
And pretty sure Naruto took down a full powered Deva path with SM quite easily in the end.. lmao.
The only problem is their "secret" as Nagato put it. If their secret is known they are about low-mid kage level in a fight.
Apparently you don't know what Edo tensei is...... Edo tensei is bringing back dead shinobi , and who have the power to do anything with them......that is EDO TENSEI..... however, that doesn't mean your not getting help from other people.
Well no shit. There was no need to say "They also call it using others to fight your own battle." in this thread though just no point. Whatever anyways it doesn't matter.
Eh, I wouldn't say SM Naruto was beyond Kage level. Nevertheless, I think you misunderstood my point. I was saying that Naruto had to do Tsunade's job for her, not because she ordered him to or whatever, but because, in the hours (or whatever) preceding it, she had shown that she was incapable of dealing with Pain.
Jiraiya was more successful? Now this just shows pure fanboyism. The fact that Jiraiya failed with Nagato.. doesn't really prove how he is more successful. Tsunade = Hokage.. Jiraiya = one of the shinobi who died for the village. Big difference son.
1. Jiraiya was the first candidate for Godaime Hokage. Tsunade was the runner-up.
2. Jiraiya trained Nagato, Minato and Naruto. Tsunade trained Sakura. Now compare the disciples of the two Sannin.
Dude.. she doesn't drink in public like that lmaoo. And drinking isn't one of the main themes.. Jiraiya drank in front of Naruto all the time lmaoooo. Hell he went for prostitution girls... Hashirama gambled in front of Tsunade.. lmaoo.
She was drinking on a bridge in public. I'm too lazy to find the panel.
Also, Hiruzen gets his paperwork done. Tsunade sneaks out to a bath and/or tea shop.
It doesn't really matter because at the end of the day, Tsunade didn't really do anything. Now if you really want to go deep, then ask your self. Can Tsunade do what Minato did any better? I think not.
There 4 Kyuubi sized monsters already present.. lmaoo. The situation was way more worst then your precious Minato faced. deal with it mate, and lets get off Minato's crouch.
Pain had defeated an entire village, Wasted 6 paths worth of chakra destroying the leaf, Defeating Sm Naruto, The fighting and defeating the kyuubi (via chibkau tensei), Then naruto got his chakra completely restored by minato, Then He had to fight Sm naruto yet again, Then losing to naruto.
Ok then, by your logic we should also restrict All summonings.
I'm not getting into this again with you, So i'm not going to try to explain Edo tensei.
It's a legit jutsu, Oro knows it, Oro can use it. All your Opinions on it aren't valid.
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How is he defeating Pain?
Preta path > Lightning armor and hell stab.
Yeah after
Pain had defeated an entire village, Wasted 6 paths worth of chakra destroying the leaf, Defeating Sm Naruto, The fighting and defeating the kyuubi (via chibkau tensei), Then naruto got his chakra completely restored by minato, Then He had to fight Sm naruto yet again, Then losing to naruto.
Why was Obito affected? Because rin died. Why did Rin die? Because Hashirama's orders weren't followed through, of kids not going into wars. Aka Hiruzen's fault.
