BenjerminGaye
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It makes no sense putting a knock off sage mode (curse mark) user against a perfect sage mode user.
Sage Mode Naruto vs Hebi 3 Tomoe Sasuke
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KidGamer65
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Naruto would comfortably defeat Sasuke w/o any summonings. Give him the help of the Boss Toads and especially the Elder Toads and he gets shit stomped. Period.
ComplexCity
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Unorthodox
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SM Naruto should win mid-difficulty.
While Hebi Sasuke can react to Naruto's speed, Naruto still has the benefit of having higher speed, Frog Katas, and greater physical strength which would allow him to comfortably overpower CS2 Hebi Sasuke at CQC, not to mention with Sage Sensing, he can comfortably sense any attempts at Sasuke using Close-Range Chidori Variants or any jutsu in general. Naruto is also capable of creating far greater amounts of clones and was only restricted due to leaving clones Mt. Myoboku which means Sasuke either gets overwhelmed by focusing on multiple clones at the same time, or Naruto simpy performs clever strategies revolving around clones that allows Sasuke to overpower Naruto.
While Hebi Sasuke can react to Naruto's speed, Naruto still has the benefit of having higher speed, Frog Katas, and greater physical strength which would allow him to comfortably overpower CS2 Hebi Sasuke at CQC, not to mention with Sage Sensing, he can comfortably sense any attempts at Sasuke using Close-Range Chidori Variants or any jutsu in general. Naruto is also capable of creating far greater amounts of clones and was only restricted due to leaving clones Mt. Myoboku which means Sasuke either gets overwhelmed by focusing on multiple clones at the same time, or Naruto simpy performs clever strategies revolving around clones that allows Sasuke to overpower Naruto.
An inferior Sage (Jiraiya) displayed great speed blitzing Human Path (somewhat) despite that same guy being able to react to FRS as well as the fact that SM Naruto blitzed Asura Path the instant before Asura Path managed to kill Tsunade and we also have to consider SM Naruto managed a Rasengan in that same amount of time as well.
What has CS2 Sasuke shown speed-wise River?
CS2 Sasuke is the third fastest state he's ever been.
Rikudo Sasuke>EMS Sasuke>CS2 Sasuke>Hebi Sasuke=MS Sasuke in speed. And MS Sasuke was portrayed fast enough to dodge E and base fought Itachi who is >= KM Naruto and B w/o Shunshin.
ComplexCity
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And how does that imply he's on par with SM Naruto's speed?
That's irrelevant to the discussion and really doesn't tell us how SM Naruto compares to CS2 Sasuke.
MS Sasuke was portrayed to have the reflexes to evade V1 Ei thanks to Precognition. He can't move anywhere near as fast as V1 Ei considering Base Bee displayed superior speed compared to Taka Sasuke.
You can argue their natural movement speed (ignoring Shunshin) is on par with each other, but SM Naruto still holds the advantage in CQC thanks to Clones, Physical Strength, Sage Sensing (which allows him to anticipate Chidori Variants), Frog Katas, and Smoke Bombs which easily allows SM Naruto to gain the upperhand here.
Ok.
No, just because he has precognition does not make him inferior. Lee already stated that to react you must have enough speed to dodge. And Sasuke did not dodge be he also counter-attacked. E > all Paths in V1 when it comes to speed.
I agree that Naruto beats him in CQC. And I agree he wins the overall fight; but, I disagree HM Naruto being any faster than CS2 Sasuke, especially when both were portrayed as fast and CS2 is faster. When it comes to Shunshin, I believe we can all say Sasuke has more and better feats. He blitzed a Sharingan user, dodged E and blitzed almost Deidara.
Black Mamba
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Lee emphasized that point when Sasuke had an undeveloped 2 Tomoe Sharingan, so the necessity of having a higher speed relative to your opponent was more important then, then it was now for Sasuke with 3 Tomoe Mastery. Furthermore, Sasuke credited his ability to dodge Bee due to his Sharingan and his Linear Attacks, not his own speed and this relates here as Ei had a linear attack and so thus, Sasuke was able to follow up on that and counter-attack. It's also the main reason why SM Naruto managed to react to the 3rd Raikage.
SM Naruto still managed to overwhelm Deva Path with all of Nagato's chakra being transferred to it in CQC without any Frog Katas. Shared Vision just aids the Paths in their reflexes a lot more than you'd think which is why KCM Naruto and Bee were both overwhelmed by Base Jin, the latter being noticeably superior to Sasuke in CQC as well as the fact that the Gokage felt the need to block the Rinnegan's Field of Vision with Mei's Hidden Mist despite not even having Shared Vision. You're totally underestimating how much the Rinnegan aids in effectively countering attacks from even much faster foes.
You haven't provided any evidence for why CS2 Sasuke is faster.
SM Naruto blitzed Asura Path despite Pain having Shared Vision. That's more impressive than almost blitzing Deidara which by feats, both SM Naruto and SM Jiraiya are both capable of doing so.
Sasuke dodging Ei has more to do with reaction speed and Precognition, not his own Flicker speed.
And Sasuke never blitzed a Sharingan User.
And? You seem to fail to grasp the idea that Sasuke got blitzed by Itachi yet he was using Sharingan. Sharingan does not make your speed go up. It's precognitive ability and just tells you an attack is coming. You knowing it does not equal to you being able to avoid it. You need speed for that.
This is CQC and you wanted to discuss Shunshin.
Since when have Paths been so fast anyway?
True.
He did.
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BenjerminGaye
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Danzo wasn't using sharingan for precognition. Shisui's eye was still on cooldown and the eyes in his hand show no signs of providing sight.
AlphaMaleLion
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