Overloaded Sensei/Sempai System
- Thread starter Dribbles
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from what i've read it seems you're suggesting that some senseis be made to teach about 20 people at once in the same thread O_O....so not gonna happen imo...
Everyone who waits gets some training.. eventually. The problem imo, is actually the number of active senseis and sempai/Shishou.
Say there're about 30 senseis, only 15 are actually active, and outta that only like 7 actually have time to train...and outta that only like 2 actually DO train, and outta that only 1 is free...U_U
Now moving on to senpais; I think its right to say that they're the ones actually doing all the training of late.And it shocks me to know that some senseis dont have one, for what reason i know not.
About the 'Shishou' i think its a good idea but not quite there yet.We have 4 teaching ken etc....and 1 for clay bla bla bla...and non for Sharingan .I mean, if the admin want to reduce the load on senseis they should concentrate on what matters. Since my time on NB i've only seen 1/2 person,s who uses a Diedara bio.whereas numerous people are lurking round looking for sharingan activation...
All this said, you still cant decide whom a sensei should train.You can only suggest that he train you and he'll accept if you're lucky enough.Although some senseis write on their wall that they're full but are never ever ever in the training forums[for like 30+ pages]...imo that is freaking annoying...if you dont wanna, just say so,or simply quit U_U
Peace!!!
Everyone who waits gets some training.. eventually. The problem imo, is actually the number of active senseis and sempai/Shishou.
Say there're about 30 senseis, only 15 are actually active, and outta that only like 7 actually have time to train...and outta that only like 2 actually DO train, and outta that only 1 is free...U_U
Now moving on to senpais; I think its right to say that they're the ones actually doing all the training of late.And it shocks me to know that some senseis dont have one, for what reason i know not.
About the 'Shishou' i think its a good idea but not quite there yet.We have 4 teaching ken etc....and 1 for clay bla bla bla...and non for Sharingan .I mean, if the admin want to reduce the load on senseis they should concentrate on what matters. Since my time on NB i've only seen 1/2 person,s who uses a Diedara bio.whereas numerous people are lurking round looking for sharingan activation...
All this said, you still cant decide whom a sensei should train.You can only suggest that he train you and he'll accept if you're lucky enough.Although some senseis write on their wall that they're full but are never ever ever in the training forums[for like 30+ pages]...imo that is freaking annoying...if you dont wanna, just say so,or simply quit U_U
Peace!!!
McRazor
Active member
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When are you guys going to stop looking at the senseis as a figure for training. There is much more background stuff they're doing that you just don't see because you don't have access to Sensei HQ. They're grading battles, conducting tests, giving their opinions on battles and so on. If someone has the Sensei status it means that he EARNED it with his knowledge and it means that he is a figure in the RP and that people can come to them asking not only about training but about different RP related stuff. Just stop and think outside of the box for once.
yeaah you're right.teachers shouldn't come to class cuz they have to grade tests...anyways that wasnt my point.Tis was you still cant decide whom a sensei should train.You can only suggest that he train you and he'll accept if you're lucky enough.
So I'll just reply to what I generally gathered from this thread.
Group training doesn't work, simple as that. Your suggestion of training people in a huge group will bring more flaws to the system than corrections. Why doesn't it work? Because what are the chances that all ten students, heck, even two students, and one sensei are all online at the same time each day, get off at the same time, and all have time to reply at the same time. Practically impossible right? Now the sensei can make one of two choices. Not respond until all the students respond, holding up the other student and making training even slower than it needs to be. Or they can just go on with the active student, which completely defeats the purpose of double training because then as a result of going on with only one student, they then have to go back and teach the other student the same exact thing over again. They can alternatively have them reply to everything that they missed, but that often results in the student not understanding a word of what they're learning. Group training is more flawed than singular training.
And then the fun part. Making senseis teach lower ranked members? Yeah... no. And you're annoyed that senseis sometimes choose to simply not reply to VMs. Lol, it's very easy to tell senseis what they should do, and I've seen many members do the same until they actually became a sensei for themselves. If I'm full on students, or don't currently have time to train people, then why should I bother replying to every VM that I get (20+ per day for many senseis) asking for training? Furthermore, let's say that we do have time, and that we are free for once. What makes you think that we want to spend every moment of our time on NB training? Because that seems to be what many members thing; that senseis are only on NB to train. If I don't reply to a VM asking for training, and then make a battle thread or even talk to a friend for a few minutes, I've often been immediately marked as ignoring my responsibilities. Which is ridiculous. Quite frankly, no sensei feels like explaining why they can't train fifteen times a day, because as you (or one of you, can't remember which one) proved on the first page, most students refuse to accept a simple "no" and think of it as an insult or an abuse of power. Basically, people on this site get butthurt way too easily.
Furthermore, the problem isn't that senseis don't like to train noobs. The problem is that many new members fail at showing simple courtesy or even an ounce of respect. And honestly, no sensei is going to waste their time teaching someone who constantly badgers them when they don't reply within ten minutes. Sorry, that's just the truth of the matter. And if a sensei is doing his or her job and training people or doing battle tests or giving their opinion on arguments in battle (yes those are all part of a senseis responsibilities, not just training) then they have every right to do that, after all, this isn't a paying job where we have to put up with all kinds of attitudes. I assure you, no RP moderator on this site expects us to train someone who refuses to show respect. Just like normal members, we have the right to ignore and block other people; when we become senseis we do not simply lose that right. And for the record, since I saw that no denying students for personal reasons thing being tossed around here a bit, we already spoke about this in the sensei HQ, and it's an easily abused rule. However, when Nexus and Jinbei made that rule they meant for it to apply to situations in which the sensei illogically doesn't want to train the student. Most senseis don't like certain students simply because that student posts on their page fifteen times a day or refuses to show common courtesy. Having a sensei not like a student for an illogical reason is actually a rather rare situation and most senseis aren't like that. Once again, I assure you, if you go to them with a case of you being disrespectful to a sensei (I'm not saying that you are) then they are not going to demote that sensei.
And as for the many senseis who do not currently train due to inactivity, that's fine too. The thing is, being a sensei doesn't mean that we have to spend our every moment training. It means that we have the RIGHT to train you. Senior senseis specifically have already been helping the site for years, and as a result have earned the right to at times take a break from their duties. Basically, if what you guys said here is taken into account then senseis are going to be forced to all actively train, and by some people's definition of active means that I have to accept at least one out of every five students that request. Someone also said that you don't have the right to be a sensei if you're not currently training people or if you're not training certain people. Yes, let's fire about half of the senseis on the base. That will certainly solve all of your problems.
And as a side note, specifically to what Frozenstein said, first come first serve isn't a flaw at all. Are you telling me that it would be more moral for senseis to get a VM requesting training on Monday, deny it, and then get another VM requesting training on Friday, and then accept it? That's ridiculous. Whoever comes first gets trained first, what other way is there to do it? And for the record, if you become a sensei you'll find that taking 10 students at once on a continuous basis is much more of a hassle than you're making it seem. Again, that's essentially telling a sensei to spend all of their time online NB, which most people use for leisure, training people. And if by 1/day you mean one post per day, then that would be even slower than if you just took one or two students at once. So either you're training methods would leave you heavily overworked or it would leave you as one of, if not the, slowest training active sensei.
I'm sorry if any of this sounds unintentionally harsh or rude, but it does annoy me when people randomly accuse or imply that senseis are not doing their jobs just because of their personal experience. Think of it this way, students outnumber senseis by a landslide. As a result our system is flawed but there isn't much better that you can do. Honestly, it's either be extremely patient or leave the RP, that's really the genuine truth of it. RPing right now takes a huge amount of patience. Improvements have been suggested but almost every time that happens we realize that those suggestions will bring up more problems than solutions. Becoming a sensei really isn't very difficult at all, so if you want to help the system, then tell the people who finished their training to apply. Because I really have yet to see a suggestion, both in this thread and in other suggestion threads about the same thing, that actually brings about any improvements.
As for the teacher analogy that defg made. That analogy means nothing because as Erzo said, teachers are paid, we're not.
Group training doesn't work, simple as that. Your suggestion of training people in a huge group will bring more flaws to the system than corrections. Why doesn't it work? Because what are the chances that all ten students, heck, even two students, and one sensei are all online at the same time each day, get off at the same time, and all have time to reply at the same time. Practically impossible right? Now the sensei can make one of two choices. Not respond until all the students respond, holding up the other student and making training even slower than it needs to be. Or they can just go on with the active student, which completely defeats the purpose of double training because then as a result of going on with only one student, they then have to go back and teach the other student the same exact thing over again. They can alternatively have them reply to everything that they missed, but that often results in the student not understanding a word of what they're learning. Group training is more flawed than singular training.
And then the fun part. Making senseis teach lower ranked members? Yeah... no. And you're annoyed that senseis sometimes choose to simply not reply to VMs. Lol, it's very easy to tell senseis what they should do, and I've seen many members do the same until they actually became a sensei for themselves. If I'm full on students, or don't currently have time to train people, then why should I bother replying to every VM that I get (20+ per day for many senseis) asking for training? Furthermore, let's say that we do have time, and that we are free for once. What makes you think that we want to spend every moment of our time on NB training? Because that seems to be what many members thing; that senseis are only on NB to train. If I don't reply to a VM asking for training, and then make a battle thread or even talk to a friend for a few minutes, I've often been immediately marked as ignoring my responsibilities. Which is ridiculous. Quite frankly, no sensei feels like explaining why they can't train fifteen times a day, because as you (or one of you, can't remember which one) proved on the first page, most students refuse to accept a simple "no" and think of it as an insult or an abuse of power. Basically, people on this site get butthurt way too easily.
Furthermore, the problem isn't that senseis don't like to train noobs. The problem is that many new members fail at showing simple courtesy or even an ounce of respect. And honestly, no sensei is going to waste their time teaching someone who constantly badgers them when they don't reply within ten minutes. Sorry, that's just the truth of the matter. And if a sensei is doing his or her job and training people or doing battle tests or giving their opinion on arguments in battle (yes those are all part of a senseis responsibilities, not just training) then they have every right to do that, after all, this isn't a paying job where we have to put up with all kinds of attitudes. I assure you, no RP moderator on this site expects us to train someone who refuses to show respect. Just like normal members, we have the right to ignore and block other people; when we become senseis we do not simply lose that right. And for the record, since I saw that no denying students for personal reasons thing being tossed around here a bit, we already spoke about this in the sensei HQ, and it's an easily abused rule. However, when Nexus and Jinbei made that rule they meant for it to apply to situations in which the sensei illogically doesn't want to train the student. Most senseis don't like certain students simply because that student posts on their page fifteen times a day or refuses to show common courtesy. Having a sensei not like a student for an illogical reason is actually a rather rare situation and most senseis aren't like that. Once again, I assure you, if you go to them with a case of you being disrespectful to a sensei (I'm not saying that you are) then they are not going to demote that sensei.
And as for the many senseis who do not currently train due to inactivity, that's fine too. The thing is, being a sensei doesn't mean that we have to spend our every moment training. It means that we have the RIGHT to train you. Senior senseis specifically have already been helping the site for years, and as a result have earned the right to at times take a break from their duties. Basically, if what you guys said here is taken into account then senseis are going to be forced to all actively train, and by some people's definition of active means that I have to accept at least one out of every five students that request. Someone also said that you don't have the right to be a sensei if you're not currently training people or if you're not training certain people. Yes, let's fire about half of the senseis on the base. That will certainly solve all of your problems.
And as a side note, specifically to what Frozenstein said, first come first serve isn't a flaw at all. Are you telling me that it would be more moral for senseis to get a VM requesting training on Monday, deny it, and then get another VM requesting training on Friday, and then accept it? That's ridiculous. Whoever comes first gets trained first, what other way is there to do it? And for the record, if you become a sensei you'll find that taking 10 students at once on a continuous basis is much more of a hassle than you're making it seem. Again, that's essentially telling a sensei to spend all of their time online NB, which most people use for leisure, training people. And if by 1/day you mean one post per day, then that would be even slower than if you just took one or two students at once. So either you're training methods would leave you heavily overworked or it would leave you as one of, if not the, slowest training active sensei.
I'm sorry if any of this sounds unintentionally harsh or rude, but it does annoy me when people randomly accuse or imply that senseis are not doing their jobs just because of their personal experience. Think of it this way, students outnumber senseis by a landslide. As a result our system is flawed but there isn't much better that you can do. Honestly, it's either be extremely patient or leave the RP, that's really the genuine truth of it. RPing right now takes a huge amount of patience. Improvements have been suggested but almost every time that happens we realize that those suggestions will bring up more problems than solutions. Becoming a sensei really isn't very difficult at all, so if you want to help the system, then tell the people who finished their training to apply. Because I really have yet to see a suggestion, both in this thread and in other suggestion threads about the same thing, that actually brings about any improvements.
As for the teacher analogy that defg made. That analogy means nothing because as Erzo said, teachers are paid, we're not.
Frozenstein
Active member
"And as a side note, specifically to what Frozenstein said, first come first serve isn't a flaw at all. Are you telling me that it would be more moral for senseis to get a VM requesting training on Monday, deny it, and then get another VM requesting training on Friday, and then accept it? That's ridiculous. Whoever comes first gets trained first, what other way is there to do it? And for the record, if you become a sensei you'll find that taking 10 students at once on a continuous basis is much more of a hassle than you're making it seem. Again, that's essentially telling a sensei to spend all of their time online NB, which most people use for leisure, training people. And if by 1/day you mean one post per day, then that would be even slower than if you just took one or two students at once. So either you're training methods would leave you heavily overworked or it would leave you as one of, if not the, slowest training active sensei."
you seem to misunderstood my post. I ALREADY saw application threads like this. The sensei/senpai makes the thread and after 1-3 days he/she closes it and chose a certain number of students and not only the first 2. and this works and people don't feel like they have to be no-lifers to get some training.
also I have/had trainings with 1 post per WEEK and even more. and you call my idea the slowest. this is ridiculous.
you don't have to take 10 students all the time, just go back to the application thread and accept another student.
you seem to misunderstood my post. I ALREADY saw application threads like this. The sensei/senpai makes the thread and after 1-3 days he/she closes it and chose a certain number of students and not only the first 2. and this works and people don't feel like they have to be no-lifers to get some training.
also I have/had trainings with 1 post per WEEK and even more. and you call my idea the slowest. this is ridiculous.
you don't have to take 10 students all the time, just go back to the application thread and accept another student.
Migualon J.J.
Active member
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to bolded, some of us just enjoy having Orange Name xd
(jk, well partly, i like my orange name xd)
eh, ok, let's say that we ALL senseis stop teaching for 1 month? than we might actually get appreciated for our work on NB's RP by all members, how about that? :| or wait, how about every sensei who isn't teaching for, what was it, 30+ Pages drops his position, how many senseis would stay you ask? um, 5 or maybe 6? :| + i actually saw this argument MANY times, and that is "why don't you just drop your sensei position?"; my question is "WHY SHOULD WE?" why people think that there can be only limited amount of senseis? THEORETICALLY there can be 1000 senseis, god even 10000000 senseis at once, why should any of us drop our position as sensei? O_O
i actually read that, you have to teach me Wall No Jutsu you learned from Cali, well, to this whole post, just 1 emotican is appropriate
:worshippy:
it will be good if every sensei has 2 or 3 sempais under him to teach the fellow students that way he can train the more higher up levels ...and the newbies like many can grasp basic training and have fun without the possibility of so many rejections
I'm not going to argue against first thing that you said because I don't exactly know what part of my post you're responding to.
I really don't see the point that you're trying to make by bringing up application threads here. How exactly is making a thread and then closing it after a few days and then taking a few students out of the thread relevant to what I said? If you're referring to the first come first serve part of my post, then... what? How is this not first come first serve? You make an application, you accept a certain amount of people in order from when they post (if you're not doing that then you're simply being biased which is what most of the members are complaining about here). Other than that I really don't see any relevance to that and what I said. The parts of your post that I was responding to were the first come first serve concept, the idea of having ten students all at once, and the fact that one post per day doesn't solve anything, as I'll reinforce below.Still, your suggestion to make more students get trained is to train people and only post once per day? Training someone in an acceptable method in, water for example, from start to finish can easily be about sixty posts or more. Most likely more. It's not at all ridiculous to say that your method is EXTREMELY slow. Notice that I said slowest training ACTIVE sensei. I don't know many senseis who actively train on a regular basis that make it a point to reply to a thread only once a week. They reply when they have time or they don't post at all. With that method if you remain consistently active then those students would finish in about two months, give or take. Whereas if you are still just as active and train even just one student at a time, you could easily finish with a student every couple of days. And this is assuming that you stay active during this time. If you ever go inactive with those students for even a while, then you could extend that time greatly. I'm not saying that your training method is wrong and that it isn't done regularly. I'm saying that you're suggesting that this somehow makes more people get trained and speeds up the training process. When in reality it doesn't at all.
"You don't have to take 10 students all the time, just go back to the application thread and accept another student."
Which would effectively make you have ten students at once, no? Otherwise you're former post in which you said that you would take ten students made no sense. What you're saying is I take ten students. Say that one of them finishes, and then I only have nine. I then go back to my application thread and take a new one. Then I have ten again. By all interpretations that's what you're saying. Which, like I said, having ten students at all times is a hassle.
However, I believe that I've already made my points, and any further arguing (not with you specifically, I mean in general) will most likely just end up going in circles. So those are all of my opinions on the matter, take it or leave it.
-Broly-
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riku i believe hes talking about application threads like thisI'm not going to argue against first thing that you said because I don't exactly know what part of my post you're responding to.
Still, your suggestion to make more students get trained is to train people and only post once per day? Training someone in an acceptable method in, water for example, from start to finish can easily be about sixty posts or more. Most likely more. It's not at all ridiculous to say that your method is EXTREMELY slow. Notice that I said slowest training ACTIVE sensei. I don't know many senseis who actively train on a regular basis that make it a point to reply to a thread only once a week. They reply when they have time or they don't post at all. With that method if you remain consistently active then those students would finish in about two months, give or take. Whereas if you are still just as active and train even just one student at a time, you could easily finish with a student every couple of days. And this is assuming that you stay active during this time. If you ever go inactive with those students for even a while, then you could extend that time greatly. I'm not saying that your training method is wrong and that it isn't done regularly. I'm saying that you're suggesting that this somehow makes more people get trained and speeds up the training process. When in reality it doesn't at all.
"You don't have to take 10 students all the time, just go back to the application thread and accept another student."
Which would effectively make you have ten students at once, no? Otherwise you're former post in which you said that you would take ten students made no sense. What you're saying is I take ten students. Say that one of them finishes, and then I only have nine. I then go back to my application thread and take a new one. Then I have ten again. By all interpretations that's what you're saying. Which, like I said, having ten students at all times is a hassle.
However, I believe that I've already made my points, and any further arguing (not with you specifically, I mean in general) will most likely just end up going in circles. So those are all of my opinions on the matter, take it or leave it.
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I know what he's talking about. I simply don't see the relevance between that and what I posted. Nor do I see how that makes more people get trained since it's essentially the same as just accepting a small amount of people at once, and most senseis only do this every few months or so.
-Haku Yuki-
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riku has the Kg wall of text no Jutsu U_U iunherted from cailburn O_O its unstoipable read it all and i agree with riku..
Migualon J.J.
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why not give Sensei position on golden plate for just being nice to people without test? as it is now, Senpais are almost the same as Senseis, so now there would be even more smaller Senseis? what would be the point of being sensei than? Orange name? O_O