Orochimaru w/ Samehada vs Killer Bee

[Rιver]

Lol. You couldn't hava picked any worse example. Naruto was shocked. Never in his dreams did he think something like that would even happen to his village. Sensing has nothing to do in here.



Plot or rather lack of plot. And lack of panel time. We both know Orochimaru could've used anything from what I already mentioned to get there faster but for some reason he didn't. Ask Kishimoto.

There's no difference, whatsoever between the cases; f.e. KM Naruto, who's sensing is passive could not sense Sasuke or his team heading his way. He also couldn't sense Nagato moving around, while talking to Itachi. There are multiple examples, that is not the only fact. All while passive and 'not shocked'.

It's as if you're blindfolded and asked to examine milk; however, when you drink it, you ultimately realize you were given juice. No matter the juice, the taste will be entirely different and you might even experience a hallucination of tasting milk although you drank juice. This is due to expectations.

One could also say that Sasuke could have used on instances Tsukuyomi, but did not, and instead used Sharingan; Genjutsu. We all know though, Sasuke does not possess Tsukuyomi. It's not due to plot nor panel time, it's due to the lack of abilities.​

@River

Simple. Hashi DNA!

As I stated Orochimaru sensed a chakra within and hypothesized it being Yamato or someone he's familiar with. If I remember correctly, Orochimaru stated "hm, could it be" meaning he distinguish something about the chakra. Zetsu = Hashi chakra, something he's currently using. Yamato = Hashi chakra and his own.


That quote was in regard to Kabuto and his multiple mixtures of chakra

Also, I'm on my phone. Can you separate the multiple quotes pls

Not really... there's the fact that Yamato possesses Hashirama's chakra, which is equal to Zetsu's. There should be no difference whatsoever in that case, which means that even if Yamato was in Zetsu, he wouldn't be able to tell the difference. What you're suggesting though (I assume), is that Orochimaru already knew of Yamato's own chakra signature to begin with if he attempted to differentiate of these two individuals; which is impossible. He never knew of Yamato's chakra signature before that to begin with.

Unfortunately, it'd be multi-posting. I'm afraid I can't.​

 

[TRE MERCER]

When Manda gets the strength feats to restrain a Bijuu then we can talk. Until then, if Manda attacks him, he gets slapped away with minimal effort, and if Orochimaru goes underground, he gets nuked when he comes back up. I have no reason to believe Orochimaru is going to consistently evade a projectile that has Mountain sized AoE and moves as fast as Rasen Shuriken, especially when Killer B can just use his whirlwind first, blow these guys back (preventing them from going underground) and then nuking them.

Lol, stabbing Hachibi isn't going to do anything. Orochimaru stabs him, B retaliates and Orochimaru gets raped.

What strength feats do Bijuu have suggesting Manda cannot restrain him? Manda had no problem restricting summonings which have similar strength to Bijuu. Hachibi couldn't even break through a wood dragon until Madara was weakened. When has an uncharged Bijuudama destroyed a mountain? Please Manda is extremely strong whirlwind throwing Manda around is laughable. Not to mention how is that stopping them form going underground not to mention the whirlwind has huge dust clouds.(

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). so how is Hachibi going to stop and nuke them if he can't be sure where there at?

 

[Nattana]

One could also say that Sasuke could have used on instances Tsukuyomi, but did not, and instead used Sharingan; Genjutsu. We all know though, Sasuke does not possess Tsukuyomi. It's not due to plot nor panel time, it's due to the lack of abilities.[/FONT]

Slithering Snake Mode is nothing but pure speed and agility boost, yet Orochimaru didn't use it. U wanna say that Orochimaru lacks an ability to use it?

The only thing that needs to be stopped is your stupid wank for this character. You initially mentioned all those nonsense techniques such "Hiding in a mole" but once you realized it was useless, you initial choice was to wank the hell out of Mayfly.

Hiding like a mole isn't useless. It's actually very op. But I won't be denying that Mayfly is (probably, since we know almost nothing about Leech All Creation) superior to Hiding Like a Mole in almost everything.

I showed you a scan of him jumping back to show you he had to widen the gap since that would give him more time to defend himself. It would damage him if he merges. As simple as that. He could summon that because of the distance. Like I told you, the gap was widened. He said if he gets hit, he dies and then jumped back. Why then would he jump back and summon rashoumon? Simply because he couldn't summon Rashoumon or defend himself from such a distance.

Lol, he jumped back like three times. And? The distance he gained by jumping was negated by the distance Rashoumon Gates used when summoned in fron of Orochimaru BEFORE they got hit by KN4's attack.

Straight up TBB from KN4 would've 'killed' that Oro's body - true. But Orochimaru didn't evade that attack because he wanted to test his Rashoumon Gates. Actually, fighting against and testing unknown jutsu is one of his favourite things (look: Hiruzen vs Orochimaru and Oro's Databook description and personal information).

I wonder where you got traveling 10 KM and not slower than Obito from when Obito was already there before he did and it wasn't even shown when Obito got to Sasuke. That doesn't save him from CTBB.

I never stated that Mayfly isn't slower than Kamui because it is. Kamui is instant, but the sole fact that it was even compared to Kamui's speed and the fact that on a distance worth of 10km it wasn't MUCH slower, proves that closing the distance of a few tens of meters with it would be nearly instant.

There we go with your nonsense again.

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This is a tailed beast ball and that's what he used. Stop this bullcrap you're talking about Bomb and blast when it's the same damn thing but just used differently. The SFX says Explosion

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meaning the ball exploded and produced that result . Your gibberish doesn't help.

Also if you don't stop wanking this guy then I guess you should stop posting. KN6 Naruto did the same damn thing without swallowing any damn TBB and adding chakra to it like your stupid logic implies. I showed a scan of the exact tame thing. Can't tell they are the same? KN6

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KN4

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. It's the same energy beam that surrounds the ball and it is more than evident there unless you need to get your eyes checked. SFX weren't used for that entire chapter which is probably why you keep saying they are different. There's no evidence that additional chakra was used for that KN4 TBB. Not at all.

Obviously, everything starts from forming a TBB. The difference is in how it's used. TBB can be used as a condensed ball of chakra that gets fired off and explodes on impact. But it can also be used as a blast that releases the power in a cone straight from the users mouth.

KN4 used a combination of BOTH - a ball AND a wave/beam/blast/whatever-you-want-to-call-it.
KN6 used only a TBB - it evaporated the rocks it passed through. There was no energy released with it - the whole chakra was focused in the ball.

 

[Rιver]

Slithering Snake Mode is nothing but pure speed and agility boost, yet Orochimaru didn't use it. U wanna say that Orochimaru lacks an ability to use it?

That only works in plain fields, like before. In this case, he was going through a rubble. It wouldn't be possible, or at least faster, no matter how hard he tried. Ninja's also don't use Shunshin in forest, but jump through the trees. It's all matter of environmental advantage.​

 

[KidGamer65]

What strength feats do Bijuu have suggesting Manda cannot restrain him?

Hachibi

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and

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Manda isn't restraining shit here, nor will he get the chance to do so as stated in my post, which I conveniently see no reply to.

Manda hand to problem restricting summonings which have similar strength to Bijuu.

Yeah, no, he hasn't.

Hachibi couldn't even break through a wood dragon until Madara was weakened.

Not only was that not Wood Dragon, Mokuton suppresses Bijuu's power. So why you are using this as any kind of legit example baffles me.

When has an uncharged Bijuudama destroyed a mountain?

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These are standard Bijuu Dama from Bijuu 2-7 with the exception of 4.

Please Manda is extremely strong whirlwind throwing Manda around is laughable.

Strength has shit to do with it. Killer B punching and using its tentacles throws Bijuu around and slaps them around. Manda is similar sized, so Hachibi spinning rapidly will knock him backwards, especially if if he gets hit by the tentacles directly.

Not to mention how is that stopping them form going underground not to mention the whirlwind has huge dust clouds.(

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). so how is Hachibi going to stop and nuke them if he can't be sure where there at?

Can't go underground when you are

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. Lol, what kind of question is that? If Manda and Oro are sent flying straight backwards, he just needs to fire the Bijuu Dama in the direction they went in. He doesn't need to see them to know that his whirlwind will only push them backwards on the same trajectory they were at before.

 

[Joker]

Regarding the Fushi Tensei technique, why would Kishimoto spend all this time, implying, and even explicitly saying Orochimaru wants Sasuke's body for his Sharingan. Going against years of implications and statements with poor examples is meaningless. "Oh, hw could've used this here, or here", no, that's not what Kishimoto wanted for unknown purposes, it's plot. We seen it happen multiple times, and this isn't any different, so intead of questioning whether he can or not, focus on the match-up and stop going against facts

 

[blazekev90]

@ River:

... -_- at the double quote lol

Second, Zetsu is made completely of Hashi DNA, Yamato was an infant with Hashi DNA implanted. Therefore, there is a difference. This difference can be distinguish, but not necessarily recognized. This would explain Orochimaru hypothesizing the possibilities.

Did Karin have prior contact with Danzo before sensing his presence at the summit? I don't believe so.

 

[Rιver]

Regarding the Fushi Tensei technique, why would Kishimoto spend all this time, implying, and even explicitly saying Orochimaru wants Sasuke's body for his Sharingan. Going against years of implications and statements with poor examples is meaningless. "Oh, hw could've used this here, or here", no, that's not what Kishimoto wanted for unknown purposes, it's plot. We seen it happen multiple times, and this isn't any different, so intead of questioning whether he can or not, focus on the match-up and stop going against facts

Different matter. F.e. if one lends you chakra, you are given more chakra but not access to their unique abilities (although there are different cases, such as Orochimaru and Hashirama, but mainly due to Senjutsu...), while when given a dōryoku, you can access any of their abilities as Kakashi and Danzō have displayed.​

@ River:

... -_- at the double quote lol

Second, Zetsu is made completely of Hashi DNA, Yamato was an infant with Hashi DNA implanted. Therefore, there is a difference. This difference can be distinguish, but not necessarily recognized. This would explain Orochimaru hypothesizing the possibilities.

Did Karin have prior contact with Danzo before sensing his presence at the summit? I don't believe so.

Chakra signatures do not vanish nor modify when aging [

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-

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].​

 

[Haizaki]

Zetsu hyping a jutsu he's unfamiliar with means nothing when scans are presented.

He was shielding himself from the debris after the impact, which is reasonable.

Zetsu staying in the same spot, as I shown you earlier and withstand this impact

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Is highly unlikely. The impact destroyed everything, even the statue Sasuke leaped to use the technique.

Not at all. He said it was inescapable because of the speed at which lightning travels. Which only makes sense since Zetsu himself said it is faster than sound and said he couldn't travel at the speed of light with Obito. No reason to believe he evaded kirin at all. You surely can't expect an accurate position with the drawing. Especially when he wasn't seen traveling and rocks are scattered about. I'll draw it out with the scans shortly.

 

[blazekev90]

I know I didn't just read Kidgamer questioning whether Manda had the "strength" to restrain hachi!! Dude you can't be serious lol

And in defending your claim you present a scan of hachi punching a Bijuu as if that illustrated his "strength" to peel Manda off him Lol

 

[blazekev90]

Different matter. F.e. if one lends you chakra, you are given more chakra but not access to their unique abilities (although there are different cases, such as Orochimaru and Hashirama, but mainly due to Senjutsu...), while when given a dōryoku, you can access any of their abilities as Kakashi and Danzō have displayed.​

Chakra signatures do not vanish nor modify when aging [

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-

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].​

That just proves my point.

 

[Rιver]

That just proves my point.

Pardon...?​

 

[TRE MERCER]

Hachibi

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and

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Manda isn't restraining shit here, nor will he get the chance to do so as stated in my post, which I conveniently see no reply to.



Yeah, no, he hasn't.



Not only was that not Wood Dragon, Mokuton suppresses Bijuu's power. So why you are using this as any kind of legit example baffles me.

Sm Naruto threw a summoning meters in the air and yet was being restrained by Preta path. Manda restrains Hachibi. I countered it clearly i said when Hachibi swings it's hand Manda wraps around it and proceed to wrap him up. Physical strength isn't restrained seeing as a beaten and chakra less Kisame broke out of some Mokuton.

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These are standard Bijuu Dama from Bijuu 2-7 with the exception of 4.



Strength has shit to do with it. Killer B punching and using its tentacles throws Bijuu around and slaps them around. Manda is similar sized, so Hachibi spinning rapidly will knock him backwards, especially if if he gets hit by the tentacles directly.



Can't go underground when you are

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. Lol, what kind of question is that? If Manda and Oro are sent flying straight backwards, he just needs to fire the Bijuu Dama in the direction they went in. He doesn't need to see them to know that his whirlwind will only push them backwards on the same trajectory they were at before.

It seems you forgot this scan where they wer being charged.(

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). You realize in the time it takes Killer bee to go 8tails Manda will have already went underground right? It spins you around you saying they will be in the same direction just further is fanfic buddy.

 

[Rιver]

Sm Naruto threw a summoning meters in the air and yet was being restrained by Preta path. Manda restrains Hachibi. I countered it clearly i said when Hachibi swings it's hand Manda wraps around it and proceed to wrap him up. Physical strength isn't restrained seeing as a beaten and chakra less Kisame broke out of some Mokuton.

Fairly certain that was due to Preta Path absorbing his Senjutsu; in other words, strength.​

 

[KidGamer65]

Sm Naruto threw a summoning meters in the air and yet was being restrained by Preta path. Manda restrains Hachibi. I countered it clearly i said when Hachibi swings it's hand Manda wraps around it and proceed to wrap him up. Physical strength isn't restrained seeing as a beaten and chakra less Kisame broke out of some Mokuton.

Preta Path was absorbing Naruto's Senjutsu Chakra, once again you've brought a bad example. Manda does nothing to Hachibi.

Then the other hand slaps him away, oh wait, will he evade that too? Yeah, not happening, not after evading the first one. Him coming out of the ground and evading Hachibi's first strike is ridiculous enough.

Suppresses the Bijuu's power=They can't break out of it, period. If it didn't suppress them physically then B would have broken out the moment he was caught, but he couldn't as his power was being suppressed.

Lol. Kisame wasn't chakra less. He had enough chakra to use summoning and use Suiton, and that only proves that Yamato's Mokuton is weak.

It seems you forgot this scan where they wer being charged.(

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). You realize in the time it takes Killer bee to go 8tails Manda will have already went underground right? It spins you around you saying they will be in the same direction just further is fanfic buddy.

That is the smallest Bijuu Dama shown in the series. "Charged" means a significantly larger one since ALL Bijuu Dama have to be charged at some point despite the size. Why we are even talking about this baffles me since Hachibi easily makes a Bijuu Dama that size or he easily spits out 4 instead of charging up one large one.

If Manda starts going underground before B goes Hachibi Mode, then he simply stays in V2 and evades Manda's attempt to grab him, goes Bijuu Mode and blows him away and then nukes him.

Dafuq? I even posted a scan and you are still arguing otherwise. It doesn't spin you around, don't know where you got that from. It blows you back. The only thing spinning around is Killer B. If a gust of wind going in a straight path hits something small enough, it will go backwards in a straight path. It won't spin around, this isn't some tornado stuff here.

 

[TRE MERCER]

Fairly certain that was due to Preta Path absorbing his Senjutsu; in other words, strength.​

No getting your chakra absorb does not restrict your strength. Seeing as Killer bee getting absorbed his cloak absorbed and still managed to land him so fair damage.(

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)-(

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). Also he's sucking his chakra how is this making him weaker please explain?

 

[Rιver]

No getting your chakra absorb does not restrict your strength. Seeing as Killer bee getting absorbed his cloak absorbed and still managed to land him so fair damage.(

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)-(

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). Also he's sucking his chakra how is this making him weaker please explain?

Jesus Christ...

This is not normal chakra we are talking about; this is Senjutsu we are talking about. In Naruto's case, it amplifies his physical strength greatly, as implied and explicitly stated in the manga. B has the chakra of a bijū, which doesn't amplify physical strength even nearly as much as Senjutsu.​

 

[TRE MERCER]

Preta Path was absorbing Naruto's Senjutsu Chakra, once again you've brought a bad example. Manda does nothing to Hachibi.

Then the other hand slaps him away, oh wait, will he evade that too? Yeah, not happening, not after evading the first one. Him coming out of the ground and evading Hachibi's first strike is ridiculous enough.

Suppresses the Bijuu's power=They can't break out of it, period. If it didn't suppress them physically then B would have broken out the moment he was caught, but he couldn't as his power was being suppressed.

Lol. Kisame wasn't chakra less. He had enough chakra to use summoning and use Suiton, and that only proves that Yamato's Mokuton is weak.

How is that a bad example please explain? He's already going to be wrapped around him how is slapping Manda with his other hand is going to get him off l0l? Actually no seeing as Kurama was breaking the wood dragon all up when it first attacked it. That fodder level suiton lol.

That is the smallest Bijuu Dama shown in the series. "Charged" means a significantly larger one since ALL Bijuu Dama have to be charged at some point despite the size. Why we are even talking about this baffles me since Hachibi easily makes a Bijuu Dama that size or he easily spits out 4 instead of charging up one large one.

If Manda starts going underground before B goes Hachibi Mode, then he simply stays in V2 and evades Manda's attempt to grab him, goes Bijuu Mode and blows him away and then nukes him.

Dafuq? I even posted a scan and you are still arguing otherwise. It doesn't spin you around, don't know where you got that from. It blows you back. The only thing spinning around is Killer B. If a gust of wind going in a straight path hits something small enough, it will go backwards in a straight path. It won't spin around, this isn't some tornado stuff here.

So now your denying that they charged that Bijuudama up? If bee's goes Hachibi v2 he gets annihilate seeing as Orochimaru can fuse with Samehada bee has no choice but to go into full Bijuu form. It doesn't spin you around.(

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). Take a good look at them tree's buddy.

Jesus Christ...

This is not normal chakra we are talking about; this is Senjutsu we are talking about. In Naruto's case, it amplifies his physical strength greatly, as implied and explicitly stated in the manga. B has the chakra of a bijū, which doesn't amplify physical strength even nearly as much as Senjutsu.​

Don't bring Jesus into this debate he's not going to save you. BOLD is helping my case seeing as it doesn't give Killer bee much strength feats and that still happened. When he first grabbed Naruto Naruto had plenty of senjutsu he could of broke out of it right then and there but he didn't now why is that?

 

[Rιver]

Don't bring Jesus into this debate he's not going to save you. BOLD is helping my case seeing as it doesn't give Killer bee much strength feats and that still happened. When he first grabbed Naruto Naruto had plenty of senjutsu he could of broke out of it right then and there but he didn't now why is that?

I'm not exactly the one who needs a savior here...

:|

Yeah, right [

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-

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].​

 

[KidGamer65]

How is that a bad example please explain? He's already going to be wrapped around him how is slapping Manda with his other hand is going to get him off l0l? Actually no seeing as Kurama was breaking the wood dragon all up when it first attacked it. That fodder level suiton lol.

Absorbing chakra=Absorbing strength. Absorbing Senjutsu chakra takes him out of Sage Mode which reduces his strength. Chakra=Stamina. Less stamina you have the weaker you become. Go get me a valid example and then we can talk.

Bold is obviously false. Against BM Naruto, he bit it once but it ended up binding him, biting him, and absorbing his chakra. Once it started absorbing his chakra there was no resistance. In fact, Mokuryu doesn't suppress chakra, it absorbs it, and it didn't start doing that to Naruto until it bit him, hence the resistance.

Kurama only broke it before it started absorbing his chakra as well at the Valley of the End.

Based on what? Oh wait, nothing.

So now your denying that they charged that Bijuudama up? If bee's goes Hachibi v2 he gets annihilate seeing as Orochimaru can fuse with Samehada bee has no choice but to go into full Bijuu form. It doesn't spin you around.(

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). Take a good look at them tree's buddy.

No, I explicitly stated that ALL Bijuu Dama needed to be charged up.

The fanfic is strong with the bold. Orochimaru only has one month with the sword here as OP stated, no reason to believe he'll be as good as it is as Kisame. No reason to believe he can fuse with it. And even if he can, it doesn't change anything I stated. Manda still gets evaded and he still enters BM after that to wipe it out.

Go take a look at the Jinchuuriki who got sent flying back in a straight path, buddy. I don't care about the trees. The trees are lodged into the ground, the Jins weren't, so they are much better comparisons for another thing that isn't lodged into the ground (Manda)