Madara broke the Gates..

[SIR UZMAKIMADARA]

OT:-
somehow you are right

 

[Penguin]

They were Edo Tensei corpses, so they don't lose stamina or Chãkra.

This way your whole theory is crashed.

Yes they do. They can regenerate it, but it takes a while at least. Hashirama was panting for Christ sake.

 

[SharinganisOP]

I see that analyzing the situation isn't the best quality of majority of the members. Seeing as everyone is going off of what they say, instead of connecting the pieces and rereading it.


Madara broke out of the lil tiny gates due to this:

1. His chakra had been put to check, him and Hashirama were tired af, so Madara already weakened hella much.

2. Naruto's Rasenshuriken weakened him more. And then Hashirama threw in the gates, that were needed to control a weakened Madara not a full powered Madara.

3. Notice that Hashirama didn't even use the bigger gates which increase in size according to how powerful the thing is. We can witness this against Obito, that he only puts down the gates according to the need.

4. When Madara did the rinne tensei, he returned back to full powered living state (which he had been in starting of their Edo fight), meaning the gates that were put on a weakened Madara were of course going to fail...its kind of common sense..

5. So there you have it how Madara was able to break the Gates.. that weren't even that strong to begin with...

1. I agree, Madara's chakra had been almost completely drained by the dragon, being revived gave him back all his chakra and allowed him to break out.

2. and 3. I would actually say that Hashi used as many gates as he could. Both Hashi and Madara were clearly tired and the black rods should have been disturbing Hashi's chakra. If he could have put more, he probably would have.

4. Agreed, he was put back to the strength of when he was originally summoned as an edo, except now he himself can perform rinne tensei (something dead people seemingly can't do). Of course 3 gates weren't going to work on a fully powered Madara who is capable of making a perfect Sussano.

5. Ya, the gates weren't that strong, and the gates could have been broken through various means. Sheer force, shinra tensei, his ability to use mokuton messing with the gates and makeing them explode. It doesn't really show, but regardless a fully powered Madara wasn't going to be held by so few Gates.

 

[KingHashirama]

Good idea. Lets start.

1) Hashirama is not in sage more and he couldnt make bigger gates? He is visibly tired, wounded.

I highly doubt that both mokuton and preta user was unable to revert the chakra absorption power of lame wooden dragon.
Hashi is out of SM, which is odd giving his stamina. It appears to me that madara has succeed in gaining sage chakra as he wasnt squashed by dragon nor destroyed by giant FRS and easily owned both gates and the tiger.
I dont think rinne tensei puts you with full chakra. Who knows.

1. How do you know he couldn't make bigger gates? He has only shown to need the Sage Mode for Gates that make Gamabunta and etc look like Rats.. Not for gates that are about 3times the size of a human.. so a weak rebuttal and a counter here.

No, it is now proven Mokuton > Preta path, in regards to absorbing chakra if you still want to argue, go argue with Kishimoto.
He wasn't suppose to be squashed.. Show proof of sage chakra.. he absorbed Rasenshuriken impact..

Rinne tensei revives you back fully powered..since that is the whole freaking point of rinne tensei.

So basically you tried to counter my post with your assumptions and theories.. wow..

1. I agree, Madara's chakra had been almost completely drained by the dragon, being revived gave him back all his chakra and allowed him to break out.

2. and 3. I would actually say that Hashi used as many gates as he could. Both Hashi and Madara were clearly tired and the black rods should have been disturbing Hashi's chakra. If he could have put more, he probably would have.

4. Agreed, he was put back to the strength of when he was originally summoned as an edo, except now he himself can perform rinne tensei (something dead people seemingly can't do). Of course 3 gates weren't going to work on a fully powered Madara who is capable of making a perfect Sussano.

5. Ya, the gates weren't that strong, and the gates could have been broken through various means. Sheer force, shinra tensei, his ability to use mokuton messing with the gates and makeing them explode. It doesn't really show, but regardless a fully powered Madara wasn't going to be held by so few Gates.

2/3. no with evidence that Hashirama only uses the gates needed to hold down a specific opponent and doesn't use higher gates than needed (shown with the Juubi also).. because it is futile to use any bigger gates..

5. Well he couldn't break them in his Edo form, since the gates immobilized him with his weakened form.

 

[Dantee]

So now the best excuse for Madara losing is he got caught on purpose or he wasn't trying?

-sigh-, lord buddha this base just gets worst and worst.

#Regenerative stamina post was countered by today's chapter. You should've read it before posting.

Not like it really matters or not, but Hashirama is saying he just now managed to immobilize Madara. Not only that Madara wasn't even panicking or anything like it was a dire situation. I'm not saying edo's can't get tired but their stamina regenerates at a higher rate. Undying body remember? and why isn't Madara breathing heavy as well for a fight that wore down Hashirama so much, Madara seems to be fine.

 

[UchihaNagashi]

ARguing with the Manga I see.. nice to know, when it is a god damn fact that the Hokage couldn't go all out while mainitaining the barrier. =].

I mean its not like Hashirama tired af here right? Hes probably just breathing hard for showing off his breathing skills, huh.

Well, he made some around Jûbi. It's big.

Not to mention that it was stated many times throughly manga that Edo's regenerate stamina and Chãkra almost instantaneously [

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].

And the barriers weren't always big. Obito got a size of his own [

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]. Madara go 3 and broke still out [

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].

Not to mention, Hashirama made about 50 of those. Imagine [

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].

Hashirama wasn't weakened. It was desired to keep him in position. Hashirama isn't careless.

 

[iRefleX]

ARguing with the Manga I see.. nice to know, when it is a god damn fact that the Hokage couldn't go all out while mainitaining the barrier. =].

I mean its not like Hashirama tired af here right? Hes probably just breathing hard for showing off his breathing skills, huh.

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Not really. . Since they weren't even meant for a full powered Madara, but for a weakened version of Madara. It kind of pales in comparison to Obito.. and nor is it even emphasized in the manga.. but only by the fans for some reason.

W8wot!? You're comparing Madara to juubito? You know was a ton times strong than everyone on that battlefield right?

And lol if you still believe Hashirama is stronger than Madara...

No the gates weren't weakened, he just used less gates to immobilise him.

 

[UchihaNagashi]

Incorrect. They can lose chakra. Otherwise they would be able to create limitless amounts of clones, which they can't (as stated by tobirama saying he can only make two.) Also I'll just put these two images here which shows edos are capable of losing chakra:

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False and correct.

If you'd use logic, Kage Bunshin only divide up Chãkra. When they're gone your Chãkra goes back normal.

If they use a jutsu that needs continuous Chãkra away giving, they won't be able to restore it back until done.

However, you are right in losing. Of course they can lose, but the Chãkra is replenished every time so.

If you are suggesting however, limited amount of Chãkra, I suggest you go back in the beginning of manga.

 

[KingHashirama]

Not like it really matters or not, but Hashirama is saying he just now managed to immobilize Madara. Not only that Madara wasn't even panicking or anything like it was a dire situation. I'm not saying edo's can't get tired but their stamina regenerates at a higher rate. Undying body remember? and why isn't Madara breathing heavy as well for a fight that wore down Hashirama so much, Madara seems to be fine.

Madara has never panicked.... .

He knew black Zetsu was still out there.. but how does that = he wasn't trying in the fight. Sure the stamina regenerates.. but apparently its taking its time in Hashirama's case. Why isn't Madara breathing heavy? I mean its only common sense for a person who is sitting down and getting chakra sapped up to not be breathing heavily..

Same can really be said for Hashirama.. if Madara had the power to put Hashirama down, he would've done so. Arguing against that is quite futile, since he wanted to take control of Hashirama.

 

[Xāvî1]

They were Edo Tensei corpses, so they don't lose stamina or Chãkra.

This way your whole theory is crashed.

Absolutely agreeed

 

[UchihaNagashi]

Madara has never panicked.... .

He knew black Zetsu was still out there.. but how does that = he wasn't trying in the fight. Sure the stamina regenerates.. but apparently its taking its time in Hashirama's case. Why isn't Madara breathing heavy? I mean its only common sense for a person who is sitting down and getting chakra sapped up to not be breathing heavily..

Same can really be said for Hashirama.. if Madara had the power to put Hashirama down, he would've done so. Arguing against that is quite futile, since he wanted to take control of Hashirama.

No, he just wanted to beat Obito with Hashirama's power, but Naruto already weakened him so he doesn't need Hashirama anymore.

Now he just wants to re-group the Bijû's and take control of the Shinju.

Lol, not to mention Madara was laughing at Hashirama who was ''panting''. Are you suggesting that Madara has more stamina and Chãkra than Hashirama?

 

[Dantee]

Madara has never panicked.... .

He knew black Zetsu was still out there.. but how does that = he wasn't trying in the fight. Sure the stamina regenerates.. but apparently its taking its time in Hashirama's case. Why isn't Madara breathing heavy? I mean its only common sense for a person who is sitting down and getting chakra sapped up to not be breathing heavily..

Same can really be said for Hashirama.. if Madara had the power to put Hashirama down, he would've done so. Arguing against that is quite futile, since he wanted to take control of Hashirama.

I've already said he wasn't fighting back or using the time he was immobilized

to take concentrate on taking control of Obito rather than fighting Hashirama.

@boldNot sure if that makes alot sense their King. Having your chakra drained and being restrained isn't breath taking. Are you sure about that buddy ? Their is evidence to suggest otherwise.

 

[KingHashirama]

Well, he made some around Jûbi. It's big.

Not to mention that it was stated many times throughly manga that Edo's regenerate stamina and Chãkra almost instantaneously [

You must be registered for see links

].

And the barriers weren't always big. Obito got a size of his own [

You must be registered for see links

]. Madara go 3 and broke still out [

You must be registered for see links

].

Not to mention, Hashirama made about 50 of those. Imagine [

You must be registered for see links

].

Hashirama wasn't weakened. It was desired to keep him in position. Hashirama isn't careless.

- It also has more chakra and more power, so futile argument

- countered by the scans of Hashirama panting, and madara getting his chakra sucked away.

- Yes but notice the ones behind the little tiny ones...the stronger you are the more he uses.. nothing else.

- Hashirama is shown to be weakened now, arguing that is arguing with the manga.. if you desire to take it out with the writers or editors.

W8wot!? You're comparing Madara to juubito? You know was a ton times strong than everyone on that battlefield right?

And lol if you still believe Hashirama is stronger than Madara...

No the gates weren't weakened, he just used less gates to immobilise him.

Lol if you still believe Edo Madara > Edo Hashirama.. when he got immobilized , until Black Zetsu saved his ass..

I've already said he wasn't fighting back or using the time he was immobilized

to take concentrate on taking control of Obito rather than fighting Hashirama.

@boldNot sure if that makes alot sense their King. Having your chakra drained and being restrained isn't breath taking. Are you sure about that buddy ? Their is evidence to suggest otherwise.

- Black Zetsu is the one that took control of Obito and revived Madara.. Madara had no say in it. If Black Zetsu had betrayed Madara , Madara was done for..

- Difference between the ones you'll show me and this one is the "slow" part. Wood dragon does it on a slow basis.

 

[Aya San]

I find it weird how a tiny dragon can sap all of Madara's chakra, I mean it's comparable to Kurama... But well oh well Edo Hashi > Edo Maddy I guess

 

[UchihaNagashi]

- It also has more chakra and more power, so futile argument

- countered by the scans of Hashirama panting, and madara getting his chakra sucked away.

- Yes but notice the ones behind the little tiny ones...the stronger you are the more he uses.. nothing else.

- Hashirama is shown to be weakened now, arguing that is arguing with the manga.. if you desire to take it out with the writers or editors.



Lol if you still believe Edo Madara > Edo Hashirama.. when he got immobilized , until Black Zetsu saved his ass..



- Black Zetsu is the one that took control of Obito and revived Madara.. Madara had no say in it. If Black Zetsu had betrayed Madara , Madara was done for..

- Difference between the ones you'll show me and this one is the "slow" part. Wood dragon does it on a slow basis.

Wait what? :|

Madara done for? XD

What was his sole purpose? To become the Jinchûriki. So what did he need? Exactly. Rinne Tensei.

Looking at those scans in Hashirama ''panting'' (Lol), Madara beat the hell out of him when chilling and waiting for that Zetsu.

You are contradicting yourself on every single point of view.

 

[AlphaScythian]

1. How do you know he couldn't make bigger gates? He has only shown to need the Sage Mode for Gates that make Gamabunta and etc look like Rats.. Not for gates that are about 3times the size of a human.. so a weak rebuttal and a counter here.

Maybe an overwhelming difference of what he can make in SM compared to base? Wooden golem vs shinsu?

No, it is now proven Mokuton > Preta path, in regards to absorbing chakra if you still want to argue, go argue with Kishimoto.
He wasn't suppose to be squashed.. Show proof of sage chakra.. he absorbed Rasenshuriken impact..

No, nothing is proven so far. Madara - hashirama = (mokuton + preta) - mokuton = preta. Even if preta is weaker madara should have the edge, its not that hashirama has preta to know which one is better while madara specifically bet on sucking hashi's sage powers. And you are completely negating the FACT that hashi is panting madara is not.

Rinne tensei revives you back fully powered..since that is the whole freaking point of rinne tensei.

No where in manga does it state so.

So basically you tried to counter my post with your assumptions and theories.. wow..

Is that so? Feels like you have made alot of haste conclusions yourself

 

[KingHashirama]

Wait what? :|

Madara done for? XD

What was his sole purpose? To become the Jinchûriki. So what did he need? Exactly. Rinne Tensei.

Looking at those scans in Hashirama ''panting'' (Lol), Madara beat the hell out of him when chilling and waiting for that Zetsu.

You are contradicting yourself on every single point of view.

To become the Jin.. hmm nice nice.. But I can provide a scan that says beating Hashirama.

Yea only problem is Hashirama put him down.. while he couldn't do shit to Hashirama. # Manga facts never deny them.


Even though you can't even point out a single contradiction..

Maybe and overwhelming difference of what he can make in SM compared to base? Wooden golem vs shinsu?
No, nothing is proven so far. Madara - hashirama = (mokuton + preta) - mokuton = preta. Even if preta is weaker madara should have the edge, its not that hashirama has preta to know which one is better while madara specifically bet on sucking hashi's sage powers. And you are completely negating the FACT that hashi is panting madara is not.
No where in manga does it state so.
Is that so? Feels like you have made alot of haste conclusions yourself

Fact that Madara was immobilized and couldn't do sh*t until Black Zetsu revived him. If you want to counter anything you need to provide scans of where those things happened. Making assumptions is only going to cause flame wars.

I mean I already called this out yesterday, that if Madara is shown to be losing to Hashirama, everyone should be prepared for the b*tching and moaning.

Yes because an immobilized person who was sitting down should be panting.. cool.

 

[UchihaNagashi]

To become the Jin.. hmm nice nice.. But I can provide a scan that says beating Hashirama.

Yea only problem is Hashirama put him down.. while he couldn't do shit to Hashirama. # Manga facts never deny them.


Even though you can't even point out a single contradiction..

You're getting boring.

Provide a scan of beating Hashirama? Mm, I don't know what you mean but sure do.

Lol, are you serious. Hashirama is the one ''panting'' and Madara the one waiting for Zetsu and breaking the Gates.

You are one biased and blind person Lol. I'm going back to my biography.

 

[-Sky-]

I don't get what's being argued here.. Rinne Tensie obviously rejuvenated Madara.

Edo Tensei's on the other hand take time to regenerate. So the Madara we see now is at full health, and Edo Hashirama hasn't been able to recuperate from his fight with Madara quite yet.

But don't worry Madara lovers. He has to have some sort of plan up his sleeve, so he'll be pulling out OP moves soon enough.

 

[KingHashirama]

You're getting boring.

Provide a scan of beating Hashirama? Mm, I don't know what you mean but sure do.

Lol, are you serious. Hashirama is the one ''panting'' and Madara the one waiting for Zetsu and breaking the Gates.

You are one biased and blind person Lol. I'm going back to my biography.

- you said his only goal was to become the jin.. I said I can provide a scan where it was also to beat down Edo Hashirama and take control over him.


- Hashirama was also the one who was moving around.. . Unless you believe a person who is immobilized should be the one panting and not the one who is running around.

Even though you are hurt to admit Hashirama > Madara in any form.. rofl. Sorry, i'm not the biased one here seeing as I admit Hashirama and Naruto to be weaker to many opponents.