Jiraya's place in this manga is always forgotten for no reasons

[DaisukeUchiha]

Naruto
Obito
Kabuto in DSM
Itachi
Minato

Just a few names...

I feel he's on the same level that Itachi is
and a lot of people say itachi and minato are on even grounds
so jiraiya and minato would be even
and kabuto in dsm got solo'd by itachi so he'd be below jiraiya imo
naruto and obito, okay ya maybe them

 

[Ace of the fire fist]

I feel he's on the same level that Itachi is
and a lot of people say itachi and minato are on even grounds
so jiraiya and minato would be even
and kabuto in dsm got solo'd by itachi so he'd be below jiraiya imo
naruto and obito, okay ya maybe them

You're using ABC logic bro, that doesn't work. The sad thing is, and this is a major flaw in Jiraiyas' ability is that it takes time to go into SM.

Minato: They both have contracts with toads, so that automatically rules out toads. I'll give J man Ma and Pa though. It takes time for him to get into sage mode, and Jiraiya has to keep his hands together. Minato can finish him off in a matter of seconds then.

Itachi: Automatic Tsukuyomi. In reality, it's only one second. That isn't enough time for Ma and Pa to break him out of it.

Kabuto: Itachi never soloed him. He had Sasuke with him. White rage kills.

 

[Owarij]

1) With basic english you can see they first was talking about "him" then started talking about jiraya and dealing with him, translators say him is refering to a fight with the 9tails jinchriki

2) Hiruzen actually wanted orochimaru to carry on his title, he said so himself

3)You say by feats he almost captured them? no he failed,there is no almost... you can't fight someone, lose and then say he almost killed him

4) The point about Jiraya hadnling all 6.. wrong, he didn't , when all 6 came Jiraya just about got slaughtered..he handled about 3

5) Jiraya let his guard down in enemy territory and you use that as plot no jutsu? no

6) One shotted one of the weakest akatsuki members because he basically had full knowledge of her and how fighting style was

 

[Bogard]

1) With basic english you can see they first was talking about "him" then started talking about jiraya and dealing with him, translators say him is refering to a fight with the 9tails jinchriki

You can't be serious. Why would they consider a small child who knew almost nothing about the thing inside him as a threat?

2) Hiruzen actually wanted orochimaru to carry on his title, he said so himself

He never said what you say. As far as i remember, he was talking about his will or something. He never mentioned Oro as a hokage. Tsunade states that Hiruzen always wanted Jiraya as his successor in the hokage title. Manga disagrees with you

3)You say by feats he almost captured them? no he failed,there is no almost... you can't fight someone, lose and then say he almost killed him

The fact remain that he still put both of them in difficulty in one move effortlessly when Itachi afterward had to turn his sharingan off, rest a while in some place because of the drawbacks of releasing amaterasu. So that scene was to show the difference in their power level, no matter what you say

 

[DaisukeUchiha]

You're using ABC logic bro, that doesn't work. The sad thing is, and this is a major flaw in Jiraiyas' ability is that it takes time to go into SM.

Minato: They both have contracts with toads, so that automatically rules out toads. I'll give J man Ma and Pa though. It takes time for him to get into sage mode, and Jiraiya has to keep his hands together. Minato can finish him off in a matter of seconds then.

Itachi: Automatic Tsukuyomi. In reality, it's only one second. That isn't enough time for Ma and Pa to break him out of it.

Kabuto: Itachi never soloed him. He had Sasuke with him. White rage kills.

Jiraiya v Minato would be a lot closer than you're suggesting
it could go either way imo, Jiraiya is a tough sob and minato is quick as hell
so who really knows who would win that one

and Itachi never just uses genjutsu at the beginning (close to it v kabuto) so it wouldn't go down like that
Jiraiya knowing not to look in his eyes would make the fight an actual fight
Itachi feared fighting Jiraiya not cause he thought he would lose but because he thought he could die or be severely injured
they never really fought so it could go either way as well, with a slight edge to itachi

and Itachi did solo Kabuto, Sasuke didn't do anything he just stood there and yelled a few times

 

[Uchiha Legacy]

Jiraiya v Minato would be a lot closer than you're suggesting
it could go either way imo, Jiraiya is a tough sob and minato is quick as hell
so who really knows who would win that one

and Itachi never just uses genjutsu at the beginning (close to it v kabuto) so it wouldn't go down like that
Jiraiya knowing not to look in his eyes would make the fight an actual fight
Itachi feared fighting Jiraiya not cause he thought he would lose but because he thought he could die or be severely injured
they never really fought so it could go either way as well, with a slight edge to itachi

and Itachi did solo Kabuto, Sasuke didn't do anything he just stood there and yelled a few times

Itachi almost always starts with genjutsu...:|

OT: There are many things I disagree with, but I refuse to argue with Bogard(though I never have before).

No disrespect.

I'm not in a mood for an endless debate.

 

[DaisukeUchiha]

Itachi almost always starts with genjutsu...:|

Not really, if he does it's nothing huge
and it rarely works the first time
people know not to stare him in the eyes

 

[Owarij]

You can't be serious. Why would they consider a small child who knew almost nothing about the thing inside him as a threat?

Right, they had no info on how much control naruto had over the fox.. they were afraid of a fight with the bijuu not the boy.. yagura who was about 15 was a perfect jink.. gaara who was naruto's age could be taken over and enter bijuu mode...


If you think itachi and kisame think that even with back up from akatsuki members, that they can't take jiraya, you're even MORE insane..
Because akatsuki was going to send just ONE person for Orochimaru when he fled...but I guess they'll need 8 for Jiraya right? and not the strongest jinchuriki

He never said what you say. As far as i remember, he was talking about his will or something. He never mentioned Oro as a hokage. Tsunade states that Hiruzen always wanted Jiraya as his successor in the hokage title. Manga disagrees with you

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Manga disagree's with you.. Hiruzen disagree's with you.. what else in the world is he talking about? the person who would carry on the hokage's will and strength is the next hokage..

Hiruzen even said - I AM THE MAN WHO INHERITED THE WILL OF THE FIRST AND SECOND HOKAGE, I AM SANDAIME HOKAGE " -_- Paraphrasing of course... It's obvious he wanted orochimaru to succeed him

The fact remain that he still put both of them in difficulty in one move when Itachi afterward had to turn his sharingan off, rest a while in some place because of the drawbacks of releasing amaterasu. So that scene was to show the difference in their power level, no matter what you say

Diff in power level? it shows Itachi and kisame didnt' give a shit about him, keep buying itachi's excuses to kisame, Itachi could have amaterasud him easily in that corridor and he couldn't do anything about it, he literally turned his back on him and used tsukyomi on a child, while jiraya watched

And difference in powerlevels?
When jiraya can even stand up to orochimaru, we can argue a difference in power levels...

Even kisame after witnessing what Jiraya is capable of WANTED to go back

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Because he knew Itachi could take his ass

sure, difference in powerlevels

 

[Exaar]

I just cannot understand why kisame would state "Naruto" is out of his league simply because he has a Sealed kyuubi inside him, Yet in part two, he fearlessly went up against a perfect Jin of the 8tails.

 

[Talal]

Right, they had no info on how much control naruto had over the fox.. they were afraid of a fight with the bijuu not the boy.. yagura who was about 15 was a perfect jink.. gaara who was naruto's age could be taken over and enter bijuu mode...


If you think itachi and kisame think that even with back up from akatsuki members, that they can't take jiraya, you're even MORE insane..
Because akatsuki was going to send just ONE person for Orochimaru when he fled...but I guess they'll need 8 for Jiraya right? and not the strongest jinchuriki

Was that seriously said? O.O

I just cannot understand why kisame would state "Naruto" is out of his league simply because he has a Sealed kyuubi inside him, Yet in part two, he fearlessly went up against a perfect Jin of the 8tails.

This. I'm not denying that he was talking about the Kyuubi, but it also doesn't make much sense.

 

[Bogard]

Right, they had no info on how much control naruto had over the fox.. they were afraid of a fight with the bijuu not the boy.. yagura who was about 15 was a perfect jink.. gaara who was naruto's age could be taken over and enter bijuu mode...

Do you remember that they even went as far as drawing Jiraya's attention somewhere else to catch Naruto? All that shows that they were refering to Jiraya, because they saw him as too much of a threat that they needed to draw his attention to have no problems in capturing Naruto. If you read the manga well, it's what you should have understood from this passage

Manga disagree's with you.. Hiruzen disagree's with you.. what else in the world is he talking about? the person who would carry on the hokage's will and strength is the next hokage..

Hiruzen even said - I AM THE MAN WHO INHERITED THE WILL OF THE FIRST AND SECOND HOKAGE, I AM SANDAIME HOKAGE " -_- Paraphrasing of course... It's obvious he wanted orochimaru to succeed him

Do you notice that in what you say, you're only interpretating someone's sentence? But on the pic i posted, there is no interpretation. It's a direct fact, a direct statement gave by someone who was always walking along with Hiruzen, Orochimaru and Jiraya, and even Jiraya agrees with that statement, which shows that Hiruzen probably said it plenty of times when they were around. Again, it's a manga fact and that mangafact contradicts your interpretation

 

[Talal]

Another thing that doesn't make sense is how they still went after Naruto after that conversation and Kisame didn't even hesitate to attack Naruto.

 

[Ace of the fire fist]

Jiraiya v Minato would be a lot closer than you're suggesting
it could go either way imo, Jiraiya is a tough sob and minato is quick as hell
so who really knows who would win that one

and Itachi never just uses genjutsu at the beginning (close to it v kabuto) so it wouldn't go down like that
Jiraiya knowing not to look in his eyes would make the fight an actual fight
Itachi feared fighting Jiraiya not cause he thought he would lose but because he thought he could die or be severely injured
they never really fought so it could go either way as well, with a slight edge to itachi

and Itachi did solo Kabuto, Sasuke didn't do anything he just stood there and yelled a few times

Nah man, Minato wins, I've already told you why.

Itachi always starts with genjutsu. Look at his fight with Sasuke and Kakashi

Sasuke broke him out of the genjutsu, and he did have Kabuto dodging and weaving a few times. You're also forgetting Itachi was an edo. White rage would have finished him off... and Jiraiya's genjutsu is useless since Kabuto can fight deaf and blind.

 

[FleeOnSight]

Nice thread. Plus rep.

 

[Owarij]

Do you notice that in what you say, you're only interpretating someone's sentence? But on the pic i posted, there is no interpretation. It's a direct fact, a direct statement gave by someone who was always walking along with Hiruzen, Orochimaru and Jiraya, and even Jiraya agrees with that statement, which shows that Hiruzen probably said it plenty of times when they were around. Again, it's a manga fact and that mangafact contradicts your interpretation

What hiruzen was saying he was thinking in his heart.. even though he probably said something else.. he even admits he tried ignoring oro's faults because he truly wanted him to believe he was the one to carry on his will

obvious is obvious, anyone who sees that manga scan will automatically know what hiruzen is saying, you just don't want to admit it to cling on to what little point you want

They drew away his attention because no fighting is better than fighting at all, common sense

 

[Bogard]

What hiruzen was saying he was thinking in his heart.. even though he probably said something else.. he even admits he tried ignoring oro's faults because he truly wanted him to believe he was the one to carry on his will

obvious is obvious, anyone who sees that manga scan will automatically know what hiruzen is saying, you just don't want to admit it to cling on to what little point you want

So you believe in your interpretation and ignore Tsunade's statement?

 

[Ace of the fire fist]

I actually remember Hiruzen saying he wanted Oro to become hokage but he saw a blood lust and power hungry guy, so he chose Minato. Something along the lines of that.

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[Owarij]

Was that seriously said? O.O


.

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Cropped badly, soz,

"Since I was supposed to kill Orochimaru, I Have a beef with uchiha sasuke "


But hey, genius logic would think, akatsuki was going to send 1 member after arguably the strongest sannin, they'll need friken 5 or 6 for jiraya right? makes perfect sense, perfect

 

[Bogard]

I actually remember Hiruzen saying he wanted Oro to become hokage but he saw a blood lust and power hungry guy, so he chose Minato. Something along the lines of that.

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Read well. He never said he wanted Oro to be Hokage, he said "one of the reasons i didn't chose you hokage was because of his ideology". He says one of the reason, which means there were other reasons why Oro couldn't be hokage, and one of them was his twisted ideology. Others could be that there were probably better choices, stronger people, etc

 

[Ace of the fire fist]

Read well. He never said he wanted Oro to be Hokage, he said "one of the reasons i didn't chose you hokage was because of his ideology". He says one of the reason, which means there were other reasons why Oro couldn't be hokage, and one of them was his twisted ideology. Others could be that there were probably better choices, stronger people, etc

Yes, but don't forget; "Why I didn't choose you", meaning he definitely considered him to be hokage, but because of his ideology, he never. Hiruzen also said he wanted Oro to carry on his will, meaning the hokage seat of course.