[Discussion] How do you feel about a black James Bond?

[Multiply]

Well, he is a Creationist after all.

Them creationists man Lol.

 

[Punk Hazard]

You see Riker, you are again missing the point. You've missed the basis of the comparison between Shaft and Bond. You missed the point of my posts by taking what I said and tweaking it. You also missed the point where you think the reason Idris is getting the role and by doing so you contradict yourself. Furthermore you keep going back the "Representation and the amount of iconic black characters" Something you brought in that might have served a point if we were talking about a new film series entirely.

The fact of the matter is this, a black Bond makes no more sense than a white Shaft or an Asian Poncharelo.

The last one is from CHiPs in case you're wondering.



Seven days.

I understand the basis of your comparison between making Bond black and making Shaft white. I'm saying making a comparison between the two isn't viable because the latter would accomplish something while the former would not.

I never said Idris was being cast as Bond for that reason, I said making Bond black(I didn't specify Idris or any other black actor precisely because I was speaking in general and not about any one particular case, but I suppose you didn't catch that) would accomplish that reason. Whether it was intentional by those who make that decision or not is irrelevant, it's still gonna happen, and that makes it incomparable to making Shaft white.

Once again, you miss the part where I've said multiple times it's not about having iconic black characters, but having black people in the roles of iconic characters. Do I need to explain the difference to you, or are you more comfortable confusing the two continuously?

 

[Ōkami]

I understand the basis of your comparison between making Bond black and making Shaft white. I'm saying making a comparison between the two isn't viable because the latter would accomplish something while the former would not.

I never said Idris was being cast as Bond for that reason, I said making Bond black(I didn't specify Idris or any other black actor precisely because I was speaking in general and not about any one particular case, but I suppose you didn't catch that) would accomplish that reason. Whether it was intentional by those who make that decision or not is irrelevant, it's still gonna happen, and that makes it incomparable to making Shaft white.

Once again, you miss the part where I've said multiple times it's not about having iconic black characters, but having black people in the roles of iconic characters. Do I need to explain the difference to you, or are you more comfortable confusing the two continuously?

Riker, I've take notice to your basis of "More black people in iconic character roles" and I've told you the problem with it by the basis of the character itself.

You're continuing to insist I'm confusing the two but in reality I think you're the one that's getting the mixed up. Also I think you've misinterpreted Idris in this again by thinking that's my reason behind it.

Well I'm bored now.

Take your loss or take your "win".

I think I would have better luck explaining evolution to Rush.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Riker, I've take notice to your basis of "More black people in iconic character roles" and I've told you the problem with it by the basis of the character itself.

You're continuing to insist I'm confusing the two but in reality I think you're the one that's getting the mixed up. Also I think you've misinterpreted Idris in this again by thinking that's my reason behind it.

Well I'm bored now.

Take your loss or take your "win".

I think I would have better luck explaining evolution to Rush.

Except you haven't? You just repeated ¨It'd be like making Shaft white¨ again. You never actually explained how being white is an integral part of Bond's character or anything that qualifies as ¨the basis of the character¨, unless you're referring to the basis of Shaft's character, at which point I must once again stress why the two cases are not the comparable.

Hard to assume you aren't when I've been saying one thing and you insist on respond as though I said the other. I don't know what the latter half of this line is supposed to mean, misunderstanding Idris?

 

[Funky Tiger]

nah, bond's background is immaterial to the whole franchise now. its all "boom boom pow wow thats a hot chick **** you terrorists" now. i don't see why he shouldn't play bond.

 

[Disquiet]

I understand Okami's point, somewhat (well, I fully understand it, it's just that I haven't seen Shaft/was really young when I saw it). My approach to his point would be that it's going to be hard to justify "sticking to the script" when the roles are culturally neutral (again, I haven't seen Shaft). By this, I mean behavior, mannerisms, and lingo that may be specific to or most recognizable by that culture.

Was Shaft's role culturally neutral? I can't answer that, but that's the argument I'm making. It would be odd to see a movie full of americans portraying the Yakuza. There are some solid defenses that could be made, some not so solid.

Though I haven't gotten into the James Bond series, I know of it more than I do Shaft. It doesn't seem to me that the role is a cultural specific type. Does his behavior or style represents whites in any way? I'm not saying an argument can't be made, just that even the best argument in this case would most likely be a thickly veiled, variation of "It's a different color, and that makes it weird to me".

That's because color is the only thing left to argue when the role doesn't represent any race or ethnic group, in any way whatsoever.

 

[Utsuho]

I understand Okami's point, somewhat (well, I fully understand it, it's just that I haven't seen Shaft/was really young when I saw it). My approach to his point would be that it's going to be hard to justify "sticking to the script" when the roles are culturally neutral (again, I haven't seen Shaft). By this, I mean behavior, mannerisms, and lingo that may be specific to or most recognizable by that culture.

Was Shaft's role culturally neutral? I can't answer that, but that's the argument I'm making. It would be odd to see a movie full of americans portraying the Yakuza. There are some solid defenses that could be made, some not so solid.

Though I haven't gotten into the James Bond series, I know of it more than I do Shaft. It doesn't seem to me that the role is a cultural specific type. Does his behavior or style represents whites in any way? I'm not saying an argument can't be made, just that even the best argument in this case would most likely be a thickly veiled, variation of "It's a different color, and that makes it weird to me".

That's because color is the only thing left to argue when the role doesn't represent any race or ethnic group, in any way whatsoever.

James Bond is supposed to be a suave british gentleman . All three are things I wouldn't associate with the average black guy tbh .

 

[Conspirator.]

It makes absolutely no difference, on the proviso that he plays the role to the required standard and that his change in background/colour/race won't have an impact on the movie. That's all that matters, does it not?

 

[RasenUchihaChaos]

Nah I'm black and I say nah to a black James Bond already have people being butthurt with a black flame on guy for F4

 

[Karna]

I don't care enough about the franchise to decide whether I would mind a black guy playing bond or not, I mean as long as they don't make him do any stereotypical black guy thing, it really depends on how good of an actor he is, I wouldn't want someone like Usher playing bond because then we would clearly see the African American dude instead of the European dude that comes to mind when people say Bond, which have a lesser chance of happening if say Daneal craig was a bad actor, it would still seem more like bond- not breaking out of the character that much.

What I am saying is it doesn't matter which person(actor) wears the mask(character) as long as they wear the costume is really good, enough to fool the people(audience).

Now that all doesn't matter if they are gonna pull 'Bond is just a title' thing, in that case it would actually be awesome to have a black guy be Bond for once, this industry needs more culturally and racially varied characters, but make new characters, Don't turn existing white guys into them-that's no diversity.

 

[Disquiet]

James Bond is supposed to be a suave british gentleman . All three are things I wouldn't associate with the average black guy tbh .

The thought process you have (not just you though, and I can understand where you're getting this from) is entangled with some misconceptions and misunderstandings. Let's try undoing one knot at a time. First, I should say the corrected form of your statement is, "All three are things I wouldn't associate with the average black guy in Britain". I don't think those characteristcs can be ascribed to the average white guy here in America either. Second, are you really implying those traits are, or should be, racially inclined? The way you said that made it seem as if those traits can't be assigned to a black person indidvidually. I guess I should clarify this by saying while there are certain traits (independent of race though) more abundant in one race than another, they are in any normal circumstance percieved as unattached to any kind of race or ethnic group. For example, I see whites wearing suits way more often than I do blacks. Does this mean that suits are apart of some kind of white culture? Before you answer that, let me discuss a mentality displayed by whites/blacks and societies as a whole.

While it's true that a lot of blacks themselves would dismiss another black person on the basis of "acting white", whites themselves don't seem to percieve many aspects of "their" behavior as acting white. When complaining about "black behavior", you don't see many whites (or even other ethnicities for that matter), saying "Black people should be a gentleman, start acting like white people!" or "Pull up your pants and start acting like white people!" or "Stop doing drugs and start acting like white people!" or "Get an education and start acting like white people!"

Know why this is? Because those behaviors are socially inclined rather than culture specific. They are simply seen as a "proper way to be in society". That's why a Japanese thug would look at another like he's retarded if he was told his "corrected" behavior was white behavior when there's so many Japanese people in his world that acts opposite as he. That's why different ethnicities can come here (U.S.) and "act, dress, and talk white" but a portion of the black race (that specific portion that identify such conduct with whites) would ignore that, but claim imitation only when it's being done by their own.

Look at some of the replies here, why is it that people are saying he has a bond like demeanor (and I'm sure it's not just them, this most likely has something to do with why he was chosen)? Has he been acting like a white guy all this time? Or a suave Britsh gentleman but failed to be noticed for it by the general public?


A part of the reason why black people say that about their own is because it's not commonly seen among them/wasn't something that was common to them (not unlike the reason you used), but they are obviously wrong about it being white behavior.

My point to all this is that you are mistaking a social role for a racial one.

 

[Cornson]

I don't care enough about the franchise to decide whether I would mind a black guy playing bond or not, I mean as long as they don't make him do any stereotypical black guy thing, it really depends on how good of an actor he is, I wouldn't want someone like Usher playing bond because then we would clearly see the African American dude instead of the European dude that comes to mind when people say Bond, which have a lesser chance of happening if say Daneal craig was a bad actor, it would still seem more like bond- not breaking out of the character that much.

What I am saying is it doesn't matter which person(actor) wears the mask(character) as long as they wear the costume is really good, enough to fool the people(audience).

Now that all doesn't matter if they are gonna pull 'Bond is just a title' thing, in that case it would actually be awesome to have a black guy be Bond for once, this industry needs more culturally and racially varied characters, but make new characters, Don't turn existing white guys into them-that's no diversity.

I have nothing against the actor, he is a damn good one and I don't have any doub he would make a really good james bond.

However I still don't think it's a good idea, because "james bond" issen't just a title, it's a name of 1 of the 00 agents, hence why I have been against the swopping of actors true out the series, I personally think it would be much more interesting if this new character was a different 00 agent in the same universe, than just another james bond.

(I actually posted the same thing earlier in the topic which resulted in someone giving me a negative downvote on it and calling me a racist) -.-'

 

[paratise]

Jesus and Moses are middleeastern , so they are white . Not sure about egypt , but some of them were white . For example Cleopatra.

People are branched much more than the main racial groups (white, yellow, black). "So they are white" does not mean their racial represantations are mainly Germanic and British Western whites while we are speaking of Semitic middle Easterns.

Cleopatra was Greek btw. She was not originally Egyptian.

 

[Kishi Uzumaki]

Who cares even if he's black, half-black,white or black and white, if he can act well and play the character .

it's good and almost time for a change .

 

[Tantalus Thief]

As long as the actor is good

 

[Bakimono]

What? Where does it say in our Coustitution does it say only White Anglosaxons could be president..... Let me save you the trouble it doesn't. In the first Ian Flemming Noval it state James Bond is a White Scottish heritage which means not black but white.. If it just said Scottish heritage then sure geez