1. Who is Iruka in the ninja world? Like is he strong, did h contribute anything? *Do not answer that*I am very open-minded, so please come up with contrary evidence, and I am willing to change my opinion.
To me, Manga says that Hiruzen > Hashirama. Proof below:
1) Iruka calls Hiruzen the greatest hokage
2) Hiruzen was able to fight Hashirama, Tobirama [both with INFINITE ****ing chakra] AND orochimaru; when he wasn't even in PRIME. Madara who is weaker than Hashirama; is able to solo 5 kages. And Hiruzen alone was stronger than Madara. If Hiruzen fought non-edo Hashi at prime; he would have probably killed Hashi while reading "Icha Icha tactics".
3) Official databook says Hiruzen is stronger than Hashirama
4) Kakuzu survived Hashirama encounter
5) Hashirama was killed by random ninja
When it comes to restraining Kyubii alone, Tenzo/Yamato can do a better job than Jiraiya. But J-man will probably solo 10 ninja of Yamato's calibre.
So Hiruzen >>> Hashirama.
i hate this hiruzen-hashirama threads1. Iruka, a fodder called him the best hokage...Madara, one of the main villain called Hashi the best shinobi.
2. Edo, but not using its full power.
3. Where???!
4. Hashi didn't like to finish off someone, he a cool man, a Hokage.
5. Please state.
Since you're there you mind as well check out this:I thought everyone already knew Hiruzen was stronger
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it was full power...it was just a different power scaling...please get ur facts straight.1. Iruka, a fodder called him the best hokage...Madara, one of the main villain called Hashi the best shinobi.
2. Edo, but not using its full power.
3. Where???!
4. Hashi didn't like to finish off someone, he a cool man, a Hokage.
5. Please state.
It wasn't full powered...If you compare Kabuto' and Oro's edo justu. Kabuto's is obviously superior to Oro. If they were full powered then....god bless naruto threads.it was full power...it was just a different power scaling...please get ur facts straight.
but i agree, im sick of these threads too, but no need to be so harsh, hes got like 50 posts here, he didnt know lol
I believe people like you and Owarij made much better arguments.It's funny, because you've presented a better argument than a large majority of people yet you have been flammed.
I am very open-minded, so please come up with contrary evidence, and I am willing to change my opinion.
To me, Manga says that Hiruzen > Hashirama. Proof below:
1) Iruka calls Hiruzen the greatest hokage
2) Hiruzen was able to fight Hashirama, Tobirama [both with INFINITE ****ing chakra] AND orochimaru; when he wasn't even in PRIME. Madara who is weaker than Hashirama; is able to solo 5 kages. And Hiruzen alone was stronger than Madara. If Hiruzen fought non-edo Hashi at prime; he would have probably killed Hashi while reading "Icha Icha tactics".
3) Official databook says Hiruzen is stronger than Hashirama
4) Kakuzu survived Hashirama encounter
5) Hashirama was killed by random ninja
I am also going to go ahead and refute your evidence before you present it
a) Madara's claim that Hashirama was/is the only one who can stop him should not be taken seriously. Why? See spoiler.
Madara probably only knew Hiruzen as a child. Hiruzen probably grew leaps and bounds after that. If Orochimaru/Asuma comes back as Edo-Tensei; he will find it hard to believe that Naruto has outgrown Jiraiya. Similarly, Madara has no means to know what happened after his death. If Orochimaru is resurrected after 50 years, he will see Konohamaru as a kid. Does that mean that Konohamaru wouldn't have surpassed Orochimaru?
Also, another important point - just because Hashirama was able to restrain Kyubi easily, it doesn't make him the strongest. Why? See spoiler.
When it comes to restraining Kyubii alone, Tenzo/Yamato can do a better job than Jiraiya. But J-man will probably solo 10 ninja of Yamato's calibre.
So Hiruzen >>> Hashirama.
I agree. I battled Owarij before on a Jman vs Pain thread for like 3 -6 pages..lol.I believe people like you and Owarij made much better arguments.
The OP is wrong when he compares Edo Madara with Hashirama and Hiruzen.
Secondly did you just say that Jiraiya can solo 10 ninjas on the same level as Yamato, who is one of the most powerful jounin in the series and who is close to low kage level? I guess you were exaggerating but good point I guess.
Well, believe me, this is a pretty good argument in comparison to the other ones people have put forward. Which made it all the more ironic that he was flammed. If certain other people catch wind of this thread, they'll begin to spread false information, and they'll do so with arrogance.I believe people like you and Owarij made much better arguments.
The OP is wrong when he compares Edo Madara with Hashirama and Hiruzen.
Secondly did you just say that Jiraiya can solo 10 ninjas on the same level as Yamato, who is one of the most powerful jounin in the series and who is close to low kage level? I guess you were exaggerating but good point I guess.
1) I am sorry but I take madara's word over who is strong over iruka's any day but that's just me :sy:I am very open-minded, so please come up with contrary evidence, and I am willing to change my opinion.
To me, Manga says that Hiruzen > Hashirama. Proof below:
1) Iruka calls Hiruzen the greatest hokage
2) Hiruzen was able to fight Hashirama, Tobirama [both with INFINITE ****ing chakra] AND orochimaru; when he wasn't even in PRIME. Madara who is weaker than Hashirama; is able to solo 5 kages. And Hiruzen alone was stronger than Madara. If Hiruzen fought non-edo Hashi at prime; he would have probably killed Hashi while reading "Icha Icha tactics".
3) Official databook says Hiruzen is stronger than Hashirama
4) Kakuzu survived Hashirama encounter
5) Hashirama was killed by random ninja
I am also going to go ahead and refute your evidence before you present it
a) Madara's claim that Hashirama was/is the only one who can stop him should not be taken seriously. Why? See spoiler.
Madara probably only knew Hiruzen as a child. Hiruzen probably grew leaps and bounds after that. If Orochimaru/Asuma comes back as Edo-Tensei; he will find it hard to believe that Naruto has outgrown Jiraiya. Similarly, Madara has no means to know what happened after his death. If Orochimaru is resurrected after 50 years, he will see Konohamaru as a kid. Does that mean that Konohamaru wouldn't have surpassed Orochimaru?
Also, another important point - just because Hashirama was able to restrain Kyubi easily, it doesn't make him the strongest. Why? See spoiler.
When it comes to restraining Kyubii alone, Tenzo/Yamato can do a better job than Jiraiya. But J-man will probably solo 10 ninja of Yamato's calibre.
So Hiruzen >>> Hashirama.
This is also true hiruzen looked about 7-8 in his flash back with hashirama and tobirama and hashi died shortly after. Even hiruzen and the elders won't know the full extent this is what I am talking about when I say the people who called hiruzen the strongest don't even know the 1st and barely the second they just heard stories of the guy who founded their village. How can they judge who is the strongest when they haven't even seen a single thing the first can do.hiruzen doesnt even know the full extent of hashiramas power. nobody knows. thats why hashiramas power was a myth. the very few that did know tried to tell others and were dismissed because nobody thought such a powerful shinobi could exist.
Ask you self this if he was stronger why fake his death? why not win the battle you still get his dna and the village will be unstable. Faking his death means he realised he was going to lose but found a way to make it seem like hashi had killed him and then escape.Madara is not weaker then Hashirama,he lost on purpose to gain his power (I think)