andy canaris
Member
Gaara attack cannot touch Pain,,did you forget that all of path eyes are connected and watch each other path from every attack..
Gaara can defeat Nagato.
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Okumura Rin
Active member
Nagato absorbs chakra. He can't absorb physical objects.
If the sand is coming at Nagato, he can absorb the chakra from it, meaning Gaara can no longer control it. The sand would still be travelling at the same velocity with the same amount of force, just with no chakra.
Like if someone throws a chakra infused Kunai. The kunai will no longer have chakra, but the Kunai will still go through.
I don't think Gaara can win this, but you all seem to think because Nagato can absorb Chakra, that Gaara's sand is useless. When it's obviously not.
If the sand is coming at Nagato, he can absorb the chakra from it, meaning Gaara can no longer control it. The sand would still be travelling at the same velocity with the same amount of force, just with no chakra.
Like if someone throws a chakra infused Kunai. The kunai will no longer have chakra, but the Kunai will still go through.
I don't think Gaara can win this, but you all seem to think because Nagato can absorb Chakra, that Gaara's sand is useless. When it's obviously not.
Okumura Rin
Active member
Read the thread properly before you post.
He said Nagato, not Pain, meaning he doesn't have the 6 Paths.
true enigma
Active member
Too much for gaara to handle bro, but ill say high diff bexause gaara does have many weapons and one of the best defense in the manga.
Wparker6804
Active member
Allan Hoshigaki
Banned
gaara would get crushed theyre is no attack that he can do that would hurt pain. also he can go invisible and human path him face it nagato is a beast
How so? I'm not taking away his aerial advantage, I said it wasn't shown. The reason I'm saying he doesn't really have an aerial advantage is because Gaara can go to the sky as well. Not gonna argue that, anyone and everyone is pretty much screwed when it comes to this, but if my theory is right then Gaaras chances are much higher. A gravitational pull is still a gravitational pull don't you agree? The only logical explanation to why Nagato doesn't get sucked up is because he manipulates the gravity around him to hold himself down. This would explain why he always does it while standing on the ground. If that is the case, that means that the opposing force is still there, and is no different than Gaara holding himself down. I think Onoki is the best Kage at the moment, with Gaara coming in second, but Onoki stands less of a chance than Gaara because of his style. The rest of the Kages don't stand a chance.
A little side note. Tsunade was able to save most of Konoha from Pains massive scaled Shinra Ten'sei by covering them with Katsuyu. Gaaras sand is much stronger than that.
That type of logic doesn't work here. If you were to look at things that way then technically a healthy Kimimaro could kill Deidara.
Now that I think about it, Gaara is a good match-up against Nagato. I don't see him winning due to Nagato not only having the 6 paths but also having mastered the 5 elements. Either way, I see him having higher chances than many others only if they were to fight in a place that would give Gaara an advantage though. The beach, his village, the desert, etc. but if you were to make them fight in the ocean, good luck Gaara.
Gaara could actually counter most of Nagato's paths. I'm not sure whether Gaara uses his chakra to manipulate other sources of sand other than his gourd's as well. If he does need chakra to manipulate other sources of sand then the sand would get the chakra sucked right out of it on contact with Nagato which means that it would pretty much be useless to use as an offensive to strike Nagato himself. I don't see any other way on how Gaara could manipulate sand without using his chakra. The sand would still work as a good defensive as long as it doesn't touch Nagato. The sand could attempt to smash Nagato with other objects objects as well to avoid actual contact with him since these objects won't have chakra in them. The sand could be used in plenty of other ways. The sand still won't be useless since Gaara could send it towards Nagato at high speed so it'll still collide with Nagato but it won't be restraining Nagato since it's just going to be regular sand. He'll have to use it as a striking force rather than a restraining force if he tends to use it on Nagato. If Preta Path works.
Chibaku Tensei- Note that not only is Gaara going to get pulled in but the sand that might try to hold him back would also get pulled in. It affects the entire sorrounding area. If Nagato extends the reach to the entire battlefield then Gaara has poor chances of surviving it.
It also seems like he can control the weather or atleast make it rain. This could be a problem for Gaara since it's going to make his sand dense and it could slow down and be harder to control if it starts to fall apart. The rain will also increase Nagato's raiton effectiveness if it strikes Gaara's wet sand while Gaara is making contact with it. Another possibility would be that the sand might not be able to restrain Gaara that effectively due to the wet sand falling apart. Nagato will then be able to use a Bansho Tennin with an increased gravitational force more effectively and if it manages to pull Gaara from the restrains of his wet sand, Human Path could be Gaara's downfall.
Without Nagato's 5 elements, Gaara would have higher chances but I still don't see him winning in this fight due to Deva Path and perhaps Preta Path too if it works. Animal Path could provide linked vision as well as good diversions. Naraka Path incase any of his summons die.
I still think Nagato would win most of the time but Gaara does have higher chances against him than most others do. A good match-up for Nagato as long as it's in a place that would favor Gaara.
Gaara could actually counter most of Nagato's paths. I'm not sure whether Gaara uses his chakra to manipulate other sources of sand other than his gourd's as well. If he does need chakra to manipulate other sources of sand then the sand would get the chakra sucked right out of it on contact with Nagato which means that it would pretty much be useless to use as an offensive to strike Nagato himself. I don't see any other way on how Gaara could manipulate sand without using his chakra. The sand would still work as a good defensive as long as it doesn't touch Nagato. The sand could attempt to smash Nagato with other objects objects as well to avoid actual contact with him since these objects won't have chakra in them. The sand could be used in plenty of other ways. The sand still won't be useless since Gaara could send it towards Nagato at high speed so it'll still collide with Nagato but it won't be restraining Nagato since it's just going to be regular sand. He'll have to use it as a striking force rather than a restraining force if he tends to use it on Nagato. If Preta Path works.
Chibaku Tensei- Note that not only is Gaara going to get pulled in but the sand that might try to hold him back would also get pulled in. It affects the entire sorrounding area. If Nagato extends the reach to the entire battlefield then Gaara has poor chances of surviving it.
It also seems like he can control the weather or atleast make it rain. This could be a problem for Gaara since it's going to make his sand dense and it could slow down and be harder to control if it starts to fall apart. The rain will also increase Nagato's raiton effectiveness if it strikes Gaara's wet sand while Gaara is making contact with it. Another possibility would be that the sand might not be able to restrain Gaara that effectively due to the wet sand falling apart. Nagato will then be able to use a Bansho Tennin with an increased gravitational force more effectively and if it manages to pull Gaara from the restrains of his wet sand, Human Path could be Gaara's downfall.
Without Nagato's 5 elements, Gaara would have higher chances but I still don't see him winning in this fight due to Deva Path and perhaps Preta Path too if it works. Animal Path could provide linked vision as well as good diversions. Naraka Path incase any of his summons die.
I still think Nagato would win most of the time but Gaara does have higher chances against him than most others do. A good match-up for Nagato as long as it's in a place that would favor Gaara.
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TrollingSage
Active member
Ok you've got a few things wrong. Katsuya couldnt save the villagers who got hit by the brunt of Pain's shinra tensei. She only saved those who weren't close to the attack. As strong as Gaara's sand is I dont see it protecting him from a shinra tensei as strong as the one Pain used against Konoha.
And as for C/T I've already explained why Gaara cant counter it. The attacks draws everything including the ground, meaning Gaara will have nothing to hold on to.
Now you claim Gaara can counter most of Nagato's techs but ask yourself this; Can he defend himself from universal pull whilst fending of all of Animal Path's summons and defending himself against Nagato's missiles? If your answer to the above question is yes, then maybe he does have a 5% chance.
2. naruto was caught offguard by crippled nagato. and naruto can sense even malice on the enemy itself while in bijuu mode. but still nagato caught him because of some divertions. I'm saying it is possible for nagato to sneek near gaara if he uses all of his summons for diversion. you're wrong if you say gaara would just crush all of pain's summon at the same time.. you cannot compare the scenario on three kages.. these summons are much bigger than those 3 and nagato has a total of 8(I think), gaara would need to control a huge amount of sand and that would definitely drain his chakra, as we've seen when he tried to control huge sand amount at his village(fight with deidara).
3. king of hell can extract soul aswell as seen on pain invasion. and I also remember that king of hell can only be seen by naraka's target. just browse back when pain invaded konoha I'm too lazy to find that part now.
4. every jutsu in narutoverse needs chakra. it has not been explained yet but it has to be controlled by chakra or it uses chakra even a little.
6. If im not mistaken his auto defense's sand comes from the gourd. so no gourd=no auto defense.
7. dude crab is a valuable asset here for nagato. it can spit out huge amount of water/bubbles. if oil was able to render gaara's sand useless.. water has the same effect specially with huge volume of it. think of this.. can you create sand castle underwater?common logic. and don't compare gold from water. coz gold is solid and of course water is liquid it will make gaara's sand fall apart.
exaclty, thats the only logical explanation here. nagato controls gravity, gaara can't. huge difference, nagato can chose not to get pulled because he controls the gravity, gaara won't be able to hold himself in the ground because the ground itself would get pulled aswell. all of his sand/surrounding would all be subject to gravitational pull there's no escaping CT unless you did what itachi naruto bee did. and gaara doesn't have that firepower.
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Please... Deva solos him: Shinra tensei to counter any incoming sand (and, possibly, even overpower and controll it instead) and chibaku tensei to crush him alive... Even Kurama could not last the gravity of Chibaku with 8 tails, why the hell would Gaara?
Saiyan Kammy
Active member
how am I a fanboy don't comment if you don't know what you're on about Gaara fanboy
I highly disagree, that Shinra Tensei practically reached the entrance of Konoha. Look at the screens in the links after this paragraph, you're telling me there wasn't not one Katsuya in this entire range that saved someone? No freaking way man. There would be nothing left if that was the case. Katsuya took the hit, and some like Sakura even came out unscathed. I think Gaara has a damn good chance of surviving that. With that being said, I don't think he'd just lay back and let Nagato fly around either. This is a fight after all.
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Gaara can hold himself down, Chibaku Tensei does not dig that far into the ground to pull matter. Maybe if it did it from one small area it could, but it doesn't. Look back at the fight between Kimimaro and Gaara. He can dig down to depths of 200 meters (that was a long time ago mind you), now if you do the math 200 meters equals out to 650 feet roughly. So how much matter does CT really pull? Enough to house the 9-tails and then some, that is not 650 feet. Now I know what you're thinking, well CT itself is bigger than 650 feet. It probably is, but since the material is not being pulled from one single spot it will not dig as deep as it's actual size. And considering Gaara can probably dig deeper now I think he can keep himself planted.
I'll answer your last question with a question. When has Nagato ever done either a shinra tensei, or a universal pull when his summons are near? I'll tell you when, never. Nagato isn't dumb enough to do that because he knows he doesn't want to kill his summons, or have a face full of Rhynos ass. Also, Gaara can still hold himself down while dealing with the summons. It's not like he can only do one thing at a time, as for the missiles there's always his auto-defense. His chances aren't the best, but they are greater than 5%.
- It's because the summons are bigger that they would be easier to destroy. Gaara doesn't necessarily have to make huge amounts of sand to destroy them, or smother them. He can bind a certain part of their body and kill them, or incapacitate them. We've all seen how much pressure Gaara can exert with his sand. Here's a prime example of what I mean. If Jiraiyas hair can do this, just think about what Gaara can do.
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- Understandable, and I'm not going to deny it, but what I'm referring to is the actual manipulation of the sand. That's never been referred to as a jutsu. But like you said it hasn't been explained so it's hard to tell exactly. I'll admit if Preta Path 100% without a shadow of a doubt can absorb Gaaras sand he is screwed. There is no chance in hell he will ever win. I've never denied that. Now, if he can't then things get real interesting. How do you think it would go if Gaaras sand is not absorbed?
- I can't see that happening. The first thing Gaara does in every fight is let his sand out, and it never goes back in until the fight is over.
- Firstly, water will not make his sand fall apart, that makes no sense man. Next time you're at the beach grab some real dry sand, ball it up and throw it. It will fall apart before it even hits the ground. After that try the same thing with some wet sand, you'll get the complete opposite. Also, I highly doubt that crab will last long enough to turn the entire battlefield into a lake.
- Nagato can control gravity to keep himself grounded, but there is still an opposing force trying to pull him up. Gaara can ground himself with his sand, but there is still an opposing force trying to pull him up. In both of these cases there is still a gravitational pull, just two different methods of staying on the ground. There is no major difference. The only difference is that where Nagato is standing the ground will not be pulled up, and where Gaara is standing the ground will be pulled up. My theory is that if Gaara pierces trough that piece of land he's standing on, and digs far into the ground with his sand only the area around him will be pulled up.
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TrollingSage
Active member
Interesting. Look at your own scan again. You can see shinra tensei made a huge circle in the middle of Konoha. Now if you look carefully you'll see there were no survivors in the middle of that circle. All the survivors emerged from around the edges of the circle. Guess where Gaara will be? Right in the middle
Secondly the way Nagato keeps himself grounded is completely different from how you're claiming Gaara can. Lets examine it closely shall we? We know when Nagato does C/T, he doesnt get pulled up by it. Not only that but also the surrounding area doesnt get pulled up as well. Meaning he's able to somehow exclude a specific areafrom the effects of C/T. What this means is his body isnt under any sort of stress. Now lets look at Gaara. Lets say for some magical reason his sand doesnt get pulled up as well. You'll C/T pulling him upwards and the sand holding him down . What do you think is going to happen to him? Better yet what happens to a man if you tie to a very large tree and pull him with a car/horse?
Now in your haste to defend Gaara you seem to have neglected one thing about universal pull. It can be aimed Einstein. Meaning Nagato can use it with his summons still aroun. He only has to aim it Gaara. And as a matter of fact, he did use shinra tensei and universal pull against Bee and Naruto and guess what? His summons were around.
There were no survivors (or anything for that matter) in the huge circle in the center because Shinra Ten'sei not only pushed down, it pushed outward as well. That's why you can see all that piled up rubble around the edges. Katsuya was there for the original impact, otherwise there would have been no people left. Here's two more screens, in these you can clearly see everything being pushed back.
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I suppose if Gaara is standing right smack dab in the middle things could get hairy quick, but do you honestly think Gaara is going to put himself in such a position? I have a hard time imagining him standing in front of Nagato, watching him fly away, then letting him pull of a massive Shinra Ten'sei without any sort of movement or resistance.
How much gravitational pressure does CT apply though? That's a good question to ask yourself. Boths times we saw CT it wasn't created at lightning fast speed, and speed is what determines the strenght of the pull. It was a continous and steady pull. The first time we saw it 6 tails Naruto was trying to escape by jumping from rock to rock, and even fired a miniature TBB down towards the ground. The second time if you notice as Bee, Naruto, and Itachi are being pulled upward they are talking and moving their hands up and down. If there was that much pressure/pull they shouldn't have been able to do anything.
I know that the pull can be aimed, and what I meant by his summons being near was in the way of his target. He used Shinra Ten'sei while inside the chameleon, and shot it towards Bee and Naruto where there were no summons in the way. In the example given Gaara is said to be surrounded by the summons, it's not the same situation.
iSharingan
Member
As i've said, Nagato can use this:
He can also absorb the sands chakra with Gakidou like Madara did. And even, what will Gaara do against CT, Banshou tenin, Gakidou, Gedo Mazo??
As said before, Rinnengan is another level.
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And good bye Gaaras sand.He can also absorb the sands chakra with Gakidou like Madara did. And even, what will Gaara do against CT, Banshou tenin, Gakidou, Gedo Mazo??
As said before, Rinnengan is another level.
No. How about you leave the thread if you don't have anything constructive to add.
Please read trough the thread, I can tell you didn't read a thing. Everything you posted has already been addressed by people who actually had good arguments instead of just questions. And if you read the original post you would see that Gedo Mazo was made a restriction.