Does the theme of forgiveness in Naruto go too far?

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

To be fair Anakin Skywalker was always destined to join the Dark Side,he didn't have a choice in the matter unlike many villains in Naruto.Him killing the Emperor and as a result saving his son Luke was what allowed the good side of Anakin to be brought back from the darkness.

Actually no, Anakin was destined to bring balance to the Force, not join the Dark Side.

 

[Tennis Robot]

The boundaries between life and death in Naruto are very slim, in real life, we rely on faith/belief systems for the hope of an afterlife, while in NV, they have empirical evidence of life after death, hence there is no cessation of existence in NV and death is merely a transition to another plane of existence, while in real life we have no absolute proof that life continues after biological expiration, hence the concept of absolute cessation of being, therefore in NV it is easier in the conscience of the forgiver to forgive, just like how Luke Skywalker easily forgave Darth Vader for killing Obi-Wan since in the SW universe: "There is no death, there is the Force"

Get ****ed.

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

What's stopping him from changing his mind? And how was Minato and Naruto going to punish Obito?



Madara couldn't move at the time.

Yeah he could,Madara easily broke the Wood Dragon and Gates when he was revived.But in typical Madara fashion he didn't give a f*ck since BZ was there to force Obito to use Rinne Tensei and prevent his eye from being destroyed if necessary.

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

Actually no, Anakin was destined to bring balance to the Force, not join the Dark Side.

The hints were there when his mother was killed,that was Anakin's first step towards the Dark Side.Not to mention there was another destiny for Anakin,one that Palpatine spoke to him about.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

@the eagle: If we go for the prophecy of the Sith'ari (Chosen One of the Sith) it actually wasn't Vader, it was Darth Bane, so the Sith Prophecy didn't apply to Little Ani.

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

@the eagle: If we go for the prophecy of the Sith'ari (Chosen One of the Sith) it actually wasn't Vader, it was Darth Bane, so the Sith Prophecy didn't apply to Little Ani.

Hmm....I didn't know that.Still Anakin had began feeling emotions that were not part of the Light Side of the Force,like revenge and a desire for power.

 

[Tennis Robot]

@the eagle: If we go for the prophecy of the Sith'ari (Chosen One of the Sith) it actually wasn't Vader, it was Darth Bane, so the Sith Prophecy didn't apply to Little Ani.

How is it that you know so much about so many different (and very loosely related, if at all) topics? You must read a lot. Or maybe you have absurdly good explicit memory. Or both.

 

[Gyakusetsu]

Actually no, Anakin was destined to bring balance to the Force, not join the Dark Side.

It was both. He restored the balance by wiping out the Jedi and the Emperor and himself and had a son named Luke who had successfully mastered his darkside. Prophecy fufilled, balance restored.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Hmm....I didn't know that.Still Anakin had began feeling emotions that were not part of the Light Side of the Force,like revenge and a desire for power.

His actions like other characters in SW are within their own agency, remember what Sidious said to Luke "It is unavoidable. It is your destiny. You, like your father, are now mine. " which Luke denied, ultimately he was responsible for his own actions, Yoda put it best: "Difficult to see. Always in motion is the future."

 

[Hyuga Prodigy]

The forgiveness theme especially this war arc totally ruined the series, NaruJesus will forgive anyone and start praising them as the coolest person even to some crazy maniac.

 

[Tennis Robot]

The forgiveness theme especially this war arc totally ruined the series, NaruJesus will forgive anyone and start praising them as the coolest person even to some crazy maniac.

"Some crazy maniac" is simply a person whose behavior you do not understand. There are reasons that people are the way they are, and when you truly understand someone else's reality, you will know exactly how Naruto feels.

 

[Hyuga Prodigy]

"Some crazy maniac" is simply a person whose behavior we do not understand. There are reasons that people are the way they are, and when you truly understand someone else's reality, you will know exactly how irrational Naruto feels.

Fixed it for you.

 

[Tennis Robot]

Fixed it for you.

I hope you can learn to be more empathetic in the future

 

[Darth Uchiha]

After thinking on this for a bit and reading a thread talking about the contrast in morals on another forum,I decided to make this thread to discuss if Naruto's theme of forgiveness and redemption gets applied too much.

Some characters in the series are guilty of various crimes ranging from kidnapping,terrorism,mass murder etc;.Certain ones were forgiven for their acts but is there a limit to how much you can forgive someone?

For example the friends and families of the people Obito and Madara had killed would certainly have wanted them to brought to justice.

But lately Kishi seems to be sending the message that if you do one act of good will compared to the dozens of crimes you committed, then you're absolved of all responsibility and can go to the afterlife with a clean slate.

Obito is a perfect example of why I believe the theme of forgiveness has been used way too much.He has attacked Konoha,caused the death of the main character's parents,made several character's lives miserable,and caused a world war that claimed the lives of thousands.

Yet because he was used despite knowing full well what he was doing Obito was forgiven.All those things he did?Like it never happened,and to top it off Naruto praised him as the greatest and ultimately he got everything he wanted in death.

Those people who died because of Obito apparently don't matter because he's forgiven now.

Orochimaru is yet another example of what would happen if the theme of forgiveness takes it's course.He caused the deaths of the Fourth Kazekage and Third Hokage,experimented on countless people and attacked Konoha.

Would any sane person forgive Orochimaru despite knowing the things he's done?

Madara looks like he's gonna be redeemed for everything in the future,this is despite him being behind everything Obito did.

Unlike the latter who was manipulated into thinking his actions were for peace Madara had everything laid out from the beginning.But once again it seems like just because BZ betrayed him Kishi is trying to set Madara up for yet another redemption story.


I could go on with other characters and their actions that caused untold death and pain but I made my point.Does the theme of forgiveness get applied too much?Is there a limit to how much a character can be redeemed?

Well, not only is Madara dead, but, he didn't have the slightest hint of remorse, unlike Obito, besides, if Luke could forgive Vader and it's all good, Naruto, the freaking Jesus-kid, can forgive Obito. Plus, only Kakashi (his best friend) and Minato (Naruto before Naruto) joined in forgiveness, Sakura was at first adverse to him, and eventually indifferent, Sasuke was pretty much the same as Sakura, while the rest of the alliance wanted him dead (which he is). Orochimaru...yeah, after this is over, someone's gotta lock that crazy bastard up.

 

[Darth Uchiha]

It's not necessarily the theme of the manga that goes too far. It's mainly just Naruto's idiotic mindset that goes too far. Not everyone will forgive their enemy that caused them pain their whole life. Even calling them "awesome" and praising them while at the same time overriding all the actions done before makes you look completely stupid and senseless.

Kakashi forgiving Obito is understandable. They were teammates, but Obito never killed Kakashi's parents.

Sasuke forgiving Itachi is understandable. There was only one way out and it was to stop a war from occurring. Itachi was also trying to protect Sasuke. It's not like he was Obito and did it on purpose. Itachi's actions were all for a legitimate reason.

Hinata forgiving Neji is understandable. Neji was lost in the darkness of his clan but now he is trying to help or was trying to help Hinata before he died. Hhe even told Naruto to protect her. Neji also didn't kill her parents or anyone close to her.


Naruto forgiving Nagato was not understandable, but if he didn't forgive him then his village mates would still be dead, but unlikw with Obito he didn't cry over him nor did he praise him after killing and destroying his village.

Naruto forgiving Obito reaches the peek of pure idiocy. Obito's actions and what he has done throughout his life doesn't even come close to any body else in the NV when it comes to Naruto's enemies. Most of the shit that he did was not even needed. He just did it for the fun of it.

Naruto forgave Obito because he saw his entire life through his eyes, and even then, he still said he'd face punishment in the leaf village.

 

[Darth Uchiha]

@the eagle: If we go for the prophecy of the Sith'ari (Chosen One of the Sith) it actually wasn't Vader, it was Darth Bane, so the Sith Prophecy didn't apply to Little Ani.

To be fair, I believe Anakin was both the Sith'ari and the Jedi's Chosen One and his true destiny was to restore balance by forcing both the jedi and the sith to start over in destroying them both, but, that's another forum for another day (if you have a force.net account, we could discuss it there).

 

[MAN OF SIN]

Well, not only is Madara dead, but, he didn't have the slightest hint of remorse, unlike Obito, besides, if Luke could forgive Vader and it's all good, Naruto, the freaking Jesus-kid, can forgive Obito. Plus, only Kakashi (his best friend) and Minato (Naruto before Naruto) joined in forgiveness, Sakura was at first adverse to him, and eventually indifferent, Sasuke was pretty much the same as Sakura, while the rest of the alliance wanted him dead (which he is). Orochimaru...yeah, after this is over, someone's gotta lock that crazy bastard up.

You know what it means to forgive, right? It means to not feel anger/resentment towards and absolve of payment.

 

[NSUNSR]

No, Naruto's forgiveness doesn't go too far. Its very hard to forgive someone who did something bad to you. There should be more people like Naruto.

 

[MAN OF SIN]

No, Naruto's forgiveness doesn't go too far. Its very hard to forgive someone who did something bad to you. There should be more people like Naruto.

So you're saying we should let people get away with their crimes? Naruto's type of forgiveness isn't a good thing but Kishi's head is too far up his own ass to realize that.

 

[NSUNSR]

So you're saying we should let people get away with their crimes? Naruto's type of forgiveness isn't a good thing but Kishi's head is too far up his own ass to realize that.

Naruto doesn't just let them go with their crimes. Even a killer can change and become good again, and what Naruto tries to do is change the bad person, because killing him will just be a lost.