[Predictions] Naruto Manga 502 Discussion and 503 Predictions

[Koo]

You can't really argue who is the strongest ninja or hokage based on what characters in the manga have said. The characters in the manga have backgrounds and opinions too, aka everything they say isn't necessarily factual in the naruto world. I don't think there is any one strongest ninja or hokage considering they each have their own unique skill sets and advantages in battle.

i agree 100% and in battle there is also a bit of luck / randomness involved that can make the difference between equally matched opponents kakashi and guys ridiculous rivalry is testament to that

 

[silenceofthelambs]

SilenceOfTheLambs --> Dude u sure do know a crap load about Naruto (the manga as a whole) and are damn quick with ur link finding. Kudos!

I have a possible theory on "that jutsu". I think they might be the same (FTG and "That Jutsu"), and naruto might be able to perfect it without using the Kunai and seals. This might be a bit of a stretch, but when in sage mode naruto can detect the chakra levels of the people around him (don't really know his radius of affect). So maybe, he might be able to use that ability in conjunction with FTG to teleport ANYWHERE on the battlefield within his sensing range. this way he won't need the Kunai as long as his destination is within his sphere of influence (and while in sage mode). Just a thought

BEWARE: Personal Opinion in 3...

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As i'll reiterate we have never seen 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or madara in their prime in battle so we cant really judge their strengths. However, I think that, since each generation surpasses the previous one, Minato would have been stronger than the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd IF he survived. The reason i say this is because, for example, the 3rd was taught by the 1st and 2nd so he learned all their jutsu (not necessarily the case with most shinobi, but the 3rd being the exception) and then possibly creating his own. And then he did the same with his students. However, If the 1st and 4th were born at the same time and taught by the same master, the 4th might win with his uber speed, but we can never say for sure.

Minato was the youngest Hokage ever so i think that's a testament to his potentail BAMFness lol. I tell u what though i would love to see them all duke it out in the afterlife (although poor minato won't be there seeing as he is stuck in the Death God's Stomach fighting the ninetails yin? chakra)

this is only like my 5th or 6th post so could i get some feedback about what you think of my theories?

Thanks

Thanks. My memory, most times, serves me well and I can find the links I need in about a minute or two. It is possible that Naruto is going to take the Flying Thunder God technique to a whole new level, but if he does so, remember that Madara has already seen it before, from his fight with Minato. So Naruto is going to have to add some Sage Mode elements (as you mentioned), thus making the Flying Thunder God technique much more powerful and lethal.

I agree with your paragraphs below. Minato most likely would have become the strongest of the Hokages, if he had survived. But since he didn't, all we can say now is that he had an enormous untapped potential that unfortunately, was unrealized. Being the youngest Hokage is indeed a testament of the strength Minato could have gotten, but as I said, was not able to due to circumstances.

And, the Hokages might just have some kind of titanic "clash" in the afterlife -all of them are sealed inside the Shinigami's stomach, if you recall. The Third Hokage, sealing the souls of the First and Second, and the Fourth, sealing the Nine-Tailed Fox into his son Naruto. You present some interesting theories, let's see how they play out as the story progresses.

 

[silenceofthelambs]

To me the story is already like that. I mean didn't major characters like Kakashi say that the sharingan was derived from the byakugan that was contradicted. Some one said the 1 tail was a dead priest and some bull that was also refuted so what the Anbu Iruka and others say can also be refuted i mean its Kishi's manga if he wants the 4th to be the strongest he can reconed everyone and make it so. So thats why i said don't get too caught up in characters opinions

The large number of Naruto chapters have most likely caught up with Kishimoto at this point - facts he presented the first 200 chapters or so are now readily contradicted, because quite simply, he forgot what he wrote then. And I do not blame him - much stress is coupled with the job he has, and I'm sure he has no time to dig through old chapters to make sure his story is as seamless as can be.

The only thing is, where does Kishimoto state, in either an interview or the manga itself, that the Fourth Hokage is the most powerful Hokage? I've read several of his interviews as well - and nowhere has Kishimoto said that Minato is the best of all Hokages; as a matter of fact, he still has not said who indeed is the strongest Hokage. Unless Kishimoto states this in the manga, it's going to be debated, until evidence arrives.

Sometimes the opinions of certain characters might not be entirely correct, but for the most part, we can take them for fact. Otherwise, people would be confused, struggling to determine what is correct information and what is false. It's just that because no one has directly said that Minato is the most powerful Hokage is why I don't think he is the strongest Hokage. Simply for that reason.

 

[silenceofthelambs]

Well, all I know is that madara is probably uninjured.
People might say minato is the strongest ev4hr p10x h4xxicatorx, like all noobs, but lets face it, Madara can easily defeat him probably.
The 1st is probably weaker in normal terms than the 4th, but, the 1st probably possessed some ability to counter madara's abilities.
Therefore I say none is superior, they are all strong, but it depends on who is fighting who.
As for now I am 100% sure Madara defeats Minato, as Minato himself put, '' he read all my moves''.
Wich can point ount Minato had no way to counter the sharingan, or perhaps something else.

Yes, I don't understand why Minato would say "he saw through everything I did" if this isn't actually the case. He is making himself seem weaker than he really is - perhaps for military strategy, this could be effective, but for a person, why would they want to reduce their own self-worth, so to speak? Besides, Minato was speaking in front of his son - wouldn't he want to relieve him a little by saying "he is powerful, but I managed and so can you?"

In my opinion Madara will emerge from this attack unharmed and launch his own plan of attack against Minato. If this were to happen, then Minato would be telling the truth when saying "he saw through everything I did," not if he actually managed to land an attack. The appropriate wording for that, then, would be: he almost saw through everything I did.

These upcoming chapters will, hopefully, settle this debate once and for all. Until then, all we can do is keep predicting. And for those who think Madara is stronger, two pieces of evidence apparently support that argument. So far, they lead most of what people have to say, but manga readers will also get some more to support or refute what others have to say.

 

[silenceofthelambs]

First of i'm new here, finally decided to sign-up. Nice to meet all of you blah blah blah.

Secondly, I am rating this chapter a 5/5. Great chapter, great action.

Thirdly, @silenceofthelambs, Kishi in one of his previous interviews stated that Minato the 4th Hokage was the strongest of all the other Kages. So if the author/writer says that Minato is the strongest kage than, with all due respect, your statements about him (Minato) not being the strongest are ALL in vain. Sorry dude.

If it's not too much trouble to ask, could you please find this interview? I've read several of Kishimoto's interviews, and honestly, nowhere does he state that Minato is the most powerful Hokage. But if you find evidence to contradict my words, then you will be correct.

 

[silenceofthelambs]

it's not the manga contradicting itself, it's your beliefs, my beliefs that differ from kishi's belief. From 1/32 theories one might be right. We all have different way of looking at things. We all have different opinions and right now, I am sure you are seeing the naruto chapter differently from what I am seeing. This is what makes naruto series so debatable. There is only one master mind here and that's kishi. He has his own way of thinking, belief, idealism etc.

This is why we are not no one to say whether something is right or not. We can only wait for kishi to solve our questions or make assumptions. No matter how much you know naruto manga, there will still be twists and you will still be wrong.

this is why some people get mad and say "wtf but this is what should have happened".

If the manga, dealing with facts, contradicts itself, does it matter what beliefs I hold or what you think? If you're reading a chapter, and you notice a contradiction of words from an earlier one, does it have anything to do with what you think of the manga?

While ultimately Kishimoto's interpretation of the story is the right one, sometimes our expectations of the story turn out to be true. Why so? Because Kishimoto hints at things to come, and we can deduce, though not often, of what might come in later chapters.

There will be plenty of twists as we continue reading the manga, but once again, it does not necessarily mean that a person has to be wrong. Most often times, they are, but not all the time. There might be that one time where you can correctly predict what might happen as the story continues. Highly unlikely, but could. That is how I view it.

 

[silenceofthelambs]

hmm I do agree with you on the fact that this show isn't like DBZ. And I keep telling people this "A>B>C=A>C" isn't true in naruto like it is in DBZ. naruto logic is more based on "rock-paper-scissors".

for example: 1st>Madara>Itachi>Orochimaru>3rd but 3rd>1st? 3rd technically defeated 1st and 2nd while Orochiamru was attacking him periodically and 3rd wasn't even in his prime. granted he gave his life to beat them, but still.

But I have to disagree with Minato "losing" to Madara. He might have told Naruto "he saw through everything I did" but that could just as easily mean "he knew I would take naruto back so he could escape with kushina. he knew the basics of my FTG."

The key word here is everything. Not some, or most, but everything. If Madara actually did not see through everything Minato had done, then it turns out Minato is lying to his son. Why would he tell Naruto that Madara read each of his moves if this was not the case? It's like Minato is reducing his self-worth, which many would not do. That is if Minato is actually doing this, which I doubt he is.

 

[silenceofthelambs]

welcome buddy and nice post I happen to go on the same beliefs.I mean who would know better then kishi right?exactly.an opinion vs kishis hey I made this manga and I say the 4th is strongest=minato IS the strongest hokage.some try to fight this fact but they honestly need to fully realize what it truly is.a fact.

To reiterate, where does it say in the manga, or in one of Kishimoto's interviews, that Minato is the strongest Hokage? If any of you can find this evidence, then they will be correct. It is possible to fight an opinion, which I am doing - but it is near impossible to fight fact, and right now, I'm not seeing it. Like I said, if someone has evidence of the claim that the Fourth is the strongest of all Hokage, please bring it forward, and that will make my statements false.

 

[silenceofthelambs]

"The next generation will always surpass the previous one. It's one of the never-ending cycles in life." (Kakashi Hatake)

Not everybody will. There have been several generations since the First Hokage's time, yet nobody has been powerful enough to come on equal footing with the extraordinary strength he had. Only Sarutobi, I suppose, could stake such a claim - but so far, there is no one. Eventually Naruto, yes, but in the present, there is not one ninja who is more powerful than Hashirama Senju. Many (from different generations) are close, but just not there. Kakashi did not mean literally that the succeeding generation would automatically always surpass the previous - he meant that the new generation would always come up with better ideas to go about things, and that was the moment where they would surpass the previous generation.

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By entrusting Konoha into this new generation, they would find better ways to maintain peace, and would in this way surpass everything the previous generation had put forth.

 

[silenceofthelambs]

I think ultimately, Minato is stronger than Madara. Why else would Madara use Naruto as a pawn to get Minato away from Kushina? If he could easily defeat him, then why not do it the same way he defeated the Anbu guards? I think Madara realized he couldn't beat him and used other tactics. As you say, what was Madara doing while Minato sealed the Kyubbi in Naruto? I think if not for Kushina and Naruto, Minato would have waxed Madara.

It was easier for Madara that way. He did not approach Kushina, Minato, and Naruto with the intention of killing them all - he wanted the Nine-Tailed Fox, and the method of operating he used was the most efficient in removing Minato for a duration of time that would allow Madara to carry on with his plans.

Besides, consider that Madara, a "mere shell of [his] former self," is taking on a fully-powered Minato. If Madara were at full strength, the results would be much different. Madara would overpower Minato in a matter of minutes - even in his weakened state, he pushed Minato to his limit fairly quickly, and Minato with a clever strategy, managed to gain the upper hand in the first part of their fight.

 

[zapp42823]

naruto will find solution to counter this kind of technique when time comes... kishi will reveal it to naruto face to face... lol... what will be the new jutsu that will develop by naruto? mmmm sasuke where are you now? i miss tsunade sama too...

 

[Koo]

i'd think the demon cloak would be enough to thwart madaras physical attacks.

 

[minato4th]

even if madara was at full power i doubt he could keep up with minato's pure speed and power. Even without the ftg minato is shown as being quite fast. madra without that space time jutsu would be dead. Even in madara's prime.

 

[Akatsuki leader]

minato fight is shit fu and toru also fight with madara and better than 4th kage!!!
minato hit madara with rasengun (kamehame) again that booring tech....and that coffin kabuto summoned... is not 4th kage.... bcz kabuto said: dont worry i wont tell anyone about this........ SO THATS mean in the coffin KISHIMOTO MASASHI!!!! or madara another body or madara brother... hell i dont know.... but sure not minato.... and why win the speed minato? of corse bcz he is kage and minato naruto father... kishimoto dont want write minato like weak kage who didnt hit madara thats why.......

 

[BigBen]

welcome buddy and nice post I happen to go on the same beliefs.I mean who would know better then kishi right?exactly.an opinion vs kishis hey I made this manga and I say the 4th is strongest=minato IS the strongest hokage.some try to fight this fact but they honestly need to fully realize what it truly is.a fact.

What he said was he was the strongest ninja that was around at the time but not the strongest ninja of all time setting Naruto up to overpower him
SO again with the madara = danzo = obito debate (kishi will do what he wants) it's all pointless as you will have Naruto being the Powerhouse of the next generation (and he will be the strongest ninja of all time until a spin off happens) ... each had his set of skills that made them unique and Jutsu's are merely weapons used by ninja ... the skill of who uses them determines how powerful they were minato has shown battle tatics and skillfully exploits weaknesses he did rasengan tobi afterall
again just a thought don't fight over useless ideals they were Hokage for a reason and leave it at that lol

 

[Sennin Jinchuuriki]

naruto will find solution to counter this kind of technique when time comes... kishi will reveal it to naruto face to face... lol... what will be the new jutsu that will develop by naruto? mmmm sasuke where are you now? i miss tsunade sama too...

Ya we have seen it from time to time that Naruto has always come up with one of his own style to counter any tech or make one. So if Naruto learns FTG which is most likely then he will upgrade it making it more versatile like Madara's space time tech.

 

[BigBen]

minato fight is shit fu and toru also fight with madara and better than 4th kage!!!
minato hit madara with rasengun (kamehame) again that booring tech....and that coffin kabuto summoned... is not 4th kage.... bcz kabuto said: dont worry i wont tell anyone about this........ SO THATS mean in the coffin KISHIMOTO MASASHI!!!! or madara another body or madara brother... hell i dont know.... but sure not minato.... and why win the speed minato? of corse bcz he is kage and minato naruto father... kishimoto dont want write minato like weak kage who didnt hit madara thats why.......

LOL @ kishi being in the coffin that was priceless

 

[Sennin Jinchuuriki]

I don't remember but someone mentioned that if Madara knew about Minato's tech then why was he surprised when Minato used it in the last chapter I think most probably its because Minato used FTG level 2 which he rarely uses or I may be wrong but it seems the most likely reason.

 

[Sennin Jinchuuriki]

It was easier for Madara that way. He did not approach Kushina, Minato, and Naruto with the intention of killing them all - he wanted the Nine-Tailed Fox, and the method of operating he used was the most efficient in removing Minato for a duration of time that would allow Madara to carry on with his plans.

Besides, consider that Madara, a "mere shell of [his] former self," is taking on a fully-powered Minato. If Madara were at full strength, the results would be much different. Madara would overpower Minato in a matter of minutes - even in his weakened state, he pushed Minato to his limit fairly quickly, and Minato with a clever strategy, managed to gain the upper hand in the first part of their fight.

I know that we haven't seen Madara at his prime but just think Madara knew all about Minato I mean at least he heard of him and he must have analyze Minato's techs in battles, plus Madara at that time had so much experience man he should have been dead but he is alive and with MAJOR experience and even then Minato in that short amount of time was able to outsmart Madara at least in that short battle. And if you think like that what would have happen if Madara was at his prime so think also like this what would have happen if Minato didn't die at such a young age and develop all those jutsus he thought of or at least progressed half way through. There's just no point in thinking what would have happen if those things happened simply because it didn't.

 

[Jinchuuriki of Juubi]

What he said was he was the strongest ninja that was around at the time but not the strongest ninja of all time setting Naruto up to overpower him
SO again with the madara = danzo = obito debate (kishi will do what he wants) it's all pointless as you will have Naruto being the Powerhouse of the next generation (and he will be the strongest ninja of all time until a spin off happens) ... each had his set of skills that made them unique and Jutsu's are merely weapons used by ninja ... the skill of who uses them determines how powerful they were minato has shown battle tatics and skillfully exploits weaknesses he did rasengan tobi afterall
again just a thought don't fight over useless ideals they were Hokage for a reason and leave it at that lol

what in gods name are you babbling about?I simply stated that if kishi actually says minato is the strongest hokage then the would mean it is fact.I never said he was the strongest ninja of all time....and first of all it is common knowledge naruto will surpass him(if he hasn't already)so don't patronize me.secondly who ever said he was strongest ninja of that time?and to be honest I could not find one point you were trying to prove in this post?it is incoherent and hardly makes sense.if you have something to say repost it so I can actually understand the point you are making