[Discussion] Why do people underrate Crocodile so much?

24 12 11 to troll

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I understand that people underrate him or bring a few pegs down the ladder because Luffy defeated him in Alabasta, but for me that's no reason to claim he's weaker than the likes of Jinbe and Sanji now

So, we know Luffy defeated Crocodile. But we forget that:
1. Crocodile neg diffed him in 2 minutes without using his poison. Luffy would've died if it wasn't for Robin
2. Crocodile then neg diffed Luffy during their second fight, while Luffy was using water, Crocodiles greatest weakness. This alone showed their gap in power was VAST. Again he didn't even use his poison. Luffy would've died if it wasn't for plot
3. During the third fight Luffy threw Crocodile off with a surprise attack, it's been made clear by Oda that he degraded Crocodile so that Luffy could actually fight him

How do we know Oda downgraded Crocodile temporarily?
1. The level of strength is clearly far weaker than that in his first two fights with Luffy e.g. He tanked Jozu's attacks in MF, (and Jozu used Haki!!!!) whereas Luffys punches somehow hurt him
2. He's held on Level 6 of Impel Down. Ivankov was only held at Level 5
3. His feats in the war:
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He clashed with Doflamingo without any trouble


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Here's the Jozu stuff, clearly showing his endurance and defence were greatly depleted for plot reasons


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Again he clashed with Mihawk, the clashes with the other Shichibukai aren't saying he's on their level, just that he's stronger than everyone believes. Keep in mind Mihawk had the intent to kill Luffy. Doflamingo considered him worthy of alliance whereas he thought of Law as unworthy


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Here he hinders an Admiral. Something Jinbe and Vista were unable to do

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Here we see his range spanned the whole port, this trounces his 30 yards or so range that was shown in Alabasta hundredfold

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He shows us new attacks that, if used on Luffy in Alabasta would've done enough damage insta kill oneshot

His Devil Fruit feats during the later arcs are way more impressive than those in Alabasta, and keep in mind there is no desert around and plenty of water, this highlights that he was most probably in a weaker state than he was in Alabasta, having also been imprisoned with no food etc., but that means he's clearly already capable of far more than we've seen

P.S. He also shows faster reactions as he was able to dodge Kairouseki Bullets in Impel Down
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4. If we haven't seen his awakening, the fact Croc is so knowledgeable of it means he is likely awakened. This means he's got a whole new level of tricks we've yet to see
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Lets not forget he's probably a far more prominent Haki user than before due to the timeskip and his residence in the New World

So no, Croc isn't weak. He's probably around the same level as G4 Luffy (Doffy>Luffy>=Crocodile as I see it), come at me bro :coffee:
 

Sheele

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G4 isn't that strong. Everyone is hyping it up to be incredible, but they forget that Luffy is basically beating up a dying man/on the verge of death man
Nah.. before I see any new feats of croc. G4 > Crocodile.

His feats in the war were great yeah, but luffy had to deal with a lot of shit as well.. same goes for Jinbe..
 

24 12 11 to troll

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Nah.. before I see any new feats of croc. G4 > Crocodile.

His feats in the war were great yeah, but luffy had to deal with a lot of shit as well.. same goes for Jinbe..
And Luffy was resurged with energy twice thanks to Ivankov... and he fought alongside others and was protected all the same. Luffy was probably by far the weakest of the big names at the war, and considering Croc far outshone him (with his gears), Croc either had a massive powerup (even though he was imprisoned? doesn't make sense, right?), or he was nerfed.
 

YellowFang

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Crocodile is the Gaara of One Piece.

Ot- I have to admit he can beat my beloved Robin neg-diff U_U

C'mon don't mention Gaara where bosses are being discussed...
Believe me Sir Croc won't have shat his pants against Madara...


OT:

He's underrated, I believe his defeat against Luffy was quite rushed writing from Oda... He's at the least on M3(minus)Luffy's level IMO...
 

OG sama

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Looks like your overrating and blowing his feats way out of proportion. I'm sure pre ts Luffy would lose to freaking Caribou 2/3 times without a way to fight back. You expect him to beat a logia without any way to touch one?

I'm just not even going to debate this again, because its the same stuff that has already been countered many times in this section.
 

24 12 11 to troll

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C'mon don't mention Gaara where bosses are being discussed...
Believe me Sir Croc won't have shat his pants against Madara...


OT:

He's underrated, I believe his defeat against Luffy was quite rushed writing from Oda... He's at the least on M3(minus)Luffy's level IMO...
NGL anybody stronger than Pre TS Luffy can beat Madara (pre Juubi)

Looks like your overrating and blowing his feats way out of proportion. I'm sure pre ts Luffy would lose to freaking Caribou 2/3 times without a way to fight back. You expect him to beat a logia without any way to touch one?

I'm just not even going to debate this again, because its the same stuff that has already been countered many times in this section.
How am I blowing feats way out of proportion when I'm simply describing them as they are with comparative notions to Alabasta. They may seem "out of proportion" to you because you refuse to accept he was just that much more impressive in the Marineford War

Luffy wouldn't have lost to Caribou even if he couldn't hit him. He was too strong. And yet Crocodile outfeated him in every way possible
 

chopstickchakra

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I understand that people underrate him or bring a few pegs down the ladder because Luffy defeated him in Alabasta, but for me that's no reason to claim he's weaker than the likes of Jinbe and Sanji now

So, we know Luffy defeated Crocodile. But we forget that:
1. Crocodile neg diffed him in 2 minutes without using his poison. Luffy would've died if it wasn't for Robin
2. Crocodile then neg diffed Luffy during their second fight, while Luffy was using water, Crocodiles greatest weakness. This alone showed their gap in power was VAST. Again he didn't even use his poison. Luffy would've died if it wasn't for plot
3. During the third fight Luffy threw Crocodile off with a surprise attack, it's been made clear by Oda that he degraded Crocodile so that Luffy could actually fight him

How do we know Oda downgraded Crocodile temporarily?
1. The level of strength is clearly far weaker than that in his first two fights with Luffy e.g. He tanked Jozu's attacks in MF, (and Jozu used Haki!!!!) whereas Luffys punches somehow hurt him
2. He's held on Level 6 of Impel Down. Ivankov was only held at Level 5
3. His feats in the war:
You must be registered for see images
He clashed with Doflamingo without any trouble


You must be registered for see images
Here's the Jozu stuff, clearly showing his endurance and defence were greatly depleted for plot reasons


You must be registered for see images
Again he clashed with Mihawk, the clashes with the other Shichibukai aren't saying he's on their level, just that he's stronger than everyone believes. Keep in mind Mihawk had the intent to kill Luffy. Doflamingo considered him worthy of alliance whereas he thought of Law as unworthy


You must be registered for see images
Here he hinders an Admiral. Something Jinbe and Vista were unable to do

You must be registered for see images
Here we see his range spanned the whole port, this trounces his 30 yards or so range that was shown in Alabasta hundredfold

You must be registered for see images
He shows us new attacks that, if used on Luffy in Alabasta would've done enough damage insta kill oneshot

His Devil Fruit feats during the later arcs are way more impressive than those in Alabasta, and keep in mind there is no desert around and plenty of water, this highlights that he was most probably in a weaker state than he was in Alabasta, having also been imprisoned with no food etc., but that means he's clearly already capable of far more than we've seen

P.S. He also shows faster reactions as he was able to dodge Kairouseki Bullets in Impel Down
You must be registered for see images
4. If we haven't seen his awakening, the fact Croc is so knowledgeable of it means he is likely awakened. This means he's got a whole new level of tricks we've yet to see
You must be registered for see images

Lets not forget he's probably a far more prominent Haki user than before due to the timeskip and his residence in the New World

So no, Croc isn't weak. He's probably around the same level as G4 Luffy (Doffy>Luffy>=Crocodile as I see it), come at me bro :coffee:
Agreed too many people get caught up on the part 1 power level differences and ignore good character design and groud work. They do it to Enel and Naruto fans did it to Zabuza.
 

24 12 11 to troll

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Agreed too many people get caught up on the part 1 power level differences and ignore good character design and groud work. They do it to Enel and Naruto fans did it to Zabuza.
True shit. People base their opinions on him on the fact he was defeated pre TS forgetting that it took three attempts and Luffy nearly died three fookin times
 

Oblivionx

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i think everyone knows that plot saved luffy against crocodile but current Luffy would be too much for him...! yeah he seems untouchable at best but so did logia types like Ace, Akainu etc but they aren't untouchable...! so i'd say he's around gear 3 level at best..! or may be a bit lower...!
 

24 12 11 to troll

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i think everyone knows that plot saved luffy against crocodile but current Luffy would be too much for him...! yeah he seems untouchable at best but so did logia types like Ace, Akainu etc but they aren't untouchable...! so i'd say he's around gear 3 level at best..! or may be a bit lower...!
And that's not underestimating croc?
 

sage1999

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ngl croc is defo my top 5 fav ppl. His no **** attitude is just great.

OT: I agree with u. Luffy vs Croc was rushed and it should hv happened post timeskip.

Enel is >>>>> Croc tho
 

Bogard

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Title should have been Why do people overestimate Crocodile so much?

Fight 1
1) Logia intangibility. Luffy couldn't injure him only because of this.

Luffy was perfectly capable of reacting to Croc and counterattacking in the same breath.

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Luffy even blitzed him several times during the fight. Crocodile couldn't even finish one sentence.

2)Luffy was completely taken off guard. Luffy was upset at Croc sending a sandstorm at Yuba so he ran up to him, grabbed his coat looked him dead in the face, and begged him to stop. Crocodile took the opportunity to stab him when he wasn't even prepared.
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Fight 2

Does this look like someone who's winning or someone who's superior to their opponent?
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Crocodile only won this fight because Luffy was put in a predicament where he had limited movement. Crocodile took this opportunity to drain him of moiature.
He again, defeated someone who was not able to fight back or defend himself.
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Fight 3

Crocodile was completely decimated.
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Crocodile was completely inferior in all stats bar intelligence and hax. He never got a got hit in on Luffy and he got completely destroyed by Luffy even when he was weakened.

Inb4 the poison, but who cares about the poison? Croc still got spanked in the actual combat department like crazy, so just because he scratched Luffy for a second(his only hit of the fight) isn't going to change his combat ability was terribly lacking and he lost the fight. Lethally poisoning someone is a cheap way to win a fight and it requires no skill at all.

Inb4 Marineford. Crocodile actually did nothing impressive in marineford. He beat up fodder, was blitzed by Jozu(saved by Doflamingo), was blocked by some half assed kick from Mingo, was blocked by a half assed attacking Mihawk(even Daz Bones did better by countering a slash - someone who was one shotted by Zoro the moment he could cut steel), managed to do, and cut a distracted logia while hiding behind multiple commanders, a feat many fodder accomplished. And more importantly, he was still portrayed as Luffy's bitch during that war when he kicked him aside like a fodder when he was a foolish enough to try to attack Whitebeard

Conclusion: Nothing wrong with Crocodile's character. He is one of the baddest character in the manga, but tends to get overhyped because of this. He did nothing to deserve the wank he gets from this section.
 
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24 12 11 to troll

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Title should have been Why do people overestimate Crocodile so much?

Fight 1
1) Logia intangibility. Luffy couldn't injure him only because of this.

Luffy was perfectly capable of reacting to Croc and counterattacking in the same breath.

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images


Luffy even blitzed him several times during the fight. Crocodile couldn't even finish one sentence.

2)Luffy was completely taken off guard. Luffy was upset at Croc sending a sandstorm at Yuba so he ran up to him, grabbed his coat looked him dead in the face, and begged him to stop. Crocodile took the opportunity to stab him when he wasn't even prepared.
You must be registered for see images


Fight 2

Does this look like someone who's winning or someone who's superior to their opponent?
You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images


Crocodile only won this fight because Luffy was put in a predicament where he had limited movement. Crocodile took this opportunity to drain him of moiature.
He again, defeated someone who was not able to fight back or defend himself.
You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images


Fight 3

Crocodile was completely decimated.
You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

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Crocodile was completely inferior in all stats bar intelligence and hax. He never got a got hit in on Luffy and he got completely destroyed by Luffy even when he was weakened.

Inb4 the poison, but who cares about the poison? Croc still got spanked in the actual combat department like crazy, so just because he scratched Luffy for a second(his only hit of the fight) isn't going to change his combat ability was terribly lacking and he lost the fight. Lethally poisoning someone is a cheap way to win a fight and it requires no skill at all.

Inb4 Marineford. Crocodile actually did nothing impressive in marineford. He beat up fodder, was blitzed by Jozu(saved by Doflamingo), was blocked by some half assed kick from Mingo, blocked a half assed attack from Mihawk, something Daz Bones could do(someone who was one shotted by Zoro the moment he could cut steel), managed to do, and cut a distracted logia while hiding behind multiple commanders, a feat many fodder accomplished. And more importantly, he was still portrayed as Luffy's bitch during that war when he kicked him aside like a fodder when he was a foolish enough to try to attack Whitebeard

Conclusion: Nothing wrong with Crocodile's character. He is one of the baddest character in the manga, but tends to get overhyped because of this. He did nothing to deserve the wank he gets from this section.
Pretty much just said that Alabasta croc is completely nerfed. So your entire argument is thwarted as you're completely ignoring his much better and more accurate feats

I've seen people match Lucci with Crocodile, or say Sanji can oneshot him. How is he ever overhyped?

P.S. Use a f*cking Spoiler will ya?
 
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