Tupac was definitely not the best.

[Kαmi]

Also, be yourself, wanting to copy and be like someone else is what got dsm kabuto caught in izanami. You are trying to be like me and copy my scheme in that reply.

He was addressing your points in order that they came and gave them numbers so that it would be clear what he was responding too as he answered... Do you really think like this? Cause that's the first I've ever heard someone try and twist such a minor thing to their advantage.

 

[Forest]

If I'm not mistaken you said NarutoB in the only credible one in this thread. Now you say you posted that message that way because you hate when people can't list the golden age meaning they don't know music. Well I wanted to point that out because you basically said I am not credible yet if I'm not mistaken I am one of the few to actually list great albums in a post yet you didn't acknowledge me. I just wanted to pint out the real from fake.


Fail. Are you not a fan?

Do you listen to the music?


Do you judge the music?


All are answered with yes and means my point is valid. Lyrical substance is based on the fans perception of the lyrics.

You haven't said anything that makes sense to me... You are arguing that "Quantity" is over quality, and the approval of fans will determine if someone is a lyrical monster? Lyrical substance is based on the fans perception???? wtf??
There are rappers that I am not even a fan of, that I consider to be MONSTERS lyrically..... and..
Do you know how many lyrical monsters there are in the genre of hip hop who have never ever been on a TV? let alone have fans outside of their small niches and crews? C'mon man..
How does a fan's perspective define lyrical substance, it's just their opinion on the music. If you analyze what they are actually saying from a non biased perspective, word for word, bar for bar, seeing how many literary elements they employ, the amount of poetic device then that is a fair way to judge..
I provided my Points and you provided no valid counter argument to anything I said to you in my last post. So if that's your response, we done here..

 

[NarutoB]

Hmmm, irrelevant stuff to make him seem like he was better than he really was....ahahaha llab I guess the majority of raps fans use a lot of irrelevant stuff to make him seem better than he really was as well.

Also I only posted no rapper today raps like him how is that making him seem better than he really was? Its not

You should really try harder.


Also, be yourself, wanting to copy and be like someone else is what got dsm kabuto caught in izanami. You are trying to be like me and copy my scheme in that reply.

That was exactly my point. What does he rap like? Last time I checked, rap is rap. Every rapper has their own technique, but what made Pac so different than any rapper today?

 

[Da Best Ever]

Right. I'm too tired for all of this lol, just explain to me how does what the majority say about an artist have any more importance than what the minority says? Imo it doesn't, you either like a certain rapper or you don't, regardless of what everyone else is saying

Basically Pac is overrated

Exactly you couldn't counter nor could you say why you think someone is better than Pac because that shit was countered so you digress and revert back to the most logical thing to say in this situation which is " its all opinions ".

The bold stands, if fans don't matter who is there to listen to judge the quality of the music? You didn't want to answer because you knew the answer would make me right. Too Easy


Jordan is overrated, LeBron is overrated, Peyton Manning is overrated, Floyd Mayweather is overrated, Barack Obama is overrated, Jesus is overrated. You have basically just said all that and more are overrated, haters say shit like that, and haters is why they strive to continue to be the best, they thank y'all haters.

 

[Forest]

Lol fans define lyrical substance? Do the artists THEMSELVES not judge their work and define their work by the very act of creating it, and observing it? They all have their own aspirations and capacities and some are far better at executing their will, Just to give an example, try listening to Aesop rock when you get the chance. You will see how he deliberately uses excessive lyricism to the point that you can't decode his bars unless you are reading his lyrics or have memorized them thoroughly

 

[Da Best Ever]

That was exactly my point. What does he rap like? Last time I checked, rap is rap. Every rapper has their own technique, but what made Pac so different than any rapper today?

WTF, so everybody raps the same. Kendrick Lamar raps like Wayne then by your logic. If everyone rap was the same then all artist lyrics would be the same substance and hold the same meaning.


By you asking what mad Pac so difference further proves to me you know nothing about his music. You don't get the same feeling from Kendrick Lamar's music that you did when you listened to Pac's music. The fact that people still think he is alive despite logic and facts further shows the impact his music had on people something kendrick lamar and any other rapper cannot get from their fans or fans or rap period, they make a good song for the now, while Pac is immortalized through his music.

 

[NarutoB]

Exactly you couldn't counter nor could you say why you think someone is better than Pac because that shit was countered so you digress and revert back to the most logical thing to say in this situation which is " its all opinions ".

The bold stands, if fans don't matter who is there to listen to judge the quality of the music? You didn't want to answer because you knew the answer would make me right. Too Easy


Jordan is overrated, LeBron is overrated, Peyton Manning is overrated, Floyd Mayweather is overrated, Barack Obama is overrated, Jesus is overrated. You have basically just said all that and more are overrated, haters say shit like that, and haters is why they strive to continue to be the best, they thank y'all haters.

@ Bold, so do I get props for being logical? Lol lmao.

And my point still stands, fans don't mean shit when determining how good an artist is, so in a way they don't matter. I mean, shit, to the rappers themselves the fans matter because that's how they make money, but why should I care about the dude that will sleep outside a record store just to be the first person to get a new Drake album? I shouldn't, my opinion is my opinion.

And to top it all off, you listed some of the people I really think are overrated lmao. Obama? Really? Lincoln solos

 

[NarutoB]

WTF, so everybody raps the same. Kendrick Lamar raps like Wayne then by your logic. If everyone rap was the same then all artist lyrics would be the same substance and hold the same meaning.


By you asking what mad Pac so difference further proves to me you know nothing about his music. You don't get the same feeling from Kendrick Lamar's music that you did when you listened to Pac's music. The fact that people still think he is alive despite logic and facts further shows the impact his music had on people something kendrick lamar and any other rapper cannot get from their fans or fans or rap period, they make a good song for the now, while Pac is immortalized through his music.

A. In a way, Kdot does rap like Wayne because that's one of his biggest influences

B. Read what I said again, I said every rapper has their own technique. Their own niche. But you said Pac raps different from modern rappers, how is that? All rappers have one thing in common, they rap.

 

[Da Best Ever]

Lol fans define lyrical substance? Do the artists THEMSELVES not judge their work and define their work by the very act of creating it, and observing it? They all have their own aspirations and capacities and some are far better at executing their will, Just to give an example, try listening to Aesop rock when you get the chance. You will see how he deliberately uses excessive lyricism to the point that you can't decode his bars unless you are reading his lyrics or have memorized them thoroughly

The artists make the music, they do not judge it other than to say mines is better than yours without going through them going through this whole argument of lyrical substance.

Jay Z in an interview on the Breakfast Club with Charlemange the God and the rest of the cast said when asked about Wayne saying he was better than him simply replied " I can't judge lyrical substance that's for the fans to decide "....

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Is Jay Z not an artist?

 

[Forest]

The artists make the music, they do not judge it other than to say mines is better than yours without going through them going through this whole argument of lyrical substance.

Jay Z in an interview on the Breakfast Club with Charlemange the God and the rest of the cast said when asked about Wayne saying he was better than him simply replied " I can't judge lyrical substance that's for the fans to decide "....

You must be registered for see links

Is Jay Z not an artist?

ANd........... here's an example of a rapper (Mos Def) right here, CLEARLY stating that MF DOOM > WAYNE lyrically, HE said he would even PUT MONEY on a battle vs Lil Wayne. Based off of lyricism.

[video=youtube;zTBIvIDnnv8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTBIvIDnnv8[/video]

 

[Da Best Ever]

A. In a way, Kdot does rap like Wayne because that's one of his biggest influences

B. Read what I said again, I said every rapper has their own technique. Their own niche. But you said Pac raps different from modern rappers, how is that? All rappers have one thing in common, they rap.

llab, you know damn well they don't rap the same, saying they do is just showing ignorance to the truth you deny. Can't believe someone said some stupid shit like that.

I understood you, I just wanted to show how stupid it is to not be specific. I already explained how he raps different in that post. If you want to ignore my post about his different skills then that's just ignorance denying truth.

 

[Da Best Ever]

ANd........... he's an example of a rapper (Mos Def) right here, CLEARLY stating that MF DOOM > WAYNE lyrically, HE said he would even PUT MONEY on a battle vs Lil Wayne. Based off of lyricism.

[video=youtube;zTBIvIDnnv8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTBIvIDnnv8[/video]

My point is not about MF Doom nor Wayne.

My point is about Pac being the best. Mos Def statement is in regards to Wayne saying and thinking he is the best rapper alive, there are many more videos of Mos Def showing him not liking Wayne giving himself that title.

 

[Forest]

What lyrics and bars are composed of, and built from:

Wordplay of any form (metaphors, punchlines, etc.)
Vocab
Subject matter (also the knowledge on the subject)
Storytelling
Execution (can also be linked to flow and charisma)
imagination

What they are not built from:

Fan's opinions
Record sales
Audience Size

 

[NarutoB]

llab, you know damn well they don't rap the same, saying they do is just showing ignorance to the truth you deny. Can't believe someone said some stupid shit like that.

I understood you, I just wanted to show how stupid it is to not be specific. I already explained how he raps different in that post. If you want to ignore my post about his different skills then that's just ignorance denying truth.

This post?

WTF, so everybody raps the same. Kendrick Lamar raps like Wayne then by your logic. If everyone rap was the same then all artist lyrics would be the same substance and hold the same meaning.


By you asking what mad Pac so difference further proves to me you know nothing about his music. You don't get the same feeling from Kendrick Lamar's music that you did when you listened to Pac's music. The fact that people still think he is alive despite logic and facts further shows the impact his music had on people something kendrick lamar and any other rapper cannot get from their fans or fans or rap period, they make a good song for the now, while Pac is immortalized through his music.

You didn't explain anything?? You just said Pac has a different feeling from Kendrick and has some fans that still think he's alive and that Kendrick won't ever have fans like that :| Come on now dude

 

[Da Best Ever]

@ Bold, so do I get props for being logical? Lol lmao.

And my point still stands, fans don't mean shit when determining how good an artist is, so in a way they don't matter. I mean, shit, to the rappers themselves the fans matter because that's how they make money, but why should I care about the dude that will sleep outside a record store just to be the first person to get a new Drake album? I shouldn't, my opinion is my opinion.

And to top it all off, you listed some of the people I really think are overrated lmao. Obama? Really? Lincoln solos

It is logical as I said, I don't think props should be given for saying the right thing.


My point exactly, ignorance denying truth. I didn't say Obama was the best President, I listed him as being overrated by you despite you not saying so before I posted that. Its just pure hate of them by you.

Rappers cannot judge the quality of their music because they are the ones making it and if they say their music is better its would be them lying just to say they are better out of pride. Think of how painters make art, they put it up for display and the actual great art is immortalized throughout history by the people long after that artist is dead and gone.

 

[NarutoB]

It is logical as I said, I don't think props should be given for saying the right thing.


My point exactly, ignorance denying truth. I didn't say Obama was the best President, I listed him as being overrated by you despite you not saying so before I posted that. Its just pure hate of them by you.

Rappers cannot judge the quality of their music because they are the ones making it and if they say their music is better its would be them lying just to say they are better out of pride. Think of how painters make art, they put it up for display and the actual great art is immortalized throughout history by the people long after that artist is dead and gone.

So you're arguing against logic...?

Also I don't hate Pac but I'm not too found of Obama even though I was joking, but I don't see what that has to do with anything.

 

[Da Best Ever]

This post?





You didn't explain anything?? You just said Pac has a different feeling from Kendrick and has some fans that still think he's alive and that Kendrick won't ever have fans like that :| Come on now dude

That's how you interpreted that, not how I meant it. The words I typed are true and hold, but you didn't comprehend the meaning behind those words. My point was to say his music gave a different feel than other artists which is why he is immortalized and hyped and...hated

His lyrics had a meaning behind them, people understood his music because he talked about what was real and actually happening, not to say kendrick or other rappers don't but he had a passion and ferocity in his voice when he rapped that rappers now lack. If you don't understand any of that then a mind is really a terrible thing to waste.

 

[Da Best Ever]

So you're arguing against logic...?

Also I don't hate Pac but I'm not too found of Obama even though I was joking, but I don't see what that has to do with anything.

My point was to list some people you think are overrated and I did. All of those I listed as you thinking they are overrated are at the top of the respected fields, which proves this is all hating from you towards them.


You can say that but I cannot argue otherwise that I am not doing so.

 

[NarutoB]

That's how you interpreted that, not how I meant it. The words I typed are true and hold, but you didn't comprehend the meaning behind those words. My point was to say his music gave a different feel than other artists which is why he is immortalized and hyped and...hated

His lyrics had a meaning behind them, people understood his music because he talked about what was real and actually happening, not to say kendrick or other rappers don't but he had a passion and ferocity in his voice when he rapped that rappers now lack. If you don't understand any of that then a mind is really a terrible thing to waste.

Don't try to be all cryptic and blame me if I don't understand it lmao, that post was pretty straightforward. Also "gave a different feel" isn't a reason as to why he raps different than modern rappers like you said earlier. You say his lyrics had meaning behind them, well so does Lupe's and a shit load of other artists, you say he has passion and ferocity but Kdot has that exact same thing, you're just creating imaginary reasons for why Pac is supposedly better than any rapper today like some sort of elitist and I'm not falling for it. I'm out. Still the reigning champion

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Don't know who Maidana is but I still WIN

 

[Da Best Ever]

What lyrics and bars are composed of, and built from:

Wordplay of any form (metaphors, punchlines, etc.)
Vocab
Subject matter (also the knowledge on the subject)
Storytelling
Execution (can also be linked to flow and charisma)
imagination

What they are not built from:

Fan's opinions
Record sales
Audience Size

You don't need big words to send a message.

You don't have to the vocabulary of Einstein to delivery a message

The rest I can agree upon but even so Pac was the best at those. Also, fans do matter, if no one buys your album then either 2 things can answer this....


1. People don't like lyricist

2. Your lyrics are not that good.