He was addressing your points in order that they came and gave them numbers so that it would be clear what he was responding too as he answered... Do you really think like this? Cause that's the first I've ever heard someone try and twist such a minor thing to their advantage.
Tupac was definitely not the best.
- Thread starter Fodder#3
- Start date
You haven't said anything that makes sense to me... You are arguing that "Quantity" is over quality, and the approval of fans will determine if someone is a lyrical monster? Lyrical substance is based on the fans perception???? wtf??
There are rappers that I am not even a fan of, that I consider to be MONSTERS lyrically..... and..
Do you know how many lyrical monsters there are in the genre of hip hop who have never ever been on a TV? let alone have fans outside of their small niches and crews? C'mon man..
How does a fan's perspective define lyrical substance, it's just their opinion on the music. If you analyze what they are actually saying from a non biased perspective, word for word, bar for bar, seeing how many literary elements they employ, the amount of poetic device then that is a fair way to judge..
I provided my Points and you provided no valid counter argument to anything I said to you in my last post. So if that's your response, we done here..
Last edited:
That was exactly my point. What does he rap like? Last time I checked, rap is rap. Every rapper has their own technique, but what made Pac so different than any rapper today?
Da Best Ever
Banned
Exactly you couldn't counter nor could you say why you think someone is better than Pac because that shit was countered so you digress and revert back to the most logical thing to say in this situation which is " its all opinions ".
The bold stands, if fans don't matter who is there to listen to judge the quality of the music? You didn't want to answer because you knew the answer would make me right. Too Easy
Jordan is overrated, LeBron is overrated, Peyton Manning is overrated, Floyd Mayweather is overrated, Barack Obama is overrated, Jesus is overrated. You have basically just said all that and more are overrated, haters say shit like that, and haters is why they strive to continue to be the best, they thank y'all haters.
Lol fans define lyrical substance? Do the artists THEMSELVES not judge their work and define their work by the very act of creating it, and observing it? They all have their own aspirations and capacities and some are far better at executing their will, Just to give an example, try listening to Aesop rock when you get the chance. You will see how he deliberately uses excessive lyricism to the point that you can't decode his bars unless you are reading his lyrics or have memorized them thoroughly
Da Best Ever
Banned
WTF, so everybody raps the same. Kendrick Lamar raps like Wayne then by your logic. If everyone rap was the same then all artist lyrics would be the same substance and hold the same meaning.
By you asking what mad Pac so difference further proves to me you know nothing about his music. You don't get the same feeling from Kendrick Lamar's music that you did when you listened to Pac's music. The fact that people still think he is alive despite logic and facts further shows the impact his music had on people something kendrick lamar and any other rapper cannot get from their fans or fans or rap period, they make a good song for the now, while Pac is immortalized through his music.
@ Bold, so do I get props for being logical? Lol lmao.
And my point still stands, fans don't mean shit when determining how good an artist is, so in a way they don't matter. I mean, shit, to the rappers themselves the fans matter because that's how they make money, but why should I care about the dude that will sleep outside a record store just to be the first person to get a new Drake album? I shouldn't, my opinion is my opinion.
And to top it all off, you listed some of the people I really think are overrated lmao. Obama? Really? Lincoln solos
Last edited:
A. In a way, Kdot does rap like Wayne because that's one of his biggest influences
B. Read what I said again, I said every rapper has their own technique. Their own niche. But you said Pac raps different from modern rappers, how is that?
All rappers have one thing in common, they rap.Da Best Ever
Banned
The artists make the music, they do not judge it other than to say mines is better than yours without going through them going through this whole argument of lyrical substance.
Jay Z in an interview on the Breakfast Club with Charlemange the God and the rest of the cast said when asked about Wayne saying he was better than him simply replied " I can't judge lyrical substance that's for the fans to decide "....
You must be registered for see links
Is Jay Z not an artist?
ANd........... here's an example of a rapper (Mos Def) right here, CLEARLY stating that MF DOOM > WAYNE lyrically, HE said he would even PUT MONEY on a battle vs Lil Wayne. Based off of lyricism.
[video=youtube;zTBIvIDnnv8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTBIvIDnnv8[/video]
Da Best Ever
Banned
llab, you know damn well they don't rap the same, saying they do is just showing ignorance to the truth you deny. Can't believe someone said some stupid shit like that.A. In a way, Kdot does rap like Wayne because that's one of his biggest influences
B. Read what I said again, I said every rapper has their own technique. Their own niche. But you said Pac raps different from modern rappers, how is that?
I understood you, I just wanted to show how stupid it is to not be specific. I already explained how he raps different in that post. If you want to ignore my post about his different skills then that's just ignorance denying truth.
Da Best Ever
Banned
My point is not about MF Doom nor Wayne.
My point is about Pac being the best. Mos Def statement is in regards to Wayne saying and thinking he is the best rapper alive, there are many more videos of Mos Def showing him not liking Wayne giving himself that title.
What lyrics and bars are composed of, and built from:
Wordplay of any form (metaphors, punchlines, etc.)
Vocab
Subject matter (also the knowledge on the subject)
Storytelling
Execution (can also be linked to flow and charisma)
imagination
What they are not built from:
Fan's opinions
Record sales
Audience Size
Wordplay of any form (metaphors, punchlines, etc.)
Vocab
Subject matter (also the knowledge on the subject)
Storytelling
Execution (can also be linked to flow and charisma)
imagination
What they are not built from:
Fan's opinions
Record sales
Audience Size
Last edited:
This post?
You didn't explain anything?? You just said Pac has a different feeling from Kendrick and has some fans that still think he's alive and that Kendrick won't ever have fans like that :| Come on now dude
Da Best Ever
Banned
It is logical as I said, I don't think props should be given for saying the right thing.
My point exactly, ignorance denying truth. I didn't say Obama was the best President, I listed him as being overrated by you despite you not saying so before I posted that. Its just pure hate of them by you.
Rappers cannot judge the quality of their music because they are the ones making it and if they say their music is better its would be them lying just to say they are better out of pride. Think of how painters make art, they put it up for display and the actual great art is immortalized throughout history by the people long after that artist is dead and gone.
Da Best Ever
Banned
That's how you interpreted that, not how I meant it. The words I typed are true and hold, but you didn't comprehend the meaning behind those words. My point was to say his music gave a different feel than other artists which is why he is immortalized and hyped and...hated
His lyrics had a meaning behind them, people understood his music because he talked about what was real and actually happening, not to say kendrick or other rappers don't but he had a passion and ferocity in his voice when he rapped that rappers now lack. If you don't understand any of that then a mind is really a terrible thing to waste.
Da Best Ever
Banned
My point was to list some people you think are overrated and I did. All of those I listed as you thinking they are overrated are at the top of the respected fields, which proves this is all hating from you towards them.
You can say that but I cannot argue otherwise that I am not doing so.
Don't try to be all cryptic and blame me if I don't understand it lmao, that post was pretty straightforward. Also "gave a different feel" isn't a reason as to why he raps different than modern rappers like you said earlier. You say his lyrics had meaning behind them, well so does Lupe's and a shit load of other artists, you say he has passion and ferocity but Kdot has that exact same thing, you're just creating imaginary reasons for why Pac is supposedly better than any rapper today like some sort of elitist and I'm not falling for it. I'm out. Still the reigning champion
You must be registered for see images
Don't know who Maidana is but I still WIN
Last edited:
Da Best Ever
Banned
You don't need big words to send a message.
You don't have to the vocabulary of Einstein to delivery a message
The rest I can agree upon but even so Pac was the best at those. Also, fans do matter, if no one buys your album then either 2 things can answer this....
1. People don't like lyricist
2. Your lyrics are not that good.