Tsunade is a bad Hokage???

[Black Wolf]

showing to us =/= the character's knowledge.. They have vastly more knowledge on ninja than us..

It doesn't change the fact that most of the Sannin's legendary status stems from hearsay and hype.

Sorry, but "legendary" status determines someone's power. It is gained through being strong. If you ain't strong, you ain't being legendary.. in the ninja world.. sorry but that is how it is.

No, it does not.

Legendary is gained by being present in important battles and living long enough for whatever accomplishment you had to get blown out of proportion. The Sannin got their nickname by losing to Hanzo.

And i already explained Kakashi and Gai.. Kakashi is superior to Gai.. Manga doesn't state them to be equal.. no clue where you got this from. They have been rivals.. but as far as we know their little record of the 99 fights.. is based on small competitions between each other. Not actual fights.

Kakashi is more versatile than Gai. He isn't superior to Gai on the overall power spectrum. The manga implies their equality in numerous ways. Gai immediately introduces himself as Kakashi's superior, and Sasuke immediately realizes that he wasn't kidding.

I also wanna know who called Kakashi a legendary shinobi... i'm interested in this..

Every single opponent that has encountered him immediately recognized him (Zabuza, Kisame, Itachi, Pain, Kakuzu, etc). Kages from other villages immediately recognized him. Hell, Kakuzu knew who he was before even seeing him just based on Kakashi's Raiton usage ("This level of Raiton . . . you must be Kakashi Hatake!"). 4th Raikage recognized Kakashi's technique when Sasuke used it, as did Deidara.

Not sure how you're going to pretend that international recognition and being globally renowned to the extent you have your own moniker =/= legendary in the ninja world.

 

[archbeta]

A bad Hokage means a Hokage that plays his/her role as Hokage badly. Also I've included the mistakes of Tobirama and Hiruzen as the previous Hokages. You should have understand what I meant to be a good or bad Hokage.

No, your OP didn't limit bad to performance. Why aren't we also evaluating philosophy?

 

[mohdzarif]

No, your OP didn't limit bad to performance. Why aren't we also evaluating philosophy?

Any flaws to her philosophy since she became a Hokage?

 

[archbeta]

Any flaws to her philosophy since she became a Hokage?

I didn't say consider her philosophy. I meant philosophy in general. How we define/limit/use/argue/prove good and bad is very shallow in performance.

 

[maniaoqan]

why was Hiruzen caught off-guard with Orochimaru, when he knew his existence???

Why was Minato caught/Hiruzen caught off-guard, while they knew anything could happen during the kyuubitransfer?

Son, she was already prepping for Pain... However, if Pain didn't catch Konoha off-guard.. that would just take away feats from Pain.. the fact he managed to catch a prepped konoha, off-guard is a feat to Nagato's genius.. rofl.

"Bad leadeR".. yea sadly Mei doesn't agree with you there. Same for Jiraiya.. Same for the people who were happy to see her.

Wanna know why? Because she saved dozens of lives by establishing the Medical ninja system.

Sorry bro but you're twisting the facts. Minato and Hiruzen took precautions necessary. No one could anticipate Obito and his Zetsu Network. They tried to do it secretly away from village. Obito managed to get in the village because of Kamui. He literally teleported to the village no one can get prepared to that. But in Nagato's case. Tsunade was aware of him. Yet failed.You're saying she healed people during the invasion. As you said protecting people Hokage's duty she did what she could as a shinobi. But as a leader she didn't done anything about Danzo for past 3 years which lead to weakness of Villages defence. Saying again she is a good medic and shinobi. But a bad hokage.

 

[~Sky~]

Tsunade was a good Hokage. She was up against a huge threat..

Hiruzen's first reign as Hokage was good, he was awful when he came out of retirement when Minato died though.

I'd say Hiruzen's second term as Hokage was the worst.

 

[grizzlyshree]

Tsunade was a good Hokage. She was up against a huge threat..

Hiruzen's first reign as Hokage was good, he was awful when he came out of retirement when Minato died though.

I'd say Hiruzen's second term as Hokage was the worst.

Hiruzen and Tsunades reign were quite good. Tsunade has done what she can according to her abilities. she may fade in front of the first 4 hokages but still she did what she can.

 

[grizzlyshree]

Sorry bro but you're twisting the facts. Minato and Hiruzen took precautions necessary. No one could anticipate Obito and his Zetsu Network. They tried to do it secretly away from village. Obito managed to get in the village because of Kamui. He literally teleported to the village no one can get prepared to that. But in Nagato's case. Tsunade was aware of him. Yet failed.You're saying she healed people during the invasion. As you said protecting people Hokage's duty she did what she could as a shinobi. But as a leader she didn't done anything about Danzo for past 3 years which lead to weakness of Villages defence. Saying again she is a good medic and shinobi. But a bad hokage.

yahu r right. i agree 100%

 

[KingHashirama]

Sorry bro but you're twisting the facts. Minato and Hiruzen took precautions necessary. No one could anticipate Obito and his Zetsu Network. They tried to do it secretly away from village. Obito managed to get in the village because of Kamui. He literally teleported to the village no one can get prepared to that. But in Nagato's case. Tsunade was aware of him. Yet failed.You're saying she healed people during the invasion. As you said protecting people Hokage's duty she did what she could as a shinobi. But as a leader she didn't done anything about Danzo for past 3 years which lead to weakness of Villages defence. Saying again she is a good medic and shinobi. But a bad hokage.

Sorry, but what were the precautions? Doing it in a secret facility??? rofl.. even thought ninjna are specilists in finding out about a secret facility.. nice nice. As I recall Hiruzen himself was busy with his writing. Instead of being there during the birth.. By using the logic you are using on Tsunade, i can call that carelessness.


Nagato literally came out of nowhere. There were no reports of him being sited.. She didn't do anything about Danzo? What was she supposed to do? Considering the fact the 2 Hokages you are trying protect didn't do sh*t about Danzo either.. Hell actually she kept Danzo and the elders in check. Can you tell me of any interference made by Danzo during her reign? In fact it was Danzo's fault Konoha got destroyed. There was a reason she called Naruto back. Do you think she didn't have a plan? rofl. Please get real son.

According to their intel Pain was going to take more than a week.. his arrival was unexpected.. its like if Russia threw nukes at us.. while we know they are potentially dangerous.. are you gonna B*tch and Moan , about the government not knowing?? Because there is no way they could have known about a surprise attack.. Hence why its called a surprise attack. But the funny thing, Tsunade took action immediatly. She already had a plan..But she was betrayed by a man who the other 2 couldn't do anything about. .


Yea well Hiruzen was nothing but a good enma user, and Minato nothing but a good FTG user.. but bad Hokage... Anything else?


Hell Minato didn't even have any effect on the shinobi world prior to being a Hokage either, besides winning the war for Konoha.. that was literally it.

 

[maniaoqan]

Sorry, but what were the precautions? Doing it in a secret facility??? rofl.. even thought ninjna are specilists in finding out about a secret facility.. nice nice. As I recall Hiruzen himself was busy with his writing. Instead of being there during the birth.. By using the logic you are using on Tsunade, i can call that carelessness.


Nagato literally came out of nowhere. There were no reports of him being sited.. She didn't do anything about Danzo? What was she supposed to do? Considering the fact the 2 Hokages you are trying protect didn't do sh*t about Danzo either.. Hell actually she kept Danzo and the elders in check. Can you tell me of any interference made by Danzo during her reign? In fact it was Danzo's fault Konoha got destroyed. There was a reason she called Naruto back. Do you think she didn't have a plan? rofl. Please get real son.

According to their intel Pain was going to take more than a week.. his arrival was unexpected.. its like if Russia threw nukes at us.. while we know they are potentially dangerous.. are you gonna B*tch and Moan , about the government not knowing?? Because there is no way they could have known about a surprise attack.. Hence why its called a surprise attack. But the funny thing, Tsunade took action immediatly. She already had a plan..But she was betrayed by a man who the other 2 couldn't do anything about. .


Yea well Hiruzen was nothing but a good enma user, and Minato nothing but a good FTG user.. but bad Hokage... Anything else?


Hell Minato didn't even have any effect on the shinobi world prior to being a Hokage either, besides winning the war for Konoha.. that was literally it.

You're funny. Acting aggressive doesn't making your points valid.
Doing birth secret was the right thing to do. Hiruzen's presence at birth would be pointless. If he was there he would've died as well. He was hokage and stayed at the village there was no enemy threat at the moment. Only threat was Kyuubi's risk during birth and 4th was there to keep the seal under control. Someone like Obito isn't like Nagato. Nagato rampages he has firepower. Obito comes out of nowhere. There were ANBU jounins on guard. There were no patrols or else to watch Nagato. She knew his abilities mostly. Fukasaku gave her report. Yet she clearly underestimated. Calling Naruto you say ? She had no idea about Naruto's trainings progress. She took her shot.
Tsunade didn't do shit about Danzo. She only yelled at 2 elders. She should've stripped him out of his ranks and authorities long ago. Her bad leadership made Root betray village. If she took care of Danzo before she could've used Root shinobis to defend village.They might fail or not, at least would've decreased the casualties. She ignored Root's existence just like Hiruzen.
And I'm not defending Hiruzen. Hiruzen is the worst Hokage. Tsunade is only better than Hiruzen yet still a bad hokage. Danzo became who he is on Hiruzen's watch.

4th is bad you say. Clearly you're delusional.

And its not relevant but nukes can be detected via satellites and radars so don't give shitty examples. Fap her all you want clearly we can't come to an understanding.

 

[TheEvilOne]

Tsunade didn't do shit about Danzo. She only yelled at 2 elders. She should've stripped him out of his ranks and authorities long ago.

Care to explain why? She had no idea Danzo is going to betray her. She never trusted him, therefore she kept him in check, but she never expected his betrayal.

 

[paratise]

She was better than other hokages.

 

[KingHashirama]

You're funny. Acting aggressive doesn't making your points valid.
Doing birth secret was the right thing to do. Hiruzen's presence at birth would be pointless. If he was there he would've died as well. He was hokage and stayed at the village there was no enemy threat at the moment. Only threat was Kyuubi's risk during birth and 4th was there to keep the seal under control. Someone like Obito isn't like Nagato. Nagato rampages he has firepower. Obito comes out of nowhere. There were ANBU jounins on guard. There were no patrols or else to watch Nagato. She knew his abilities mostly. Fukasaku gave her report. Yet she clearly underestimated. Calling Naruto you say ? She had no idea about Naruto's trainings progress. She took her shot.
Tsunade didn't do shit about Danzo. She only yelled at 2 elders. She should've stripped him out of his ranks and authorities long ago. Her bad leadership made Root betray village. If she took care of Danzo before she could've used Root shinobis to defend village.They might fail or not, at least would've decreased the casualties. She ignored Root's existence just like Hiruzen.
And I'm not defending Hiruzen. Hiruzen is the worst Hokage. Tsunade is only better than Hiruzen yet still a bad hokage. Danzo became who he is on Hiruzen's watch.

4th is bad you say. Clearly you're delusional.

And its not relevant but nukes can be detected via satellites and radars so don't give shitty examples. Fap her all you want clearly we can't come to an understanding.

Becausing making my points = being aggressive.

Smartass if Hiruzen was that afraid he should have been there himself. If Minato was that prepared, he should've had the most elite ninja there.. You are telling me they were scared of something might happen.. knowing that this was the oppertunity many people in the world might have been waiting for... they still went along with just Minato and like 5 or 6 anbu protecting them.. yea okkkk.

Sorry, but surely you never read the Pain arc. They didn't even know where Nagato lived.. how he travels? They hardly had any information on him.. So if i tell you there are aliens.. how are you gonna prepare for them?? Show me.. and tell me.

She underestimated Pain? ARE YOU HIGH BRO?? rofl. Yes she underestimated pain.. and had Naruto go train to be a Sage.. yea nice logic with that.

Also, sadly, Hiruzen gave Danzo too much power.. He wasn't even under the Hokage anymore. However, even with that, she didn't let Danzo participate in her affairs as the Hokage.. like under Hiruzen's reign where it was a daily thing. Wanna know why? Because she didn't give a f*ck about the elders. Unlike the 2 who you are trying to protect in this argument.

Yea If Hiruzen and Minato had taken care of DAnzo... maybe all this crap wouldn't have happened in the first place... Funny that you are accusing Tsunade of not taking care of Danzo yet you aren't even mentioning Minato and Hiruzen's failure..


"Nukes can be detected via statelitte".. sure unless they somehow build non-detectable nukes.. same way pain was non-detectable.. Then what? you are still gonna b*tch and moan about the government not being prepared?

4th isn't bad.. he literally do sh*t except the responsibility of every shinobi in the village.. aka protecting the village.

 

[maniaoqan]

Care to explain why? She had no idea Danzo is going to betray her. She never trusted him, therefore she kept him in check, but she never expected his betrayal.

She knew Danzo is opposing 3rd Hokage's will of fire thing and finding it naive. Even other kages know how sneaky Danzo is. Raikage said he represents the darkness of shinobi world. She was well aware how dangerous Danzo is. She was Hokage for 3 years, she had many strong shinobis on her side. If she was determined she could've got ridden of Danzo with little effort.

Becausing making my points = being aggressive.

Smartass if Hiruzen was that afraid he should have been there himself. If Minato was that prepared, he should've had the most elite ninja there.. You are telling me they were scared of something might happen.. knowing that this was the oppertunity many people in the world might have been waiting for... they still went along with just Minato and like 5 or 6 anbu protecting them.. yea okkkk.

Sorry, but surely you never read the Pain arc. They didn't even know where Nagato lived.. how he travels? They hardly had any information on him.. So if i tell you there are aliens.. how are you gonna prepare for them?? Show me.. and tell me.

She underestimated Pain? ARE YOU HIGH BRO?? rofl. Yes she underestimated pain.. and had Naruto go train to be a Sage.. yea nice logic with that.

Also, sadly, Hiruzen gave Danzo too much power.. He wasn't even under the Hokage anymore. However, even with that, she didn't let Danzo participate in her affairs as the Hokage.. like under Hiruzen's reign where it was a daily thing. Wanna know why? Because she didn't give a f*ck about the elders. Unlike the 2 who you are trying to protect in this argument.

Yea If Hiruzen and Minato had taken care of DAnzo... maybe all this crap wouldn't have happened in the first place... Funny that you are accusing Tsunade of not taking care of Danzo yet you aren't even mentioning Minato and Hiruzen's failure..


"Nukes can be detected via statelitte".. sure unless they somehow build non-detectable nukes.. same way pain was non-detectable.. Then what? you are still gonna b*tch and moan about the government not being prepared?

4th isn't bad.. he literally do sh*t except the responsibility of every shinobi in the village.. aka protecting the village.

Lets go one by one. Since you're too fired up you might not understand my points.

-Minato and Hiruzen. I dont need to explain their difference of knowledge about sealing techs. Minato is superior about sealing so it only makes sense he would be the one to go with Kushina. He left 3rd at the village, entrusting the security to him.
-There were no enemy threat then. Only threat was Kushina's seals weakness. If it were broken in the village it would be disaster so they take her out of the village in secret. It was the most logical move. And of course you'll only have couple ANBU guards. You know what secretly means right ?
-Don't give me Naruto crap. There was no guarentee that he would succeed. A leader must have precautions in case of a plans failure. She only had Naruto. No backup plan. Poor vision.
-Hiruzen is the reason Danzo became who he is. Its Hiruzen's fault. But Tsunade had enough time to solve that problem. She underestimated Danzo's capabilities. Hiruzen was too emotional about his friend, Tsunade was to poor visioned. Minato had no time to deal with Danzo. There was shinobi war he didn't get time to focus on politics. Despite that short time his accomplishments were good.

 

[KingHashirama]

- Even though the third was writing.. what security are you talking about? . Are you saying others weren't capable of protecting? what?

- How were there not enemy threats? Kumo clearly wanted the 9-tails. why would they not attack? Who knows? And also, Minato knows more than Hiruzen about seals? Uh please no..

- Hmm actually there was guaranteed he would succeed.. rofl. And also, she did have precautions.. which was saving the people instead of the village that could be rebuilt.

- Its Minato's fault for being the "hope" yet not doing sh*t....


Only reason why i'm even arguin about Minato and Hiruzen is because you wanna make excuses for those 2.. and yet blame everything on Tsunade.. sorry that ain't how it works mate.

When Minato became Hokage shinobi war was over.. and shinobi war = politics.. what do you mean it didn't give him anytime.. rofl.

 

[maniaoqan]

Its like I'm showing you an apple but you're claiming its a banana. We can't come to terms. Keep fapping.