~So let me try to understand this character Naruto Uzumaki~

[bencoby]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

Still doesn't smile and d ride Naruto, every chance he can get. The only thing that Itachi did was give Naruto advice on what a "true Kage" should do and respect him for thinking for Sasuke as a brother.


There was nothing logical there so how can I counter something logical if it's not logical in the first place?


We're on the same page here.


Is that why you are so predictable?


Naruto is an idiot. Why should I care about what he thinks? He is unrealistic remember?


You can't counter something that's not there.

(1) And when did Itachi start smiling at people at every turn?. Itachi still believed in Naruto and entrusted him with things just like Nagato did.
So again Itachi is a fanboy, a cool one but still a fanboy.

(2) If you say so, am looking at you.

(3) Errrr??????

(4) Errrrt?????

(5) That's not the point. Naruto in this situation has more relevance than you. Go figure.

(6) Whatever you say.

 

[iKaras]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

Thanks for the quality thread. Did enjoy the read.

 

[hixa kuogame]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

The current Obito still committed those crimes in the past is all I'm saying.

The same person, different mindset.

I don't care

.
I don't care if you don't care. You not caring doesn't change anything.

No ones harboring grudges. Naruto is just an unrealistic character, and if we are speaking on real life grudges. I wonder how long you would last if someone killed your parents. You're basically trying to tell me that you would forgive someone after they killed your parents and your friends. Nice to know how naïve and lovey dovey you are as well.

Thanks for watering it down as much as possible.:| you're not even trying to be accurate..
Obito was a kid that wanted to become hokage just like Naruto. He was corrupted by the ninja world and as a result he killed and destroyed. Unlike you, Naruto understands that Obito has changed and that the villainous Obito is completely different from the Obito from 687.
Just speaking hypothetically, lets say Hitler was once a good man that cared for his family and dreamed of becoming fuhrer, but was mentally ravaged by WW1. He goes on and wreaks havok in WW2 but then later he realizes his actions were terrible and goes on to help save the world in WW3 of course his sins aren't forgiven, but he's certainly not the same man from WW2. Naruheinz (the aspiring german fuhrer) who has repeatedly preached about stopping the cycle of hatred being kindhearted and nice will at least somewhat forgive hitler. He umderstands . Hitler and recognizes his struggle. He's not just looking at the surface.

What I'm saying is it's not easy for Naruto to forgive Obito, but it's even harder for him of all people to persecute him.

"something like that"? You probably couldn't even comprehend the op given your tone of a matter "something like that"

I said "Something like that" because I barely read this shit thread, not to mention the shit grammar, so no, I guess I wouldn't fully comprehend his post.

No ones trying to tell Naruto to become hateful. We all know his character and his personality.
But trying to defend all of his decisions just because you like Naruto is rather ignorant.
I like Sasuke and I didn't like the fact that he wanted to become Hokage.

I'm stating why I disagree, not such much defending Naruto.

You really are saying that Naruto should change his character because you think it's best for him to remain vindictive towards Obito rather than be the forgiving person that he has always been.
I love how this is just singling out specifically the recent case between Naruto and Obito as if the same thing hasn't been happening since the beginning. Naruto forgave Haku who at the time "killed" Sasuke. He forgave Neji after he beat the shit out of Hinata. He forgave Gaara after he took countless lives, attacked Sakura, Sasuke, plotted against the leaf village, and almost ended Lee's ninja career. He forgave Nagato the murderer of his teacher, and he forgave Kurama who made his life miserable and killed his parents.

Sometimes you need to see the flaws in the characters that you like or love and stop being so simpleminded.

It's easy to call someone simple minded when they don't agree.

Just what I'd expect from an ignorant indecisive Naruto fanboy. Keep up the rage.

I'm not a Naruto fanboy and I'm not raging...

 

[lanakui8]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

First of all, it doesn't matter if Naruto changed obito from all the mistakes he's has done in the past because you can't forgive them that easily in such a short amount of time, and we reader look at the amount content in this arc from when he just Fought Obito to when Obito got Tnj to his sacrifical death. What we look at is that It totally condensed the time in this 1 arc. This tnj to Nagato was nothing like Obito. Naruto was still mad but he gave so much respect for nagato , not because he's a pupil of jiraiya but he also restored the whole villager, and he was destined to stop the cycle of hatred even though Naruto doesnt like it, but this is a reasonable to forgive. For Obito, there's no reason to get carried away just to show your over emotional just because "Naruto was the chosen Savior" doesn't give the right to excuse from the past Obito committed. We're talking this jurist law system. He still should not be admired for the things that Obito did to the people. It's okay to show respect for Obito death and just because " Obito changed the way he used to be like Naruto" but like I said Naruto is being over sentimental and that shows his unrealistic traits. Surely if Naruto had any respect for himself and other people, he would not be admiring someone who caused him pain just because of a title of Hokage, but no, I guess since Naruto shares the same dream as this criminal then it's all ok.

Can't you see that it's just your own moral subjective feelings of 'what is good enough to be forgiven' that you are all basing this on? Who's to say that what Nagato did was 'good enough to warrant his forgiveness'? If Naruto killed a person, but saved a thousand people, does that mean Naruto should be forgiven? If so, by who's authority? It's all just subjective. You're just arbitrarily weighing the crimes obito did by your own gut feelings. So if just because Naruto doesn't have the same 'gut feeling' as you do when he decides to forgive someone doesn't somehow make what he's doing wrong. It's the same thing with when you say 'what is reasonable to forgive'. What is that even based on? Is it based on what most people would believe is forgivable? Why should the majority's gut feeling be the standard for what is right or wrong? By that logic, the Civil rights movement should have never happened, and the majority suppressing the minority should be celebrated. By that logic, if the majority of people liked naruto as a character, then you are wrong for disliking naruto as a character.

Next, Naruto has every right to forgive Obito on a personal level. I have no idea where you people got the idea that Naruto choosing to forgive Obito is suppose to mean that EVERYONE has forgiven Obito. Naruto can decide who he wants to forgive. How has Naruto excused Obito from the past he's lived? ARe you arguing that had Obito survived the war, Naruto would have made it mandatory that Obito be completely free of punishment? If not, then Naruto either doesn't have the authority to aleviate Obito from punishment or still believes that Obito should be punished. Naruto simply admiring who Obito is doesn't in anyway mean that Naruto believes Obito should get out of jail free or shouldn't have to pay for what he did in the past.

Why in the world does Naruto choosing to admire the Obito who was willing to die for the entire shinobi alliance and paid ultimate price for naruto = he doesn't have any respect for himself or his friends? You're literally just asserting this without providing any reasons to believe such is true. And then you've just devolved into the thing that I literally stated and proved is false: that Naruto admires obito just because Obito wanted to be hokage.

You're literally just ignoring what i've typed about how Naruto admires the Obito who died for him, and not the Obito who decided to start this war, asserting your own subjective moral taste as the moral standard for what is right and wrong, and asserting things without providing any reasoning for them.

Second of all, you're aware that all the Konoha11 and every shinobi still does not forgive Sasuke and or Obito. If Naruto comrades on his arm saw Naruto forgivness to Obito, they would be mad at Naruto for being over passionate at Obito which the way Naruto portrays negate all the deaths and consider them as "Cool". You know when shit hit the Nail on Naruto when someone on his comrade dies yet in the end he always tends to forgets them as he treated them as fodders and being way too passionate about these criminals. It's as Itachi explained, when you're more powerful, you start to forget all your friends and become more arragonace which clings to your ego. You said that Naruto getting himself fallen into dark ness will render naruto a hypocrite, I agree but he has to defeat the enemies regardless without showing any sign of pity to the enemy, look at what he did to pain, he shows his determination to stop Nagato but he respected him in the end when Nagato use rinnetensie. So the least I could expect Naruto, is to show respect to Obito death without going overboard.

So waht if the K11 and every shinobi doesn't forgive Sasuke and Obito? So what if his comrades get mad at him for forgiving Obito? There are tons of times when people get pissed when others make the tough, but right decision. Other than that the bolded has been answered over and over: the Obito naruto thinks is cool is not the same one who did all that stuff. Naruto never said or implied that the acts Obito did in the past have been negated, if you got that from naruto simply thinking the current Obito is cool, that's your problem.

I don't understand where you get the idea that Naruto has forgotten about his fallen comrades. The very fact that Naruto has gone out of his way to save Sakura, Kakashi and Obito despite Sasuke always edging him on to just forget about them completely thrashes your argument about Naruto forgetting his comrades because he got more power.

Why does Naruto have to defeat his enemies without showing any sign of pity? No one insulted Nagato right after Nagato used rinne tensei to revive the entire village, and the naruto back then was the one who had just learned the concept of forgiving the enemy for the sake of ending the cycle of hatred.

I don't think anyone could relate someone like Naruto who can forgive a mass murderer even your ideal is for peace. Any ideology you have, or you support, automatically makes it a product of what your self covets. It means whatever you are doing it is to satisfy the self.

Why don't you think anyone can relate to Naruto? How long have you lived on earth? Have you seen the best the human race has to offer? have you walked in similar shoes to naruto?

The child of Prophecy does effect the theme of Naruto. It was said that the prophesied was correct all along even knew before Naruto was born and even it's a 50/50 chance, Naruto will still be the chosen one because he's the main character and he will always be the prophesied. . Neji pointed out that you can't change destiny, destiny is how you're born. It's all about Genius vs Hardwork. Naruto is all about the symbol of hardwork. Naruto is trying to attempt to prove Neji that you can change destiny. However when he was the chosen savior of the world, this contradicts his theme.

What in the world? Of course Naruto's going to be the child of prophecy since he's the main character of the manga. That's like saying Naruto did everything because he's the main character of this manga and kishi gave him the ability to do them, you're just stating it has nothing to do with an in-universe argument. Neji asserted that you can't change destiny, Naruto is absolutely not the symbol of hardwork, he's he symbol of fighting for your comrades. Neji vs Lee was genius vs hardwork. And unless you believe that Naruto could have just sat on his butt or committed suicide in chapter 1 and would have still fulfilled the CoP, neji's statement is easily falsified.

KCM and BM doesn't make his power with by going all the trouble of befriended Kurama, because in the end they're not the same entity, Naruto had to rely on using the fox power to master his skills. His training wasn't hard since he recieved his help from Minato, his mother, and the eight tails ox and even Yamato stop ninetails from rampaging. So in the end, Naruto had been taking lots of shortcuts with having the advantage to change Kurama.

So what if they aren't the same entity? You asserted that Naruto didn't work or train for his powers, Naruto did have to work for BM and KCM, being from a different entity means nothing. Who said that Naruto didn't have help with him gaining those modes? That's obviously part of Naruto's theme: not doing everything on your own. And if you want to nitpick, everyone had help with getting to where they are, so I don't see why any of that stuff has anything to do with Naruto not working hard to achieve his new powerups.

 

[bencoby]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

So you r saying that Naruto is respecting Obito because he also wanted to become hokage and held the position in high esteem?

Unfortunately or fortunately if you reread the whole thing and take the whole context into consideration, yes that's exactly what it looks like.

And there are many other obvious reasons that you already known of and they are just minor compared to above.

That's exactly what he's saying.

Silly right?

No surprise there at you opinion, because people like you only choose to read parts of the manga that serves your purpose and not the whole thing.

 

[Lana Del Taka]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

Can't you see that it's just your own moral subjective feelings of 'what is good enough to be forgiven' that you are all basing this on? Who's to say that what Nagato did was 'good enough to warrant his forgiveness'? If Naruto killed a person, but saved a thousand people, does that mean Naruto should be forgiven? If so, by who's authority? It's all just subjective. You're just arbitrarily weighing the crimes obito did by your own gut feelings. So if just because Naruto doesn't have the same 'gut feeling' as you do when he decides to forgive someone doesn't somehow make what he's doing wrong. It's the same thing with when you say 'what is reasonable to forgive'. What is that even based on? Is it based on what most people would believe is forgivable? Why should the majority's gut feeling be the standard for what is right or wrong? By that logic, the Civil rights movement should have never happened, and the majority suppressing the minority should be celebrated. By that logic, if the majority of people liked naruto as a character, then you are wrong for disliking naruto as a character.

Next, Naruto has every right to forgive Obito on a personal level. I have no idea where you people got the idea that Naruto choosing to forgive Obito is suppose to mean that EVERYONE has forgiven Obito. Naruto can decide who he wants to forgive. How has Naruto excused Obito from the past he's lived? ARe you arguing that had Obito survived the war, Naruto would have made it mandatory that Obito be completely free of punishment? If not, then Naruto either doesn't have the authority to aleviate Obito from punishment or still believes that Obito should be punished. Naruto simply admiring who Obito is doesn't in anyway mean that Naruto believes Obito should get out of jail free or shouldn't have to pay for what he did in the past.

Why in the world does Naruto choosing to admire the Obito who was willing to die for the entire shinobi alliance and paid ultimate price for naruto = he doesn't have any respect for himself or his friends? You're literally just asserting this without providing any reasons to believe such is true. And then you've just devolved into the thing that I literally stated and proved is false: that Naruto admires obito just because Obito wanted to be hokage.

You're literally just ignoring what i've typed about how Naruto admires the Obito who died for him, and not the Obito who decided to start this war, asserting your own subjective moral taste as the moral standard for what is right and wrong, and asserting things without providing any reasoning for them.


So waht if the K11 and every shinobi doesn't forgive Sasuke and Obito? So what if his comrades get mad at him for forgiving Obito? There are tons of times when people get pissed when others make the tough, but right decision. Other than that the bolded has been answered over and over: the Obito naruto thinks is cool is not the same one who did all that stuff. Naruto never said or implied that the acts Obito did in the past have been negated, if you got that from naruto simply thinking the current Obito is cool, that's your problem.

I don't understand where you get the idea that Naruto has forgotten about his fallen comrades. The very fact that Naruto has gone out of his way to save Sakura, Kakashi and Obito despite Sasuke always edging him on to just forget about them completely thrashes your argument about Naruto forgetting his comrades because he got more power.

Why does Naruto have to defeat his enemies without showing any sign of pity? No one insulted Nagato right after Nagato used rinne tensei to revive the entire village, and the naruto back then was the one who had just learned the concept of forgiving the enemy for the sake of ending the cycle of hatred.


Why don't you think anyone can relate to Naruto? How long have you lived on earth? Have you seen the best the human race has to offer? have you walked in similar shoes to naruto?


What in the world? Of course Naruto's going to be the child of prophecy since he's the main character of the manga. That's like saying Naruto did everything because he's the main character of this manga and kishi gave him the ability to do them, you're just stating it has nothing to do with an in-universe argument. Neji asserted that you can't change destiny, Naruto is absolutely not the symbol of hardwork, he's he symbol of fighting for your comrades. Neji vs Lee was genius vs hardwork. And unless you believe that Naruto could have just sat on his butt or committed suicide in chapter 1 and would have still fulfilled the CoP, neji's statement is easily falsified.


So what if they aren't the same entity? You asserted that Naruto didn't work or train for his powers, Naruto did have to work for BM and KCM, being from a different entity means nothing. Who said that Naruto didn't have help with him gaining those modes? That's obviously part of Naruto's theme: not doing everything on your own. And if you want to nitpick, everyone had help with getting to where they are, so I don't see why any of that stuff has anything to do with Naruto not working hard to achieve his new powerups.

ain't nobody got time to reply to that.

 

[ANiMUS]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

Unfortunately or fortunately if you reread the whole thing and take the whole context into consideration, yes that's exactly what it looks like.

And there are many other obvious reasons that you already known of and they are just minor compared to above.


No surprise there at you opinion, because people like you only choose to read parts of the manga that serves your purpose and not the whole thing.

that actually sounds even more deplorable than my interpretation

 

[iNotorious]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

Can't you see that it's just your own moral subjective feelings of 'what is good enough to be forgiven' that you are all basing this on? Who's to say that what Nagato did was 'good enough to warrant his forgiveness'? If Naruto killed a person, but saved a thousand people, does that mean Naruto should be forgiven? If so, by who's authority? It's all just subjective. You're just arbitrarily weighing the crimes obito did by your own gut feelings. So if just because Naruto doesn't have the same 'gut feeling' as you do when he decides to forgive someone doesn't somehow make what he's doing wrong. It's the same thing with when you say 'what is reasonable to forgive'. What is that even based on? Is it based on what most people would believe is forgivable? Why should the majority's gut feeling be the standard for what is right or wrong? By that logic, the Civil rights movement should have never happened, and the majority suppressing the minority should be celebrated. By that logic, if the majority of people liked naruto as a character, then you are wrong for disliking naruto as a character.

Next, Naruto has every right to forgive Obito on a personal level. I have no idea where you people got the idea that Naruto choosing to forgive Obito is suppose to mean that EVERYONE has forgiven Obito. Naruto can decide who he wants to forgive. How has Naruto excused Obito from the past he's lived? ARe you arguing that had Obito survived the war, Naruto would have made it mandatory that Obito be completely free of punishment? If not, then Naruto either doesn't have the authority to aleviate Obito from punishment or still believes that Obito should be punished. Naruto simply admiring who Obito is doesn't in anyway mean that Naruto believes Obito should get out of jail free or shouldn't have to pay for what he did in the past.

Why in the world does Naruto choosing to admire the Obito who was willing to die for the entire shinobi alliance and paid ultimate price for naruto = he doesn't have any respect for himself or his friends? You're literally just asserting this without providing any reasons to believe such is true. And then you've just devolved into the thing that I literally stated and proved is false: that Naruto admires obito just because Obito wanted to be hokage.

You're literally just ignoring what i've typed about how Naruto admires the Obito who died for him, and not the Obito who decided to start this war, asserting your own subjective moral taste as the moral standard for what is right and wrong, and asserting things without providing any reasoning for them.


So waht if the K11 and every shinobi doesn't forgive Sasuke and Obito? So what if his comrades get mad at him for forgiving Obito? There are tons of times when people get pissed when others make the tough, but right decision. Other than that the bolded has been answered over and over: the Obito naruto thinks is cool is not the same one who did all that stuff. Naruto never said or implied that the acts Obito did in the past have been negated, if you got that from naruto simply thinking the current Obito is cool, that's your problem.

I don't understand where you get the idea that Naruto has forgotten about his fallen comrades. The very fact that Naruto has gone out of his way to save Sakura, Kakashi and Obito despite Sasuke always edging him on to just forget about them completely thrashes your argument about Naruto forgetting his comrades because he got more power.

Why does Naruto have to defeat his enemies without showing any sign of pity? No one insulted Nagato right after Nagato used rinne tensei to revive the entire village, and the naruto back then was the one who had just learned the concept of forgiving the enemy for the sake of ending the cycle of hatred.


Why don't you think anyone can relate to Naruto? How long have you lived on earth? Have you seen the best the human race has to offer? have you walked in similar shoes to naruto?


What in the world? Of course Naruto's going to be the child of prophecy since he's the main character of the manga. That's like saying Naruto did everything because he's the main character of this manga and kishi gave him the ability to do them, you're just stating it has nothing to do with an in-universe argument. Neji asserted that you can't change destiny, Naruto is absolutely not the symbol of hardwork, he's he symbol of fighting for your comrades. Neji vs Lee was genius vs hardwork. And unless you believe that Naruto could have just sat on his butt or committed suicide in chapter 1 and would have still fulfilled the CoP, neji's statement is easily falsified.


So what if they aren't the same entity? You asserted that Naruto didn't work or train for his powers, Naruto did have to work for BM and KCM, being from a different entity means nothing. Who said that Naruto didn't have help with him gaining those modes? That's obviously part of Naruto's theme: not doing everything on your own. And if you want to nitpick, everyone had help with getting to where they are, so I don't see why any of that stuff has anything to do with Naruto not working hard to achieve his new powerups.

Dam just dam i agree

You must be registered for see images

 

[Conspirator.]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

The problem with this series(with regards to side characters in general) is the manga's name. The fact that the main character is also the name of the series, means it becomes almost impossible for side characters in general to be developed. As for the rest of it, I agree mostly. Naruto's "friendship" with Sasuke is unrealistic and somewhat sickening, as is the hypocrisy with the whole destiny stuff. +rep

 

[bencoby]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

that actually sounds even more deplorable than my interpretation

Oh really and can I know why because am basing all my thoughts on manga facts and its a pity i can't post scans.

 

[bencoby]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

Can't you see that it's just your own moral subjective feelings of 'what is good enough to be forgiven' that you are all basing this on? Who's to say that what Nagato did was 'good enough to warrant his forgiveness'? If Naruto killed a person, but saved a thousand people, does that mean Naruto should be forgiven? If so, by who's authority? It's all just subjective. You're just arbitrarily weighing the crimes obito did by your own gut feelings. So if just because Naruto doesn't have the same 'gut feeling' as you do when he decides to forgive someone doesn't somehow make what he's doing wrong. It's the same thing with when you say 'what is reasonable to forgive'. What is that even based on? Is it based on what most people would believe is forgivable? Why should the majority's gut feeling be the standard for what is right or wrong? By that logic, the Civil rights movement should have never happened, and the majority suppressing the minority should be celebrated. By that logic, if the majority of people liked naruto as a character, then you are wrong for disliking naruto as a character.

Next, Naruto has every right to forgive Obito on a personal level. I have no idea where you people got the idea that Naruto choosing to forgive Obito is suppose to mean that EVERYONE has forgiven Obito. Naruto can decide who he wants to forgive. How has Naruto excused Obito from the past he's lived? ARe you arguing that had Obito survived the war, Naruto would have made it mandatory that Obito be completely free of punishment? If not, then Naruto either doesn't have the authority to aleviate Obito from punishment or still believes that Obito should be punished. Naruto simply admiring who Obito is doesn't in anyway mean that Naruto believes Obito should get out of jail free or shouldn't have to pay for what he did in the past.

Why in the world does Naruto choosing to admire the Obito who was willing to die for the entire shinobi alliance and paid ultimate price for naruto = he doesn't have any respect for himself or his friends? You're literally just asserting this without providing any reasons to believe such is true. And then you've just devolved into the thing that I literally stated and proved is false: that Naruto admires obito just because Obito wanted to be hokage.

You're literally just ignoring what i've typed about how Naruto admires the Obito who died for him, and not the Obito who decided to start this war, asserting your own subjective moral taste as the moral standard for what is right and wrong, and asserting things without providing any reasoning for them.


So waht if the K11 and every shinobi doesn't forgive Sasuke and Obito? So what if his comrades get mad at him for forgiving Obito? There are tons of times when people get pissed when others make the tough, but right decision. Other than that the bolded has been answered over and over: the Obito naruto thinks is cool is not the same one who did all that stuff. Naruto never said or implied that the acts Obito did in the past have been negated, if you got that from naruto simply thinking the current Obito is cool, that's your problem.

I don't understand where you get the idea that Naruto has forgotten about his fallen comrades. The very fact that Naruto has gone out of his way to save Sakura, Kakashi and Obito despite Sasuke always edging him on to just forget about them completely thrashes your argument about Naruto forgetting his comrades because he got more power.

Why does Naruto have to defeat his enemies without showing any sign of pity? No one insulted Nagato right after Nagato used rinne tensei to revive the entire village, and the naruto back then was the one who had just learned the concept of forgiving the enemy for the sake of ending the cycle of hatred.


Why don't you think anyone can relate to Naruto? How long have you lived on earth? Have you seen the best the human race has to offer? have you walked in similar shoes to naruto?


What in the world? Of course Naruto's going to be the child of prophecy since he's the main character of the manga. That's like saying Naruto did everything because he's the main character of this manga and kishi gave him the ability to do them, you're just stating it has nothing to do with an in-universe argument. Neji asserted that you can't change destiny, Naruto is absolutely not the symbol of hardwork, he's he symbol of fighting for your comrades. Neji vs Lee was genius vs hardwork. And unless you believe that Naruto could have just sat on his butt or committed suicide in chapter 1 and would have still fulfilled the CoP, neji's statement is easily falsified.


So what if they aren't the same entity? You asserted that Naruto didn't work or train for his powers, Naruto did have to work for BM and KCM, being from a different entity means nothing. Who said that Naruto didn't have help with him gaining those modes? That's obviously part of Naruto's theme: not doing everything on your own. And if you want to nitpick, everyone had help with getting to where they are, so I don't see why any of that stuff has anything to do with Naruto not working hard to achieve his new powerups.

I agree, but unfortunately some fanboys won't read and even those who do skim through a few will still criticize it.

I on the other hand thinks that all the things Obito did for Naruto and the SA are minor in Narutos eys to the dream they shared HOKAGE.

And that's why he respects Obito.

 

[ANiMUS]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

Oh really and can I know why because am basing all my thoughts on manga facts and its a pity i can't post scans.

Because that means that Naruto is overlooking what Obito has done and simply praising him because he shared Naruto's dream.

Considering what has happened that is really jerkish, but from what I had posted. That Naruto was looking past Obito's bad actions and stating that the real Obito, the Obito that's wanted to be hokage was someone praise worthy.

My only gripe was that putting someone who has hurt so many of your friend's loved ones on a pedestal is very offensive even if you only r looking at the good in Obito the proper thing would have been to stand up for what Obito stood for not Obito himself that way he wouldn't sidestepping Obito's wrong doings, but praising Obito the way that Naruto did it was exactly that (sidestepping)

 

[kimb]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

I agree, but unfortunately some fanboys won't read and even those who do skim through a few will still criticize it.

I on the other hand thinks that all the things Obito did for Naruto and the SA are minor to the dream they shared HOKAGE.

And that's why he respects Obito.

Naruto respected Nagato. Naruto called Obito, "cool".

 

[Dannie]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

The same person, different mindset.

Same person who still committed those crimes. Don't know why you're trying to cover this up.

I don't care if you don't care. You not caring doesn't change anything.

Good for you. Your irrelevant opinion about Obito redeeming his actions means more than nothing to me.

Thanks for watering it down as much as possible.

Not that you will get it.

Obito was a kid that wanted to become hokage just like Naruto.

Yes, because the title of Hokage is so very important that it completely negates the actions of everything, be it good or bad.

He was corrupted by the ninja world and as a result he killed and destroyed.

Kakashi was also influenced by the ninja world, meaning horrible things has also happened to him too, but unlike Obito, Kakashi actually had some sense and self respect.
He killed and destroyed many people because of one incident, so your justification for him is redundant and boring.

Unlike you, Naruto understands that Obito has changed and that the villainous is completely different from the Obito from 687.

And that's why Naruto's mindset is fcked up as of today.

> You destroyed my village by summoning the Kyubi and killing innocent people but it's ok, as long as you change your ways and tell me that you really just wanted to become hokage.

> You summoned the Kyubi and the end result killed my parents but it's ok, as long as you change your ways and tell me that you just wanted to become Hokage.

> You summoned the Kyubi, killed my parents and resulted in my parents last act of desperation of sealing a beast inside of me, causing my loneliness and fellow village members to despise me, but it's ok, as long as you change your ways and tell me that you wanted to become hokage.

> You created and started an organization that consisted of 10+ s-ranked criminals that did heinous acts against the Shinobi world and their village that hunt Bijuu and collect chakra for their won twisted plans, but it's ok, as long as you change your ways and tell me that you wanted to become hokage.

> You started a war to create a world under a giant Genjutsu swapped of illusions to assume that everyone will be happy under your command, but it's ok, as long as you change your ways and tell me that you wanted to become hokage

> You killed thousands of ninja, including one of your close friends and even played with many ninja's emotions, but it's ok, as long as you change your ways and tell me that you wanted to become hokage.
Glad to know that the title of Hokage is way more important than all of these things that have happened.

Just speaking hypothetically, lets say Hitler was once a good man that cared for his family and dreamed of becoming fuhrer, but was mentally ravaged by WW1. He goes on and wreaks havok in WW2 but then later he realizes his actions were terrible and goes on to help save the world in WW3 of course his sins arenr't forgiven, but he's certainly not the same man from WW2. Naruheinz (the aspiring german fuhrer) who has repeatedly preached about stopping the cycle of hatred being kindhearted and nice will at least somewhat forgive hitler.

Hitler and Obito are much alike, wouldn't you say? Lol

What I'm saying is it's not easy for Naruto to forgive Obito, but it's even harder for him of all people to persecute him.

He admired him. Of course it's easy for him to forgive. After all, he "did just want to become hokage, so he was nothing more than badass".

Let's speak for all those weak fodder shinobi who lost their lives over Obito. They wouldn't find it hard to persecute him. Hell, even if I were one of those weak dead fodders, I wouldn't hesitate for a moment to call upon his death, but Naruto is different. He forgives anyone no matter what they cause him, and that's what makes him unrealistic, naïve and completely dumb.

I said "Something like that" because I barely read this shit thread,

It's only a shit thread because you can't fathom the flaws in this character so you dismiss it and call it shitty. It only shows your own ignorance.

not to mention the shit grammar,

Another stupid argument used by morons who can't counter. They attack the grammar (not that it was horrible or bad) because that is all they can comment and counter to.
You must not have been in Howling Fox's threads or even UZMAKIMADARA'S threads, but considering that they are huge Naruto fappers, it really wouldn't surprise me that you would like their grammar.

so no, I guess I wouldn't fully comprehend his post.

Grammar aside, you are too simpleminded to understand.

I'm stating why I disagree, not such much defend Naruto.

Another desperate counter used by secret agents who are secretly Naruto fans but try to deny it. Dude, I really don't care if you're a fan of his or not. Just stop lying and say so.

You really are saying that Naruto should change his character because you think it's best for him to remain vindictive towards Obito rather than be the forgiving person that he has always been.

It's been like an hour since he was trying to tear his head off and now since Obito announced that he always wanted to become Hokage, he his crying and falling head over heels for this guy. It's not that he forgave him, more so, the time, and the reaction of him doing it. Naruto last chapter looked like a complete idiot.

I love how this is just singling out specifically the recent case between Naruto and Obito as if the same thing hasn't been happening since the beginning.

No one in the past has done deeds that are worse than Obito's.

Naruto forgave Haku who at the time "killed" Sasuke. He forgave Neji after he beat the shit out of Hinata. He forgave Gaara after he took countless lives, attacked Sakura, Sasuke, plotted against the leaf village, and almost ended Lee's ninja career. He forgave Nagato the murderer of his teacher, and he forgave Kurama who made his life miserable and killed his parents.

Like I said and have already explained above, these guys don't compare to Obito.

It's easy to call someone simple minded when they don't agree.

Your whole post reeks of simpleminded trash.

I'm not a Naruto fanboy and I'm not raging...

Naruto fanboy...Obito fanboy... I don't care, but you're a fanboy of one of these clowns. That's for sure.

 

[Kratoss]

I'm honestly beginning to think that this manga is too deep for some people...

:|

 

[bencoby]

Because that means that Naruto is overlooking what Obito has done and simply praising him because he shared Naruto's dream.

Considering what has happened that is really jerkish, but from what I had posted. That Naruto was looking past Obito's bad actions and stating that the real Obito, the Obito that's wanted to be hokage was someone praise worthy.

My only gripe was that putting someone who has hurt so many of your friend's loved ones on a pedestal is very offensive even if you only r looking at the good in Obito the proper thing would have been to stand up for what Obito stood for not Obito himself that way he wouldn't sidestepping Obito's wrong doings, but praising Obito the way that Naruto did it was exactly that (sidestepping)

Like I said earlier on in the thread the whole praise was to that Hokage position and not to Obito himself. You can go back and look through the thread that's what i have been talking about all along.

Like you said he should have praised what he stood for and that's exactly what Naruto did. Thus praising the Hokage position.

Naruto respected Nagato. Naruto called Obito, "cool".

You should remember that Naruto and Nagato never shared a dream so sensitive to Naruto.

 

[InfamousB]

Dat Naruto Logic......

And why he is the most unrealistic fictional character in any anime thus far, which why most of his fans are probably teenage boys haha.....

You have a guy who; directly and indirectly murdered my family, started a coup that caused the extinction of his own clan, almost destroyed my village on multiple occasions, hunted and killed multiple people who were vessels of tailed beasts, resurrected the dead to start a war with the entire shinobi world, brought back the guy who first concocted the moon's eye plan and is now the incarnation of the apparent origin of evil, resurrected the ten tails, and killed "more" my friends. But yet I think obito is a pretty cool guy, he wants to become hokage and isn't afraid of anything."

Despite all of this, take my hand and join my side as Obito of the HIDDEN LEAF VILLAGE!!!!! Oh, and wait, I'm also going to shed a couple of tears for you, cause I despite everything you've done, In the end, I just feel so damn bad for you.

But wait, guess who else wanted to be hokage? Danzo, pretty dope guy! Orochimaru too, ay lets get it! Dat naruto.... got to love him? BELIEVE IT !!!!

-Sincerely, Uzamaki Naruto !!!!!!

Btw, Obito is boss, no hate on obito! Just kishi picked the worse character in the history of anime to be the lead of an entire series, just my opinion, what do you guys think?

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

Re: Naruto (Character) Hate is Justified

Can't you see that it's just your own moral subjective feelings of 'what is good enough to be forgiven' that you are all basing this on? Who's to say that what Nagato did was 'good enough to warrant his forgiveness'? If Naruto killed a person, but saved a thousand people, does that mean Naruto should be forgiven? If so, by who's authority? It's all just subjective. You're just arbitrarily weighing the crimes obito did by your own gut feelings. So if just because Naruto doesn't have the same 'gut feeling' as you do when he decides to forgive someone doesn't somehow make what he's doing wrong. It's the same thing with when you say 'what is reasonable to forgive'. What is that even based on? Is it based on what most people would believe is forgivable? Why should the majority's gut feeling be the standard for what is right or wrong? By that logic, the Civil rights movement should have never happened, and the majority suppressing the minority should be celebrated. By that logic, if the majority of people liked naruto as a character, then you are wrong for disliking naruto as a character.

Next, Naruto has every right to forgive Obito on a personal level. I have no idea where you people got the idea that Naruto choosing to forgive Obito is suppose to mean that EVERYONE has forgiven Obito. Naruto can decide who he wants to forgive. How has Naruto excused Obito from the past he's lived? ARe you arguing that had Obito survived the war, Naruto would have made it mandatory that Obito be completely free of punishment? If not, then Naruto either doesn't have the authority to aleviate Obito from punishment or still believes that Obito should be punished. Naruto simply admiring who Obito is doesn't in anyway mean that Naruto believes Obito should get out of jail free or shouldn't have to pay for what he did in the past.

Why in the world does Naruto choosing to admire the Obito who was willing to die for the entire shinobi alliance and paid ultimate price for naruto = he doesn't have any respect for himself or his friends? You're literally just asserting this without providing any reasons to believe such is true. And then you've just devolved into the thing that I literally stated and proved is false: that Naruto admires obito just because Obito wanted to be hokage.

You're literally just ignoring what i've typed about how Naruto admires the Obito who died for him, and not the Obito who decided to start this war, asserting your own subjective moral taste as the moral standard for what is right and wrong, and asserting things without providing any reasoning for them.


So waht if the K11 and every shinobi doesn't forgive Sasuke and Obito? So what if his comrades get mad at him for forgiving Obito? There are tons of times when people get pissed when others make the tough, but right decision. Other than that the bolded has been answered over and over: the Obito naruto thinks is cool is not the same one who did all that stuff. Naruto never said or implied that the acts Obito did in the past have been negated, if you got that from naruto simply thinking the current Obito is cool, that's your problem.

I don't understand where you get the idea that Naruto has forgotten about his fallen comrades. The very fact that Naruto has gone out of his way to save Sakura, Kakashi and Obito despite Sasuke always edging him on to just forget about them completely thrashes your argument about Naruto forgetting his comrades because he got more power.

Why does Naruto have to defeat his enemies without showing any sign of pity? No one insulted Nagato right after Nagato used rinne tensei to revive the entire village, and the naruto back then was the one who had just learned the concept of forgiving the enemy for the sake of ending the cycle of hatred.


Why don't you think anyone can relate to Naruto? How long have you lived on earth? Have you seen the best the human race has to offer? have you walked in similar shoes to naruto?


What in the world? Of course Naruto's going to be the child of prophecy since he's the main character of the manga. That's like saying Naruto did everything because he's the main character of this manga and kishi gave him the ability to do them, you're just stating it has nothing to do with an in-universe argument. Neji asserted that you can't change destiny, Naruto is absolutely not the symbol of hardwork, he's he symbol of fighting for your comrades. Neji vs Lee was genius vs hardwork. And unless you believe that Naruto could have just sat on his butt or committed suicide in chapter 1 and would have still fulfilled the CoP, neji's statement is easily falsified.


So what if they aren't the same entity? You asserted that Naruto didn't work or train for his powers, Naruto did have to work for BM and KCM, being from a different entity means nothing. Who said that Naruto didn't have help with him gaining those modes? That's obviously part of Naruto's theme: not doing everything on your own. And if you want to nitpick, everyone had help with getting to where they are, so I don't see why any of that stuff has anything to do with Naruto not working hard to achieve his new powerups.

That must've took a long time to type.....I agree with most of it though.

 

[ANiMUS]

Like I said earlier on in the thread the whole praise was to that Hokage position and not to Obito himself. You can go back and look through the thread that's what i have been talking about all along.

Like you said he should have praised what he stood for and that's exactly what Naruto did. Thus praising the Hokage position.




You should remember that Naruto and Nagato never shared a dream so sensitive to Naruto.

Sorry that is not how it sounds to me. I will wait till the viz translation comes out

 

[Angelic.]

Re: Dat Naruto Logic......

reread the gaara speech to the alliance.

naruto doesnt forgive tobi, only true obito. thats his choice to break the hate. peace maaan