SM Jiraiya vs Kages + Bodyguards

Icelerate

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Not even gonna take the cornbreadstrawman guy seriously lmao. Jiraiya wankers on this site are terrible this year.


How does Jiraiya beat Onoki in a 1v1, let alone with Kitsuchi and Akatsuchi?
I once made a and everyone came to the conclusion that Jiraiya takes it handedly. Kitsuchi is not in this matchup as he isn't a kage bodyguard.
 

Apêx1

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I once made a and everyone came to the conclusion that Jiraiya takes it handedly. Kitsuchi is not in this matchup as he isn't a kage bodyguard.

Oh shit, I totally misread, thought he granted him Kitsuchi lmaooo. Either way, the conclusion they came to was fallacious. Onoki shits on him without help. Not to mention I've seen KG say Onoki solos SM Jiraiya, so opinions have changed. People seem to think Onoki's only ability is Jinton, when it's far from the truth. Onoki mid diffs on a bad day.

Considering I posted manga scans and explained in depth how Jiraiya counters his opponents' abilities and defeats them, and all you said is that I'm wrong and called me a Jiraiya wanker with no explanation, I guess you concede this argument.

@Bold I already explained and you couldn't counter so theres no reason for you to ask Icelerate the same question.

I don't concede anything, but if you want to feel like you are right then go right ahead. I don't like arguments which think they are right when they don't comprehend manga scans correctly or use them in wrong ways to reach a fallacious conclusion.

Your counter wasn't sufficient, so I am looking for alternatives.
 

Beans2

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Oh shit, I totally misread, thought he granted him Kitsuchi lmaooo. Either way, the conclusion they came to was fallacious. Onoki shits on him without help. Not to mention I've seen KG say Onoki solos SM Jiraiya, so opinions have changed. People seem to think Onoki's only ability is Jinton, when it's far from the truth. Onoki mid diffs on a bad day.

I don't concede anything, but if you want to feel like you are right then go right ahead. I don't like arguments which think they are right when they don't comprehend manga scans correctly or use them in wrong ways to reach a fallacious conclusion.

Your counter wasn't sufficient, so I am looking for alternatives.

@Bold; you described yourself. Your own points were wrong, so I pointed out why they were wrong. You were the one who made incorrect assumptions; for example

How is Jiraiya weaving hand seals/summoning seal while in a sand coffin? That makes no sense..

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So no in fact, you are the one with "fallacious" claims, since that seems to be your favorite word.
 

Apêx1

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@Bold; you described yourself. Your own points were wrong, so I pointed out why they were wrong. You were the one who made incorrect assumptions; for example



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You can keep telling yourself that, I really have no intention of debating with the likes of you.

So no in fact, you are the one with "fallacious" claims, since that seems to be your favorite word.

Are you suggesting Gaara in part 2 isn't smart enough to bind the hands first?.. There's a clear difference between that Gaara and the pt. 1 Gaara that bound Kimimaro's entire body 100 times over (Inb4 you take this literally). Last reply to you m8, too much ignorance.
 

Beans2

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You can keep telling yourself that, I really have no intention of debating with the likes of you.



Are you suggesting Gaara in part 2 isn't smart enough to bind the hands first?.. There's a clear difference between that Gaara and the pt. 1 Gaara that bound Kimimaro's entire body 100 times over (Inb4 you take this literally). Last reply to you m8, too much ignorance.

If you can't counter what I said then there is no point in continuing this conversation.
 

Killua Zoldyck

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Ei is most certainly blitzing Jiraiya once in V2. There is no denying this. Ei >>> 3rd Raikage in speed. SM Naruto >>> SM Jiraiya in reflexes. Jiraiya lacks sensing precog, he failed to dodge Asura path despite the latter giving him a heads up before attacking him. Ei in V1 dodged something similar. Which means that V1 Ei speed > SM Jiraiya. Let alone V2, which is substantially greater then V1. He looses round 3 and round 5. Ei soloes him, Ōnoki soloes him. Wins the rest.
 
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Ghost in the Shell

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Round 2:Sand Siblings wins med diff (facing Sand Siblings is Like facing Six Paths Of Pain)


Lol


Anyways, what is up with the underestimation of Ero Sennin here? Loses each one except 1?? Oh please...


Round 1: Jiraiya wins with low difficulty. Mist is blown away by Ma's fuuton, and they all get burned to death by Senpō: Goemon or a giant, sage mode and oil enhanced katon, which has a larger AoE than Mei's water pillar.


Round 2: Jiraiya wins med diff max.


- Trollkage-sama was countering Gaara's sand shields and restraints simply by secreting oil from his body, Bunta can spit out large quantities and make Gaara's sand null. It's even worse for Gaara if the location isn't a desert. The quantity and quality of his gourd sand is high, but not enough to shield them from Senpō: Goemon, large scale katons, multiple Ōdama and maybe a Chō Ōdama Rasengan, all powered up by senjutsu chakra.


- Temari (sorry Ice) and Kankurō are no match here for Jiraiya's firepower. Kiri Kiri Mae's AoE is much smaller than Gamayu Endan, and her other wind techniques get overwhelmed by smaller katons. Kankurō is even worse, Jiraiya can create shadow clones and mow down his puppets with Kebari Senbon and small fire techniques, or maybe even Ma/Pa's tounges and katon/fuuton combo.


Round 3: Jiraiya wins with high difficulty.


- Darui's black raiton and ranton are still ninjutsu, which means that they can be stalemated or overpowered by medium scale/large scale katons in conjunction with Ma's fuuton to weaken the lightning. Shee's only function here is as a medic and a sensor; genjutsu is a non factor in front of sage sensing and the partner method. Even then, Shee won't have enough time to heal anybody with the onslaught of Jiraiya's sage ninjutsu.


- Ay is trouble here I'll admit, with his v2 speed and strength. However, he still has to charge chakra on his feet to use shunshin like he did to dodge Amaterasu. Ma's fuuton dust cloud makes for a good distraction while Jiraiya makes several shadow clones and has them all use a transformation jutsu to make it look like they have Ma and Pa on their shoulders to fake out Kumo. One of the sage trio can also summon another boss toad or toads to attack the Kumo jōnin and distract Ay while Ma an Pa prep the genjutsu, which I think only took half a chapter to prep (can't be THAT long).


Round 4: Jiraiya med difficulty.


- Torune and Fū suffer the same fate as Temari and Kankurō, genjutsu won't work, bugs get burnt to a crisp, Pa's tongue splits Fū in half, fuuton/katon combo end Torune, etc.


- Baku gets greeted warmly with a nice and simple katon in his mouth. Dissapears several seconds after he gets summoned. Danzō's izanagi spam and his respawn speed could be a problem, but Jiraiya can make shadow clones to cover the his perimiter, and even have them all use a SM enhanced sensing barrier if needed. From there on, nothing Danzō does will go unnoticed, and nothing he has in his arsenal is a match for even base Jiraiya. I assume KA is restricted.


Round 5: Jiraiya med diff


- Kurotsuchi and Akatsuchi are even worse off than the other kage bodyguards


- Ōnoki is not prepping jinton here with the speed and scale of Jiraiya, Ma, and Pa's attacks added with the leaping power of boss summons. Ōnoki will have to make rock golems to protect them from Jiraiya's sage ninjutsu spam, and even then they can be utterly obliterated by Chō Ōdama Rasengan, or overwhelmed with large scale AoE attacks like Senpō: Goemon, and Gamayu Endan.




Bonus round: He probably loses this one. Tsunades's elites are on a whole other level compared to the other kage's bodyguards, and Tsunade herself isn't a slouch either when backed by strong allies.
 

KingHashirama

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He loses to all.... There is a limit to how much people can wank on SM Jiraiya.. he is not taking on the War arc Kages and their bodyguards.
 

Beans2

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He loses to all.... There is a limit to how much people can wank on SM Jiraiya.. he is not taking on the War arc Kages and their bodyguards.

I want to hear how Mei beats him.
 

Icelerate

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Jiraiya isn't beating anyone here except for Kiri and Iwa.
 

Beans2

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Jiraiya isn't beating anyone here except for Kiri and Iwa.

Challenge accepted.

Against Kumo it can go either way but Suna loses.
 
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Selan

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These are individual rounds. Jiraiya starts his battle in Sage Mode.

Round 1:

Mei, Ao, and Chojuro = Jiraiya stomps

Round 2:

Gaara, Temari, Kankuro = Jiraiya wins most likely

Round 3:

Ay, Darui, and Cee = It can go either way

Round 4:

Danzo, Torune, and Fu = It can go either way

Round 5:

Onoki, Akatsuchi, and Kurotsuchi = It can go either way

Bonus Round:

If Tsunade was hokage instead of Danzo, she would have come assisted by her elites Gai and Kakashi. Can SM Jiraiya take on Gai, Kakashi, and Tsunade all at once? (Kamui restricted, 7th Gate restricted) = No, definitely. They stomp him. Kakashi can solo. Gai can solo.

In the quote.
 

Lariatoo

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IMO, he certainly wins against the Mist team and the Sand Team. Wins more times than not against Danzo's team. Wins against Ay if you consider a distance were he isn't outright blitzed. Loses to the Konoha trio. Probably loses against the Rock trio.
 
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Beans2

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Is it not Chojuro + Ao+ Mei?

1 Kage level ninja + 2 Kakashi level ninja.. yea in which reality is jiraiya strong enough to take them on?


so you are saying you were wanking on Jiraiya?

Base Jiraiya is kage level as he was the top candidate for hokage after Hiruzen died. You need to understand that not all kage leveled ninjas are of the same strength, for example Tsunade and Third Raikage are both kages except Raikage would stomp her. Chojuro and Ao were never ever stated or implied to be on Kakashi's level, and by feats SM Jiraiya neg diffs them.

Yeah, but anyway I asked how Kiri beat him and you still haven't put up an argument. How do they kill Jiraiya?
 

KingHashirama

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Base Jiraiya is kage level as he was the top candidate for hokage after Hiruzen died. You need to understand that not all kage leveled ninjas are of the same strength, for example Tsunade and Third Raikage are both kages except Raikage would stomp her. Chojuro and Ao were never ever stated or implied to be on Kakashi's level, and by feats SM Jiraiya neg diffs them.

Yeah, but anyway I asked how Kiri beat him and you still haven't put up an argument. How do they kill Jiraiya?
No Orochimaru was the top candidate for Hiruzen. And they were the strongest in their village.. consider Tsuna had already left the village..

Never said all Kages are of the same level.. but a person with 3 KKG can sure rival an imperfect SM user.. having help from kakashi calibur ninjas.


I can put up an argument, that'd be countered , due to the insufficient showcasing of the power by Ao.Chojuro, and Mei. and i'm sure.. But if you still want me to I can..
 
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Beans2

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No Orochimaru was the top candidate for Hiruzen. And they were the strongest in their village.. consider Tsuna had already left the village..

I said after Hiruzen died, Jiraiya was the top candidate. Orochimaru surely wasn't since a few days previously he tried to destroy the Leaf.

Never said all Kages are of the same level.. but a person with 3 KKG can sure rival an imperfect SM user.. having help from kakashi calibur ninjas.

Mei has 2 KKG and Ao/Chojuro were never implied to be as strong as Kakashi. SM Jiraiya by feats and manga portrayal would beat all 3 at once, matter of fact his teammates (Ma and Pa) are by feats more powerful than Mei's teammates.

I can put up an argument, that'd be countered , due to the insufficient showcasing of the power by Ao.Chojuro, and Mei. and i'm sure.. But if you still want me to I can..

Please don't.
 

KingHashirama

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I said after Hiruzen died, Jiraiya was the top candidate. Orochimaru surely wasn't since a few days previously he tried to destroy the Leaf.



Mei has 2 KKG and Ao/Chojuro were never implied to be as strong as Kakashi. SM Jiraiya by feats and manga portrayal would beat all 3 at once, matter of fact his teammates (Ma and Pa) are by feats more powerful than Mei's teammates.



Please don't.
oops i put 3.

Yea he was the top candidate, because he was above Kakashi and etc.

Ma and pa by feats would get pawned By Zetsu...... Their only good attack would be the Genjutsu attack, which takes time to prep of course, and that won't be the case, when you acid user and a lava user against you.

And also, Ao/Darui/Kitsuchi/Kakashi are portrayed to be around the same level.. of course Kakashi is stronger than them.. but simply talking prowess here.

But like i said before, the arguments for Mei's team would be countered due to all 3 of the kiri ninja not having that much screen time to display their techniques....
 

EliteKakashi

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Just to clarify here, Jiraiya was still the top candidate for Hokage even when Orochimaru was still in the Leaf.

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Ma and pa by feats would get pawned By Zetsu...... Their only good attack would be the Genjutsu attack, which takes time to prep of course, and that won't be the case, when you acid user and a lava user against you.

Their only good attack is Gama Rinsho?

lololol

Guess we'll just ignore Zessenzan, Zessenbaku, Frog Kata/their SM strength, Kawazu Naki and their elemental abilities. Not to mention they too can summon any toad they want to from Myoboku.

I might go over each of these matchups later, don't feel like it right now.
 
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