**Sigh** Are we really that slow to say 8 gate is a Tie? Really? lmmfao

[Draegod]

For what ever reason many Users on this Particular Site seem to think that If you use 8 gates, Kill the Opponent, then wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy After the fact You die from your own Tech that it's a Draw... Dafuq????

8 gates isn't the same as RDS or C0 or Meteor Sky fall nor Compare! The Difference in those Tech's is OBV if you have any common sense... You Die at the Same time! Let's take it back to Grade school for the clueless users:

Draw:

—v.i.
1. to leave a contest undecided; tie.

Now Lets Learn the Meaning of Tie:

Tie:

v.i.
12. to make the same score; be equal in a contest: to tie for first place.

Now lets look at the Definition of "Win(ning)" and "Victory".

win [win] Show IPA
verb (used without object), won, win·ning.
1.
to finish first in a race, contest, or the like.
2.
to succeed by striving or effort: He applied for a scholarship and won.
3.
to gain the victory; overcome an adversary: The home team won.
4.
Slang. to be successful or competent and be acknowledged for it: My sister wins at getting the biggest bargains. Compare fail ( def 9 ) .
verb (used with object), won, win·ning.
5.
to succeed in reaching (a place, condition, etc.), especially by great effort: They won the shore through a violent storm.
6.
to get by effort, as through labor, competition, or conquest: He won his post after years of striving.
7.
to gain (a prize, fame, etc.).
8.
to be successful in (a game, battle, etc.).
9.
to make (one's way), as by effort or ability.

vic·to·ry [vik-tuh-ree, vik-tree] Show IPA
noun, plural vic·to·ries.
1.
a success or triumph over an enemy in battle or war.
2.
an engagement ending in such triumph: American victories in the Pacific were won at great cost.
3.
the ultimate and decisive superiority in any battle or contest: The new vaccine effected a victory over poliomyelitis.
4.
a success or superior position achieved against any opponent, opposition, difficulty, etc.: a moral victory.
5.
( initial capital letter ) the ancient Roman goddess Victoria, often represented in statues or on coins as the personification of victory.

Now that we got that out the way, lets look at the def' for when you have lost and the battle is officially over:

loss [laws, los] Show IPA
noun
1.
detriment, disadvantage, or deprivation from failure to keep, have, or get: to bear the loss of a robbery.
2.
something that is lost: The painting was the greatest loss from the robbery.
3.
an amount or number lost: The loss of life increased each day.
4.
the state of being deprived of or of being without something that one has had: the loss of old friends.
5.
death, or the fact of being dead: to mourn the loss of a grandparent.

Now People if you haven't figured it out yet. If I succeed in Killing You the Battle is officially over and I WIN! If I die wayyyy after, it doesn't matter since its already over and I was the Cause of my death. It wasn't because of you and the battle has long since been won. This is common sense that even Little kids can grasp! With RDS you die together, C0 you Die together etc etc. With 8th Gate I kill you, Battles over, then Way way way later I die at home or something. That's like Mike Tyson fighting, Throwing a Hay-maker that Connects, Wins with TKO, I go home then Later realize he over stretched my arm and Something happens that results in his death wayyyy later. Now even though he later dies, was the battle already won? Ask your self and use your brain....

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[Rike Senju]

I heavily agree with this.

 

[Curse Mark]

Yeah guys what's next restricting RDS and saying that's a tie?

 

[Exaar]

Completely agree

 

[NarutoB]

Madara > Guy

 

[Draegod]

I heavily agree with this.

I'm Tryna tell em'

Completely agree

Thanks my man, just tryna see what dafuq is going on with the users.

Yeah guys what's next restricting RDS and saying that's a tie?

RDS isn't the same as gates though, RDS seals both at once.

 

[Draegod]

Madara > Guy

Kay.................I don't care!

 

[Joshutsu]

They don't even have to go down the tie road t obe a snob. Just say that Gai has to kill himself to beat my guy. That's near as satisfying.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

Thank the Good Lord Jesus.... someone gets it. An already exhausted Gai has been in the 8th gate for 3 whole chapters going on 4.... So it's not even like it's a quick 1-2-3 he busts his final nut and dies.

 

[Touken]

"Gai wins at the cost of his own life" is the correct way to put it. I don't understand why people say "Tie." though, especially since Gai can maintain 8G for an extended period of time. Like FT put it, it's not a couple of hits and then he gives out.

 

[Bad Touch Yakushi]

I agree. The fact that Guy dies as a result of using the technique is an after effect. It's no longer considered part of the battle when the other person is dead, the match is over, Guy is technically victorious and THEN falls back and deals with the consequences outside of battle.

 

[NarutoB]

Kay.................I don't care!

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[PlasticAngelx]

I agree

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[Draegod]

They don't even have to go down the tie road t obe a snob. Just say that Gai has to kill himself to beat my guy. That's near as satisfying.

LMAo Hell yea, that makes it that much worse for the opposing argument! hahahaha Same as Only Chuck Norris can Kill Chuck Norris!

Thank the Good Lord Jesus.... someone gets it. An already exhausted Gai has been in the 8th gate for 3 whole chapters going on 4.... So it's not even like it's a quick 1-2-3 he busts his final nut and dies.

Niguh Looking Like PREACH!!! Bro they need to learn the differnce, and know that If Guy Merks them he wins if he is STILL STANDING!

"Gai wins at the cost of his own life" is the correct way to put it. I don't understand when people say "Tie." though.

Pretty much. But It still counts in a victory for Guy since he didn't die at the same time.

 

[Disquiet]

Interesting. Though, I think some perspective is encompassing this.

I have a hypothetical question. If Gai uses 8 gates, but his opponent simply dodges the whole time without even landing a hit on Gai, Gai dies. Did his opponent defeat Gai, or did Gai defeat himself? Remember, the premise is that Gai chooses his own death <---- don't forget that, that's important.

Is it a downright win for the opponent? Or is it not so black and white, and thus left up to one's own perspective?

 

[paratise]

Well agreed, i made a thread on the matter but mainly referred to fact that it is his own power and Gai is not ultimately strong as max. 7 gates when he dies:

Let me tell you why this logic does not blatantly apply.

As starters, Kishi does not have top 10, 20 or tier lists. He does not put characters in a line with a certain logic of who has more power. Every battle depend on a scenarior author have choosen. So "X is not top 10" is like saying "8 is not the best color". Stuffing a character in a bracket that can not exist in author's universe is not a definete result.

Second, a person can die as a result but can gain a power beyond comprehension of many others. In 1 vs 1 scenario; it is a "draw" by "versus" logic. NV is not vs section.

For example lets take look at 3rd raikage vs Gai, without last gate Gai loses to raikage, with it he wins, but they both die.
then look at Nagato vs 3rd raikage; Nagato would have a win yet raikage has nothing to stop Nagato, even if wants to give his life. Gai would lose his life, but he can take down Nagato.

As a result; Gai can end Nagato if that's his purpose, but 3rd raikage can't. Guess what; they both die in the end but atleast Gai is taking dwon the enemy.

Why did i give this example?

Because as i said NV is not a vs section. Same logic can be reversed to other characters with no over powered techs and say "they can't do anything when they die". Being able to get immense power even at the cost of one's can still fulfill purposes the many many others can't.

Beside, everybody dies in the end and most shinobi are all about putting their lives in the line. Getting overpowered and dying later is better than just dying.

At the cost of on his life he gets much stonger than about 5 people can grasp in NV.
And dead is not a loss depending on battle mindset, considering many ninja are willing to put their lives on the line; Gai makes it more worthful than many can.

But people still blabber about "top 20 or not" logic while Kishi does not have one.

 

[Bogard]

Minato used summoning jutsu, saved Naruto, waited for Kushina's speech, chakra transfer with eight trigram seal after RDS. It doesn't kill you instantly. Double standards?

 

[Forbidden Technique]

Niguh Looking Like PREACH!!! Bro they need to learn the differnce, and know that If Guy Merks them he wins if he is STILL STANDING!

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And to put it simply for these niggas, I wasn't even going to waste my time but since were at it right now... Say two people are racing, and they both reach the finish line at the same time. That is what you call a tie. Now, say one person reaches the finish line first but over exerts himself and dies ten minutes after. You gon' tell me he didn't win...? He crossed the finish line first and won the race, but because he died, it makes it a tie...? Doesn't even make sense.

 

[Disquiet]

Minato used summoning jutsu, saved Naruto, waited for Kushina's speech, chakra transfer with eight trigram seal after RDS. It doesn't kill you instantly. Double standards?

This was going to be my second point if I got the answer I was expecting.

 

[Sennin of Logic]

Alert! alert! we have a rabid fanboy eating the heads off of any who have a separate opinion!

The fact that the result is that both die makes it a tie. The fact that a suicide technique becomes necessary means that the other character was stronger than the other ninja. This also means that the other character forced the suicider to the point that they're going to die no matter what.



Funny how you're insulting everyone by calling us "slow" considering you made a bone-headed mistake in your line of thinking. You said RDS kills both the user and the victim at the same time. Far from it.

Spoiler

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Does this look like a simultaneous death to you? The entire premise of your argument that the 8th gate isn't like the other suicide techs that nobody uses in debates applies to RDS as well. In other words, you either A. Have to accept that 8th gate doesn't count just like RDS doesn't, or B. Have to give Alive Minato RDS making him above pretty much any shinobi minus a juubi jin including Guy.


Don't insult people for having a view. Especially don't do it if your own view is fragile and easily shattered.