Should I wear a gun in this situation?

kakashi owns all

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Oct 21, 2011
Messages
5,570
Reaction score
407
As a business family i can tell you what we do.

we have a firearm under our desk in a way that no one can see it and if we were to put our hands to the register its only a small adjustment to get it insted

@ sales - based on what your selling i dont think people will care
 

'Nāpalm

Banned
Regular
Joined
Oct 21, 2012
Messages
1,236
Reaction score
167
You must be registered for see images


get one of these :p
 

Wang

Banned
Elite
Joined
May 17, 2012
Messages
5,807
Reaction score
587
However, if you just want to wear the gun as a fashion accessory, I approve.
 

~WastelandSociety~

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
5,164
Reaction score
353
I love hookahs flavored tobacco xd

Yes,you should have a glock with you in the store.
But make sure you don't have it so customers would see it but have it so you can grad in a flash just in case some nut tries to rob you.
 

Shinobi Train

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Messages
6,011
Reaction score
399
Please don't ask a forum where you have an average age range of about 14-18.

There are plenty of older people on the base.

Well, if the danger is just minimally potential and you don't want to go lethal, you should just buy a simple pistol like a lightweight 9mm with 12 rounds or a Glock and use ceramic bullets. I look at the suggestions above and I want to slam my head into the wall. These tough guys played too much Call of Duty.

Ceramic bullets sound interesting, I'm just worried about stopping power in that case though.

simply you dont need to have anything fancy, and a shotgun would work fine...a shotgun under the counter.....but you have a right to have a gun to defend yourself if neccesaary. it is the people that kill people, not guns

A shotgun would be hard to swing around though, plus it would rip the place to shreds. xd

We both know you don't know how to use a gun, maybe you should invest in a very good security camera system instead.

How much cash could you possibly be carrying in the store at any point, don't most people use credit cards? If you get robbed, just hand them the money & call 911. I'm assuming there are other businesses around you, so if someone decided to pick the record store/bong shop to rob, they're extremely stupid & extremely dangerous. You don't want a gun.

Dude, I think I know how to handle a gun, it's not rocket science. You stay calm (most imporntantly), aim the barrel and pull the trigger (granted the safety is off xd). I have shot before, it's not like this is brand new.

Sometimes most of our sales are in cash, but when it starts getting really full I'm supposed to take a load out and secure it. It doesn't matter how much cash is there though, people get shot all the time for twenty bucks, and anything open that late is a target.

Never think that you don't need any training. Once a person starts thinking that way, they become negligent. I've seen people that carry firearms on a daily basis as a part of their profession have mishaps. We had a saying that there is no such thing as an accidental discharge of firearm. When a weapon goes off, it was through negligence.

I can't answer if you need to get a gun or not. But if you do decide to get one. Stick with a 9mm. Glock 17 or Beretta 92F. Really should be all you need. Moderate rate of fire, easy control and aim, and quick reload. Maybe even a colt 1911. But higher caliber ammo means less rounds in the magazine. If you get a shotgun, you might do more damage to the store.

I'm the cautious one in the family. I don't make a movement unless I know what I'm doing, and a gun is the last thing I'd make a mistake with. No, there are no accidental discharges.

Thanks, I'll investigate the Glock 17 maybe.

As a business family i can tell you what we do.

we have a firearm under our desk in a way that no one can see it and if we were to put our hands to the register its only a small adjustment to get it insted

@ sales - based on what your selling i dont think people will care

Yeah, I don't think people will care either, there are other shop owners that open carry in the area.

I love hookahs flavored tobacco xd

Yes,you should have a glock with you in the store.
But make sure you don't have it so customers would see it but have it so you can grad in a flash just in case some nut tries to rob you.

I doubt our customers are using these particular products for tabacco, but cool. xd
 

Anorien16

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Sep 3, 2010
Messages
5,543
Reaction score
497
I wld also like to advice u to get some bulletproof vest and a few other security stuff (like a taser fitted to the counter that u can activate secretly while pretending to draw cash to stun the person standing infront of the counter...... ) cos even if u wear a gun there is no guarantee that u will have time to draw it properly...... u may as well be dead before u are prepared to shoot. I also advice smaller guns as they can be drawn faster than shotguns.... time is always of the essence.
Also i little pro training never hurts.....
 
Last edited:

Sanguis

Jōnin Strategist 🧠
Regular
Joined
Sep 3, 2012
Messages
1,515
Reaction score
158
Because what? You gonna cry like always and report to the mods? ..

OT: Colt 45, Desert Eagle, Makarov, TT.

You should stop playing too much Call of Duty, if you knew anything about weapons you would know the desert eagle is way to much fire power for self defence, it is just not needed and it is not a good firearm because they are prone to jamming and are very expensive, plus they are not a weapon for armatures. I cannot comment on the other weapons but with what you have listed it just seems you play too many games or watch too many movies.

There are plenty of older people on the base.

I hate to be inappropriate but this is not the place to ask. You are asking an anime fanbase forum, many of the people on here would have no experience in owning a store and running it at night. I will advise you to ask somewhere a little more appropriate, for example Yahoo Answer may be a better choice or do some research on this matter. This is for your own safety.
 

Shinobi Train

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Messages
6,011
Reaction score
399
I hate to be inappropriate but this is not the place to ask. You are asking an anime fanbase forum, many of the people on here would have no experience in owning a store and running it at night. I will advise you to ask somewhere a little more appropriate, for example Yahoo Answer may be a better choice or do some research on this matter. This is for your own safety.

It's called general discussion for a reason, all the little kids are in the Naruto section arguing about whether Sasuke is better than the Ramen guy. I'm just asking opinions, and I have done some research; it's not like I don't know what I'm doing. ;)

You must be registered for see images
 

Sanguis

Jōnin Strategist 🧠
Regular
Joined
Sep 3, 2012
Messages
1,515
Reaction score
158
It's called general discussion for a reason, all the little kids are in the Naruto section arguing about whether Sasuke is better than the Ramen guy. I'm just asking opinions, and I have done some research; it's not like I don't know what I'm doing. ;)

You must be registered for see images

Well I apologise that I am not a seer and I cannot see into the future or I am not psychic.

My point was not addressing age as a factor, it was merely addressing an example. You sit on the premise that all the kids are currently arguing in Naruto Discussion but you get people telling you to buy desert eagles or a cross bow to defend your store lol.
 

Wesobi

Kage in the Making 👑
Legendary
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Messages
13,053
Reaction score
639
If you actually do get it, put it somewhere that customers wouldn't see it, but isn't too far away. Don't put it under your counter though, from my expertise in robberies (American movies ftw?) they'll see through that (figuratively). Anyways, I'm at all pro-guns, but I somewhat understand your concern. I have no idea what guns are best for this, so I'll leave that to others. Just make sure to only use it when absolutely necessary.
 

Typhon

Kage in the Making 👑
Legendary
Joined
Apr 29, 2009
Messages
15,991
Reaction score
603
If safety is your main concern I say don't get it, or if you do only use it if the robber is using a knife or a weapon other than a gun. Most robbers have no intention of shooting the clerk when they rob a place. The gun is more for motivation. But if someone does that and then you pull a gun on them all bets are off. Just makes it more likely for you to get shot, and the money isn't worth your life.
 

Shig

Kage in the Making 👑
Legendary
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
10,273
Reaction score
249
If you actually do get it, put it somewhere that customers wouldn't see it, but isn't too far away. Don't put it under your counter though, from my expertise in robberies (American movies ftw?) they'll see through that (figuratively). Anyways, I'm at all pro-guns, but I somewhat understand your concern. I have no idea what guns are best for this, so I'll leave that to others. Just make sure to only use it when absolutely necessary.

American movies... yeah... sure. :rolleyes:

Anywho, I don't endorse carrying guns, and I personally prefer if there was some sort of gun control. I'm not going to go "all-out expert" like some 13-year olds did, I have no clue on how to shoot a gun, nor do I wish to. Have one, never use it unless it comes to a Western Showdown, my man.
If you are like me, and you do something stupid, it might have a huge toll on your mental health. I know I wouldn't forgive myself if I ever badly injured, or even worse, killed someone just because I was too rash. You need to think about the consequences, and leave aside the fact that it might help you keep robbers away.

But this is just a forum, and I'm just a member. I'd personally say: get a gun, have one clip in it and use it to scare any robbers, if they become too violent(attack you, etc.), use that one clip you have.

Other than that, good luck running the business.
 

Shinobi Train

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Messages
6,011
Reaction score
399
Well I apologise that I am not a seer and I cannot see into the future or I am not psychic.

My point was not addressing age as a factor, it was merely addressing an example. You sit on the premise that all the kids are currently arguing in Naruto Discussion but you get people telling you to buy desert eagles or a cross bow to defend your store lol.

Yeah, it's pretty easy to see the intelligent replies though. ;)

If you actually do get it, put it somewhere that customers wouldn't see it, but isn't too far away. Don't put it under your counter though, from my expertise in robberies (American movies ftw?) they'll see through that (figuratively). Anyways, I'm at all pro-guns, but I somewhat understand your concern. I have no idea what guns are best for this, so I'll leave that to others. Just make sure to only use it when absolutely necessary.

The only reason I want people to see it is because they might think twice and simply walk out. If they decide to shoot me they better kill me and not miss. I will kill them and I won't miss. I think I'm going with a Glock because they're real easy to use and don't have problems like jamming really.
 

Shinobi Train

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Messages
6,011
Reaction score
399
Okay, just to let you guys know, I purchased a Glock 19 with a belt holster. I've talked to a lot of people who know a lot of stuff and heard both sides of the argument. Wearing it open carry is the best option I believe. My decision is final, but thanks for the intelligent input I did get. ^_^
 

Aim64C

Anbu Operative 🎭
Veteran
Joined
Dec 18, 2012
Messages
3,681
Reaction score
608
I decided to put this in GD because guns happen to be somewhat controversial. I'm about to start keeping a small store open late at night for my family, it's a record shop that also sells gifts of all sorts (mostly hippie stuff) as well as pipes and hookahs. I think the business would boom if it stayed open for later, but I'm worried about the types that might come in at 11-12 at night (during the day is scary enough sometimes). So should I have a gun when I do this? I'm thinking it should be open carry just so people can see it when they walk in (would this affect sales?).

You will, first, want to consult some of your local laws. I'm not sure how business property is treated when dealing with the various carry laws. Usually, you're allowed to have a firearm on your property (so long as it is registered and you have any licenses that go along with restrictions on ownership). This is usually your home, where you can freely carry any weapon you own without a public license.

Things might get a bit quirky, however, with a business. I do not know. I am not a lawyer, and police officers are not always up to date on the laws (though I'm not one of those either, I just work with a bunch of them).

In either case - I do not recommend anyone use a firearm for self-defense without taking courses for that weapon and getting familiar/comfortable with the weapon. Far too many people get a firearm and, because they are not comfortable with how to use it in a case of self-defense, they pull it in situations they shouldn't or simply handle it improperly. This increases the chance of accidents and news headlines that demonize all of us who own firearms.

Most of my training in the military has focused on when not to shoot a firearm as opposed to when. I've had the "deadly force traingle" and the 7 justifications for deadly force beaten into my head ad-nausiem. I'm pretty sure I babble the things in my sleep. Why? Because we deploy overseas - where people get exceptionally pissed when we shoot someone on one of our bases (then they start demanding that we get removed from the area, and their governments start trying to kick us out... and we lose a strategic position... one idiot with an itchy trigger finger can threaten to compromise the strategic picture... like when those idiots raped a woman on Okinawa).

If you're in favor of such a thing, then recommend me a model if you don't mind, I'm going with a Glock though because the police use it. Also, I've never owned a gun before; plus I hate guns, I prefer fists if something goes down (I'll always win with fists xd). In fact, I actually can't believe I'm even considering this, if you told me a few months ago that I'd be carrying a firearm, I'd have literally rolled on the floor laughing. >.>

My recommendation is that you take a firearms course. If it is a good course, they will help you select a firearm that is more comfortable for you to use (you are not necessarily going to feel as comfortable with - or shoot as well using the same model a 110lb, 5'2" female is) and more applicable to your purposes.

I'm not a handgun person, myself. I've never felt very comfortable with them in a civilian environment. Sure - when I have it in a secure holster, it's alright - but those simply aren't practical for carry in most civilian environments (unless I want to go around looking like Rambo). To me, it's just far too awkward of a weapon to have sitting in your backpack, a cargo pocket, purse, etc - it's not readily-accessible for self-defense, and too easily separated from you (I'd always be paranoid that someone else would use it).

We're trained, when someone makes an attempt for our weapon, to jump straight to deadly force. It satisfies the capability, opportunity, and intent requirements - if they get that thing, it is 99% certain they are going to use it to cause you or someone else harm. So the idea of leaving it in a bag that is not practically grafted to my bone is just nerve-wracking.

I'm a rifle person. Adaptive Combat Rifle all the way (6.8mm chambered variety). You can't always keep it attached to your person in a civilian environment - but it's also much less awkward to have propped nearby (for me, at least). If they are too close for that weapon system, then they are close enough for blades or physical strikes.

Handguns, as we use them in the military, are more for use when you've exhausted the ammunition for your primary weapon. There are a few situations where you'll draw your handgun - but someone can sprint the effective range of that weapon in a very short order of time. A lot of people can be on top of you from 15 yards away before you can get the safety off (you have to be very versed in drawing your weapon and operating on the quick-draw to be able to pull it off).

In a store environment - you have a table between you and an assailant... but you still have to think about where you're going to keep this thing, whether you are going to keep it in condition 1 (safety on; round chambered - all you have to do is flip the safety and a double-action trigger pull will fire the weapon: this is the condition all officers and service members carry their weapon in unless in an area where the host nation prohibits it... there is one such place, and we all thought it was ridiculous - our side-arm was really only useful as a club) or condition 3 (safety on; chamber clear, loaded magazine inserted - you must cycle, "rack," the weapon and disengage the safety before you can engage a threat).

How long will it take you to access your weapon? What is the likelihood that someone else will gain access to it? What will you do with it when you go to other areas of the store?

A lot of these are questions you will only be able to answer after you get more familiar with the weapon and talk to instructors of self-defense courses who can give you some more targeted advice. They might be able to give you some other pointers about things you can do to reduce the likelihood that someone will cause problems in your store to begin with.
 

Shinobi Train

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Messages
6,011
Reaction score
399
You will, first, want to consult some of your local laws. I'm not sure how business property is treated when dealing with the various carry laws. Usually, you're allowed to have a firearm on your property (so long as it is registered and you have any licenses that go along with restrictions on ownership). This is usually your home, where you can freely carry any weapon you own without a public license.

Things might get a bit quirky, however, with a business. I do not know. I am not a lawyer, and police officers are not always up to date on the laws (though I'm not one of those either, I just work with a bunch of them).

In either case - I do not recommend anyone use a firearm for self-defense without taking courses for that weapon and getting familiar/comfortable with the weapon. Far too many people get a firearm and, because they are not comfortable with how to use it in a case of self-defense, they pull it in situations they shouldn't or simply handle it improperly. This increases the chance of accidents and news headlines that demonize all of us who own firearms.

Most of my training in the military has focused on when not to shoot a firearm as opposed to when. I've had the "deadly force traingle" and the 7 justifications for deadly force beaten into my head ad-nausiem. I'm pretty sure I babble the things in my sleep. Why? Because we deploy overseas - where people get exceptionally pissed when we shoot someone on one of our bases (then they start demanding that we get removed from the area, and their governments start trying to kick us out... and we lose a strategic position... one idiot with an itchy trigger finger can threaten to compromise the strategic picture... like when those idiots raped a woman on Okinawa).



My recommendation is that you take a firearms course. If it is a good course, they will help you select a firearm that is more comfortable for you to use (you are not necessarily going to feel as comfortable with - or shoot as well using the same model a 110lb, 5'2" female is) and more applicable to your purposes.

I'm not a handgun person, myself. I've never felt very comfortable with them in a civilian environment. Sure - when I have it in a secure holster, it's alright - but those simply aren't practical for carry in most civilian environments (unless I want to go around looking like Rambo). To me, it's just far too awkward of a weapon to have sitting in your backpack, a cargo pocket, purse, etc - it's not readily-accessible for self-defense, and too easily separated from you (I'd always be paranoid that someone else would use it).

We're trained, when someone makes an attempt for our weapon, to jump straight to deadly force. It satisfies the capability, opportunity, and intent requirements - if they get that thing, it is 99% certain they are going to use it to cause you or someone else harm. So the idea of leaving it in a bag that is not practically grafted to my bone is just nerve-wracking.

I'm a rifle person. Adaptive Combat Rifle all the way (6.8mm chambered variety). You can't always keep it attached to your person in a civilian environment - but it's also much less awkward to have propped nearby (for me, at least). If they are too close for that weapon system, then they are close enough for blades or physical strikes.

Handguns, as we use them in the military, are more for use when you've exhausted the ammunition for your primary weapon. There are a few situations where you'll draw your handgun - but someone can sprint the effective range of that weapon in a very short order of time. A lot of people can be on top of you from 15 yards away before you can get the safety off (you have to be very versed in drawing your weapon and operating on the quick-draw to be able to pull it off).

In a store environment - you have a table between you and an assailant... but you still have to think about where you're going to keep this thing, whether you are going to keep it in condition 1 (safety on; round chambered - all you have to do is flip the safety and a double-action trigger pull will fire the weapon: this is the condition all officers and service members carry their weapon in unless in an area where the host nation prohibits it... there is one such place, and we all thought it was ridiculous - our side-arm was really only useful as a club) or condition 3 (safety on; chamber clear, loaded magazine inserted - you must cycle, "rack," the weapon and disengage the safety before you can engage a threat).

How long will it take you to access your weapon? What is the likelihood that someone else will gain access to it? What will you do with it when you go to other areas of the store?

A lot of these are questions you will only be able to answer after you get more familiar with the weapon and talk to instructors of self-defense courses who can give you some more targeted advice. They might be able to give you some other pointers about things you can do to reduce the likelihood that someone will cause problems in your store to begin with.

Thank you so much for your detailed and intelligent response. I was dead set on a Glock because it's police issue, and inside a retail store like my family's, in my state, it's legal to carry a firearm unless stated otherwise (which it's not).

I have already purchased a Glock and I have familiarized myself with it extensively. My dad was in the Air Force too and he taught me more about gun safety than anyone should ever know...ever (when his unit would practice there was literally someone standing there with a rifle ready to kill anyone that didn't follow the protocal...like kill them as in dead). The #1 rule is you don't pass a firearm in front of someone unless your intent is to actually shoot them; that's the rule...and like someone else said, there are no accidental discharges, they don't exist.

Anyway, I think I'm good, and I'm taking your info to heart. As far as gun safety, I really don't need any more, I've had plenty to last anyone several lifetimes. I do plan on visiting a range to fire the weapon sometime soon, but that's mostly just to get the feel of the kick and see where the rounds are going. It's a small store too; even at the furthest point from the counter it would be exceptionally easy to hit the target.
 
Last edited:

7PointOh

Leaf Village Regular 🍃
Regular
Joined
Nov 17, 2011
Messages
935
Reaction score
81
Okay, just to let you guys know, I purchased a Glock 19 with a belt holster. I've talked to a lot of people who know a lot of stuff and heard both sides of the argument. Wearing it open carry is the best option I believe. My decision is final, but thanks for the intelligent input I did get. ^_^

Glock 19. Seems like a good choice. I've never had any personal experience with that particular model. I've fired the Glock 17. I think the 19 has a shorter barrel. Shorter barrels mean faster out of the holster.

Now get out to the range and practice. Find your grip. Are you a weaver guy or isosceles? Learn to present that sidearm. Getting in the habit of firing controlled and hammered pairs. The better you know your weapon, the safer you are as a user.
 

Shinobi Train

Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
Elite
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Messages
6,011
Reaction score
399
Glock 19. Seems like a good choice. I've never had any personal experience with that particular model. I've fired the Glock 17. I think the 19 has a shorter barrel. Shorter barrels mean faster out of the holster.

Now get out to the range and practice. Find your grip. Are you a weaver guy or isosceles? Learn to present that sidearm. Getting in the habit of firing controlled and hammered pairs. The better you know your weapon, the safer you are as a user.

Yep, I'm going to a range as soon as I can, maybe even next sunday. I guess I'm more of a Weaver style, I've shot a lot with bows and stuff so I'd use the same stance like a natural reaction. It's my basic defense/offense stance in any situation, I immediately turn my body to the side without even thinking about it; also gives less of a target to hit.

The only real thing that I've decided to do as far as deviating from my plan is to keep the firearm concealed. My dad and I went over the scenerios together and he's saying that desperate criminal types would just walk in and demand my gun or just shoot me and take it. However, if they didn't see it right away then they'd just ask for the cash, and at that point I can tell them the bad news (let's just say we have a line that we tell people in the store in such a situation and it's enough to make anyone pack up and leave).
 
Top