Philosophically, Naruto Uzumaki is in the wrong

[FemmeFatale]

Taking away free will, is a crime against nature. No one should have power over anyones life even if it's good or bad. Utopia in it self is flawed because no peace can be accomplished when free will is taken away.

 

[JIRAIYA perv]

"Philosophically" different views can be right to a degree.

am not gonna address what naruto believes because how he wants to reach this peace is indeed naive (his means to reach this peace is unrealistic, it's all about showing up and saying something like "i will carry your hate").

but what madara and obito want to achieve is not peace, it's forcing what they think is right on people/actually the entire world and it's nothing more than an illusion.

now after looking at both sides/views, naruto's side of "trying to understand each other, to reach peace" is a noble/meaningful goal that is worth the effort/pursuing. while the other view is nothing more than a dark, hopeless, meaningless illusion that simply gave up on humanity (this is not being realistic, it's called being weak).

so NO madara and obito are wrong and living in an imaginary world without free will is not the answer.

 

[S A G E]

The true answer to world peace should be eternal kotoamatsukami to always do good rather than eternal Tsukoyomi. Lol

 

[take it easy]

Are joking? In manga land? You refuse to believe people can change but you think it okay they can fly around and breath fire and shiz? I'm done.

+ reputation for you

 

[Ariow]

Some people never seem to change their ways until they are faced with something that could end them, and even then many are too weak. You may be right about this world but I personally refuse to think in such a depressing manner and just give up hope.

 

[mikeeozua]

this war prove that people can understand other peoples... so naruto was right.

It's implausible how just from one speech, somebody can completely forget the pain that nation caused them. It's like what Rikerslade quoted, both ways are bad, but Naruto is the lesser evil.

 

[uchihajaime]

Actually, all five nations have united, and the common theme throughout the war is that the wall of hatred between the nations has dissapeared.

That and trapping people in a world that they are willing to fight against is clearly unethical. Obito just wants to take away free will, a crime against nature. Then leave literally everyone sleeping under a genjutsu, so they can die of thirst in three days.
Naruto on the other hand wants a real peace, not an illusion of peace. He wants everyone to agree on peace, not have it forced on them.

 

[kladara]

Agreed and well said .

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

I agree. Naruto will, in the long run, fail miserably. His peace is short term. However, Obito's peace is horrible. All of humanity lies in the good will of a single mad man? That's not very attractive.
I'd just say go with the flow of the world.

 

[-ahhimane-]

I agree with your points. But for the story, Kishi's inspired by the stories he heard from his grandfather who fought in the World War or experienced the consequences. He's contributing his side through his manga as to how a Future War can be stopped/suppressed or what people should consider before knowing its consequences.
In the real world, the generation after the War haven't faced any War till today so we don't know actually how a war is ans its consequences (even if we enjoy them in any anime or movies) As said, the war in the movies and animes are not the real things but gives a picture of how it can be if everyone goes wild for their own desires.
Kishi must have his answer as to how he wants to prevent such wars. And that is why he chose the easiest way to the new generations, that is, the manga/anime, because the new generations desires to be aloof from the outside world. (including me)
That's why Kishi always says that he had pictured the end of the manga and has no second thought about changing it.
Kishi himself said in his interviews.

 

[take it easy]

It's implausible how just from one speech, somebody can completely forget the pain that nation caused them.

why you think ninja which working together in this war cant working together in peace time?

I agree. Naruto will, in the long run, fail miserably. His peace is short term.

next current generation+next generation of united ninja without war= strong peace

 

[Draxus]

"Philosophically" different views can be right to a degree.

am not gonna address what naruto believes because how he wants to reach this peace is indeed naive (his means to reach this peace is unrealistic, it's all about showing up and saying something like "i will carry your hate").

but what madara and obito want to achieve is not peace, it's forcing what they think is right on people/actually the entire world and it's nothing more than an illusion.

now after looking at both sides/views, naruto's side of "trying to understand each other, to reach peace" is a noble/meaningful goal that is worth the effort/pursuing. while the other view is nothing more than a dark, hopeless, meaningless illusion that simply gave up on humanity (this is not being realistic, it's called being weak).

so NO madara and obito are wrong and living in an imaginary world without free will is not the answer.

Well said.

 

[Touken]

Taking away free will, is a crime against nature. No one should have power over anyones life even if it's good or bad. Utopia in it self is flawed because no peace can be accomplished when free will is taken away.

I believe in the Infinite Tsukyomi they still have their free will and everything is perceived as real. If this is the case, is it truly taking away free will? What Obito is essentially creating is a paradise.

 

[Byron123]

Well naruto as in whole, has passed many realistic and important messages and as you said it's a manga and its creator tries to give a hope for a better future. Otherwise it would be sad if the evil eventually prevails.

 

[BlacLord™]

In manga land sure, but they only united around the idea of destruction and hate of Obito. Out of fear of Madara's name. In that way, Madara was absolutely correct to say that the world had not changed in his absence and that they had not learned much. Hashirama will lose to Madara, because in his life (and apparently still) he failed to realize this. Hashirama's desire to create peace was not enough, even with his power, because he was unwilling to sacrifice anything for it.

I agree with your original post but not that. Hashirama was willing to sacrifice his own life. No major country in our world would consider partaking in a full scale war nowadays, but it is only because of fear.

 

[htmwall]

madara and obito are the biggest whiny ones,all what they did so far was just pure luck(awakening MS,EMS,rinnegan is achieved throught pure luck and because of the power of love,prove me wrong if you can),obito wants to create a world that fits what he only wants,is that really a peace?that's plain slavery especially the fact that they're both controlled one person,yagura and look what happened,purges and civil wars.not to mention the whole moon eye plan makes no sense,because it's impossible to just project the genjutsu on the moon,it was clearly an asspull.

 

[Cosman]

These Uchihas have the shittiest ideologies I have ever seen. Naruto may be wrong, but the ideas and thought processing abilities of these Uchihas stem form nothing but butthurt and frailty. Madara has almost no motivation to speak of, and Obito's entire concept is driven from his inability to accept reality.

Nobody in this manga is in the right. Every single character that has an influence on this world's outcome has some shortcoming. It seems Naruto is always the scapegoat for flawed thinking, which I find myself laughing at.

 

[Transcendence]

And taking away free will, a crime against nature is better? Everybody that is under the genjutsu will inevitably die from lack of water in three days anyway... If you want to be realistic .

 

[take it easy]

reads manga about lighting from ass and fire from mouth and then want reality...

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[iNotorious]

These Uchihas have the shittiest ideologies I have ever seen. Naruto may be wrong, but the ideas and thought processing abilities of these Uchihas stem form nothing but butthurt and frailty. Madara has almost no motivation to speak of, and Obito's entire concept is driven from his inability to accept reality.

Nobody in this manga is in the right. Every single character that has an influence on this world's outcome has some shortcoming. It seems Naruto is always the scapegoat for flawed thinking, which I find myself laughing at.

And taking away free will, a crime against nature is better? Everybody that is under the genjutsu will inevitably die from lack of water in three days anyway... If you want to be realistic .

^ I like these answers OP.