[Predictions] Naruto Manga Chapter 517 Discussion and 518 Predictions
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I really think that there is a better chance that edo tensei summons are at full power than not. We have seen Deidera do some pretty drastic things with his explosions while an edo tensei summon including flipping over the giant turtle. And don't forget, Sarutobi was regarded as the strongest hokage at his time, stronger than both the 1st and 2nd; I think it is very likely that he fought them at full strength especially since his fight with them was reasonably short.
Wrong. I actually hated that part about DBZ and GT. Rivalry amongst the Leaf 10 was what I loved about Naruto and this war is a great opportunity for Kishi to show off some underrated characters. Obviously, Naruto will be the hero but let others shine for once.
Hopefully Kabuto captured Anko rather than killing her. Great chapter overall. Can't wait to see more Edo Tensei summons fight. Let's hope the next chapter isn't all about Sai's brother.
Sennin Jinchuuriki
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The thing is nothing is mentioned about Sarutobi being stronger than the 1st or the 2nd. And even if he is stronger than both of them individually then there is now way that he was stronger than the both of them together specially at that old age. And if he was stronger than the both of them together then why couldn't he beat Oro who was definitely weaker than Itachi and while guys like Madara and Nagato are/were stronger than Itachi. It just doesn't make any sense. So the most logical explanation is that the summons though had the powers of the real guys but not to the full extent, and this might be one of the few weakness or drawbacks of Edo Tensei.
Akatsuki leader
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you forgot this: kabuto edo tensei tech is much stronger tech than orochimarus edo tensei!
I believe the difference in power between the 1st and 2nd when they fought the 3rd VS their strenght when they were at their prime is due to the fact that orochimaru surpressed their personalities.And kabuto so far hasn't. And has said that his "tag" is different, not blocking completly the soul's personality. That makes me believe that edo tensei ninjas will be as strong as they were in life. The only exception will be Nagato, itachi and probably the former jinchurikis. Why? because then they would be to strong.
Next chapter I guess will show us the rest of the battle. I, however, think that kishi should pause the action for a chapter, and introduce some explainations. About Madara (just a bit more pleeeeasssseeeee...), the new relation/powers that naruto now has from the fox, the origin of nagato and, if it weren't to much to ask, explain in detail how edo tensei works, step by step. He could call an elder (one of the frogs for example) to the story so that they could explain more things. Or have madara blab about all of it in a monologue like he did with konan.
Also, is konan really really dead? and jiraya? and kisame? now I don't know for sure...are they?
Next chapter I guess will show us the rest of the battle. I, however, think that kishi should pause the action for a chapter, and introduce some explainations. About Madara (just a bit more pleeeeasssseeeee...), the new relation/powers that naruto now has from the fox, the origin of nagato and, if it weren't to much to ask, explain in detail how edo tensei works, step by step. He could call an elder (one of the frogs for example) to the story so that they could explain more things. Or have madara blab about all of it in a monologue like he did with konan.
Also, is konan really really dead? and jiraya? and kisame? now I don't know for sure...are they?
About the dead demon and edo tensei (1st, 2nd and 3rd hokage battle)
IMHO, some people missed a basic detail about techniques involving summoning the dead demon:
It allows anyone who knows the seals to defeat almost any enemy,
regardless of their relative skill.
This means that bringing someone down with the dead demon does not in any way imply that they are stronger. Maybe the opposite, since it's a last resort.
Was minato stronger than the kyubi? no.
Was hiruzen stronger than the 1st and 2nd hokage? no, that's why he used that technique, to force a draw. nobody won.. except maybe orochimaru, for some mysterious reasons.
Hiruzen wasn't stronger than the summons of hashirama and tobirama combined (just for being able to stop the two).
My conclusion is that edo tensei summons posess the same power as when they were alive, plus the immortality thing.
---- example
There are two enemy shinobi, one very powerful, one weaker. Both can call upon the dead demon, but the weaker one just happens to do it sooner. Does that mean that the one who did it was more powerful? The stronger one would never try to use the dead demon. It's a technique for the weak and desperate
IMHO, some people missed a basic detail about techniques involving summoning the dead demon:
It allows anyone who knows the seals to defeat almost any enemy,
regardless of their relative skill.
This means that bringing someone down with the dead demon does not in any way imply that they are stronger. Maybe the opposite, since it's a last resort.
Was minato stronger than the kyubi? no.
Was hiruzen stronger than the 1st and 2nd hokage? no, that's why he used that technique, to force a draw. nobody won.. except maybe orochimaru, for some mysterious reasons.
Hiruzen wasn't stronger than the summons of hashirama and tobirama combined (just for being able to stop the two).
My conclusion is that edo tensei summons posess the same power as when they were alive, plus the immortality thing.
---- example
There are two enemy shinobi, one very powerful, one weaker. Both can call upon the dead demon, but the weaker one just happens to do it sooner. Does that mean that the one who did it was more powerful? The stronger one would never try to use the dead demon. It's a technique for the weak and desperate
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Sennin Jinchuuriki
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You got a point but if that's the case then Edo Tensei would be the ultimate tech which I think is not. Most probably Kabuto's version of the Edo Tensei lets his handle more guys just like we saw. Again I am repeating this if the summons are at full strength then it would be impossible to beat Edo Tensei. But from the looks of things Kishi showed Edo Tensei before the war so that means that ultimately someone that is either Madara/Naruto/Sasuke will defeat the Edo Tensei tech and then Kaubto.
"first post in this forum"
Heres my input on Edo Tensei. The tech does resurrect the dead at full power, plus immortality, plus endless chakra (due to immortality). Now, this was limited when done by Oro because he was in complete control of the bodies; meaning the bodies were only as strong as Oro knew about them and their techs. Thats why Kabuto and his different tags enable more strength in the resurrected dead. They know when to use their tech and how to use it plus the tech you don't know about. With that said, I believe that itself is also the weakness in Kabuto's tech. There's that slight bit of consciousness that might spark a revolt. Here's the trick though. Does Kabuto see what the resurrected bodies see? Does he sense them? How will he know when something goes wrong? And if he can see/sense throw them, this tech is better than having the rinnegan's controll over dead people since he can control more bodies and make them immortal.
I also agree with Alkad in how the dead demon summon is the last resort. If he was stronger or younger he could have then blew them up. It also could have been the shock and thats another factor.
I don't know, thats just how i see it. what do you think?
Heres my input on Edo Tensei. The tech does resurrect the dead at full power, plus immortality, plus endless chakra (due to immortality). Now, this was limited when done by Oro because he was in complete control of the bodies; meaning the bodies were only as strong as Oro knew about them and their techs. Thats why Kabuto and his different tags enable more strength in the resurrected dead. They know when to use their tech and how to use it plus the tech you don't know about. With that said, I believe that itself is also the weakness in Kabuto's tech. There's that slight bit of consciousness that might spark a revolt. Here's the trick though. Does Kabuto see what the resurrected bodies see? Does he sense them? How will he know when something goes wrong? And if he can see/sense throw them, this tech is better than having the rinnegan's controll over dead people since he can control more bodies and make them immortal.
I also agree with Alkad in how the dead demon summon is the last resort. If he was stronger or younger he could have then blew them up. It also could have been the shock and thats another factor.
I don't know, thats just how i see it. what do you think?
Akatsuki leader
Active member
its not nesessery defeat the edo tensei tech only enough beat the USER (kabuto)..... and thats easily for madara he can use sharingan and rinengan and now sasuke have ems so madara and sasuke easily can defeat kabuto......
But maybe not. WHAT IF KABUTO research some tech or implanted something to immuned himself from sharingan?
and orochimaru need someone soul to use edo tensei he used some student soul from soundvillage.... but kabuto dont need that....
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Yukimaru Yoshi
Member
You can't regenerate something that isn't their. That's why I say amaterasu would be great against the summons. But I do agree with you, worst cast senario the bodies keep burning. But that all depends on the speed of regeneration. If amaterasu can burn the body faster then it can regenerate then amaterasu will make an ideal jutsu against the summons. The problem with amaterasu are only, sasuke, itachi and most likely madara knows how to use it and at the given moment they are on the same side as the summons ( at least thats what we all think).
Ive been trying to find jutsu's that will be useful to fight Edo tensei ive created a list.
1st. Yamanaka Clan Jutsu's: Body switch and mind transfer jutsu's
These two jutsu's can play a major roll if they can take over kabuto's mind or body. Side effect ( if the clan member misses the body switch, it will take a while before their souls get back to their body)
2nd. Uchiha clan susanoo, Amerterasu, and Tsukuyomi
If Itachi temporarily breaks free of the jutsu, he can use susanoo to seal the souls. Because he can't approach kabuto face on without kabuto erasing his mind using Tsukuyomi is out of the question. Therefore, sasuke will have to be the one to use it on kabuto. With the nature of Amerterasu, its a possibility it can burn the bodies faster then it can regenerate. Side effect ( body will continue to burn and possibly cause amerterasu to spread to others)
3rd. Danzo's Ura Shishou (body sealing technique). This would have been a great jutsu to use against the summons or kabuto, but because hes already dead it wont play a huge roll in the war unless someone has a similar jutsu without the huge side effects to use the jutsu (death).
4th. Nara clan: with their shadow base jutsu's they can temporarily stop the edo tensei summons. Side effect ( jutsu can only be maintain for a short period of time, loses strenght in light)
5th. Kekashi MS (God of majetsy) demension warp jutsu. The jutsu can be useful, but the side effects puts a huge toll on kekashi. Side effects are ( number of times he can use the jutsu, the distance he can move that object, the jutsu leaves him very fatigue which can put him in danger)
6th. Death God jutsu: we all know about this one.. The 3rd used it against 1st and 2nd hokage. Huge side effect (jutsu user dies after jutsu)
7th. Soul sealing jutsu's: Even though we have yet to see any, we have seen similar jutsu's being used , but not on a living person. for ex, the bijuu sealing. The bijuu sealing varies from villeage to villeage, but if they can use it on a bijuu why not on a living soul? side effect ( time to prepare the jutsu, user face danger due to remaing still to seal the souls of choice)
8th. Yamato wood element: Although hes been caught, his wood element technique would be useful. side effect ( kabuto can supress the 1st powers)
I can list some more, but to lazy
feel free to add ur own so we can have a list of possible jutsu's that can help fight edo tensei :flaw:When we saw the 3rd's fight against orochimaru, the bodies seemed to regenerate after losing their limbs. Don't know if a complete obliteration jutsu (like for example tchushikage's dust justus or amaterasu or one of the chakra blasts from the eight tails of naruto's tailed form) that destroys the whole body will be enough to stop them. Not quite sure about that.You can't regenerate something that isn't their. That's why I say amaterasu would be great against the summons. But I do agree with you, worst cast senario the bodies keep burning. But that all depends on the speed of regeneration. If amaterasu can burn the body faster then it can regenerate then amaterasu will make an ideal jutsu against the summons. The problem with amaterasu are only, sasuke, itachi and most likely madara knows how to use it and at the given moment they are on the same side as the summons ( at least thats what we all think).
Ive been trying to find jutsu's that will be useful to fight Edo tensei ive created a list.
1st. Yamanaka Clan Jutsu's: Body switch and mind transfer jutsu's
These two jutsu's can play a major roll if they can take over kabuto's mind or body. Side effect ( if the clan member misses the body switch, it will take a while before their souls get back to their body)
2nd. Uchiha clan susanoo, Amerterasu, and Tsukuyomi
If Itachi temporarily breaks free of the jutsu, he can use susanoo to seal the souls. Because he can't approach kabuto face on without kabuto erasing his mind using Tsukuyomi is out of the question. Therefore, sasuke will have to be the one to use it on kabuto. With the nature of Amerterasu, its a possibility it can burn the bodies faster then it can regenerate. Side effect ( body will continue to burn and possibly cause amerterasu to spread to others)
3rd. Danzo's Ura Shishou (body sealing technique). This would have been a great jutsu to use against the summons or kabuto, but because hes already dead it wont play a huge roll in the war unless someone has a similar jutsu without the huge side effects to use the jutsu (death).
4th. Nara clan: with their shadow base jutsu's they can temporarily stop the edo tensei summons. Side effect ( jutsu can only be maintain for a short period of time, loses strenght in light)
5th. Kekashi MS (God of majetsy) demension warp jutsu. The jutsu can be useful, but the side effects puts a huge toll on kekashi. Side effects are ( number of times he can use the jutsu, the distance he can move that object, the jutsu leaves him very fatigue which can put him in danger)
6th. Death God jutsu: we all know about this one.. The 3rd used it against 1st and 2nd hokage. Huge side effect (jutsu user dies after jutsu)
7th. Soul sealing jutsu's: Even though we have yet to see any, we have seen similar jutsu's being used , but not on a living person. for ex, the bijuu sealing. The bijuu sealing varies from villeage to villeage, but if they can use it on a bijuu why not on a living soul? side effect ( time to prepare the jutsu, user face danger due to remaing still to seal the souls of choice)
8th. Yamato wood element: Although hes been caught, his wood element technique would be useful. side effect ( kabuto can supress the 1st powers)
I can list some more, but to lazy
All the justus seem to be useful against them except the yamanaka clan justus. Why? because their minds are in control of kabuto and besides, they aren't naturally in their bodies so don't think a mind manipulation jutsu would work in the same way. Perhaps genjutsu would...but don't know...
yes but if there were no tactics why did they send ambush squads
u must think well naruto is even one of the realistic cartoons and even naruto is not the only one who has been destroying everyone unlike goku mostly
. if u know its going to end like that then wat do u expect it to be. the only reason good wins is b/c in real life it doesn't happen much.
kiotsukatanna
Member
The jutsu doesn't use the actual body of the person summoned. It simply recreates it. Kabuto is definitely not using Sasori's puppet body, the one Kankuro has, as seen by the fact that Sasori is in a human body now, the one he had before he switched it out for a puppet one. He doesn't have the line around his neck that was/is present on his puppet body, which presumably means what I said, that he is now in a human body.
very nice post. I like the various predictions for future match-ups. Just to answer your question about sasori's body: Edo Tensei does not rely on the body of the dead person, it simply makes the sacrificed person resemble the reseructed shinobi. this is shown once sarutobi defeats the 1st and 2nd hokage:
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but u never know maybe he didnt use all his atacksBut now kanurou knows sasoris attacks due to their previous encounter, so he should have a small advantage. omoi is kick ass powerful and hardcore and sai... I love his personality...I hope he kicks ass
I am new here and this chapter was very exciting for me. I was proved right on two parts to a friend. The first is that the resurected root member was Sai's brother. Second that Kishi will show each of the battles of the mainstreem characters and their loved ones. Another friend of mine foolishly thinks that Neji's father will fight Hiashi when Neji is obviously more of a mainstream character and will be affected by the confrontation more than Hiashi.
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