NaruHina fans

[Shruikan]

I know we disagree on this but when I was powering through the story to catch up about 6 months ago and I read 437 it pretty much sealed the deal for me. Regardless of development, I didn't think that Kishimoto would have Hinata say that and not follow up on it. It's not something you do with a side character just to leave her flapping in the wind at the end.of the story.

Lets agree to disagree because he didnt follow up on it at all IMO.I would have preferred development after the fake confession like some interaction but alas it didnt happen

The only thing which kept me from NH was actual solid interaction.I have no problems shipping 2 couples as I do in Bleach

 

[superturtle]

1. I might be very biased towards NaruHina, because unlike you guys above, Hinata is my fav character of the series.
NOT because of her "being a door mat" (or worse, "having boobs") - but because of her OBVIOUS development and selflessness, both being turned into actual plot devices.
I see none of it with Sakura - unless you include NEGATIVE plot devices like Failfession as well.
At least Hinata's were always POSITIVE.
Also, why do you ignore that Hinata actually explains her LOVE for Naruto?
Yes, it's based on personality admiration - but I actually prefer such a love over a "romantic" one.
Sure, a matter of personal taste, but valid nonetheless.

2. There are two aspects here:
Whether I like a certain pairing as a stand-alone.
AND
Whether a certain pairing is the best available option for the characters.
Those two can lead to very different results actually.
I'd really prefer LeeSaku over SasuSaku as a stand-alone (same logic goes for the majority of NaruSakus, it seems), but the moment I take Sakura-the-character into consideration, SasuSaku is the only option for her CANON self.
I don't like it, but I don't see Sakura with anyone else, INCLUDING Naruto.
Same goes for Hinata being a NaruHina must (actually, even more so, cause she doesn't even have any CANON alternatives).
Sasuke also gravitates towards SasuSaku due to how the entire plot was concocted (Karin is too unimportant in Sasuke's world to be a valid option).
And finally Naruto potentially COULD end up with Hinata OR Sakura, but the fact that Sakura has other options (and one of them is STRONGER than NaruSaku from her POV), while Hinata doesn't - automatically leads to NaruHina anyways.
Note:
This is based on their plot-roles, NOT character interaction.
IF we go by the latter, all of the above gets an OVER 9000 boost immediately.

I like the idea of Hinata's character, but she was badly underdeveloped in story. It's the same problem that most of the other rookies share.

 

[superturtle]

Lets agree to disagree because he didnt follow up on it at all IMO.I would have preferred development after the fake confession like some interaction but alas it didnt happen

The only thing which kept me from NH was actual solid interaction.I have no problems shipping 2 couples as I do in Bleach

Blame Kishimoto for not showing almost any casual interactions between anybody after the timeskip. It seems like he forgot to write in actual bonding moments in his series. That, and after the confession it wasn't too long after that he went to beg the Rai kage for Sasuke's forgiveness and then got herded to that island with Bee. After that it was straight into the war arc and we never looked back. There wasn't much of a chance for their interactions now that I think about it. Still, I'll agree that it should have been handled much better in story.

 

[Koshej]

I like the idea of Hinata's character, but she was badly underdeveloped in story. It's the same problem that most of the other rookies share.

None of the Rookies had moments like 98 or 559, which are very important for my whole idea.
Naruto might OUTWARDLY seem to ignore Hinata - but these little moments actually show how well they SUIT each other.
I'd call it a SOUL BOND, which NaruSaku lacks whatsoever (being replaced by a GOAL BOND over Sasuke).
SasuSaku also lacks either, which is signified by Sakura openly stating to "not having any reasons to love Sasuke" - which is probably the worst "romantic" mistake of Kishi's altogether.

 

[Shruikan]

Blame Kishimoto for not showing almost any casual interactions between anybody after the timeskip. It seems like he forgot to write in actual bonding moments in his series. That, and after the confession it wasn't too long after that he went to beg the Rai kage for Sasuke's forgiveness and then got herded to that island with Bee. After that it was straight into the war arc and we never looked back. There wasn't much of a chance for their interactions now that I think about it. Still, I'll agree that it should have been handled much better in story.

He called a meeting of K11 after the Kage Summit for the Sasuke issue including Hinata but even there he fcked up a golden opportunity

Even in the War Arc he could have made it so that even Hinata was safe from IT so we could see em fighting Kaguya together for potential NH moments but he screwed that too

 

[superturtle]

He called a meeting of K11 after the Kage Summit for the Sasuke issue including Hinata but even there he fcked up a golden opportunity

Yep. Dropped the ball badly.

 

[Sjhsgjhsgjshjshjsh]

Its not a surprise he died for that reason . I like the fact kishi doesn't sugarcoat

 

[paratise]

None of the Rookies had moments like 98 or 559, which are very important for my whole idea.

Lol.

Good amount of them barring Tenten, Shino and maybe Kiba had better character defining moments.

Your bias towards Hinata clouds your judgement and could not even comprehend with parts of manga which did not involve her.

 

[Shruikan]

Its not a surprise he died for that reason . I like the fact kishi doesn't sugarcoat

It was a lame way to kill of a bad ass guy like that for a pairing which still sucked because it didnt get any moments after he died either.In fact his death was their last moment in the manga

 

[Koshej]

Even in the War Arc he could have made it so that even Hinata was safe from IT so we could see em fighting Kaguya together for potential NH moments but he screwed that too

+9000
I was waiting for a NaruHina FIGHTING COMBO moment ever since 437...
I fully agree that Kishi ignored a golden scene there.
Maybe cause he relapsed to Hinata being "Chichi", since Chichi never had any fighting importance..?

 

[1Told]

Too be fair though unlike NH JKR actually showed hints for HG in books so although I shipped HH I always knew it wouldnt be canon BUT I liked their chemistry more

if JKR had bollocks, Hermione would have ended with Draco.
Ron deserved someone like Luna and Harry basically i don't give a crap about him but clearly Ron's little sis was too good for this wannabe jesus

 

[Koshej]

Lol.

Good amount of them barring Tenten, Shino and maybe Kiba had better character defining moments.

Your bias towards Hinata clouds your judgement and could not even comprehend with parts of manga which did not involve her.

I dare you to link me a moment when Kiba or Shikamaru (or any non-T7 Rookie actually) influenced Naruto in any way out of their own initiative.
You do realize I singled out 98 and 559, NOT 437 and 615, right?
The latter were romantic and could NOT be applied to anyone but Hinata.
The former were more bond-related, so it could've been Kiba instead of Hinata no prob (he actually appears in both, lol).
Yet it WASN'T.
Nor was it Sakura either, mind you.

 

[paratise]

I dare you to link me a moment when Kiba or Shikamaru (or any non-T7 Rookie actually) influenced Naruto in any way out of their own initiative.
You do realize I singled out 98 and 559, NOT 437 and 615, right?
The latter were romantic and could NOT be applied to anyone but Hinata.
The former were more bond-related, so it could've been Kiba instead of Hinata no prob (he actually appears in both, lol).
Yet it WASN'T.
Nor was it Sakura either, mind you.

I am not speaking of influence to Naruto, mind you he is not the only thing in manga. I am speaking of character defining moments all in all, not just regarding to MC.

And to be frank, Shimaru did impact Naruto's development a lot when he spoke of how to be grown ups and protectors of leaf when Jiraiya died. He was the one who pulled Naruto's feet down to reality. Lee did effect Naruto's mindset on not to give up and Neji sacrficed himself for him (even with a shitty way) But my main point was them having their moments which defined them, quite better than Hinata.

Sakura had a different type of impact, both series and Naruto. You judge chars by whether they do what Hinata did or not?

 

[Ansatsuken]

As I said - I don't think it's 'the reason' Kishimoto killed off Neji.

Consider the original conflict between Naruto and Neji - the "Destiny" and "Loser" argument where Naruto challenged what Neji assumed was Naruto's destiny - and how Neji was destined to die in defense of the head branch.

Also note how Naruto said he would change the Hyuuga.

Consider that Naruto was the child of prophecy - that he was destined to do great things... Even though Naruto appeared to be the boy who defied destiny - he was merely fulfilling his own destiny.

Thus, Neji must fulfill his destiny at some point. He must defend the head branch. Naruto must change the Hyuuga. It all overlays into a situation where Hinata defends Naruto and Neji defends the two of them, choosing to defend a friend. He finally earns his freedom.

Because of the intimacy of the whole thing - it is only natural to assume it would 'throw' Naruto and Hinata together.

I would argue that Neji's death in the series was predestined. It was going to happen, and it would happen defending Hinata. It would also involve defending Naruto. This was most likely conceived around the time of the Chunnin Exam arc.

Yeah I agree with you here

What Neji done is very important from his own self, and I can see that also, I dont think this can be problematic like this thread, its very deep matters between Hyuuga here as Neji is the closet to Hyuuga head branch future heir that is Hinata there and savour of Naruto world that is Naruto, he goes to protect Hyuuga heir and also a world saviour, and that his intention only, not about parring because he care less about that, he just do what he need to be done although he now that his life will be over.

Peoples rage here is not because Neji cant die, but it because his development his prematured and when he die, it will became a waste of good potential character, if peoples sees Neji development is happen although not in the level of Naruto and Sasuke, maybe peoples rage and dissatisfaction will not to hard as right now, the dissatisfaction is still happen but not to extreme. That what Im thinking right now.

Kishi have a plot but he done it wrong.

 

[Koshej]

I am not speaking of influence to Naruto, mind you he is not the only thing in manga. I am speaking of character defining moments all in all, not just regarding to MC.

And to be frank, Shimaru did impact Naruto's development a lot when he spoke of how to be grown ups and protectors of leaf when Jiraiya died. He was the one who pulled Naruto's feet down to reality. Lee did effect Naruto's mindset on not to give up and Neji sacrficed himself for him (even with a shitty way) But my main point was them having their moments which defined them, quite better than Hinata.

Sakura had a eifferent type of impact, both series and Naruto. You judge chars by whether they do what Hinata did or not?

Yes, I do.
Cause when it comes to BONDS, Hinata's bond with Naruto is the most selfless one, while at the same time showcasing such sides of Naruto that we don't see from his other interactions (which is why I focus on 98 and 559, which are unique to NaruHina).
Which is why I asked for similar moments with any other Rookie - where we see Naruto being "OOC" in a way.
98 signifies Naruto opening up about his insecurities (and the fact he "wears a mask") to a SUPPOSED total stranger for the first time in the series; then Hinata is suddenly able to cheer him up by being the first (or only) person to like the LAME Naruto (not the HERO one later on) for WHO HE IS.
559 signifies Naruto AND Hinata understanding someone to the degree of going cliche about "the eyes being the soul's mirror", totally unique.
I dare you to show me similar or stronger moments he had with other Rookies.

 

[paratise]

Yes, I do.
Cause when it comes to BONDS, Hinata's bond with Naruto is the most selfless one, while at the same time showcasing such sides of Naruto that we don't see from his other interactions (which is why I focus on 98 and 559, which are unique to NaruHina).
Which is why I asked for similar moments with any other Rookie - where we see Naruto being "OOC" in a way.
98 signifies Naruto opening up about his insecurities (and the fact he "wears a mask") to a SUPPOSED total stranger for the first time in the series; then Hinata is suddenly able to cheer him up by being the first (or only) person to like the LAME Naruto (not the HERO one later on) for WHO HE IS.
559 signifies Naruto AND Hinata understanding someone to the degree of going cliche about "the eyes being the soul's mirror", totally unique.
I dare you to show me similar or stronger moments he had with other Rookies.

I don't get why those moments are suppose to be relevant to Naruto, as they are not sattelites like Hinata is. And most of them are males, which means they can not be romantically involved with him (in this manga) so...why would one judge them over how they influence him or not? They have different inspirations and basis as characters. ..

Hinata's bond with Naruto is not the most selfless one, it seems like an odd one sided obsession rather than an actual bond until The Last. Several characters have shown to be selfless for their loved ones and what they care for like Minato, Sasuke, Gai, Sakura, Kushina,
Obito, Konan, Nagato, Yahiko, Neji, Gaara, Lee...heck even Kisame have been selfless for a cause.

Nobody liked Lame Naruto or cheered him up until 98? What? Who is Iruka then?

@ bold are you trying to say it is unique and cliche at the same time? I don't get it.

Btw here is Shikamaru's moment of influence:

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And Lee:

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Since you care so much about whether some of them influenced Naruto or not...Some did but unlike Hinata they had other things going on for their characters, and they don't have obligation to be relevant to his character that much.

 

[lndra]

All this salt yet NH is the best cannon pairing in the entire manga.

Kishimoto sucks at romance, yet look what happened. I'd hate to imagine what he plans for SS, let alone ChokixWhateverhernameis

 

[Shruikan]

All this salt yet NH is the best cannon pairing in the entire manga.

Kishimoto sucks at romance, yet look what happened. I'd hate to imagine what he plans for SS, let alone ChokixWhateverhernameis

Guys on 2ch saying the chance of a SS novel is looking more and more like a possibility

The best canon pairing in the manga is ShikaTema IMO

 

[Koshej]

I don't get why those moments are suppose to be relevant to Naruto, as they are not sattelites like Hinata is. And most of them are males, which means they can not be romantically involved with him (in this manga) so...why would one judge them over how they influence him or not? They have different inspirations and basis as characters...

You must be blind, cause I specifically SAID why I chose 98 and 559 as being NOT explicitly romantic, but rather SOUL-BONDING instead.
You keep focusing on sappy romance, as if couples can't get together for more "pragmatic" reasons.
I actually PREFER the latter - personality admiration, mutual goals, mutual outlook on life, etc.
Sappy romance ends with age, while "pragmatic" reasons actually may GROW instead (and usually DO).

Hinata's bond with Naruto is not the most selfless one, it seems like an odd one sided obsession rather than an actual bond until The Last. Several characters have shown to be selfless for their loved ones and what they care for like Minato, Sasuke, Gai, Sakura, Kushina,
Obito, Konan, Nagato, Yahiko, Neji, Gaara, Lee...heck even Kisame have been selfless for a cause.

Maybe it's my English about what "bond" means.
I mean that Hinata makes us see such sides of naruto that we never see in ANY other interaction.
And Naruto seems to realize that as well at times.

Nobody liked Lame Naruto or cheered him up until 98? What? Who is Iruka then?

I meant from his own age group, you know that.
Also, I don't recall Iruka PRAISING Naruto for anything like being a "proud failure" - or am I missing a page here?
Be my guest and LINK me to Iruka saying stuff like that.

@ bold are you trying to say it is unique and cliche at the same time? I don't get it.

Cliche overall as a type of action, unique in-universe as far as the character interaction.
Don't play dumb.

Btw here is Shikamaru's moment of influence:

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I'll give you that.

And Lee:

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Um, no.
The whole destiny topic has been extremely screwed up by Kishi with the idiotic Ootsutsuki FAMILY introduction.
I've read very diverse comments on that.

Since you care so much about whether some of them influenced Naruto or not...Some did but unlike Hinata they had other things going on for their characters, and they don't have obligation to be relevant to his character that much.

You completely miss my point.

 

[lndra]

Guys on 2ch saying the chance of a SS novel is looking more and more like a possibility

The best canon pairing in the manga is ShikaTema IMO

God I hope someone else writes it.
I really don't want to see Sakura crying because Sasuke is gone, and then he magically appears in a dream or a genjutsu.

The only hope for SS imo, would be Sasuke having feelings for Sakura but in the form of protection. Kind of how strict families show their love.

I would agree yet Kishimoto just made Temari follow him, it really just looked like Shikmaru was giving her that good D so she decided to leave Sunagakure for him. Besides that it looked like two tsunderes going at it.