Nagato can easily break Tsukuyomi

[Owarij]

Sorry I ment when Sasuke broke the genjustu in part 2.

Answer me this Uchiha fans. If you guys take every word Itachi says as the bible... Then why wouldn't Itachi stalemate Jirayia like he said in part 1

Noone takes itachi's words as fact.. the problem is the databook actually backs up itachi's statement by saying uchiha blood and sharingan is needed, and even then, exclusively the elite shinobi who have reached particularly high degrees of skillfulness


It's obvious why he won't stale mate with jman and it's obvious why he said what he said

 

[Helikido]

Sorry I ment when Sasuke broke the genjustu in part 2.

Answer me this Uchiha fans. If you guys take every word Itachi says as the bible... Then why wouldn't Itachi stalemate Jirayia like he said in part 1

He simply wanted to avoid catching naruto and killing jiraya? Do you not know that he is a pacifist?

 

[Zato]

Sorry I ment when Sasuke broke the genjustu in part 2.

Answer me this Uchiha fans. If you guys take every word Itachi says as the bible... Then why wouldn't Itachi stalemate Jirayia like he said in part 1

If you payed attention to what Itachi said in the recent chapters and what Tobi tells Sasuke about the "truth" of Itachi then you would know why Itachi ran from Jiraiya. Itachi went to Konoha for two reasons. One was the remind Danzo of their pact and to let him know that he is still living and the other was to fuel Sasuke's revenge.

 

[Seraphiel]

Kakashi not having a bother to fully wield sharingan had nothing to do with it... He doesn't have the body to resist mangekyou mental torture... and Nagato doesn't either...

Having more chakra doesn't mean anything.....Nagato is the same as kakashi but just with much more chakra and a better eye... I've already explained that uchiha blood is needed for resisting tsukyomi because Uchihas are born with high mental energy... Senju's , uzumaki's have physical energy.. something that won't help them here..


Breaking Tsukyomi has nothing to do with the BODY per se, It has to do with the MIND...... It's mental torture... And the Mind according to tobi is what uchihas were born better with....

Nagato being an Uzumaki means he has "powerful will and physical energy". And the Uchihas have "powerful chakra and spiritual energy"; they are actually not all that different. Nagato's" powerful will" is what would allow him to withstand torture, and his physical energy is what gives him the power to break Tsukuyomi. And he also has a superior doujutsu.

Nagato has extremely powerful chakra, he really cannot be compared to Kakashi in anyway. Remember that the Uzumaki have the endurance to withstand a Bijuu being extracted, even when it was stated that a Bijuu extraction would mean instant death.

P.S. Can you please not edit my posts? I don't like it when people edit them like that and don't respond to them fully.

 

[Enchanted Champion]

If you payed attention to what Itachi said in the recent chapters and what Tobi tells Sasuke about the "truth" of Itachi then you would know why Itachi ran from Jiraiya. Itachi went to Konoha for two reasons. One was the remind Danzo of their pact and to let him know that he is still living and the other was to fuel Sasuke's revenge.

I know this fact. My point is if he said something false like this to protect Kohana/Sasuke etc, then why couldnt he have said the Tsukuyomi thing as something to allude that he would only cast it on people who couldnt break it, expect sauske who he wanted to die by.

 

[Talal]

If Tsukuyomi lands Nagato instantly loses, but that doesn't mean that Itachi wins there are ways to work around it.

 

[iMicLykTyson]

Nagato being an Uzumaki means he has "powerful will and physical energy". And the Uchihas have "powerful chakra and spiritual energy"; they are actually not all that different. Nagato's" powerful will" is what would allow him to withstand torture, and his physical energy is what gives him the power to break Tsukuyomi. And he also has a superior doujutsu.

Nagato has extremely powerful chakra, he really cannot be compared to Kakashi in anyway. Remember that the Uzumaki have the endurance to withstand a Bijuu being extracted, even when it was stated that a Bijuu extraction would mean instant death.

P.S. Can you please not edit my posts? I don't like it when people edit them like that and don't respond to them fully.

he doesn't need to have powerful chakra he has to be an uchiha bloodline simple as that

 

[Helikido]

Nagato being an Uzumaki means he has "powerful will and physical energy". And the Uchihas have "powerful chakra and spiritual energy"; they are actually not all that different. Nagato's" powerful will" is what would allow him to withstand torture, and his physical energy is what gives him the power to break Tsukuyomi. And he also has a superior doujutsu.

Nagato has extremely powerful chakra, he really cannot be compared to Kakashi in anyway. Remember that the Uzumaki have the endurance to withstand a Bijuu being extracted, even when it was stated that a Bijuu extraction would mean instant death.

P.S. Can you please not edit my posts? I don't like it when people edit them like that and don't respond to them fully.

I really cannot say anything to a person who has no logic and basic comprehension. I rember the post were you said sasuke had Tsykiyomi lol. Such a fail. I'll just say this and that's all:

WHAT IS REQUIRED:

1st. An Uchiha body with MS awekening ability.

2. Pure uchiha eyes, MS or higher (Don't bring the sasuke vs Itachi argument, he went easy and was dying and wanted to conserve chakra).

BASICALLY:

An uzumaki with transplanted eyes does not meet the minimum requirement to break free

 

[Owarij]

Nagato being an Uzumaki means he has "powerful will and physical energy". And the Uchihas have "powerful chakra and spiritual energy"; they are actually not all that different. Nagato's" powerful will" is what could allow him to withstand torture, and his physical energy is what gives him the power to break Tsukuyomi. And he also has a superior doujutsu.

Nagato has extremely powerful chakra, he really cannot be compared to Kakashi in anyway. Remember that the Uzumaki have the endurance to withstand a Bijuu being extracted, even when it was stated that a Bijuu extraction would mean instant death.

P.S. Can you please not edit my posts? I don't like it when people edit them like that and don't

Spoiler

respond to them fully.

Spoiler

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Will? What are you talking about?
Phiscal energy and stanima...

Uchihas with mental/spirtual energy


Two ENTIRELY different things..Creating chakra is the combination of both mental and physical energy.... Both area's of expertise were split between the two brothers... Uchiha can withstand mental torture because of their mental energy... This is why Itachi said to fully resist tsukyomi you need their blood...

I have no idea what will you are talking about....Uzumaki's just have a strong life force....How does that have anything to do with being mentally raped?


Once again, you think this has to do with endurance? It isn't about that....This isn't physical pain.....The raikage can be tough as iron itself and still fall to tsukyomi...It doesn't matter enduring you are .....Mental damage is an entirely different ball game..

with no idea of when either of those will end. As a result, the poor prisoner can only wait until the collapse of their psyches...!! Even a body made of iron or the speed of light are powerless before this jutsu

There is simply nothing the person can do... Itachi chooses what happens in that realm and opposing him is impossible... 1 day, 3 days, 1 week, 1 month, according to him he's god.... and he varies the time to each person because he doesn't want to kill anyone..... According to the databook it's unfathomable mental pain.....


If I edited your post, it's because the edited part possibly wan't worth replying to..

 

[Seraphiel]

I really cannot say anything to a person who has no logic and basic comprehension. I rember the post were you said sasuke had Tsykiyomi lol. Such a fail. I'll just say this and that's all:

WHAT IS REQUIRED:

1st. An Uchiha body with MS awekening ability.

2. Pure uchiha eyes, MS or higher (Don't bring the sasuke vs Itachi argument, he went easy and was dying and wanted to conserve chakra).

BASICALLY:

An uzumaki with transplanted eyes does not meet the minimum requirement to break free

Eh... I don't respect you. This is my last post.

P.S. Sasuke has Tsukuyomi.

 

[Zato]

I really cannot say anything to a person who has no logic and basic comprehension. I rember the post were you said sasuke had Tsykiyomi lol. Such a fail. I'll just say this and that's all:

WHAT IS REQUIRED:

1st. An Uchiha body with MS awekening ability.

2. Pure uchiha eyes, MS or higher (Don't bring the sasuke vs Itachi argument, he went easy and was dying and wanted to conserve chakra).

BASICALLY:

An uzumaki with transplanted eyes does not meet the minimum requirement to break free

Sasuke does have Tsukuyomi. But that's another thread.

 

[Champ]

Owarij already explained it perfectly you have to be a clansmen of the uchiha with the Sharingan to overcome Tsukuyomi why because the Uchiha's have th Mental energy to overcome the mental torture.
The Manga explains the Uchiha clan ancestor inherited the Mental Power. The Senju, and Uzumaki's didn't.

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[Troyg39]

The more I've debated about this now I'm starting to think differently. Nagato wouldn't be able to easy break Tsukuyomi. It's not something that's easily broken now that I think about it.

I think most people have been like me and arguing something different: Whether Itachi could defeat Nagato with Tsukuyomi. Which I don't believe is true, since I don't think the peins sharing eye sights necessarily means they would all get put under genjutsu since clearly their mind/senses are separate from one another, as we saw when one of the pein was placed under Jiraiya's sound genjutsu, yet clearly the other peins and the real Nagato weren't effected by it.

But even still, If Itachi can place one of them under Tsukuyomi, the others wouldn't have any real way to break him out of it. Unless they kill the pein and then revive it again. Which still isn't quite an "easy" way to break Tsukuyomi

 

[Prime Rib]

In the Itachi vs Nagato threads I've seen to many fanboys mistakenly claim that Itachi could one shot Nagato with Tsukuyomi. The reasons why this would fail is because

Nagato is a sensor ninja: It has been noted that sensor ninja have the ability to sense changes in ones chakra and the chakra around them. This would alert him to being in genjustu and he could disrupt his chakra and break it.

proof that Nagato is a sensor ninja from Narutopedia:



The Rinnegan is an evolved sharigan: it is well known that the sharigan evolves into the rinnegan with the right conditions. If a normal 3 tomoe sharigan can break "the all powerful" Tsukuyomi then the rinnegan can as well. The rinnegan has shown to counter all other MS techniques so Tsukuyomi is no problem.

So with this it is clear that Nagato>>>Itachi, and itachi stands no chance U_U

sorry but a 3 sharingan tomoe sharingan cant break tsukyomi, kakashi couldent because he didnt share the same bloodline as itachi, so if your not a family member there is no way you can break it. so get your facts straight thanks

 

[Maunten]

This is Kabuto speaking TO MADARA about it. Which Madara then reveals that he awakened it after death. What more do you want him to say?

Awakening the rinnegan is not taking your sharingan itself to the level of rinnegan it is attaining an eye tech that is beyond the rinnegan.

Just as muu stated that madara did not die in that fight and madara said nothing, he has said nothing about kabuto's claim, then we had a resent talk no jutsu that confirmed madaras defeat, with hashirama ending a lot of claims that madara did not lose that fight.

Owarij already explained it perfectly you have to be a clansmen of the uchiha with the Sharingan to overcome Tsukuyomi why because the Uchiha's have th Mental energy to overcome the mental torture.
The Manga explains the Uchiha clan ancestor inherited the Mental Power. The Senju, and Uzumaki's didn't.

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No, anyone who has an incredible awareness of chakra can over come tsukyomi, that means byakugan users, senjutsu experts (people who have accomplished frog sage mode),rinnegan users (who show signs of great chakra control) and lastly uchiha clan members (who show the ability to see chakra).

 

[Kratos of cruxis]

You cant break out of tsyukiyomi unless you have the eyes and blood

 

[Blaze Release]

Whilst i agree nagato > itachi majority of the time, the argument for why nagato can break tsukuyomi is pitiful and goes against manga and databook facts.

Just because you have the sharingan/rinnegan doesnt mean you have necessarily abilities to break it and tbh i thought the scenario with kakashi has made it clear. Anyway DB entry;

Spoiler

NINJUTSU; KEKKEI GENKAI; Tsukuyomi
User: Uchiha Itachi
Supplementary; Close range; Rank: none

Main text

Amidst the insight and hypnosis possessed by Sharingan, is a supreme genjutsu, born from the aforementioned hypnosis: Tsukuyomi. Originally, people on the face of the Earth live bound by limitations like time, gravity, and space; and how people exert their abilities within those restrictions is what separates the victors from the vanquished. But in the mental world where the caster drags their opponent, the Tsukuyomi jutsu gives them control over those very limitations!

Namely, this means inside the genjutsu, the physical world's common sense is completely irrelevant and opposing the caster is impossible. Somebody caught into the Tsukuyomi find themselves into a strange world of infinity, their fate entirely lying inside the caster's hands. Some time, they will undergo the torments of Hell, and some other time, they will be repeatedly shown a horrendous, hellish picture of agony and mayhem*, with no idea of when either of those will end. As a result, the poor prisoner can only wait until the collapse of their psyches...!! Even a body made of iron or the speed of light are powerless before this jutsu, which is the reason why it is feared as the most powerful.

Sharingan is the Kekkei Genkai of the clan labeled as the most powerful, the Uchiha clan. Even among those who have Sharingan, that jutsu cannot be operated without having Mangekyou, which is its culminating point. Concurrently, the only ones who can defeat Tsukuyomi are Sharingan possessors... And even then, exclusively the elite shinobi who have reached particularly high degrees of skillfulness. Once could say this is truly a God-given jutsu solely allowed to those blessed with Uchiha blood and prodigious aptitudes.

Captions

-An inner hell as eternal as Heaven and Earth. The grip held onto the principles of all creation thoroughly annihilates one's heart and soul!!

-The ultimate doujutsu made possible only by Mangekyou Sharingan.

Picture comments

-The moment the adversary is exposed to Mangekyou Sharingan, a strange realm as they've never seen before extends before their eyes. In there, the world's principles themselves obey the caster's beck and call.

-Since attacks in the spiritual realm have no power to physically wound or kill, it bestows an unfathomable amount of mental damage.

-Only those of Uchiha blood... Does it mean only Sasuke has a chance to break a Tsukuyomi?

-The phenomena that happen inside of the mental realm are entirely the caster's to command. Which is to say, the images shown or the actions taken can be changed according to the opponent in order to yield maximum efficiency.

Databook 2, pages 252-253

Whilst manga facts along with databook facts back the idea that nagato cannot break it, the argument for he can is merely fan fiction and nothing more. Id stick to the manga and databook

 

[iMicLykTyson]

Awakening the rinnegan is not taking your sharingan itself to the level of rinnegan it is attaining an eye tech that is beyond the rinnegan.

Just as muu stated that madara did not die in that fight and madara said nothing, he has said nothing about kabuto's claim, then we had a resent talk no jutsu that confirmed madaras defeat, with hashirama ending a lot of claims that madara did not lose that fight.




No, anyone who has an incredible awareness of chakra can over come tsukyomi, that means byakugan users, senjutsu experts (people who have accomplished frog sage mode),rinnegan users (who show signs of great chakra control) and lastly uchiha clan members (who show the ability to see chakra).

Please show me where this has been stated anywhere in the manga/anime/data-book.

 

[svladcjelli42]

Nagato can't break Tsukuyomi because he can't do any sharingan techniques whatsoever and because he has repeatedly demonstrated that his only way out of genjutsu is assistance from another path. Just because the rinnegan evolves from the sharingan does not give Nagato sharingan mastery/understanding/expertise/ability.

EDIT: The SO6P has hybrid rinnegan/sharingan eyes, not an ordinary rinnegan. Obviously there is a point to having such eyes, and the ordinary rinnegan is inferior to sharingan in some aspects. Nagato fanboys just don't want their idol to be as vulnerable to genjutsu as he obviously is.

 

[svladcjelli42]

Whilst i agree nagato > itachi majority of the time, the argument for why nagato can break tsukuyomi is pitiful and goes against manga and databook facts.

Just because you have the sharingan/rinnegan doesnt mean you have necessarily abilities to break it and tbh i thought the scenario with kakashi has made it clear. Anyway DB entry;

Spoiler

NINJUTSU; KEKKEI GENKAI; Tsukuyomi
User: Uchiha Itachi
Supplementary; Close range; Rank: none

Main text

Amidst the insight and hypnosis possessed by Sharingan, is a supreme genjutsu, born from the aforementioned hypnosis: Tsukuyomi. Originally, people on the face of the Earth live bound by limitations like time, gravity, and space; and how people exert their abilities within those restrictions is what separates the victors from the vanquished. But in the mental world where the caster drags their opponent, the Tsukuyomi jutsu gives them control over those very limitations!

Namely, this means inside the genjutsu, the physical world's common sense is completely irrelevant and opposing the caster is impossible. Somebody caught into the Tsukuyomi find themselves into a strange world of infinity, their fate entirely lying inside the caster's hands. Some time, they will undergo the torments of Hell, and some other time, they will be repeatedly shown a horrendous, hellish picture of agony and mayhem*, with no idea of when either of those will end. As a result, the poor prisoner can only wait until the collapse of their psyches...!! Even a body made of iron or the speed of light are powerless before this jutsu, which is the reason why it is feared as the most powerful.

Sharingan is the Kekkei Genkai of the clan labeled as the most powerful, the Uchiha clan. Even among those who have Sharingan, that jutsu cannot be operated without having Mangekyou, which is its culminating point. Concurrently, the only ones who can defeat Tsukuyomi are Sharingan possessors... And even then, exclusively the elite shinobi who have reached particularly high degrees of skillfulness. Once could say this is truly a God-given jutsu solely allowed to those blessed with Uchiha blood and prodigious aptitudes.

Captions

-An inner hell as eternal as Heaven and Earth. The grip held onto the principles of all creation thoroughly annihilates one's heart and soul!!

-The ultimate doujutsu made possible only by Mangekyou Sharingan.

Picture comments

-The moment the adversary is exposed to Mangekyou Sharingan, a strange realm as they've never seen before extends before their eyes. In there, the world's principles themselves obey the caster's beck and call.

-Since attacks in the spiritual realm have no power to physically wound or kill, it bestows an unfathomable amount of mental damage.

-Only those of Uchiha blood... Does it mean only Sasuke has a chance to break a Tsukuyomi?

-The phenomena that happen inside of the mental realm are entirely the caster's to command. Which is to say, the images shown or the actions taken can be changed according to the opponent in order to yield maximum efficiency.

Databook 2, pages 252-253

Whilst manga facts along with databook facts back the idea that nagato cannot break it, the argument for he can is merely fan fiction and nothing more. Id stick to the manga and databook

^Itachi fanboy or no, this is the truth.