Madara is not > FTG

[shelke]

Now you're just going against the manga. As Madara clearly states that 'he USED to anticipate and Read' the technique during their battles as well, and Tobirama never negated it. Now unless you want to go against the manga, be my guest. Madara bested FTG Tobirama, that is a fact. He used to anticipate and counter it in the past, that is also a fact. FTG can be countered through reaction rate, another fact Manga showed through Bee. Feel free to ignore all these.

 

[xbreedsx]

So many FTG bashing, I still think the jutsu is still hax no matter what. Give FTG or KAMUI to Madara and nobody is touching him. Its all about the users. Madara skills bested Tobirama's.

 

[Multiply]

Now you're just going against the manga. As Madara clearly states that 'he USED to anticipate and Read' the technique during their battles as well, and Tobirama never negated it. Now unless you want to go against the manga, be my guest. Madara bested FTG Tobirama, that is a fact. He used to anticipate and counter it in the past, that is also a fact. FTG can be countered through reaction rate, another fact Manga showed through Bee. Feel free to ignore all these.

I love all these comments trying to go against what I'm saying. I don't think you guys understand it at all honestly. What I'm saying is Madara can not react to FTG speeds. He can, however react to Tobirama's speeds after the use of FTG. Notice when Tobirama's hand is rendered useless, he switches to his left hand.

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Tobirama's seal then resonates on his kunai as if falls from his hand. Kishi pointed this out to us on purpose. Then he elaborates on Madara's raw speed in the fact that he's able to lunge at Tobirama before he could activate his FTG. See the same scan above. We know he landed it because we can see the particles. however, he merely scratched Tobirama, as we can see he's still continuing forward when Tobirama is gone. Then in the bottom panel, Madara is leaned over, and Tobirama is slightly above him and has the advantage. Flying Thunder God defeated Madara's speed. Again, I feel I must reiterate, Flying Thunder God can not be defeated in speed. However, the ftg user can be defeated, as we clearly saw. My next point is towards Shelke. I went through the recent chapter and couldn't find what you said Madara said. All I see is that Madara said he did that very often. Now why would Madara Uchiha say that Tobirama Senju did that... I don't know, maybe...:

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To further support my claim:

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"You... You were the one that killed Izuna." ~ Madara Uchiha. As for Killer Bee knowing Minato would go there, I would simply call that plot no jutsu. It served a purpose for Minato and Killer Bee to have stalemated. Notice Kishi waits an entire page before starting the new chapter:

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Just for Minato to say, "I can't fail." My final claim being the Minato vs Madara scenario. If Minato was in this same situation, Minato likely would have shit on Madara. Minato has already shown to teleport and has the best reactions in the series...

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Ay was literally an inch behind Minato. Minato actually wouldn't have had his hand immobilized in the first place. That's just my opinion though.

 

[shelke]

@Inanimated

You are dragging this on for no reason. Madara - well before he activated SM - reacted to 'Speed of light' teleporation of Tsunade and Raikage. He intercepted her attack just fine. Since FTG is also instant, I don't see your point. Fact remains, Madara - and canon manga story in general - has made it clear that he had no issue getting around Tobirama's FTG when they used to fight on the battlefield.

FTG is not activated, it's instant. It was his 'Thunder God Slash' and it even says there on the page. What? So Bee reacting to Minato is plot just because you don't agree that FTG can be bested with decent reflexes? It was shown WAY BACK for a reason. That is a ridiculous scan most people keep posting. It's a finishing blow. Kakashi landed one on Kakuzu, does it mean he had the upper hand? God no. He was getting slapped around the whole time by Hidan as well and almost died twice . You don't know what happened between them. All we are shown is the finishing blow. Don't use it as some kind of decisive point.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

... No... That wouldn't have anything to do with speed.

Speed = Moving a distance over time.
Teleportation = Moving a distance instantly.

It's obvious that the two are different.

In nv not really. It still falls under speed.

 

[Multiply]

@InanimatedYou are dragging this on for no reason. Madara - well before he activated SM - reacted to 'Speed of light' teleporation of Tsunade and Raikage. He intercepted her attack just fine. Since FTG is also instant, I don't see your point. Fact remains, Madara - and canon manga story in general - has made it clear that he had no issue getting around Tobirama's FTG when they used to fight on the battlefield. FTG is not activated, it's instant. It was his 'Thunder God Slash' and it even says there on the page. What? So Bee reacting to Minato is plot just because you don't agree that FTG can be bested with decent reflexes? It was shown WAY BACK for a reason. That is a ridiculous scan most people keep posting. It's a finishing blow. Kakashi landed one on Kakuzu, does it mean he had the upper hand? God no. He was getting slapped around the whole time by Hidan as well and almost died twice . You don't know what happened between them. All we are shown is the finishing blow. Don't use it as some kind of decisive point.

Who said Ay moved at the speed of light? Seems to me like an assumption. We all know what assumptions make people... Also, I would like to tell you that Minato is not = Ay. Minato beat Ay in speed twice. When could it even be assumed that Madara and Tobirama ever threw hands before this situation? Not once... As I've already shown you, Madara was recalling the time when Tobirama slaughtered his brother in front of him. Nothing more, nothing less. FTG is activated! If it wasn't, you would assuming that FTG just happens. However, that assumption would be wrong! FTG must be used in order to work. Madara exploited that time frame by lunging at Tobirama and scratching him. However, as I've proven, Tobirama's FTG activated as Madara was hitting him. Hiraishin Giri is not an instant attack... The fact that you just said that proves to me how incompetent you are at understanding what just happened in the manga. Flying Thunder God Slash merely puts the user in the required area of attack, then the user uses the slashing portion of this assault. Proof?

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Notice when Tobirama is behind Madara, so is the kunai and Tobirama's hand is not outstretched. Yet when Tobirama extends his arm, Madara dodges it. At that same time, we see Madara's hand rising up to to disable his hand. Now if Madara truly bested Tobirama's FTG in that situation, he would have stabbed Tobirama as he was appearing in the location he was. I wouldn't necessarily say Bee reacted to Minato because no movement was shown. Which is why I said it was more likely plot that protected Bee than anything. I even provided proof of the reason why such a thing could be possible. However you seemed to have ignored it, and claimed I don't agree with it. What do you mean it was a finishing blow...? Which attack... The only attacks I could see as a finishing blow was Ay's first attack, and Minato's first attack. The last two were not.

 

[xcoyote]

This right here. Lol

Keep fighting the good fight OP.

 

[illidanson]

In nv not really. It still falls under speed.

...

Now you're just being retarded.

Whether it's in the Narutoverse or not is 100 % irrelevant, it still isn't speed.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

...

Now you're just being retarded.

Whether it's in the Narutoverse or not is 100 % irrelevant, it still isn't speed.

Yet the users are considered the fastest. And their speed unparalleled....

 

[illidanson]

Yet the users are considered the fastest. And their speed unparalleled....

Minato is considered the fastest because of his extreme base speed, not because of his FTG.

And I don't know about Tobirama, but he's pretty fast as well and was only considered the fastest back in his time, and who knows maybe he was the fastest back then???

In any case that doesn't change the fact that Teleportation isn't speed. If the characters in the series consider it speed, then that's only because they're don't know all that much about physics.

Which wouldn't bee too odd considered that they live in a different world with lesser technology, aka. a world of the past, aka. back when people didn't know all that much about physics
(Though they apparently still have some things like refrigerators )

 

[BenjerminGaye]

Minato is considered the fastest because of his extreme base speed, not because of his FTG.

And I don't know about Tobirama, but he's pretty fast as well and was only considered the fastest back in his time, and who knows maybe he was the fastest back then???

In any case that doesn't change the fact that Teleportation isn't speed. If the characters in the series consider it speed, then that's only because they're don't know all that much about physics.

Which wouldn't bee too odd considered that they live in a different world with lesser technology, aka. a world of the past, aka. back when people didn't know all that much about physics
(Though they apparently still have some things like refrigerators )

Minato was considered the fastest do to both. That's why when he beat both obito and ay it was called Victor in the battle of speed, even though it was ftg.

Same goes for tobirama according to madara.

Nv has its own laws of physics. And within those laws ftg is considered speed.

 

[shelke]

@Inanimated I said they were teleported to the battlefield. Who said he moved at the speed of light on his own accord? Tsunade turned on her Immortality technique to survive the speed - she was advised against it. Raikage's armour protected him. If he could react to that, why not FTG? If Bee could react to it, then so can anyone with decent reflexes. It's all an issue of anticipation and good reaction rate.

Ae’s V2 is foot speed and he doesn't appear to have decent reflexes. V2 is just a hyper-speed Movement and has nothing to do with CQC in general. In fact, during his fight with Sasuke, Ae slowed down and immediately stopped to land a hit on Sasuke. It works in a more linear, tackle kind of way, as Ae tackled Juugo twice. Bee is a sword master, so his reation rate should obviously be better, much much better than Raikage, who has shown no such feats.

What do you mean? I see Thunder God Slash in affect, and that's all I need to know. As far as Bee goes, then he moved his short sword at a precise angle to fend Minato off, who couldn't stab him as it put him in a vulnerable position as well. Minato NEVER defeated Ae or Bee. I have no idea how this forum even thinks that. Minato retreated, Bee forced him too.

Assumptions make people indeed.

 

[illidanson]

Minato was considered the fastest do to both. That's why when he beat both obito and ay it was called Victor in the battle of speed, even though it was ftg.

Same goes for tobirama according to madara.

Nv has its own laws of physics. And within those laws ftg is considered speed.

.... No, it's not!!! It if is teleportation, then it isn't speed! It's that simple.

If speed in the Narutoverse was simply traveling a distance the amount of time it took wouldn't matter. In that case the "fastest" person in NV would be the guy who traveled the most, that's just retarded!

Different laws of physics is possible, but that doesn't change the fact that speed is moving a distance over a certain amount time, not just moving a distance. "speed" is just a word that we made to describe that, so if speed is something different in the Narutoverse, it's only because their word "speed" is different that ours. It still wouldn't be "speed" as we know it.

So if something is different in the Narutoverse it's their word "speed" not the physics of speed.

 

[Ahmed1993]

Tobirama did use FTG and got foddersize, FTG is far from being flawless.

Kishi > you , deal with it U_U

 

[Zebstrika]

Now you're just going against the manga. As Madara clearly states that 'he USED to anticipate and Read' the technique during their battles as well, and Tobirama never negated it. Now unless you want to go against the manga, be my guest. Madara bested FTG Tobirama, that is a fact. He used to anticipate and counter it in the past, that is also a fact. FTG can be countered through reaction rate, another fact Manga showed through Bee. Feel free to ignore all these.

Correct you are. You can tell when other people are mad since they keep writing paragraphs to "counter" manga facts. The truth is now obvious to all: FTG was never as great as fanboys made it out to be.

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Stay mad. :yeah:

 

[shelke]

^ Well this ended the thread. + Rep. Minato fanboys and their typicality.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

@Inanimated I said they were teleported to the battlefield. Who said he moved at the speed of light on his own accord? Tsunade turned on her Immortality technique to survive the speed - she was advised against it. Raikage's armour protected him. If he could react to that, why not FTG? If Bee could react to it, then so can anyone with decent reflexes. It's all an issue of anticipation and good reaction rate.

Ae’s V2 is foot speed and he doesn't appear to have decent reflexes. V2 is just a hyper-speed Movement and has nothing to do with CQC in general. In fact, during his fight with Sasuke, Ae slowed down and immediately stopped to land a hit on Sasuke. It works in a more linear, tackle kind of way, as Ae tackled Juugo twice. Bee is a sword master, so his reation rate should obviously be better, much much better than Raikage, who has shown no such feats.

What do you mean? I see Thunder God Slash in affect, and that's all I need to know. As far as Bee goes, then he moved his short sword at a precise angle to fend Minato off, who couldn't stab him as it put him in a vulnerable position as well. Minato NEVER defeated Ae or Bee. I have no idea how this forum even thinks that. Minato retreated, Bee forced him too.

Assumptions make people indeed.

Bee forced minato to retreat?
What manga are you reading?
Minato got the order to retreat wayyy before that.
The moment bee saved ay minato was ordered to leave.
Like sasuke to madara, bee and ay were on borrowed time.

Chee said when ay uses the armor his synapses fire off at the speed of light so obviously his reactions would be better than that of his brother yet even her couldn't dodge.

The only person to even come close(and even then it's debatable since the fight wasn't shown) is a sage mode madara. And even then it wouldn't make any sense cuz that would mean he had better reactions than juubito.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

.... No, it's not!!! It if is teleportation, then it isn't speed! It's that simple.

If speed in the Narutoverse was simply traveling a distance the amount of time it took wouldn't matter. In that case the "fastest" person in NV would be the guy who traveled the most, that's just retarded!

Different laws of physics is possible, but that doesn't change the fact that speed is moving a distance over a certain amount time, not just moving a distance. "speed" is just a word that we made to describe that, so if speed is something different in the Narutoverse, it's only because their word "speed" is different that ours. It still wouldn't be "speed" as we know it.

So if something is different in the Narutoverse it's their word "speed" not the physics of speed.

As retarded as it sounds its true.

 

[shelke]

Bee forced minato to retreat?
What manga are you reading?
Minato got the order to retreat wayyy before that.
The moment bee saved ay minato was ordered to leave.
Like sasuke to madara, bee and ay were on borrowed time.

Chee said when ay uses the armor his synapses fire off at the speed of light so obviously his reactions would be better than that of his brother yet even her couldn't dodge.

The only person to even come close(and even then it's debatable since the fight wasn't shown) is a sage mode madara. And even then it wouldn't make any sense cuz that would mean he had better reactions than juubito.

LOL You mean he couldn't stab Bee and Ae said 'they were just getting started'? That is a forced retreat, as he couldn't finish the job. Seriously? Your analogy of parallels is borderline ridiculous. Won't even comment.

Yet Bee was the one to Jump in and Deflect an attack that got his leg chopped off? Fact is, you are just in denial and the silly rebuttals don't help. Minato got intercepted - Simple as that.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

LOL You mean he couldn't stab Bee and Ae said 'they were just getting started'? That is a forced retreat, as he couldn't finish the job. Seriously? Your analogy of parallels is borderline ridiculous. Won't even comment.

Yet Bee was the one to Jump in and Deflect an attack that got his leg chopped off? Fact is, you are just in denial and the silly rebuttals don't help. Minato got intercepted - Simple as that.

He was already ordered to leave. And already planned on leaving. There was nothing stopping him from stabbing bee but since he's following orders he didn't.
Ay even said in the many times they fought they weren't even able to touch him. Yet you think be really had a chance?
He didn't even attack, he threatened bee and forced ay in a position to stand down since obviously ay wasn't listening to him.

It doesn't matter. According to you decent reflexes is reflexes equal to or greater than that of a sane juubito.