Itachi vs. Kakashi (without sharingan)
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I see this as a narrow victory for Kakashi. He definitely has the edge in ninjutsu, with counters to all of Itachi's elemental techniques. He has also shown more variety and versatility in their application.
They are roughly equal in taijutsu. Itachi has an advantage in speed, but not a large one, and it's hard to say how much of it is from the Sharingan. Kakashi has the advantage in strength, with the First Gate, (not counting any possible other ones) and another slight advantage in stamina. It's hard to say how much Itachi was hindered by his disease, but it was likely significant. However, without the Sharingan draining his chakra, Kakashi has, to my mind, slightly more stamina than even a healthy Itachi.
Genjutsu clearly goes to Itachi. He has more demonstrated techniques of a higher potency than Kakashi. On the other hand, it's not clear how much of the genjutsu expertise is due to the Sharingan. I can only recall one example of a non-Sharingan genjutsu cast by Itachi, and that was channeled through the Akatsuki ring, which likely had special features incorporated. Without the Sharingan, I place Itachi on roughly the same level in genjutsu as Kurenai, given that he was trapped by her and had to use the Sharingan to reverse her technique.
Intelligence-wise, I figure that Kakashi is the victor. For one thing, he advanced earlier thorugh the Shinobi ranks. Yes, there was a war on, and there was a lack of manpower, but that holds true in Itachi's situation as well. The village had suffered through the Kyuubi attack, with a decent chunk of their forces taken out, as well as the loss of three legendary ninja from the Konoha-area forces (Minato, Jiraiya, Orochimaru). But that isn't the point.
In their first confrontation, Kakashi appears to have the situation in hand until he's trapped in the Tsukuyomi, a genjutsu of unheard-of potency, cast by the totally unknown (to him and most of the Shinobi world) Mangekyou Sharingan, and loses. This doesn't really count in Itachi's favor, in the intelligence-stakes. Random, unheard of powerups do not mean you have outwitted your opponent.
In the second fight, while Itachi doesn't have more than 30% of his chakra, he's also legitimately outsmarted. Both parties now know roughly what the other is capable of, yet Kakashi traps him in a deadlock by having him genjutsu a bunshin. (and having Naruto Rasengan the crap out of a corpse, but hey).
So, first fight goes to Itachi, via him revealing one of his trump cards, a pretty much impossible technique. (Cast with the Sharingan, which is banned this battle.)
Second fight to Kakashi via fooling the opponent with a bunshin.
Kakashi is smarter.
Also, nin-dogs are cooler than ravens.
They are roughly equal in taijutsu. Itachi has an advantage in speed, but not a large one, and it's hard to say how much of it is from the Sharingan. Kakashi has the advantage in strength, with the First Gate, (not counting any possible other ones) and another slight advantage in stamina. It's hard to say how much Itachi was hindered by his disease, but it was likely significant. However, without the Sharingan draining his chakra, Kakashi has, to my mind, slightly more stamina than even a healthy Itachi.
Genjutsu clearly goes to Itachi. He has more demonstrated techniques of a higher potency than Kakashi. On the other hand, it's not clear how much of the genjutsu expertise is due to the Sharingan. I can only recall one example of a non-Sharingan genjutsu cast by Itachi, and that was channeled through the Akatsuki ring, which likely had special features incorporated. Without the Sharingan, I place Itachi on roughly the same level in genjutsu as Kurenai, given that he was trapped by her and had to use the Sharingan to reverse her technique.
Intelligence-wise, I figure that Kakashi is the victor. For one thing, he advanced earlier thorugh the Shinobi ranks. Yes, there was a war on, and there was a lack of manpower, but that holds true in Itachi's situation as well. The village had suffered through the Kyuubi attack, with a decent chunk of their forces taken out, as well as the loss of three legendary ninja from the Konoha-area forces (Minato, Jiraiya, Orochimaru). But that isn't the point.
In their first confrontation, Kakashi appears to have the situation in hand until he's trapped in the Tsukuyomi, a genjutsu of unheard-of potency, cast by the totally unknown (to him and most of the Shinobi world) Mangekyou Sharingan, and loses. This doesn't really count in Itachi's favor, in the intelligence-stakes. Random, unheard of powerups do not mean you have outwitted your opponent.
In the second fight, while Itachi doesn't have more than 30% of his chakra, he's also legitimately outsmarted. Both parties now know roughly what the other is capable of, yet Kakashi traps him in a deadlock by having him genjutsu a bunshin. (and having Naruto Rasengan the crap out of a corpse, but hey).
So, first fight goes to Itachi, via him revealing one of his trump cards, a pretty much impossible technique. (Cast with the Sharingan, which is banned this battle.)
Second fight to Kakashi via fooling the opponent with a bunshin.
Kakashi is smarter.
Also, nin-dogs are cooler than ravens.
Itachi is and will always remain the no.1 genius in narto series whether people like it or not.
His achievements speek for themselves. Ex: Being an anbu at the mere age of 13, which kakashi never/couldn't accomplish.
His achievements speek for themselves. Ex: Being an anbu at the mere age of 13, which kakashi never/couldn't accomplish.
hokutoshinken
Active member
Elements can't be copied dumbo.You have to learn the element to copy a jutsu.Kakashi has Suiton,Raiton and Doton.Even Danzo ahd Suiton, Doton,Fuuton..
Where the hell did i tell that he has 5 elements?
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That's what called "taking someone else's ability and make it yours.." Kakashi didn't originally have Suiton, he got it from Obito's Sharingan.. same goes to Danzo, he has plenty of Sharingan's plus the 1st Hokage DNA, which makes him have almost all the element nature types as well.
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-Broly-
Active member
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because what you said is just so.. stupid i mean if you look at the links o posted and the thread i made youl see that theyre just items like zetsu aid and not related to his ms
Trigrams 64 palms
Member
Itachi wins easily
Kakashi has none of his copies jutsu without Sharigan and he has no way of breaking genjustu with out it. Also he can not use Raikari because without it he is easily countered by the enemy.
Itachi kunai and shurkin throwing would easily be able to kill Kakashi look at the Itachi Sasuke fight how is he going to track all of those with Sharigan.
Kakashi has none of his copies jutsu without Sharigan and he has no way of breaking genjustu with out it. Also he can not use Raikari because without it he is easily countered by the enemy.
Itachi kunai and shurkin throwing would easily be able to kill Kakashi look at the Itachi Sasuke fight how is he going to track all of those with Sharigan.
Hey i was just wondering, everyone states Kakashi can counter the Fire attacks from Itachi. I just want to ask a question, the only Jutsu he can use now is Raikiri because every other tech was learnd with the sharingan.
Itachi was fighting with 30% against Kakashi Naruto Sakura and the old hag and still had the advantage.
So i´m not a fanboy but
Itachi just needs a finger to cast a genjutsu.
Itachi was a master in Fire element techniques.
Kakashi has now only one jutsu and can move pretty fast, so how can he deal with itachi? When Minato stated, this tech is rubbish because you can´t react to your opponent.
Kakashi only can use these techs if he has his sharingan without it he can´t learn them....
Itachi was fighting with 30% against Kakashi Naruto Sakura and the old hag and still had the advantage.
So i´m not a fanboy but
Itachi just needs a finger to cast a genjutsu.
Itachi was a master in Fire element techniques.
Kakashi has now only one jutsu and can move pretty fast, so how can he deal with itachi? When Minato stated, this tech is rubbish because you can´t react to your opponent.
Kakashi only can use these techs if he has his sharingan without it he can´t learn them....
andrewperez
Active member
itachi wins this hands down..... itachis a genius when it comes to fire jutsus and kunia attacks ......... kakashi with out sharigan = chidori only original move he has..... itachi still has genjutsu ... the proof to this is when naruto look at itachis finger tips he fell into a genjutsus.... so he can cast genjutsu really well with out his ms.... so kakashi with out sharigan means he has only one ninjutsu move .... so itachi has a huge advatage
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It's not stupid.. Zetsu said they are legendary items cause he heard about them in myths, but never actually saw them, Orochimaru also got surprised when he knew about the fact that Itachi had them all along in his Susanoo, cause as I said.. SO6P could have implemented them on his "Uchiha Ancestor" son as a spiritual items that only a Uchiha successor would be able to use them as an eye technique, that explains why Orochimaru nor anyone else was able to find them during all these years.
I know I can't backup my statement with Manga proves, but I'm sure you can't backup yours either.. we never saw Itachi using them without his Susanoo, and his Susanoo can't show up without using his MS, so you have your opinion and I have mine.
-Broly-
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sigh totsuka blade and yata mirror are part of the sages treasures just like those things the kin gin brothers had the weapons they had are also spiritual and the blade and mirror can be used like that