[Discussion] Do you consider all feminists bad??

[Loki d]

Ah so you are trolling, phew,
i was worried

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[Avani]

Just the extremists, the ones who no longer believe in equality and shoot to oppress all males instead. Also the ones that believe they should be rewarded immediately or earn just as much as a male right away while excluding all other factors, such as a man that was being paid a couple million yearly in a company that he worked in for decades, so he had to earn that salary, then a feminist got his job after he retired and thought she deserved right away the exact pay he was getting. No, you don't, he spent decades earning bonuses, receiving pay raise, etc., you don't just get all that the instant you get the job, you have to earn it as well.

According to the bare facts you gave- your argument is screwed up. Salary of an employee is decided at the current market rate and the kind and amount of work the worker is expected to do in lieu of it. The bonuses are added over the years to compensate for ever increasing rate of inflation and increased expectations of work. The person who is hired today will be expected to keep up with the work and the quality that's being maintain today so obviously they will demand the salary being paid today not what was being paid decades back. I don't see why someone would not ask the same salary for the post as the previous employee was getting for the same post.

Do you think a male job seeker won't be asking the same salary, or more, for the same job being given to previous employee and it's some sort of feminist problem? Companies sometimes pay a few bucks extra for loyalty to their old workers, some times old workers keep working for less simply because they are comfortable with the atmosphere and satisfied with the job and don't feel like hunting a new one. But in either case if someone new is hired the negotiation starts with the current rates and UP and the demand etc. Certainly not to decades back unless someone is desperate and the company decides to exploit the situation with minimum wages or lower.

And you've chosen to ignore that I've posted good female characters and then just tried to move the goal post when I presented a character that is presented in a erotic fashion at times. But okay. If it isn't erotic then why is it detailed and there and noticeable for the player when the player is doing the simplest of tasks like crawling? Even without a penis on his game model when he's naked, his ass is still out and detailed for the player to see.

The plot didn't even need him naked. The previous games in the series have Snake get captured and has his stuff taken yet the most that happens to him is he loses his shirt. Even the last game the second game was trying to recreate with Raiden, everything was to scale but Raiden didn't need to be naked.

Here's two more examples

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Mr.Gold and Silver. The game gets crouch shots of these two and they're always doing something sexual. Even their attacks are sexual.

This isn't why I think feminism is bad. Infact, I never said it is bad. I think feminism is wrong on the subject of the portrayal of females in video games. It ignores that males are also over the top and have a unrealistic portrayal. Most guys I know don't have the physique of a greek statue nor do they walk around shirtless. They also don't rip people in half and have a lust for blood and war.

How is it right to ignore that males also have a unrealistic portrayal in video games but point out that females do too?

You are comparing depiction of two stereotypical homosexual characters which may as well be eunuchs( according to the wikipedia) with sexual objectification of women.. and implying somehow it balances out while for me it makes situation only worse and the complaint of video games being overly sexualized and cheap in this regard in general.

As for Raidan naked run, it is similar to bodypainted Mystique in the X-men movie. The actress had nothing but body paint for real. Her depiction is different in the sense as she is asserting herself and not seeking an approval of who she is- at least a respectable excuse. Similar was the case for Raidan.Here was an explanation to what designer were going for or so somepeople believe-

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Erza too was drawn fully naked and peeing at herself in Fairy tale. Whatever accusations fairy tale have in this regard no one picked out the naked torture scene being for objectification though some disliked the amount of vionece depicted. Yes it's an anime scene but I am trying to explain the difference in setting and how it's perceived.

Raidan's depiction still left many grumbling and complaining - especially because he doesn't look that comfortable while running around. And that portrayal is not sexy but rather pitiful and awkward because of the reason they make him doing the flip with one hand to cover himself. At worst some laugh and others complain.

The problem with video games is similar to the problems with comics, manga and anime industry or entertainment media in general. They simply think in the terms of who has better buying capacity and cater to that audience and ignore the ones that they don't see as their market. Some portrayals of female characters have improved over the years - yes. Have they been perfected- far from it and the moment they think they can get away with it they go back to "selling *** and sexism" since it's simply easy.

As for unrealistic portrayal of men-if you feel it's something that make you uncomfortable or you find such depiction problematic just say so and join feminists asking for less unrealistic portrayal of men too. After all its all about market. And if all of us would tall video game makers to listen to they may listen faster.

Anyway I am bored with this topic. It's not like we are going to agree on the issue.

 

[shelke]

I guess you got the implication on who actually sounds upset too. ^_^

Average what kind of gamer: RTS? TBS? Sports? Puzzle? RPG? Shooter? MOBA? ... You still haven't got into that thick skull of yours that you are generalising multitudes of genres and people based on the mainstream or gimmicky examples.

Do the same thing you expected me to do when you said that I must be new to gaming. Since I paid back in the same coin .. its the original coin that that must be absurdly idiotic.

Brilliant.

Given the fact that an average sentence is clearly beyond your grasp, yeah, you are a typical gamer who is up in arms about a simple aspect of gaming that needs to be brought up for discussion. Your denials on this front shouldn't concern anyone.

Oh noes, I hurted your gamerz honorz. Let's get real here man. Your antagonistic stance on a bunch of VGs is borderline unstable and absurd. It's a part of media. If anyone plays it or is a part of it, they are welcome to offer criticism. That is all there is to it.

 

[ZK]

As for Raidan naked run, it is similar to bodypainted Mystique in the X-men movie. The actress had nothing but body paint for real. Her depiction is different in the sense as she is asserting herself and not seeking an approval of who she is- at least a respectable excuse. Similar was the case for Raidan.Here was an explanation to what designer were going for or so somepeople believe-

...Just moments before you had a problem with Cortana's nudity. What changed? Neither of the two seek 'an approval of who [they] are.'

The problem with video games is similar to the problems with comics, manga and anime industry or entertainment media in general. They simply think in the terms of who has better buying capacity and cater to that audience and ignore the ones that they don't see as their market. Some portrayals of female characters have improved over the years - yes. Have they been perfected- far from it and the moment they think they can get away with it they go back to "selling *** and sexism" since it's simply easy.

Honestly, criticizing the 'entertainment media' for catering to their market is absolutely ludicrous. Do you complain to Ben and Jerry for cancelling that niche ice cream flavor that you liked, or to HBO for cancelling that cult show you enjoyed? You might, but as a rational human being you know why they were removed from the market: a lack of popular demand. It's how capitalism works. There is a big (but admittedly closing) gender discrepancy in the video game industry and when we remove game apps from the equation that gap only widens. To suggest that developers should invest heavily in games aimed at female gamers make very little sense from an economic perspective. The incentives are simply not there yet.
Also, I can't stress enough how weird I think it is that you constantly link *** and sexism. Sure, *** doesn't belong in all video games - we have ESRB ratings for a reason - but there is absolutely nothing wrong with using *** appeal in games. *** is not negative, and it certainly shouldn't be a taboo in games.

As for unrealistic portrayal of men-if you feel it's something that make you uncomfortable or you find such depiction problematic just say so and join feminists asking for less unrealistic portrayal of men too. After all its all about market. And if all of us would tall video game makers to listen to they may listen faster.

Or maybe, just maybe, we could all just sit down and enjoy the games without looking for 'social injustices' in them. I get where you're coming from, but I honestly find it quite ironic how intent you seem on making others (video game developers) listen to you, while at the same time you dismiss the other side of the argument out of hand.

Anyway I am bored with this topic. It's not like we are going to agree on the issue.

Bored already?

Brilliant.

Given the fact that an average sentence is clearly beyond your grasp, yeah, you are a typical gamer who is up in arms about a simple aspect of gaming that needs to be brought up for discussion. Your denials on this front shouldn't concern anyone.

Oh noes, I hurted your gamerz honorz. Let's get real here man. Your antagonistic stance on a bunch of VGs is borderline unstable and absurd. It's a part of media. If anyone plays it or is a part of it, they are welcome to offer criticism. That is all there is to it.

On a scale from 'Bottom Befuddled' to 'Anally Annihilated' I find you 'Orifice Obliterated.'
You're a joke. From your would-be intellectual shitposts to your snobby attitude.

 

[Bored38]

I see no difference between a feminist and a chauvinist. Neither are admirable traits in my op.

 

[shelke]

On a scale from 'Bottom Befuddled' to 'Anally Annihilated' I find you 'Orifice Obliterated.'
You're a joke. From your would-be intellectual shitposts to your snobby attitude.

Where does your scale in regards to intellectualism lie, since you seem so affected by my would-be intellectual posts? This overt defense concerning VGs clearly showcases your slight case of trivial intelligence. As if that is anything new to gamers. My stance on VGs hasn't changed and I still stand by what I said. But let me put it plainly for you; your tastes are borderline trash. You never had any argument to defend your absurd stance. This frat boy insult is just one leaf in that, largly, empty book that isn't worth much.

I am surprised I even entertained you.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Of course not. Every group has its idiots, and every group has those that are worth listening to. I'm just sorry the concept of feminism was tainted by the extremes in the views of others who are too biased to acknowledge or find out what a feminist actually is.

 

[Anorien16]

Brilliant.

Isnt it?

Given the fact that an average sentence is clearly beyond your grasp, yeah, you are a typical gamer who is up in arms about a simple aspect of gaming that needs to be brought up for discussion. Your denials on this front shouldn't concern anyone.

Translation: I dont have any argument thus I will fall back to classic ad hominem while trying appear an intellectual.

Oh noes, I hurted your gamerz honorz.

So ... that is the reaction you expected of me when you threw around a baseless accusation/statement? Typical, you would fit right in the LoL community.

Let's get real here man. Your antagonistic stance on a bunch of VGs is borderline unstable and absurd. It's a part of media. If anyone plays it or is a part of it, they are welcome to offer criticism. That is all there is to it.

Criticism is welcome, but make sure that criticism hits the target and is not retarded a generalizations of an entire industry that steamrolls over the actual issues. 'FF has fan service thus the whole VG industry is bad' is not criticism.

 

[shelke]

Isnt it?



Translation: I dont have any argument thus I will fall back to classic ad hominem while trying appear an intellectual.

So ... that is the reaction you expected of me when you threw around a baseless accusation/statement? Typical, you would fit right in the LoL community.

Criticism is welcome, but make sure that criticism hits the target and is not retarded a generalizations of an entire industry that steamrolls over the actual issues. 'FF has fan service thus the whole VG industry is bad' is not criticism.

If you can read (which I doubt by now), then you can look at a wall of argument I posted for that degenerate. Everything was covered in that.

It's hilarious that you believe yourself to be some authority on characterization and thematic representations. Seriously, man, you are talking to that man. Sit yourself down. Unlike you, some of us have actually studied critical thought. Shocking, I know. The industry does need to reevaluate itself, when decent females are probably about 10 to 15 in number at most. But VGs have trash stories, so, no surprises there.

 

[Fountain]

Yes actually, they already have more rights than men there's no need to be a feminist, good or bad.

 

[Omegga Shenron]

Well im a meninist, same thing as a feminist only with the word men in it, since "fem"inism specifies women

 

[Sir Francis Drake]

Well im a meninist, same thing as a feminist only with the word men in it, since "fem"inism specifies women

So a Men's Rights Activists?

 

[Punk Hazard]

Well im a meninist, same thing as a feminist only with the word men in it, since "fem"inism specifies women

Feminism isn't just towards women. You're a feminist fam.

[video=youtube;-ZVhuBo3Hg0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ZVhuBo3Hg0[/video]

 

[Anorien16]

Well im a meninist, same thing as a feminist only with the word men in it, since "fem"inism specifies women

Ummm ... FYI 'Meninists' are a satirical group trying to annoy people who easily get their knickers in a knot.

.... So really not sure if you are being real or not.

If you can read (which I doubt by now), then you can look at a wall of argument I posted for that degenerate. Everything was covered in that.

I can read very well ... But I very much doubt you can read anything from your high horse.

It's hilarious that you believe yourself to be some authority on characterization and thematic representations. Seriously, man, you are talking to that man. Sit yourself down. Unlike you, some of us have actually studied critical thought.

But despite being that well read you have not yet comprehended that I am talking about numbers, percentages and retarded cherry picking to push a generalization here. I agreed long ago that some of the VG content is idiotic or panders to lower denominator of tastes (Which is a very minuscule minority).It must be your tall horse interfering with your comprehension again or simply you **** cavity blocking your vision.

Shocking, I know.

Not at all. Its actually stereotypical.

The industry does need to reevaluate itself, when decent females are probably about 10 to 15 in number at most.

You will be surprised to find that decent males are nearly same in number. (Assuming you are excluding all non mainstream content).

Also since you deem yourself an expert, can you kindly mention which genres and companies need to reevaluate themselves?

But VGs have trash stories, so, no surprises there.

Possibly because VGs derive its entertainment from game play and over 60% - 70% VGs dont need much story beyond paper thin reasoning. (The most played game (at least in certain of this decade) is LoL, moba which derives all its attraction from the insane competition and character stories are just something secondary). Then again you hardly have any idea about the VG industry's vastness and scope.

 

[shelke]

I can read very well ... But I very much doubt you can read anything from your high horse.

But despite being that well read you have not yet comprehended that I am talking about numbers, percentages and retarded cherry picking to push a generalization here. I agreed long ago that some of the VG content is idiotic or panders to lower denominator of tastes (Which is a very minuscule minority).It must be your tall horse interfering with your comprehension again or simply you **** cavity blocking your vision.

You will be surprised to find that decent males are nearly same in number. (Assuming you are excluding all non mainstream content).

Also since you deem yourself an expert, can you kindly mention which genres and companies need to reevaluate themselves?

Possibly because VGs derive its entertainment from game play and over 60% - 70% VGs dont need much story beyond paper thin reasoning. (The most played game (at least in certain of this decade) is LoL, moba which derives all its attraction from the insane competition and character stories are just something secondary). Then again you hardly have any idea about the VG industry's vastness and scope.

You still haven't given me one intelligent reason as to what even makes for this 'sweeping generalization', other than this trite that is brimful of insecurity, Bullshit and straight up nonsense that works as a deterrent to common sense. VGs do present women in a terrible light. Most of them are subjected to terrible objectification. Dead or Alive series would be one such example in the bottomless abyss of horrendous female characters. To outright deny this is lunacy.

What kind of generalization here? When someone offers criticism, it's on the issue that takes a mainstream status and becomes a norm. Female objectification is the norm in most media. VGs just happen to be one such portal. There is no such thing as 100% media saturation or every single entry that carries the problem. It's always a majority or mainstream status that creats the influx of complains. Anita being one such example.

What minority? I have zero idea where you even thought I talked about the demographic other than those well-deserved jabs at that neanderthal, when I have been talking about developers and VGs female presentation all along; something that falls (mostly) on the head of the developers. Then you claim, you can read? That is a very different debate; the kind I am not even remotely interested in.

I already offered several solutions in another post and I covered the gameplay versus story aspects as well. What seems to be the issue here, then? Yeah, clearly, I have no idea because you happen to over-assume issues. I mean, look at your comprehension?

 

[Anorien16]

You still haven't given me one intelligent reason as to what even makes for this 'sweeping generalization', other than this trite that is brimful of insecurity, Bullshit and straight up nonsense that works as a deterrent to common sense.

Just so we are clear can you remind me what were the reason I gave? I could pretend otherwise but I want to know if you have at all understood what I was trying to say.

Also Insecurity? Interesting. Can you explain the reasoning behind use of such a word.

VGs do present women in a terrible light.

Much less than it present men as the source of prime sorrows of the world. Then again I dont have such sensitivities.

Also this one of the prime examples of the said retarded generalization, primarily because your statement would be true only if VGs that treat women bad specifically was the majority norm. (Which is not, because I can name 10 VGs that are neutral to positive towards women for each you can mark as 'problematic')

Most of them are subjected to terrible objectification. Dead or Alive series would be one such example in the bottomless abyss of horrendous female characters. To outright deny this is lunacy.

And thus you wonderfully expose that you actually dont comprehend what I am saying: VGs industry has its Nicki Manaj, Lady Gaga Beyonce but that does not condemn the entirety.

Though I dislike DoA for the similar reasons (and will never touch it) but can you translate theme of Scantily clad women potentially beating up generic stereotypical males? Personally I think it would have been the Early Feminist Fantasy. (As you mentioned earlier the female creator of Byonetta and a quite few other women find that horribly 'objectified' woman 'empowering' for some reason)

When someone offers criticism, it's on the issue that takes a mainstream status and becomes a norm.

Irrelevant to our discussion.

Female objectification is the norm in most media.

People like you seem to throw that word 'objectification' more than pigs like mud. Personally I dont like to use that word until it meets it dictionary meaning. But I have some issues with that statement: why would you find in any media that there are always scores of women willing to 'objectify' and most of then happen to be strong willed and independent women?

Also I think people like you tend to objectify women more than other horny 13 year olds: You for example find nothing of value in Quiet beyond her fanservice values, but to me Quiet despite being balantly hamfisted fanservice is a excellent in game support and one of the best fighters possible. (Its kinda like enjoying Lady Gaga's music but accepting her wacky side.)

VGs just happen to be one such portal. There is no such thing as 100% media saturation or every single entry that carries the problem. It's always a majority or mainstream status that creats the influx of complains.

I dont know if you had maths with Critical Theory but 1 out of 20 does not constitute a majority and someone as well read as you should know that mainstream =/= factual representative.

Anita being one such example.

I would have agreed if she got her facts right and did not lie through her teeth. Example: The Hitman analysis is factually wrong and the representation was intentionally misleading. Not to mention her reasoning contradict eventually.

What minority? I have zero idea where you even thought I talked about the demographic other than those well-deserved jabs at that neanderthal, when I have been talking about developers and VGs female presentation all along; something that falls (mostly) on the head of the developers. Then you claim, you can read? That is a very different debate; the kind I am not even remotely interested in.

When did I talk about any audience demographics? I said how a very small minority of developers uses fan service material like Fairy Tail does. (Funnily more than half of them are Japanese in origin though)

I already offered several solutions in another post and I covered the gameplay versus story aspects as well.

Copy paste in this context then. I might have missed it.

What seems to be the issue here, then? Yeah, clearly, I have no idea because you happen to over-assume issues.

Also the issue: You are cherry picking to accuse a multitude, much like the Muslim and Terrorist situation.

You have no idea because you are ignorant about about the numbers involved. AGAIN I ask you which areas of the VG industry need work in your expert opinion? I need solid numbers, names and ways. (Will expect another weasel answer .. but come on prove me wrong.)

I mean, look at your comprehension?

Saying that you clarified my point elsewhere to then proceeding to question my comprehension does not really make it a faulty.

 

[Avani]

You are comparing depiction of two stereotypical homosexual characters which may as well be eunuchs( according to the wikipedia) with sexual objectification of women.. and implying somehow it balances out while for me it makes situation only worse and the complaint of video games being overly sexualized and cheap in this regard in general.

As for Raidan naked run, it is similar to bodypainted Mystique in the X-men movie. The actress had nothing but body paint for real. Her depiction is different in the sense as she is asserting herself and not seeking an approval of who she is- at least a respectable excuse. Similar was the case for Raidan.Here was an explanation to what designer were going for or so somepeople believe-

You must be registered for see links

Erza too was drawn fully naked and peeing at herself in Fairy tale. Whatever accusations fairy tale have in this regard no one picked out the naked torture scene being for objectification though some disliked the amount of violence depicted. Yes it's an anime scene but I am trying to explain the difference in setting and how it's perceived.

Raidan's depiction still left many grumbling and complaining - especially because he doesn't look that comfortable while running around. And that portrayal is not sexy but rather pitiful and awkward because of the reason they make him doing the flip with one hand to cover himself. At worst some laugh and others complain.

The problem with video games is similar to the problems with comics, manga and anime industry or entertainment media in general. They simply think in the terms of who has better buying capacity and cater to that audience and ignore the ones that they don't see as their market. Some portrayals of female characters have improved over the years - yes. Have they been perfected- far from it and the moment they think they can get away with it they go back to "selling *** and sexism" since it's simply easy.

As for unrealistic portrayal of men-if you feel it's something that make you uncomfortable or you find such depiction problematic just say so and join feminists asking for less unrealistic portrayal of men too. After all its all about market. And if all of us would tall video game makers to listen to they may listen faster.

Anyway I am bored with this topic. It's not like we are going to agree on the issue.

...Just moments before you had a problem with Cortana's nudity. What changed? Neither of the two seek 'an approval of who [they] are.'



Honestly, criticizing the 'entertainment media' for catering to their market is absolutely ludicrous. Do you complain to Ben and Jerry for cancelling that niche ice cream flavor that you liked, or to HBO for cancelling that cult show you enjoyed? You might, but as a rational human being you know why they were removed from the market: a lack of popular demand. It's how capitalism works. There is a big (but admittedly closing) gender discrepancy in the video game industry and when we remove game apps from the equation that gap only widens. To suggest that developers should invest heavily in games aimed at female gamers make very little sense from an economic perspective. The incentives are simply not there yet.
Also, I can't stress enough how weird I think it is that you constantly link *** and sexism. Sure, *** doesn't belong in all video games - we have ESRB ratings for a reason - but there is absolutely nothing wrong with using *** appeal in games. *** is not negative, and it certainly shouldn't be a taboo in games.



Or maybe, just maybe, we could all just sit down and enjoy the games without looking for 'social injustices' in them. I get where you're coming from, but I honestly find it quite ironic how intent you seem on making others (video game developers) listen to you, while at the same time you dismiss the other side of the argument out of hand.



Bored already?

Camera angle and the timing of focus changed. Yes there is a market for child porn too. I don't see why are you so agitated over someone demanding for aesthetics and better depiction of characters. You are likely to continue getting what you want while some of the game makers may just accommodate the new section of the consumers too.- After all everyone seem to be claiming that there is no difference in wages of males and females and on top of it I hear that females get a lot of easy money. So they much have the buying capacity so why shouldn't they ask for what they would like to see? It is how capitalism work, don't you say yourself?

Yes I am bored with this topic of sexual objectification. I already made several posts explaining myself on this subtopic and I don't want to keep repeating myself. In fact searching GD may give even more idea as how I see this topic in several thousand words in last 1-2 year. You can either disagree or just continue with your dissatisfaction over someone's objection over too much breast/thong for far too long in the middle of the screen.

 

[Anorien16]

Camera angle and the timing of focus changed. Yes there is a market for child porn too. I don't see why are you so agitated over someone demanding for aesthetics and better depiction of characters. You are likely to continue getting what you want while some of the game makers may just accommodate the new section of the consumers too.- After all everyone seem to be claiming that there is no difference in wages of males and females and on top of it I hear that females get a lot of easy money. So they much have the buying capacity so why shouldn't they ask for what they would like to see?

Remember that Female Thor fiasco? They truly threw the lore and commonsense out of window to make it a feminist version of Thor and ultimately it was cancelled (The sales did not go well for a reboot either). You should know about all the attention and justification and all about it .... But funnily Marvel already tried to push two Female led Norse based comics .. twice ... one with Lady Sif and one with Valkyr and both got no publicity and was cancelled due to low sales. The same thing happens more often than not in the gaming industry in other ways .... that is why some people can be agitated. Things can change for good .. Like the Lara Croft reboot but more often than not it leave a bitter taste on the mouth like Dragon Age: Inquisition (which traditionally had better writing and was very egalitarian) which went out of it way to push some ideas and ended up laming the horse (Yet got bombed by the progressive anyway). There is absolutely nothing wrong asking for something else and asking for improvement benefits all ... but employing means that is stupid and reactionary only ends up in destroying. This is exactly like movie, manga and anime: some uses fan service to push mediocre content (Fighting games like DoA) or some adds it for the lols (Metal Gear Solid ... Quiet IS a fanservice charachtered with the single purpose of provoking reactions. But yet its not a bad game) or some peruse it tastefully (Heavy rain) ... so the issue is not as simple as it seems (Byonetta is on the level of Quiet but was designed by a woman and many woman considers her 'empowering') .. thus overly generalized statement does not suffice and definitely doesn't improve. Hope you are getting me.

PS Most Fanservice in VGs never make sense to most players you know (At least the ones I know) ... no one pays for the pixel tits and ass but doesnt like it when its taken away. No one plays Halo for Cortana's non corporal female holographic form but wld get angry if you changed it. Its bit like Bollywood spontaneous dancing sequences ... it doesn't make sense but it is there and wld get mobbed if you questioned it.

 

[Avani]

Remember that Female Thor fiasco? They truly threw the lore and commonsense out of window to make it a feminist version of Thor and ultimately it was cancelled (The sales did not go well for a reboot either). You should know about all the attention and justification and all about it .... But funnily Marvel already tried to push two Female led Norse based comics .. twice ... one with Lady Sif and one with Valkyr and both got no publicity and was cancelled due to low sales. The same thing happens more often than not in the gaming industry in other ways .... that is why some people can be agitated. Things can change for good .. Like the Lara Croft reboot but more often than not it leave a bitter taste on the mouth like Dragon Age: Inquisition (which traditionally had better writing and was very egalitarian) which went out of it way to push some ideas and ended up laming the horse (Yet got bombed by the progressive anyway). There is absolutely nothing wrong asking for something else and asking for improvement benefits all ... but employing means that is stupid and reactionary only ends up in destroying. This is exactly like movie, manga and anime: some uses fan service to push mediocre content (Fighting games like DoA) or some adds it for the lols (Metal Gear Solid ... Quiet IS a fanservice charachtered with the single purpose of provoking reactions. But yet its not a bad game) or some peruse it tastefully (Heavy rain) ... so the issue is not as simple as it seems (Byonetta is on the level of Quiet but was designed by a woman and many woman considers her 'empowering') .. thus overly generalized statement does not suffice and definitely doesn't improve. Hope you are getting me.

Stupid execution of some supposed "feminist" idea is just that - stupid. I don't care for Quite particularly-but if you are going to claim her breast and thong weren't used and objectified as soft porn theme at times I am going to disagree. If you are trying to say that such moments were not that many as to stand out and over all the depiction takes the eye away from it then it's another matter( although I find it debatable seeing the Gifs over it). It's hard to be sympathetic for me for the designer when he is tweeting that now "Quite toy is for sale and you can push and press her breasts" or something along that line for I forgot the exact quote. At least tell your designer to not be be such a blabber mouth.

 

[YowYan]

I used to call myself a feminist for quite some time but then, then at some point changed my mind as 'feminist' is just another label that categorizes people and creates more distance instead of unity. Just look at the squabbles revolving around that topic. So now I just keep it at 'equal rights advocate'/'humanitarian'.