[VS] Danzo vs kakashi

[Brother Numpsay]

Uh what? Where did you even get that from? Minato's reactions>Danzo's reactions in general.

im getting it from your confusing example

 

[KidGamer65]

im getting it from your confusing example

My example isn't confusing in the slightest nor can it get any simpler. My example had nothing to do with whether Minato's reactions are better than Danzo's. It blatantly showed the difference between Mental and Physical reactions. How hard is that to understand?

 

[Brother Numpsay]

My example isn't confusing in the slightest nor can it get any simpler. My example had nothing to do with whether Minato's reactions are better than Danzo's. It blatantly showed the difference between Mental and Physical reactions. How hard is that to understand?

Its hard to understand how this example is the reason Izanagi cannot escape kamui. anyways not funny anymore since you're ready to concede that izangi is able to escape kamui. now that the one shot argument is out of the way. how do still see a
kakashi taking this
edit I don't know why my auto word the word.funny in my sentence

 

[OnPoint]

The aggressive approach that Sasuke took is the completely wrong one to take when fighting Danzo to begin with(unless you're some sort of chakra god ala a Kisame or Hashirama). It's a complete waste of chakra. The advantage for Kakashi in this fight is his superior tai and kenjutsu skills. While he certainly has the chakra reserves now to use raikiri or it's variants multiple times over a 10 minute period, it wouldn't be required here, nor would it be intelligent to take that route.

I disagree. The approach Sasuke took was effective because it brought complacency into Danzō's game and made the former's act of deception all the more easier to carry out. Taking a less zealous approach simply means that Danzō can release the Izanagi and prolong his invincibility. It being demanding with regards to chakra works both ways - Danzō is also being taxed as he attempts to keep the technique active, as Obito explained.

I know it isn't feasible for Kakashi to mirror such an approach. He can use Raikiri and its variants to exhaust Danzō's immortality, but they'll only be effective if they're used in such a way as to force Danzō into using that Jutsu; he won't waste it on techniques he could've simply avoided or dodged normally.

 

[KidGamer65]

Its hard to understand how this example is the reason Izanagi cannot escape kamui. anyways not funny anymore since you're ready to concede that izangi is able to escape kamui. now that the one shot argument is out of the way. how do still see a
kakashi taking this

No, I was just explaining the difference between two types of reactions. It had nothing to do with the discussion at hand. Again, clear if you were reading my posts.

Just because he can't use Kamui to teleport him away, doesn't mean he can't warp away bits of his body, which take much less chakra than warping his whole body. That still forces him to keep Izanagi active at all times if he doesn't want to die. He still has Raikiri and variants to kill Danzo to force him to use Izanagi not to mention he has displayed the ability to teleport himself.

 

[slimreaper]

The aggressive approach that Sasuke took is the completely wrong one to take when fighting Danzo to begin with(unless you're some sort of chakra god ala a Kisame or Hashirama). It's a complete waste of chakra. The advantage for Kakashi in this fight is his superior tai and kenjutsu skills. While he certainly has the chakra reserves now to use raikiri or it's variants multiple times over a 10 minute period, it wouldn't be required here, nor would it be intelligent to take that route.

wrong sasuke chose the right means to fight danzo. if you were to just hold off an not pressure danzo, he could just deactivate izanagi.

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[EliteKakashi]

I disagree. The approach Sasuke took was effective because it brought complacency into Danzō's game and made the former's act of deception all the more easier to carry out. Taking a less zealous approach simply means that Danzō can release the Izanagi and prolong his invincibility. It being demanding with regards to chakra works both ways - Danzō is also being taxed as he attempts to keep the technique active, as Obito explained.

I know it isn't feasible for Kakashi to mirror such an approach. He can use Raikiri and its variants to exhaust Danzō's immortality, but they'll only be effective if they're used in such a way as to force Danzō into using that Jutsu; he won't waste it on techniques he could've simply avoided or dodged normally.

It's not the correct approach with CQC feats of someone like Kakashi(and I feel even Sasuke..but whatever). Kakashi's vast superiority in tai and kenjutsu would be enough to pressure Danzo in to keeping it active, especially considering the kubikiribocho is in

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. Kakashi's already shown he can compete with the 7 swordsmen in kenjutsu, and his kunai usage is among the best we've seen in the manga, showing he can

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, then

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and put

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Kakashi's feats in these areas are more than enough to dominate Danzo and keep him pressured/using Izanagi.

wrong sasuke chose the right means to fight danzo. if you were to just hold off an not pressure danzo, he could just deactivate izanagi.

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Responded to above.

 

[OnPoint]

It's not the correct approach with CQC feats of someone like Kakashi(and I feel even Sasuke..but whatever). Kakashi's vast superiority in tai and kenjutsu would be enough to pressure Danzo in to keeping it active, especially considering the kubikiribocho is in

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. Kakashi's already shown he can compete with the 7 swordsmen in kenjutsu, and his kunai usage is among the best we've seen in the manga, showing he can

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, then

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and put

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Kakashi's feats in these areas are more than enough to dominate Danzo and keep him pressured/using Izanagi.

I agree that Kakashi has the tools needed to best an Izanagi user like Danzō - I merely implied that his means/method of doing so may not be as effective as Sasuke's (although, from a chakra standpoint, it may be more efficient). It'll be more difficult for him to get at Danzō, because a fighter more suited to CQC will be more at risk at being caught by his Juinjutsu. There's also the Sharingan's precognitive abilities to consider. I think Kakashi has what it takes to seize a victory, but I don't think his arsenal will allow him to 'dominate' the fight - rather, subtly maintain the upper hand (by making use of feints, guerrilla tactics and such).

 

[slimreaper]

It's not the correct approach with CQC feats of someone like Kakashi(and I feel even Sasuke..but whatever). Kakashi's vast superiority in tai and kenjutsu would be enough to pressure Danzo in to keeping it active, especially considering the kubikiribocho is in

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. Kakashi's already shown he can compete with the 7 swordsmen in kenjutsu, and his kunai usage is among the best we've seen in the manga, showing he can

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, then

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and put

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Kakashi's feats in these areas are more than enough to dominate Danzo and keep him pressured/using Izanagi.



Responded to above.

danzo would try to make this a long range fight considering all his attacks are long range except his fuuton sword

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danzo wouldn't let this be a close range fight, unless he knew he could win

 

[EliteKakashi]

I agree that Kakashi has the tools needed to best an Izanagi user like Danzō - I merely implied that his means/method of doing so may not be as effective as Sasuke's (although, from a chakra standpoint, it may be more efficient). It'll be more difficult for him to get at Danzō, because a fighter more suited to CQC will be more at risk at being caught by his Juinjutsu. There's also the Sharingan's precognitive abilities to consider. I think Kakashi has what it takes to seize a victory, but I don't think his arsenal will allow him to 'dominate' the fight - rather, subtly maintain the upper hand (by making use of feints, guerrilla tactics and such).

I feel the chakra conservation does make it more effective. Otherwise, you can be put at a serious disadvantage in regards to chakra if you ever screw something up/miss. In regards to the juinjutsu, that's where Kakashi's superiority would come in handy. I'm not sure Danzo has the feats to even hit Kakashi in a CQC fight. Precog is true, but it's also something Kakashi possesses, and as Lee stated vs Sasuke, being able to see the move coming doesn't give you the physical abilities to counter/react.

In regards to dominate, didn't really mean that Kakashi was on a completely different tier than Danzo(you could argue Danzo is above Kakashi on an overall scale) or whatever, just more so that Kakashi's skill set counters Danzo's almost perfectly. I also feel the knowledge the OP gave Kakashi helps favor him, too. Knowing Danzo is a futon user gives him the knowledge of how to react if it were to turn in to a ninjutsu battle at some point.

 

[EliteKakashi]

danzo would try to make this a long range fight considering all his attacks are long range except his fuuton sword

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danzo wouldn't let this be a close range fight, unless he knew he could win

Danzo can "not want" it to turn in to a CQC fight all he wants, doesn't mean it's going to stop Kakashi from making it one once he's observed Danzo's abilities. Kakashi has the speed feats to close ground on Danzo very quickly, even faster if he were to use raikiri to amplify his speed. Kakashi's knowledge of Danzo's futon use will prepare him for it.

 

[slimreaper]

Danzo can "not want" it to turn in to a CQC fight all he wants, doesn't mean it's going to stop Kakashi from making it one once he's observed Danzo's abilities. Kakashi has the speed feats to close ground on Danzo very quickly, even faster if he were to use raikiri to amplify his speed. Kakashi's knowledge of Danzo's futon use will prepare him for it.

he managed to make it a long range fight against the comparably fast sasuke due to izanagi popping him up wherever. kakashi closing distance would be difficult considering danzo's ranged attacks. I also see kakashi having very little response to baku. he doesn't have the time to think of a plan like sasuke did

 

[Brother Numpsay]

No, I was just explaining the difference between two types of reactions. It had nothing to do with the discussion at hand. Again, clear if you were reading my posts.

Just because he can't use Kamui to teleport him away, doesn't mean he can't warp away bits of his body, which take much less chakra than warping his whole body. That still forces him to keep Izanagi active at all times if he doesn't want to die. He still has Raikiri and variants to kill Danzo to force him to use Izanagi not to mention he has displayed the ability to teleport himself.

instead of a summary, explain how he win without getting touch. touch equel seal. my phone is about to die so I will reply later

 

[KidGamer65]

instead of a summary, explain how he win without getting touch. touch equel seal. my phone is about to die so I will reply later

lol? Danzo is going to apply the seal to a guy who can

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, attack long range via Kamui (

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) and has Bunshin feints? Not to mention Danzo actually has to hold him long enough to apply the seal, he only got that opportunity with Sasuke cause the latter charged in with his sword. If you think that one simple touch means its been applied, well, then you should stop overrating Danzo's abilties. Kakashi would shit on him in CQC anyway.

 

[deidara senpai]

kakashi got tougher in the war but he still aint danzos level

kakashis stamina has gotten better but still not there yet, danzo could end izanagi when he wants to and if kakashi keeps using raikiris and kamuis he wont have enough of them to completely kill danzo, he has wind element and wood element for when rakiri comes out and danzo has izanagi on when he keeps kamuing him and keeps coming back

danzo i can see losing most of his eyes but sadly the bastard beats kakashi i hate to admit it, i hate danzo to hell

 

[Brother Numpsay]

lol? Danzo is going to apply the seal to a guy who can

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, attack long range via Kamui (

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) and has Bunshin feints? Not to mention Danzo actually has to hold him long enough to apply the seal, he only got that opportunity with Sasuke cause the latter charged in with his sword. If you think that one simple touch means its been applied, well, then you should stop overrating Danzo's abilties. Kakashi would shit on him in CQC anyway.

I hope you don't believe Kakashi can Kamui into the dimensions by himself. I will literately not waste time in this discussion if you believe so.

You are also sensitive to wordplay I used. "Touch" wasn't necessary meant in no means simple. As shown in the manga he needs to imprint his opponent. Danzo tried

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to go

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but Sussanoo one-up all his attempts. An absolute defense is the game-factor for Sasuke's victory who is also skilled in CQC and yet Danzo was shown many times that he performs up

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due to

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[EliteKakashi]

I hope you don't believe Kakashi can Kamui into the dimensions by himself. I will literately not waste time in this discussion if you believe so.

He's shown he's capable of using kamui on himself.

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He's never warped himself to the dimension before, but seeing as he can use it on himself, I'm not sure why it wouldn't be possible.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

He's shown he's capable of using kamui on himself.

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He's never warped himself to the dimension before, but seeing as he can use it on himself, I'm not sure why it wouldn't be possible.

That cause you got it all wrong. Obito is the one warping him in. He is only allow to get out, not put himself in.

 

[TheEvilOne]

Izanagi > Kamui. Danzo wins med diff.

 

[Bogard]

Kamui is too fast that even a self Kamui user with Sharingan and Rinnengan didn't manage to notice it in time. So just saying that Danzo could notice and activate Izanagi in time is laughable(at least if Kakashi gets the timing right). So Danzo would be transfered in the other dimension without even noticing what happened before. Plus Izanagi only transforms wounds into dream.

Kamui only transfering someone's body from place to place, it wouldn't even allows Izanagi to happen. Basically it's as if a person was going from position A to position B. So to activate Izanagi in this case, Danzo would also have to hurt himself. Furthermore, the Izanagi image only appear next to the one that gets destroyed. Even if Izanagi were to activate, being in the other dimension already, it won't help him to escape since the image would only appear next to his former position(in the other dimension). Kamui is really a perfect counter for Izanagi