[Discussion] At what difficulty can Roger defeat an admiral?

[ssjelf]

Also meaning an equality in value or standing or A LEVEL of equality

an average, usual, or normal amount, degree, quality, condition, standard, or the like:
above par; to feel below par.

It has different meanings but is essentially the same thing. It depends on how you used the word and the context. I say top tiers are on a LEVEL of equality but that doesn't mean that Kizaru is Roger's complete equal to use an example. Once again, the top tiers are on par with each other in my opinion.

Thats fair enough so long as im clear what you meant but what about my other questions?

 

[Vandenre1ch]

What other questions exactly? Kinda lost track with all the other stuff.

 

[ssjelf]

What other questions exactly? Kinda lost track with all the other stuff.

Difficulty WB wins in Old Wb vs akainu. Prime WB vs akainu.

Also that you said sanji at eos is on par with admirals and luffy hgih diffs sanji, doesnt luffy high diff admirals? At the very least sanji should beat admirals in some amount of time after the manga ends because he is in monster trio. Luffy will gro wafter manga two and like it was said luffy is basically roger so that means that they should be equal eventually.

 

[Vandenre1ch]

Difficulty WB wins in Old Wb vs akainu. Prime WB vs akainu.

Also that you said sanji at eos is on par with admirals and luffy hgih diffs sanji, doesnt luffy high diff admirals? At the very least sanji should beat admirals in some amount of time after the manga ends because he is in monster trio. Luffy will gro wafter manga two and like it was said luffy is basically roger so that means that they should be equal eventually.

Before I start, I need to explain my take on difficulty or else this may lead to another problem.

Med Dif- Typically the fighters match each other blow for blow, stalemating each other and neither seemingly getting put at a disadvantage. The victor/loser of a fight like this may walk away with moderate injuries if unlucky or minor/no injures if lucky. Example: Luffy vs Don Chinjao, Zoro vs Ryuma

High Diff- Same as Med but injuries will normally pile up and the winner/loser will walk away with moderate injures at least if he is lucky. Example: Luffy vs Crocodile, Zoro vs Kaku

Extreme Diff- a fight so intense that bad injuries are guaranteed for both sides. Changing one little detail about a fight like this can lead to an opposite result. Example: Luffy vs Lucci, Akainu vs Aokiji


Old WB(without heart attacks) would exteme diff Akainu imo. Old WB was still said to be the WSM. Prime WB would still extreme diff Akainu. Old WB only seems to have lowered stamina and reflexes.

Uzumaki Macho said Roger would med-diff admirals. I said Roger would at least have high diff against admirals. His question was "if EoS Luffy can med-diff EoS Sanji, shouldn't EoS med-diff admirals?" I said EOS Luffy would high diff EOS Sanji but never said which difficultly Sanji would beat an admiral. EOS Sanji beats an admiral extreme diff. EOS LUFFY beats an admiral high diff but would have extreme difficulty against admiral Akainu. As I said before, strength still varies between admirals.

 

[Uzumaki Macho]

Before I start, I need to explain my take on difficulty or else this may lead to another problem.

Med Dif- Typically the fighters match each other blow for blow, stalemating each other and neither seemingly getting put at a disadvantage. The victor/loser of a fight like this may walk away with moderate injuries if unlucky or minor/no injures if lucky. Example: Luffy vs Don Chinjao, Zoro vs Ryuma

High Diff- Same as Med but injuries will normally pile up and the winner/loser will walk away with moderate injures at least if he is lucky. Example: Luffy vs Crocodile, Zoro vs Kaku

Extreme Diff- a fight so intense that bad injuries are guaranteed for both sides. Changing one little detail about a fight like this can lead to an opposite result. Example: Luffy vs Lucci, Akainu vs Aokiji


Old WB(without heart attacks) would exteme diff Akainu imo. Old WB was still said to be the WSM. Prime WB would still extreme diff Akainu. Old WB only seems to have lowered stamina and reflexes.

Uzumaki Macho said Roger would med-diff admirals. I said Roger would at least have high diff against admirals. His question was "if EoS Luffy can med-diff EoS Sanji, shouldn't EoS med-diff admirals?" I said EOS Luffy would high diff EOS Sanji but never said which difficultly Sanji would beat an admiral. EOS Sanji beats an admiral extreme diff. EOS LUFFY beats an admiral high diff but would have extreme difficulty against admiral Akainu. As I said before, strength still varies between admirals.

Whitebeard had lost his CoO, CoC, and had his disease eating away at his health, how can you say that would make only a very minute difference in his strength?

 

[ssjelf]

Before I start, I need to explain my take on difficulty or else this may lead to another problem.

Med Dif- Typically the fighters match each other blow for blow, stalemating each other and neither seemingly getting put at a disadvantage. The victor/loser of a fight like this may walk away with moderate injuries if unlucky or minor/no injures if lucky. Example: Luffy vs Don Chinjao, Zoro vs Ryuma

High Diff- Same as Med but injuries will normally pile up and the winner/loser will walk away with moderate injures at least if he is lucky. Example: Luffy vs Crocodile, Zoro vs Kaku

Extreme Diff- a fight so intense that bad injuries are guaranteed for both sides. Changing one little detail about a fight like this can lead to an opposite result. Example: Luffy vs Lucci, Akainu vs Aokiji


Old WB(without heart attacks) would exteme diff Akainu imo. Old WB was still said to be the WSM. Prime WB would still extreme diff Akainu. Old WB only seems to have lowered stamina and reflexes.

Uzumaki Macho said Roger would med-diff admirals. I said Roger would at least have high diff against admirals. His question was "if EoS Luffy can med-diff EoS Sanji, shouldn't EoS med-diff admirals?" I said EOS Luffy would high diff EOS Sanji but never said which difficultly Sanji would beat an admiral. EOS Sanji beats an admiral extreme diff. EOS LUFFY beats an admiral high diff but would have extreme difficulty against admiral Akainu. As I said before, strength still varies between admirals.

See I actually agree with most of what you said. I don't think roger can mid diff any admiral, i think he can high diff them with the exception of akainu most likely, he is extreme diff now that he is Fleet admiral. ( I believe that because this is shonen, a promotion is saying the character got stronger.) But regardless of that extreme diff. If luffy high diffs the admirals then so should roger right? I know luffy or roger wont med diff any admirals.

I know sanji vs an admirals would be extreme diff (except akainu). But that was besides my point, it was only that luffy should beat an ooponent that sanji could beat at an easier level than sanji did. And it seems we agree.

The only disagreement I have is prime WB vs akainu. marco said he could have dodged akainu punch when he was younger (the first punch thourgh WB's chest) this means that a lot of damage done to WB in their fight would have been prevented if WB was in his prime. It also means akianu might not have punched off WB's face. I think it would have gone to WB high diff for these reasons and also for one other. If roger equals WB and EOS luffy high diffs admirals, and luffy will at some point equal roger, then Prime WB should also high diff admirals. Aee note regarding how this applies to akainu because I know you said luffy extreme diff akainu,

BIG NOTE: Like I said before I personally believe that pre ts akainu is weaker than TS akainu just because of shonen manga tropes of rank=power. We have yet to see, but i would also think that akainu has been "training" by fighting aokiji. I am sure that fight pushed him and aokijis abilities a bit. It was also seen that pre ts akainu after the war was sailing the new world in search of BB, which means he probably clashed with some strong fighters. This personal opinion leads me to believe that pre ts akainu loses high diff to prime WB, but TS akainu loses extreme diff. Same with roger and luffy at some point. But its just my thoughts based on the shonen genre.

 

[Vandenre1ch]

See I actually agree with most of what you said. I don't think roger can mid diff any admiral, i think he can high diff them with the exception of akainu most likely, he is extreme diff now that he is Fleet admiral. ( I believe that because this is shonen, a promotion is saying the character got stronger.) But regardless of that extreme diff. If luffy high diffs the admirals then so should roger right? I know luffy or roger wont med diff any admirals.

I know sanji vs an admirals would be extreme diff (except akainu). But that was besides my point, it was only that luffy should beat an ooponent that sanji could beat at an easier level than sanji did. And it seems we agree.

The only disagreement I have is prime WB vs akainu. marco said he could have dodged akainu punch when he was younger (the first punch thourgh WB's chest) this means that a lot of damage done to WB in their fight would have been prevented if WB was in his prime. It also means akianu might not have punched off WB's face. I think it would have gone to WB high diff for these reasons and also for one other. If roger equals WB and EOS luffy high diffs admirals, and luffy will at some point equal roger, then Prime WB should also high diff admirals. Aee note regarding how this applies to akainu because I know you said luffy extreme diff akainu,

BIG NOTE: Like I said before I personally believe that pre ts akainu is weaker than TS akainu just because of shonen manga tropes of rank=power. We have yet to see, but i would also think that akainu has been "training" by fighting aokiji. I am sure that fight pushed him and aokijis abilities a bit. It was also seen that pre ts akainu after the war was sailing the new world in search of BB, which means he probably clashed with some strong fighters. This personal opinion leads me to believe that pre ts akainu loses high diff to prime WB, but TS akainu loses extreme diff. Same with roger and luffy at some point. But its just my thoughts based on the shonen genre.

So for you pre ts Akainu loses to Prime WB high diff but TS Akainu wins extreme diff. I personally think TS and pre-ts Akainu have the same strength but I completely understand your point with shonen rankings.

For Old WB, Marco only mentioned WB's deteriorating health and reflexes when Squardo stabbed him. I don't ever recall Marco saying about Akainu punching WB's chest not that it matters, as Akainu only managed to do it at that moment because WB had a heart attack.

Also, when I mentioned EOS Luffy, I was completely thinking of him as Roger's equal/being barely stronger than Roger.

 

[ssjelf]

So for you pre ts Akainu loses to Prime WB high diff but TS Akainu wins extreme diff. I personally think TS and pre-ts Akainu have the same strength but I completely understand your point with shonen rankings.

For Old WB, Marco only mentioned WB's deteriorating health and reflexes when Squardo stabbed him. I don't ever recall Marco saying about Akainu punching WB's chest not that it matters, as Akainu only managed to do it at that moment because WB had a heart attack.

Also, when I mentioned EOS Luffy, I was completely thinking of him as Roger's equal/being barely stronger than Roger.

You are right about marco's statement, my bad.

 

[Anduril]

Again after speding so much time on this thread I ought to clear my stand of tiers and Roger vs admiral,
Tiers for me are different,

Legends: Roger, Rayleigh, Garp, Dragon, Whitebeard, Gorosei (This is just a speculation)
Top Tier: Yonkou, Admirals, Kuzan, CP0, Mihawk.
Just below top tier: Doflamingo, Luffy, Trafalgar Law, Sabo (with M&M), Jinbei


And finally to answer the thread - According to cloudsblacklightninwhitetigergermanshephard's difficulty levels I think Roger will High diff any admiral.

 

[kageking]

Having seen what whitebeard could do at marineford and knowing he and roger were rivals I think a prime roger mid diffs admirals. His conquerors haki must have been immense, we've seen that used to knock people unconscious and more recently as a combat enhancement that makes mountains quake ( luffy vs chinjao and doflamingo ). Imagine what roger would have been capable of!

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

Having seen what whitebeard could do at marineford and knowing he and roger were rivals I think a prime roger mid diffs admirals. His conquerors haki must have been immense, we've seen that used to knock people unconscious and more recently as a combat enhancement that makes mountains quake ( luffy vs chinjao and doflamingo ). Imagine what roger would have been capable of!

Even though Whitebeard would have lost to Sakazuki had it not been for his surprise attack?

Sakazuki basically killed the guy, it just took time for his injuries to take effect