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Analysis of Hashirama vs Madara battle then Edo Madara vs Edo Hashirama [read first]

Do you agree with Madara and Base Hashirama being around same level ?

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    Votes: 7 58.3%

  • No

    Votes: 5 41.7%
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KCMNaruto

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Hello guys I would like to shown detailed anylysis of Hashirama vs Madara battle, and while displaying/estabilishing some facts I would like to debunk some common misconceptions. Let's begin !

Madara vs Hashirama battle begins in 620 chapter page 13:
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then lasts until 621 chapter page 12 interrupted by flashback in meanwhile then begins continue from 626 chapter page 3 and lasts to 626 chapter page 15.

Madara vs Hashirama battle as living beings​
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^^ First scene of Madara vs Hashirama clash displaying equal skills with use of weapons/Bukijutsu/Kenjutsu

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^^ Madara controls Kyuubi and commands to fire off Tailed beast bomb while base Hashirama uses Mokuton: Mokuryu no jutsu/Wood dragon

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^^ Wood dragons attacks Kyuubi, who shoot casual TBB at it, destroying it in process

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^^ Hashirama creates Wood hand which catches casual TBB and slams at Kyuubi covered by Madara's Final Sussano v4. unstabilized form.

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^^ Now take a look at Hashirama and Madara's face expressions. Madara seems to be not scared and easy going while Hashirama clench his teeth showing lack of confidence or not being to sure about easily tanking this casual TBB.

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^^ Madara coats Kyuubi with Perfect Sussano armor

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^^ Kyuubi coated in PS armor swings it's blade at Hashirama

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^^ Hashirama uses wod hands to stop Swing of the Sussano's blade in time, then try to surronds Madara on controlled Kyuubi coated by PS armor with wood hands emerging out of ground form all sides. However Madara easily cut them in pieces along with cutting tops of the mountains.

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^^ Hashirama already shows fatigue and worry that he can NOT win like that, but he can NOT summon Shin SuuSenjuu here as it would destroys great scale of landscape and that why he get away from Madara luring him out in sea's direction. Meanwhile Madara commands Kyuubi to use another casual TBB

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^^ Madara add Perfect Sussano blade to TBB, piercing through it then shoot it at escaping Hashirama, who stops and try to summon something.

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^^ Hashirama summons five gates of Rashomon which allows him to change trajectory of incomming TBB with PS sword infused. Note that it was not enough to stop it or tank it but just a bit change direction of attack.

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^^ Base Hashirama notices explosion behind him cuased by Madara's attack and is forced to clap his hands and does something finally. Note as madara is relaxed why Hashirama get serious.

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^^ Madara and Hashirama talks to each other.

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^^ Hashirama knows that nothing he will do in his base form... can help him in that battle, so he is forced to enter Sage mode. It is further proved by Hashi words: "It can not be helped"

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^^ Hashirama summons Shin Suu Senjuu in his Sennin mode

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^^ Both Hashirama and Madara are going serious at each other. Even although Shin SuuSenjuu size dwarfs over Kyuubi size then Still Madara is not shown worried but serious.

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^^ Madara and SM hashirama are going at each other with serious intent.

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^^ Buddha strikes with all thousand fists at Madara standing on Kyuubi coated by PS's armor, while striking some buddha hands get shattered. It shows how durable and thick PS's armor on Kyuubi is.

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^^ Madara shots barrage of casual TBB with PS's blades infused at Shin SuuSenjuu, which keep striking at Madara with all power.

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^^ Buddha is shown with all wood hands shattered/broken, while Sussano armor get almost completly removed from Kyuubi with just a bit of it staying. Hashirama and Madara both patns, but here is proved that Hashirama thanks to greater amount of stamina can first attack, before Madara will have time to react.

^^ Note also, that Kyuubi is not damaged at all, so Shin Suu Senjuu strikes was just enough to remove Sussano but could not harm Kyuubi...

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^^ Kyuubi get caught by Shin SuuSenjuu hand while Madara didn't give any command to Kyuubi from being low on stamina or couldn't catch breath. Hashirama then jumps off on Wood dragon and attack Madara fast, forcing him to get away from Kyuubi and do not give him time to counterattack.

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Wood's dragon hand lands on Kyuubi's head making use of Mokuton surprassing Bijuu powers right away but releasing Kyuubi from Madara's control then forcing it to sleep before it goes at rampage or be fully awoken. Hashirama then keep attacking EMS Madara, while still keeping SM. Zoom on Madara's EMS in last scan shows that Madara may used some powerfull Genjutsu on Hashirama.

Then we skip to it:

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^^ Both Madara and base Hashirama are shown panting, then charge at each other... It fruther proves that they are around equal. EMS Madara without PS=Base Hashirama.

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^^ Madara and Hashirama swings at each other with their weapons

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^^ Hashirama get power up due to will of fire and win against Madara

Edo Madara vs Edo Hashirama battle as zombies ​
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^^ Madara intercepts Hashirama.

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^^ Clash of Wood dragon with Sussano's Sword v3

^^ Hashirama is still using Sage mode

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^^ Madara ascends his Sussano to Perfect Sussano while battling against SM Hashirama using Wood dragon which also grows in size.

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^^ Both Madara and SM Hashirama are serious but not worried and calm. Perfect Sussano is bigger then Wood dragon used by SM Hashirama...

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^^ SM Hashirama seems worried while Edo Madara is seems crazy but having situtation under control

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^^ Madara descends his Sussano to v1 form, just chakra shroud while facing off Hashirama after Obito nuked TBB.

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^^ Hashirama lost SM and Madara is just using Sussano shroud... and they seems to be equals.

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^^ Both Madara and Base Hashirama are shown easy going at each other.

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^^ Madara trying to pierce base Hashirama, who is struggling and shows fatigue while avoiding attack.

Then later Hashiram's clone is nowhere to be seen, but we have to wait to see conclusion/result of Madara vs Hashirama battle.

Also here is reason why Hashirama could not understimate power of Kyuubi:

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^^ Hashirama is badly wounded and he seems to be worried. If it was easy for him to bind Kyuubi then he would be relaxed but he was NOT.


NOTE: Sage mode enhances even techniques used in base form... So Wood dragon of SM Hashirama > Wood dragon of Base Hashirama... the gap may be quite big.

Also Edo Madara posses Hashirama's DNA... so I believe his PS may get enhanced as well and is > EMS Madara's PS version.

Summary :​
  • EMS Madara without Perfect Sussano alive is around Base's Hashirama level, with PS he is > Base Hashirama.
  • Base Hashirama was almost all the time on defence against EMS Madara controlling Kyuubi, so EMS Madara with Kyuubi >> Base Hashirama
  • Shin Suu Senjuu's thousand arms striking were just enough to remove Sussano's armor, nothing more. Kyuubi was unwounded with no damage shown.
  • Edo Madara with PS >= SM Hashirama without Shin SuuSenjuu (Madara was stalemating with SM Hashirama using wood dragon)
  • Perfect Sussano of Edo Madara is more powerfull then EMS Madara as alive, because it PS Edo Madara was able to keep going against SM Hashirama using Wood dragon and easily to add.
  • After all it looks like that: SM Hashirama using Buddha >=Edo Madara with PS>=SM Hashirama using Wood dragon=EMS Madara with Kyuubi> EMS Madara with PS> Base Hashirama=EMS Madara without PS(Final Sussano available.)
  • Any form of EMS Madara(except without PS) > Base Hashirama
Thanks for reading !

Please share your thoughts ;)

If you are going to argue against me... then you only deny manga facts ;)

But feel free to do that... if you know better then Kishi

MANGA FACTS
 
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Hype:
-Madara is 2nd Rikudou Sennin
-Madara is invincible and immortal
-Madara has the power of god
-Madara has the power of Rikudou Sennin
-Madara is perfect and has no weakness stated by Kishi in his interview

Using hype between the rivals, Madara is easily above the god of shinobi as he has stronger hype. Now using feats in conjunction with hype, Madara is a lot more powerful. EMS Madara who pushed Hashirama to his limits was inferior to edo Madara [
You must be registered for see links
] yet EMS Madara alone was almost equal to Hashirama [
You must be registered for see links
], so explain how edo Madara is weaker when at the same moment he stronger than EMS Madara who is stated to be almost as strong as Hashirama.

Moving on...if we take a look at their prowess, EMS Madara's only problem that made him weaker is his stamina cannot keep up with Hashirama, and that's why he needed Kyuubi so he can tire the mighty Senju. However being an edo, stamina is no problem as he now can fight infinitely, so that alone makes him completely equal to Hashirama. However at the same time, Hashirama needs Sage Mode so he can match Madara in power as proven that when Madara summoned PS, Hashirama doesn't have any jutsu in his arsenal to best out PS other than Shinsuusenju that requires SM. So now that we know the difference between in prowess and weakness, everything else is easy to establish.

Edo Madara = EMS Madara + base Hashirama + Nagato in one body [
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] as Kabuto called edo Madara the union of his prime and Hashirama. So if we look at edo Madara's prowess in battle, he is a lot more versatile and has Rinnegan which he canonically confirmed he can use [
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] and Rinnegan alone proved to be bigger threat than Kyuubi [
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] that even Hashirama stated to be too great for him [
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]. The combination of EMS + Mokuton + Rinnegan in one body is too great for Hashirama.

Edo Madara beats Hashirama/edo Hashirama mid difficulty.
 
KCMNaruto

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Madara Rules said:

Hype:
-Madara is 2nd Rikudou Sennin
-Madara is invincible and immortal
-Madara has the power of god
-Madara has the power of Rikudou Sennin
-Madara is perfect and has no weakness stated by Kishi in his interview

Using hype between the rivals, Madara is easily above the god of shinobi as he has stronger hype. Now using feats in conjunction with hype, Madara is a lot more powerful. EMS Madara who pushed Hashirama to his limits was inferior to edo Madara [
You must be registered for see links
] yet EMS Madara alone was almost equal to Hashirama [
You must be registered for see links
], so explain how edo Madara is weaker when at the same moment he stronger than EMS Madara who is stated to be almost as strong as Hashirama.

Moving on...if we take a look at their prowess, EMS Madara's only problem that made him weaker is his stamina cannot keep up with Hashirama, and that's why he needed Kyuubi so he can tire the mighty Senju. However being an edo, stamina is no problem as he now can fight infinitely, so that alone makes him completely equal to Hashirama. However at the same time, Hashirama needs Sage Mode so he can match Madara in power as proven that when Madara summoned PS, Hashirama doesn't have any jutsu in his arsenal to best out PS other than Shinsuusenju that requires SM. So now that we know the difference between in prowess and weakness, everything else is easy to establish.

Edo Madara = EMS Madara + base Hashirama + Nagato in one body [
You must be registered for see links
] as Kabuto called edo Madara the union of his prime and Hashirama. So if we look at edo Madara's prowess in battle, he is a lot more versatile and has Rinnegan which he canonically confirmed he can use [
You must be registered for see links
] and Rinnegan alone proved to be bigger threat than Kyuubi [
You must be registered for see links
] that even Hashirama stated to be too great for him [
You must be registered for see links
]. The combination of EMS + Mokuton + Rinnegan in one body is too great for Hashirama.

Edo Madara beats Hashirama/edo Hashirama mid difficulty.
Click to expand...
I agree with everything expect:

SM Hashirama with Shin SuuSenjuu is still > everything shown by Edo Madara so far...

sorry but this is truth even if I don't like it.

Maybe if Madara begin to utilize Rinnegan then it changes... because Rinnegan is his only hope.

It is as manga shows: SM Hashirama using Buddha >=Edo Madara with PS>=SM Hashirama using Wood dragon=EMS Madara with Kyuubi> EMS Madara with PS> Base Hashirama=EMS Madara without PS(Final Sussano available.)

Note that I compare just Madara using his PS, as Madara stated it is his full power... so Meteorite may be below it.

Senjuu DNA in Madara is <=Hashirama's Senjuu DNA...

So only left is Rinnegan and it depends on it if Madara is stronger or not.

Narutoga said:
nice work, it seemed as if i reread the manga, i understand better now, and i agree SM hashirama > madara any form =D
rep
Click to expand...
Yes and not because it depends what you mean:

SM Hashirama using Shin SuuSenjuu > Madara any from(Although Edo Madara with PS and meteorite may be not so far behind.)

but SM Hashirama without Shin Suu Senjuu IS NOT > Madara any form, because Edo madara with PS >= SM Hashirama without Shin Suu Senjuu

Manga facts ;), and I am happy that I helped
 
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Narutoga

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Madara Rules said:

Hype:
-Madara is 2nd Rikudou Sennin
-Madara is invincible and immortal
-Madara has the power of god
-Madara has the power of Rikudou Sennin
-Madara is perfect and has no weakness stated by Kishi in his interview

Using hype between the rivals, Madara is easily above the god of shinobi as he has stronger hype. Now using feats in conjunction with hype, Madara is a lot more powerful. EMS Madara who pushed Hashirama to his limits was inferior to edo Madara [
You must be registered for see links
] yet EMS Madara alone was almost equal to Hashirama [
You must be registered for see links
], so explain how edo Madara is weaker when at the same moment he stronger than EMS Madara who is stated to be almost as strong as Hashirama.

Moving on...if we take a look at their prowess, EMS Madara's only problem that made him weaker is his stamina cannot keep up with Hashirama, and that's why he needed Kyuubi so he can tire the mighty Senju. However being an edo, stamina is no problem as he now can fight infinitely, so that alone makes him completely equal to Hashirama. However at the same time, Hashirama needs Sage Mode so he can match Madara in power as proven that when Madara summoned PS, Hashirama doesn't have any jutsu in his arsenal to best out PS other than Shinsuusenju that requires SM. So now that we know the difference between in prowess and weakness, everything else is easy to establish.

Edo Madara = EMS Madara + base Hashirama + Nagato in one body [
You must be registered for see links
] as Kabuto called edo Madara the union of his prime and Hashirama. So if we look at edo Madara's prowess in battle, he is a lot more versatile and has Rinnegan which he canonically confirmed he can use [
You must be registered for see links
] and Rinnegan alone proved to be bigger threat than Kyuubi [
You must be registered for see links
] that even Hashirama stated to be too great for him [
You must be registered for see links
]. The combination of EMS + Mokuton + Rinnegan in one body is too great for Hashirama.

Edo Madara beats Hashirama/edo Hashirama mid difficulty.
Click to expand...
hashi is also an edo, so infinite stamina, and madara highest mokuton, tech is a wood dragon at about 7 times smaller than the normal one, hashi's mokuton < base hashi, also edo madara is without full kurama and this is replaced with a watered down base hashi, and an unmastered rinnegan
 
Narutoga

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KCMNaruto said:
I agree with everything expect:

SM Hashirama with Shin SuuSenjuu is still > everything shown by Edo Madara so far...

sorry but this is truth even if I don't like it.

Maybe if Madara begin to utilize Rinnegan then it changes... because Rinnegan is his only hope.

It is as manga shows: SM Hashirama using Buddha >=Edo Madara with PS>=SM Hashirama using Wood dragon=EMS Madara with Kyuubi> EMS Madara with PS> Base Hashirama=EMS Madara without PS(Final Sussano available.)

Note that I compare just Madara using his PS, as Madara stated it is his full power... so Meteorite may be below it.

Senjuu DNA in Madara is <=Hashirama's Senjuu DNA...

So only left is Rinnegan and it depends on it if Madara is stronger or not.



Yes and not because it depends what you mean:

SM Hashirama using Shin SuuSenjuu > Madara any from(Although Edo Madara with PS and meteorite may be not so far behind.)

but SM Hashirama without Shin Suu Senjuu IS NOT > Madara any form, because Edo madara with PS >= SM Hashirama without Shin Suu Senjuu

Manga facts ;), and I am happy that I helped
Click to expand...
yeah, with shinsuusenju
 
Erza Scarlet

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Madara Rules said:

Hype:
-Madara is 2nd Rikudou Sennin
-Madara is invincible and immortal
-Madara has the power of god
-Madara has the power of Rikudou Sennin
-Madara is perfect and has no weakness stated by Kishi in his interview

Using hype between the rivals, Madara is easily above the god of shinobi as he has stronger hype. Now using feats in conjunction with hype, Madara is a lot more powerful. EMS Madara who pushed Hashirama to his limits was inferior to edo Madara [
You must be registered for see links
] yet EMS Madara alone was almost equal to Hashirama [
You must be registered for see links
], so explain how edo Madara is weaker when at the same moment he stronger than EMS Madara who is stated to be almost as strong as Hashirama.

Moving on...if we take a look at their prowess, EMS Madara's only problem that made him weaker is his stamina cannot keep up with Hashirama, and that's why he needed Kyuubi so he can tire the mighty Senju. However being an edo, stamina is no problem as he now can fight infinitely, so that alone makes him completely equal to Hashirama. However at the same time, Hashirama needs Sage Mode so he can match Madara in power as proven that when Madara summoned PS, Hashirama doesn't have any jutsu in his arsenal to best out PS other than Shinsuusenju that requires SM. So now that we know the difference between in prowess and weakness, everything else is easy to establish.

Edo Madara = EMS Madara + base Hashirama + Nagato in one body [
You must be registered for see links
] as Kabuto called edo Madara the union of his prime and Hashirama. So if we look at edo Madara's prowess in battle, he is a lot more versatile and has Rinnegan which he canonically confirmed he can use [
You must be registered for see links
] and Rinnegan alone proved to be bigger threat than Kyuubi [
You must be registered for see links
] that even Hashirama stated to be too great for him [
You must be registered for see links
]. The combination of EMS + Mokuton + Rinnegan in one body is too great for Hashirama.

Edo Madara beats Hashirama/edo Hashirama mid difficulty.
Click to expand...
It doesn't matter what you say, the manga has already shown that Hasirama is stronger then Madara, and that was when he had Kurama to help.
 

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KCMNaruto said:
I agree with everything expect:

SM Hashirama with Shin SuuSenjuu is still > everything shown by Edo Madara so far...

sorry but this is truth even if I don't like it.

Maybe if Madara begin to utilize Rinnegan then it changes... because Rinnegan is his only hope.

It is as manga shows: SM Hashirama using Buddha >=Edo Madara with PS>=SM Hashirama using Wood dragon=EMS Madara with Kyuubi> EMS Madara with PS> Base Hashirama=EMS Madara without PS(Final Sussano available.)

Note that I compare just Madara using his PS, as Madara stated it is his full power... so Meteorite may be below it.

Senjuu DNA in Madara is <=Hashirama's Senjuu DNA...

So only left is Rinnegan and it depends on it if Madara is stronger or not.
Click to expand...
You're still preaching the wrong conclusion.

Shinsuusenju was not enough to best out Madara and the Uchiha latter destroyed the remains of it after Kyuubi's suppression [
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] [
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]. As you can see in those panels, Shinsuusenju was still around after Hashirama suppressed the Kyuubi and resulting Madara and Hashirama's exhaustion, EMS Madara had destroyed the remains of it. Note: the remains of the statue.

Moving on...using the arguemnt of PS being Madara's full power is contradiction as shown the latter can still combine PS attacks along with other jutsu like TBB. So that contradicts Madara's words. Now using common sense, Madara performed V3 Susanoo along with meteor, Katon along with V2 Susanoo, genjutsu with V3 Susanoo. So to say that Madara cant perform anything in his PS when manga showed he defiantly can then there is no reason to say he cant perform PS with meteor or even PS clones giving thoughts of his infinite chakra.

And one more thing, Meteor > Shinsuusenju. Not only that its bigger than the statue if you calculate the difference in their size, but its too heavy for buddah to push it back especially when its weight and velocity are coming at high speed.

Narutoga said:
hashi is also an edo, so infinite stamina, and madara highest mokuton, tech is a wood dragon at about 7 times smaller than the normal one, hashi's mokuton < base hashi, also edo madara is without full kurama and this is replaced with a watered down base hashi, and an unmastered rinnegan
Click to expand...
Madara states Hashirama's mokuton dragon was the same one he used to subdue Kyuubi [
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]

Uhh although Madara confirmed he can use rinnegan feats. Nice try.

Narutoga said:
yeah, with shinsuusenju
Click to expand...
Meteor.

Erza Scarlet said:
It doesn't matter what you say, the manga has already shown that Hasirama is stronger then Madara, and that was when he had Kurama to help.
Click to expand...
It doesn't matter what you say, manga showed Hashirama needs help from the alliance to seal edo Madara.
 
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You are so being biased...

Using Hashirama's expression to say he was scared ? I guess you missed the part where he chuckled at the sight of PS Kurama

And I'm just going to say this, I see you talking about EMS Madara without PS is around Hashirama... Still not true.

As shown in your scan, EMS Madara + Kurama was getting wiped by Base Hashirama, Madara had to use PS to enhance Kurama, that's when Hashirama used SM.

Hashirama > EMS Madara.

Without Kurama, he would have badly lost against Buhdda God, his PS would have been shattered and every bone in his body broken.
 
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Stop polluting the forums with your bullshit.

EMS Madara without Perfect Sussano alive is around Base's Hashirama level, with PS he is > Base Hashirama.
Click to expand...
Mokujin is a base technique and it stalemated PS, so EMS Madara w/PS>=Base Hashirama. Base Hashirama would stomp Madara without PS.

Base Hashirama was almost all the time on defence against EMS Madara controlling Kyuubi, so EMS Madara with Kyuubi >> Base Hashirama
Click to expand...
Agreed.

Shin Suu Senjuu's thousand arms striking were just enough to remove Sussano's armor, nothing more. Kyuubi was unwounded with no damage shown.
Click to expand...
Irrelevant.

Edo Madara with PS >= SM Hashirama without Shin SuuSenjuu (Madara was stalemating with SM Hashirama using wood dragon)
Click to expand...
Agreed, but this is the same as EMS Madara w/PS>=Base Hashirama.


Perfect Sussano of Edo Madara is more powerfull then EMS Madara as alive, because it PS Edo Madara was able to keep going against SM Hashirama using Wood dragon and easily to add.
Click to expand...
Baseless assumption, Edo Madara's PS=EMS Madara's PS.

After all it looks like that: SM Hashirama using Buddha >=Edo Madara with PS>=SM Hashirama using Wood dragon=EMS Madara with Kyuubi> EMS Madara with PS> Base Hashirama=EMS Madara without PS(Final Sussano available.)
Any form of EMS Madara(except without PS) > Base Hashirama
Click to expand...
lmao, what the hell is this crap? Lol

SM Hashirama>>>Edo Madara with just PS since it was stalemating Mokujin.

SM Hashirama using Mokuryu isn't equal to EMS Madara w/Kurama? Did you not see 1 Bijuu Dama nuke Mokujin and Mokuryu? lmao...

EMS Madara>=Base Hashirama as Mokujin was stalemating PS, so that means he stomps EMS Madara w/o PS. (Not a stomp if you give him the giant Susanoo, but that still counts as PS)
 
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KidGamer65 said:
Stop polluting the forums with your bullshit.


Mokujin is a base technique and it stalemated PS, so EMS Madara w/PS>=Base Hashirama. Base Hashirama would stomp Madara without PS.


Agreed.



Irrelevant.


Agreed, but this is the same as EMS Madara w/PS>=Base Hashirama.




Baseless assumption, Edo Madara's PS=EMS Madara's PS.



lmao, what the hell is this crap? Lol

SM Hashirama>>>Edo Madara with just PS since it was stalemating Mokujin.

SM Hashirama using Mokuryu isn't equal to EMS Madara w/Kurama? Did you not see 1 Bijuu Dama nuke Mokujin and Mokuryu? lmao...

EMS Madara>=Base Hashirama as Mokujin was stalemating PS, so that means he stomps EMS Madara w/o PS. (Not a stomp if you give him the giant Susanoo, but that still counts as PS)
Click to expand...
Bolded part is wrong... as EMS Madara is just restricted from using PS, but he can still use Final Sussano v4 unstabilized form:
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^^ Imao I would like to see Base Hashirama stomping EMS Madara using Final Sussano v4 unstabilized form...

The manga clearly points that they are around equal.

Underlined part... was only to prove Kyuubi is threat to hashirama, at least base form of Hashirama.

Red Color used font, you have no proof as I don't have also. However considering that EMS Madara didn't have Senjuu DNA while Edo Madara has it... support more my point.

If you says EMS Madara after injecting Senju DNA PS=Edo Madara PS... then I agree as Rinnegan has no effect on it.
 
KCMNaruto

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Madara Rules said:
Just to not the fact that Shinsuusenju did not completely break PS defence.
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I know, that why I believe Shin SuuSenjuu has NOT DESTRUCTIVE POWER > PS of EMS madara + Full Kyuubi...

But Shin SuuSenjuu was still enough to win it, but only due to Madara runing out of gas while Kyuubi was not used then Hashirama forced kyuubi to sleep before it was full awoken and could mess him a bit.

PS defence was no completly broken but still everyone will say otherwise...

xcoyote said:
Hashirama would have stomped,Kishi didnt want him to.Budha smashes everything.
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Bullshit, bring manga scans or don't bother posting here.

Manga shows something completly different.

Size does not means power always... so until kishi states something like that this is pure speculation.

SM Hashirama won, but not easily.
 

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KCMNaruto said:
I know, that why I believe Shin SuuSenjuu has NOT DESTRUCTIVE POWER > PS of EMS madara + Full Kyuubi...

But Shin SuuSenjuu was still enough to win it, but only due to Madara runing out of gas while Kyuubi was not used then Hashirama forced kyuubi to sleep before it was full awoken and could mess him a bit.

PS defence was no completly broken but still everyone will say otherwise...
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Actually it wasn't just the work of Shinsuusenju. It was the statue and 12 TBB + PS blade explosion that broke half of PS:
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Whether Shinsuusenju breaks PS this time without the explosion of 12 TBB and PS blades is doubtful.
 
YellowFang

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I agree on the point that,
EMS Madara >= Base Hashirama(w/o any major Mokuton techs)

But when both go all-out, Hashi goes right ahead of Madara...
 
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Madara Rules said:
Actually it wasn't just the work of Shinsuusenju. It was the statue and 12 TBB + PS blade explosion that broke half of PS:
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Whether Shinsuusenju breaks PS this time without the explosion of 12 TBB and PS blades is doubtful.
Click to expand...
The max. power of SS was kept by that TBB+PS-blades barrage...
If you say that those projectiles were also the reason for PS's dismantling,
Then we don't know the results if SS had made it's max. impact on PS...

So, if Madara defends with TBB combo it his loss and if he doesn't, SS will smash it like a bug...
 
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