[Discussion] Akainu and Doflamingo Vs Aokiji and Marco

[-Akuma-]

Parasite is simply a overrated move until Oda will show the counter of it hopefully during this fight and Doffy wankers will shut the fuck up. Thinking it would work against Marco/Jozu and above when they are on-guard is ridiculous. Like i've already said, Jozu is likely the physical strongest(outside Garp), so if it really worked on him, it would work against anyone else

Thank you. Tired of these stupid arguments

Hmph I agree, if Parasite was so powerful, Mingo wouldn't of been so hesitant to fu*k with both Kuzan and Fuji.

 

[Punk Hazard]

What are u implying here? Did I said that Joker is fodder when compared to Marco? I admit that breaking out of Aokiji's ice is impressive but I don't think it would make him stronger than Jozu. Aokiji wasn't even trying against Joker.

My point is that tricks such as black knight aren't much of a help for Joker against someone of Marco's caliber.

aokiji was just standing around when he froze jozu.he wasn't serious,against jozu he was dead serious.and whats doffy gonna do to jozu.cut him.

Both of you are incorrect. Aokiji has never shown any visible signs of effort when using his powers, so his expression or stance is a horrible way of determining what amount of power he uses when creating ice. A better measure would be the amount of ice created, and Aokiji created a lot more ice when he froze Doflamingo than when he froze Jozu. There is absolutely nothing that indicates he used an equal force on both of them, or less force on Doflamingo, while the amount of ice created points to the latter. For now, Aokiji using more force on Doflamingo stands way more than him using more on Jozu.

Both men were aware of Aokiji's presence.
Both were aware that Aokiji was in an offensive position to them.
Jozu even turned around before and reacted to Aokiji freezing his arm, so if he had the powers to escape the ice, he could have. The fact that he didn't indicates he didn't have the strength too, while Doflamingo broke out of an ice encasement that had even more of a power output to it.

1. Kizaru is a troll
2. The WB pirates would have just countered it. Marco blocks Yasakani no Magatama. WB counters Dai Funka. Jozu counters Aokiji's attack.
5. The execution had a scheduled time.
6. Garp already went. Sengoku didn't expect Garp to get knocked off.
7. If he killed Kizaru then, after the war, a large Marine force would chase after him and the SHs for being involved in killing an admiral.
8. He was repaying Luffy by not killing him or his crew for saving Alabasta.

1. Kizaru's troll personality is a plot device. If Kizaru was as relentless as Akainu, it'd make no sense for him to not shoot Luffy in the head. His personality is for the convenience of the plot due to his haxxed abilities.

2. No they couldn't, not while underwater to an attack they couldn't see coming. I'm talking about those long seconds of bubbling, if the 3 Admirals had fired attacks then, the ship would have shot up straight into it.

5. I'm well aware there was a scheduled time. That was a plot device. Why did the Marines go with a scheduled time? What was stopping them from not having a scheduled time? Plot.

6. The question is why didn't Sengoku go before Garp did. Because if he did, he wouldn't have held back like Garp did. Garp going was for the sake of the plot.

7. LOL what? They were already AT WAR and being chased by the WG. None of the WB pirates had a problem with killing the Admiral, this answer doesn't even remotely make sense.

This Parastie thing is ridiculous, Jozu is most likely physically stronger than every Admiral. So by this logic Mingo beats everyone bar WB, Garp, and Shanks.

No it's not, you people just love being close-minded because thinking critically is just too hard. There are many people that are reasonably stronger than Jozu, there are many people that can reasonably avoid or escape Parasite.

All this "Jozu could have escaped" and "Doffy didn't really catch him" stuff is bullshit. If Jozu could have escaped, he would have. Time and time again I've already countered Bogard's baseless statements that
Jozu could have escaped and he's been unable to refute it, at this point saying it is a joke.

You guys are just unable to admit Doflamingo is stronger than you want to give him credit for so you call it "wanking", and it's just weak.

 

[Uzumaki Macho]

Both of you are incorrect. Aokiji has never shown any visible signs of effort when using his powers, so his expression or stance is a horrible way of determining what amount of power he uses when creating ice. A better measure would be the amount of ice created, and Aokiji created a lot more ice when he froze Doflamingo than when he froze Jozu. There is absolutely nothing that indicates he used an equal force on both of them, or less force on Doflamingo, while the amount of ice created points to the latter. For now, Aokiji using more force on Doflamingo stands way more than him using more on Jozu.

Both men were aware of Aokiji's presence.
Both were aware that Aokiji was in an offensive position to them.
Jozu even turned around before and reacted to Aokiji freezing his arm, so if he had the powers to escape the ice, he could have. The fact that he didn't indicates he didn't have the strength too, while Doflamingo broke out of an ice encasement that had even more of a power output to it.



1. Kizaru's troll personality is a plot device. If Kizaru was as relentless as Akainu, it'd make no sense for him to not shoot Luffy in the head. His personality is for the convenience of the plot due to his haxxed abilities.

2. No they couldn't, not while underwater to an attack they couldn't see coming. I'm talking about those long seconds of bubbling, if the 3 Admirals had fired attacks then, the ship would have shot up straight into it.

5. I'm well aware there was a scheduled time. That was a plot device. Why did the Marines go with a scheduled time? What was stopping them from not having a scheduled time? Plot.

6. The question is why didn't Sengoku go before Garp did. Because if he did, he wouldn't have held back like Garp did. Garp going was for the sake of the plot.

7. LOL what? They were already AT WAR and being chased by the WG. None of the WB pirates had a problem with killing the Admiral, this answer doesn't even remotely make sense.

No it's not, you people just love being close-minded because thinking critically is just too hard. There are many people that are reasonably stronger than Jozu, there are many people that can reasonably avoid or escape Parasite.

All this "Jozu could have escaped" and "Doffy didn't really catch him" stuff is bullshit. If Jozu could have escaped, he would have. Time and time again I've already countered Bogard's baseless statements that
Jozu could have escaped and he's been unable to refute it, at this point saying it is a joke.

You guys are just unable to admit Doflamingo is stronger than you want to give him credit for so you call it "wanking", and it's just weak.

I was talking about after the war ended.

 

[Punk Hazard]

I was talking about after the war ended.

I know, and it still doesn't make sense. The Government is just gonna say "Cool beans WB Pirates, we'll leave you alone completely now" once the war ended?

If the WB pirates were trying to avoid killing admirals, explain Marco and Vista slicing Sakazuki in the throat and WB stabbing Kuzan in the stomach, both with Haki infused.

The mere fact that WB intended to sink all of MF, which would bring even more trouble for his crew than killing one Admiral, shows how little sense that makes.

 

[-Akuma-]

Both of you are incorrect. Aokiji has never shown any visible signs of effort when using his powers, so his expression or stance is a horrible way of determining what amount of power he uses when creating ice. A better measure would be the amount of ice created, and Aokiji created a lot more ice when he froze Doflamingo than when he froze Jozu. There is absolutely nothing that indicates he used an equal force on both of them, or less force on Doflamingo, while the amount of ice created points to the latter. For now, Aokiji using more force on Doflamingo stands way more than him using more on Jozu.

Both men were aware of Aokiji's presence.
Both were aware that Aokiji was in an offensive position to them.
Jozu even turned around before and reacted to Aokiji freezing his arm, so if he had the powers to escape the ice, he could have. The fact that he didn't indicates he didn't have the strength too, while Doflamingo broke out of an ice encasement that had even more of a power output to it.



1. Kizaru's troll personality is a plot device. If Kizaru was as relentless as Akainu, it'd make no sense for him to not shoot Luffy in the head. His personality is for the convenience of the plot due to his haxxed abilities.

2. No they couldn't, not while underwater to an attack they couldn't see coming. I'm talking about those long seconds of bubbling, if the 3 Admirals had fired attacks then, the ship would have shot up straight into it.

5. I'm well aware there was a scheduled time. That was a plot device. Why did the Marines go with a scheduled time? What was stopping them from not having a scheduled time? Plot.

6. The question is why didn't Sengoku go before Garp did. Because if he did, he wouldn't have held back like Garp did. Garp going was for the sake of the plot.

7. LOL what? They were already AT WAR and being chased by the WG. None of the WB pirates had a problem with killing the Admiral, this answer doesn't even remotely make sense.


No it's not, you people just love being close-minded because thinking critically is just too hard. There are many people that are reasonably stronger than Jozu, there are many people that can reasonably avoid or escape Parasite.

All this "Jozu could have escaped" and "Doffy didn't really catch him" stuff is bullshit. If Jozu could have escaped, he would have. Time and time again I've already countered Bogard's baseless statements that
Jozu could have escaped and he's been unable to refute it, at this point saying it is a joke.

You guys are just unable to admit Doflamingo is stronger than you want to give him credit for so you call it "wanking", and it's just weak.

Yes it is, I'm not being close minded sure the are alot of people who beat Jozu but in raw physical Jozu ahs the best feat in the manga, and if he can't break parasite that means. Kuzan, Fujitora, Kizaru, Akainu etc would be caught by parasite. Once again some people may be able to avoid parasite but by the way you are talking nobody is escaping it. So please going by your standards how does one escape parasite, or at this point the likes of Kuzan is getting no diffed by Mingo's parasite.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Yes it is, I'm not being close minded sure the are alot of people who beat Jozu but in raw physical Jozu ahs the best feat in the manga, and if he can't break parasite that means. Kuzan, Fujitora, Kizaru, Akainu etc would be caught by parasite. Once again some people may be able to avoid parasite but by the way you are talking nobody is escaping it. So please going by your standards how does one escape parasite, or at this point the likes of Kuzan is getting no diffed by Mingo's parasite.

And who says physical strength is the requirement to escape or avoid Parasite? What's to say Haki, can't be used to repel it and Jozu's isn't that good?

Who's to say mental willpower isn't the requirement?

Who's to say Logias can't just disperse past the strings, or a strong enough DF like Whitebeard's cant push the strings away, or Aokiji's can't freeze them and make them shatter?

The point is, nothing sets Marco apart from Jozu that would allow you to reason that he can escape or avoid Parasite.

How about you explain how Marco resists, escapes or avoids Parasite?

 

[sravan]

aokiji and marco for sure.marco can heal himself and if he defeats doffy then they can go on 2vs 1.Akainu can't handle both of them so he will be defeated.

 

[shri3kbat]

Akainu and Doflamingo wins imo

 

[Apêx1]

There seems to be some kind of no limits fallacy that since Jozu couldn't escape parasite; the likelihood of someone else doing so is close to 0. We barely know the way in which it works to start boasting that the only way to escape is strength, otherwise there are only about 10 people who can truly combat parasite. Marco is portrayed to be above Jozu, so in my opinion, he should be given the benefit of the doubt of having some form of counter to parasite. That's just me though, and inb4 no feats of "benefit of the doubt." Well what feats or implications does anyone have of being able to break out? By feats Whitebeard shouldn't break out because parasite has no limit at this point. Soon enough this will become the most revered no limits fallacy of OP. "amagawd if Doflamingo was around in the Pirate kings era, he would've been restrained sooo neg diff."

 

[Punk Hazard]

There seems to be some kind of no limits fallacy that since Jozu couldn't escape parasite; the likelihood of someone else doing so is close to 0. We barely know the way in which it works to start boasting that the only way to escape is strength, otherwise there are only about 10 people who can truly combat parasite. Marco is portrayed to be above Jozu, so in my opinion, he should be given the benefit of the doubt of having some form of counter to parasite. That's just me though, and inb4 no feats of "benefit of the doubt." Well what feats or implications does anyone have of being able to break out? By feats Whitebeard shouldn't break out because parasite has no limit at this point. Soon enough this will become the most revered no limits fallacy of OP. "amagawd if Doflamingo was around in the Pirate kings era, he would've been restrained sooo neg diff."

No he isn't. Marco failed to injure a single Admiral when he struck them, while Jozu managed to at least Aokiji bleed.

 

[Apêx1]

No he isn't. Marco failed to injure a single Admiral when he struck them, while Jozu managed to at least Aokiji bleed.

Marco is WB's right-hand man and was the most notable of the whole WB crew, bar WB himself. Gorosei singled him out and claimed he had the potential to stop Blackbeard, while Shanks singled him out and asked him to join his crew. Jozu was never, and I repeat, never singled out by a higher up in order to hype him. By portrayal and hype, Marco is in fact above Jozu.

 

[Aømine]

No he isn't. Marco failed to injure a single Admiral when he struck them, while Jozu managed to at least Aokiji bleed.

Because Marco was in a way different situation as Jozu, that is the reason.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Marco is WB's right-hand man and was the most notable of the whole WB crew, bar WB himself. Gorosei singled him out and claimed he had the potential to stop Blackbeard, while Shanks singled him out and asked him to join his crew. Jozu was never, and I repeat, never singled out by a higher up in order to hype him. By portrayal and hype, Marco is in fact above Jozu.

Because Marco was in a way different situation as Jozu, that is the reason.

Jozu slammed into Aokiji from the side, Aokiji bled.

Marco kicked Aokiji from the side, no visible damage to Aokiji.

Shanks didn't single out Marco, Marco yelled at Shanks and then Shanks noticed him and jokingly asked him to join because Marco called out to him first. If Jozu had yelled at Shanks, the same thing would have happened.

The Gorosei singled out Marco because he was WB's right-hand, yes, but your right-hand man isn't always the second strongest, simply one you're closest too or trust the most or who has the leadership skills required.

The fact that Marco failed to injure Aokiji in the same fashion Jozu was able to speaks for itself. If you disagree, take it up with Oda.

 

[Apêx1]

Jozu slammed into Aokiji from the side, Aokiji bled.

Marco kicked Aokiji from the side, no visible damage to Aokiji.

Shanks didn't single out Marco, Marco yelled at Shanks and then Shanks noticed him and jokingly asked him to join because Marco called out to him first. If Jozu had yelled at Shanks, the same thing would have happened.

The Gorosei singled out Marco because he was WB's right-hand, yes, but your right-hand man isn't always the second strongest, simply one you're closest too or trust the most or who has the leadership skills required.

The fact that Marco failed to injure Aokiji in the same fashion Jozu was able to speaks for itself. If you disagree, take it up with Oda.

I never disputed Jozu's superiority power wise. I am simply saying that Marco is superior to Jozu all-round. More so, Shanks having strength to rival Jozu is highly improbable as well, he most likely has his own aspects of superiority. Either way, the interpretation of hype and portrayal is subjective, so I'll just agree to disagree.

 

[Punk Hazard]

I never disputed Jozu's superiority power wise. I am simply saying that Marco is superior to Jozu all-round. More so, Shanks having strength to rival Jozu is highly improbable as well, he most likely has his own aspects of superiority. Either way, the interpretation of hype and portrayal is subjective, so I'll just agree to disagree.

Nothing indicates Marco would defeat Jozu in a fight and only their blows to Aokiji hint vice versa. We don't have enough to say which would win, so the most reasonable approach is they're about even.

 

[A v i]

Both of you are incorrect. Aokiji has never shown any visible signs of effort when using his powers, so his expression or stance is a horrible way of determining what amount of power he uses when creating ice. A better measure would be the amount of ice created, and Aokiji created a lot more ice when he froze Doflamingo than when he froze Jozu. There is absolutely nothing that indicates he used an equal force on both of them, or less force on Doflamingo, while the amount of ice created points to the latter. For now, Aokiji using more force on Doflamingo stands way more than him using more on Jozu.

If Aokiji wasn't even trying against Jozu and Jozu is really that weak against Aokiji then there is no need for Aokiji to attack Jozu when he was distrated. Unlike Joker, Jozu was fighting Aokiji face to face and yet Aokiji failed to put a dent on him until Jozu was distracted which clearly puts Jozu above Joker concerning Aokiji's part. Yes,Aokiji created more Ice against Joker but that doesn't meat that total potential of attack was used on Joker and remember that Joker wasn't moving when he was attacked by Aokiji hence he has enough time to break free from the attack using Haki but Jozu hit the ground immediately which lead him to loose his hand.

Nothing from what we have seen from Joker VS Aokiji can put joker above or on par with Jozu.

Both men were aware of Aokiji's presence.
Both were aware that Aokiji was in an offensive position to them.
Jozu even turned around before and reacted to Aokiji freezing his arm, so if he had the powers to escape the ice, he could have. The fact that he didn't indicates he didn't have the strength too, while Doflamingo broke out of an ice encasement that had even more of a power output to it.

Don't post arguments for the sake of arguing bro, their conditions are totally different. Jozu was concerned more about WB condition. He was in no condition to think of counters for Aokiji. If Jozu wasn't good enough to hold Aokiji then why didn't Aokiji managed to wound him before he was distracted?

 

[Punk Hazard]

If Aokiji wasn't even trying against Jozu and Jozu is really that weak against Aokiji then there is no need for Aokiji to attack Jozu when he was distrated. Unlike Joker, Jozu was fighting Aokiji face to face and yet Aokiji failed to put a dent on him until Jozu was distracted which clearly puts Jozu above Joker concerning Aokiji's part. Yes,Aokiji created more Ice against Joker but that doesn't meat that total potential of attack was used on Joker and remember that Joker wasn't moving when he was attacked by Aokiji hence he has enough time to break free from the attack using Haki but Jozu hit the ground immediately which lead him to loose his hand.

Nothing from what we have seen from Joker VS Aokiji can put joker above or on par with Jozu.



Don't post arguments for the sake of arguing bro, their conditions are totally different. Jozu was concerned more about WB condition. He was in no condition to think of counters for Aokiji. If Jozu wasn't good enough to hold Aokiji then why didn't Aokiji managed to wound him before he was distracted?

Okay first off, what is with you people? What's with this "Ugh stop arguing, agree to disagree" crap going around? Don't post arguments to argue? This is a debate thread, why are you even posting in here if you don't want to debate?

Jozu actually turned around and noticed Aokiji freezing him before the ice got past his shoulder. While he may have been distracted when the freezing began, he was aware it was happen before it was completed, so it's not like he was completely unaware that he was frozen. The fact that Doffy broke out before he could fall over and crack like Jozu is just more testament to Doffy>Jozu.

If he used more ice on Doffy, then he released more power. That's just that. This is evident by the fact that the most amount of ice Aokiji ever created was in his hardest battle against Sakazuki.

 

[Vandenre1ch]

Aokiji and Marco wins. Whether its Aokji vs Akainu/Doffy vs. Marco or Aokiji vs. Doffy/Marco vs. Akainu, Aokiji and Marco team wins.

It will always come down to Aokiji and Marco vs. Akainu. Marco has the strength to hold off Akainu while Doflamingo is someone who struggles against fighters who can't even fight Admirals. Doflamingo will always be the first one to go down.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Aokiji and Marco wins. Whether its Aokji vs Akainu/Doffy vs. Marco or Aokiji vs. Doffy/Marco vs. Akainu, Aokiji and Marco team wins.

It will always come down to Aokiji and Marco vs. Akainu. Marco has the strength to hold off Akainu while Doflamingo is someone who struggles against fighters who can't even fight Admirals. Doflamingo will always be the first one to go down.

Who has Doflamingo struggled against?

 

[Luther]

Akainu and donflamingo. Mid diffculty, marco would just be a bother.