100% proof(manga pages) edo hashirama was complete and perfect

[~Sovereign~]

i agree but i disagree too

part 1 naruto is COMPLETELY different power levels lol

back in part 1 the biggest damage (mostly) was from a summoning

NOW, everyone has jutsus that can destroy mountains

it's hard to compared part 1 fighting to shippuden levels

i think hiruzen is top 20 or top 15

 

[Unbiased]

Humour me here. What if he doesnt see the flowers cos Hashirama used B.O.D first?

He would have to exert chakra to disrupt of the flow of chakra inside his body like jiraya taught naruto. This genjutsu isn't on the level of itachi's mind you.

 

[phantomlord22]

shodai hokage tonaro moktuno senju hashirama solos all xd

 

[Summer]

Well your argument falls short on the fact that just because A>B and B>C doesn't mean A>C. (A=hiruzen, B=hashirama, and C=Madara). It only means hiruzen has a chance it doesn't guarantee victory. Gai beat kisame when Bee lost to a 30% clone does that mean gai is stronger then bee? Not at all.

I'm not arguing at all I'm saying kishi's piss poor writing skills contradict his story to unmeasurable levels. It's more annoying than anything when a writer contradicts his own info that he has written.

 

[Unbiased]

Humour me here. What if he doesnt see the flowers cos Hashirama used B.O.D first?

I'm not arguing at all I'm saying kishi's piss poor writing skills contradict his story to unmeasurable levels. It's more annoying than anything when a writer contradicts his own info that he has written.

I agree 100% i've actually made threads about it. It is getting out of hand nowadays.

 

[GenKiDama]

Kishi didnt decide on his importance until later, and than gave decided he needed to be stronger for the plot to make sense, u could say hiruzen won by plot jusu

 

[Unbiased]

Kishi didnt decide on his importance until later, and than gave decided he needed to be stronger for the plot to make sense, u could say hiruzen won by plot jusu

I guess that's kinda true. The plot would of ended if konoha was destroyed and the hokages went on a rampage with orochimaru.

One thing to note is that kishi made sure hiruzen countered all his techniques so you could so plot no jutsu along with battle intelligence.

 

[Nagatoballer]

100% proof that oro did not have edo perfected if u say that they first and second were at full strength had unlimited stamina and chakra plus can't die and they got owned U R STUPID I will make a list

1.2 hokages that are edo vs 1 hokage that is retired that just sounds dumb no matter who it is
2. Hiruzan is NOT STONGER THEN MADARA OR THE FIRST even if they where a live and not edo and it is soooooo clear because they can easily control tailed beasts hiruzan can not
3. the way hiruzan won was with a suicide atk it killed him to win so that is not stronger
4. The biggest point is why no giant wood dragon from the first or space time from the second they did not use all there power
5. Its simple it has been what 2-5 years since oro used edo amd kabuto
Has been working on it since then so it is better now.
6. Your title should say "my stupid opinion that I did not think through" thereis no proof too what u say thereisno proof against it so really stop being so dumb haha saying the third is> then madara and the first soooo dumb

 

[Nagatoballer]

And u mean kabuto was praising his master by saying oro perfected it that is not proof u moron

 

[Carlhens]

Kishi did not want the third to die by the first nor second hokage thats the reason i did not make them used their full power

 

[Disturbedhalo117]

every one knows this why is it even debated, the reason people try and falsify the manga is because they cant accept 3rd hokage > 1st/2ed hokage that are endo. because then he is on endo madara level and people refuse to believe that.

This guy gets it.

 

[Nagatoballer]

This guy gets it.

Even though he was proven wrong hiruzan > 1 st And 2 nd edo ha ha ha ha ha stupid

 

[Nagatoballer]

Kishi did not want the third to die by the first nor second hokage thats the reason i did not make them used their full power

So u agree that hiruzan is way below the first and madara

 

[Nagatoballer]

I bet the guy who made this thread would say sage mode NARUTO > pain hahahahaha

 

[LegendaryAce]

Nope manga shows hiruzen owning hashirama and they even apologized to hiruzen. (apologizing is a form of submission and admittance of screwing up)




1: This shows him seeking out hashirama and tobirama using his sense of smell. He wasn't just blocking he was on the offensive.

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2: Your second statement only proves my point as to they were only toying with him in the BoD

3: Your last statement only shoots you in the foot as the user perfected edo tensei.

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They were next to him why can't you understand that any retard could have just grabbed them seriously for crying out loud ... If they had been further from him they would have killed him before he touched them...if you can't understand that I feel bad for u cuz I give up

Also how does it shoot me in the foot ... Where the hell did I say it was imperfect .. I said a weapon is as good as its user I thought you would understand that Orochimaru wasn't really good at controlling hashirama and Tobirama he was too busy chilling and talking and laughing and changing into a girl or whatever that was ... Do you know what makes kabutos Edos better not counting madara.. They torture their old teammates ect emotionally making them weak and hesitant like for example choji didn't want to hurt asuma blahblahblah and then the downfall is they can get talk no jutsud ending up standing there waiting to be sealed or something ... That's the reason why Orochimaru took away all emotions and controll he wanted his Edos to be killing machines but you can use something you know nothing or little about... It's like going in a plane and you suddenly fly a plane with no experience whatsoever that's absurd ...


Thus I say a weapon is as good as its user /master/wielder because its all on how much you know about the Edo you are controlling and as we so from oro he didn't seem to know much .. He probably only knew what was written about them and not all their arsenal and he lost that fight and embarrassed the hokages because it was his teacher he wanted to torment him and mess him up And make him lose hope and make him feel guilty about why he didn't kill him before he became what he was ... It was working he gave up if you read the manga and then he snapped out of it and ended up killing him self

Don't get me wrong i don't hate him .. Hell he did good for an old geezer .. But without drs he was going to die alone and if Orochimaru was serious from the start he would have killed him so fast he wouldn't know what hit him.. For instance people say hashirama only best madara because he is best suited to fight him .. This also applies to hiruzen he and minato would have been the best choices for that fight hell I bet my 2 cent that minato would have taken Orochimaru aswell or came up with a better plan .. Drs was the only choice hiruzen had .. If you think otherwise you just ignorant I am afraid

The person who said hiruzen = Edo madara because of that fight ... What kind of drugs are you on? Just for the fun of it what makes hiruzen = madara ?

 

[Unbiased]

They were next to him why can't you understand that any retard could have just grabbed them seriously for crying out loud ... If they had been further from him they would have killed him before he touched them...if you can't understand that I feel bad for u cuz I give up

Also how does it shoot me in the foot ... Where the hell did I say it was imperfect .. I said a weapon is as good as its user I thought you would understand that Orochimaru wasn't really good at controlling hashirama and Tobirama he was too busy chilling and talking and laughing and changing into a girl or whatever that was ... Do you know what makes kabutos Edos better not counting madara.. They torture their old teammates ect emotionally making them weak and hesitant like for example choji didn't want to hurt asuma blahblahblah and then the downfall is they can get talk no jutsud ending up standing there waiting to be sealed or something ... That's the reason why Orochimaru took away all emotions and controll he wanted his Edos to be killing machines but you can use something you know nothing or little about... It's like going in a plane and you suddenly fly a plane with no experience whatsoever that's absurd ...


Thus I say a weapon is as good as its user /master/wielder because its all on how much you know about the Edo you are controlling and as we so from oro he didn't seem to know much .. He probably only knew what was written about them and not all their arsenal and he lost that fight and embarrassed the hokages because it was his teacher he wanted to torment him and mess him up And make him lose hope and make him feel guilty about why he didn't kill him before he became what he was ... It was working he gave up if you read the manga and then he snapped out of it and ended up killing him self

Don't get me wrong i don't hate him .. Hell he did good for an old geezer .. But without drs he was going to die alone and if Orochimaru was serious from the start he would have killed him so fast he wouldn't know what hit him.. For instance people say hashirama only best madara because he is best suited to fight him .. This also applies to hiruzen he and minato would have been the best choices for that fight hell I bet my 2 cent that minato would have taken Orochimaru aswell or came up with a better plan .. Drs was the only choice hiruzen had .. If you think otherwise you just ignorant I am afraid

The person who said hiruzen = Edo madara because of that fight ... What kind of drugs are you on? Just for the fun of it what makes hiruzen = madara ?

1: So it shows hiruzen running and you interpret the hokages as "right next to him". Yeah...
2:The revived can use all their original jutsus. Chapter 520 page 13 ORochimaru doesn't need to know their techniques, he gives the order to kill and they do their best at it. Just like nagato's emotions were taken away along with the third raikage yet they were mindless killing machines and a force to be reckoned with
3: Don't respond to trolls that say hiruzen = madara it only feeds them. That statement can never be verified and is just a hypothetical situation.
4: Hiruzen used DRS not because it was his only sealing jutsu but it removed any possibility of the hokages ever attacking konoha again and delayed konohas destruction. There's more of a tactical reason instead of just saying its his only seal. It can be used for a variety of reasons.

 

[The Necromancer]

1: So it shows hiruzen running and you interpret the hokages as "right next to him". Yeah...
2:The revived can use all their original jutsus. Chapter 520 page 13 ORochimaru doesn't need to know their techniques, he gives the order to kill and they do their best at it. Just like nagato's emotions were taken away along with the third raikage yet they were mindless killing machines and a force to be reckoned with
3: Don't respond to trolls that say hiruzen = madara it only feeds them. That statement can never be verified and is just a hypothetical situation.
4: Hiruzen used DRS not because it was his only sealing jutsu but it removed any possibility of the hokages ever attacking konoha again and delayed konohas destruction. There's more of a tactical reason instead of just saying its his only seal. It can be used for a variety of reasons.

Spoiler

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This is the only page needed. Kabuto clearly states that HE will use the techniques of Nagato to kill naruto and bring him back. That means he is giving the orders which means he has to KNOW the powers in order to use them. The debate is over.

 

[Nagatoballer]

100% proof that oro did not have edo perfected if u say that they first and second were at full strength had unlimited stamina and chakra plus can't die and they got owned U R STUPID I will make a list

1.2 hokages that are edo vs 1 hokage that is retired that just sounds dumb no matter who it is
2. Hiruzan is NOT STONGER THEN MADARA OR THE FIRST even if they where a live and not edo and it is soooooo clear because they can easily control tailed beasts hiruzan can not
2.1 prefect susanoo would rape hiruzan
3. the way hiruzan won was with a suicide atk it killed him to win so that is not stronger
4. The biggest point is why no giant wood dragon from the first or space time from the second they did not use all there power
5. Its simple it has been what 2-5 years since oro used edo amd kabuto
Has been working on it since then so it is better now.
6. Your title should say "my stupid opinion that I did not think through" thereis no proof too what u say thereisno proof against it so really stop being so dumb haha saying the third is> then madara and the first soooo dumb
7. Can hiruzan block TBB like the first NO NO NO NO (QUOTE)

Prove any of this wrong

 

[LegendaryAce]

1: So it shows hiruzen running and you interpret the hokages as "right next to him". Yeah...
2:The revived can use all their original jutsus. Chapter 520 page 13 ORochimaru doesn't need to know their techniques, he gives the order to kill and they do their best at it. Just like nagato's emotions were taken away along with the third raikage yet they were mindless killing machines and a force to be reckoned with
3: Don't respond to trolls that say hiruzen = madara it only feeds them. That statement can never be verified and is just a hypothetical situation.
4: Hiruzen used DRS not because it was his only sealing jutsu but it removed any possibility of the hokages ever attacking konoha again and delayed konohas destruction. There's more of a tactical reason instead of just saying its his only seal. It can be used for a variety of reasons.

Yes but they had no intention of killing him that's the only thing I am trying to make you understand it would also explain the lack of full force attack and their biggest move .. I mean they had so many opportunities to do it but 90 % of the time Orochimaru stood there doing nothing but attacking hiruzen emotionally ... And hashirama and Tobirama relied on a couple of flashy moves then stood around every now and then they hit with taijitsu and hiruzen was done for he knew it .. Hence the reason he said he had no other choice but to use drs .. You might not agree but look at it from that point of view ..( ofcourse I know they can use all their techs and whatnot - don't you think if Orochimaru had wanted to kill hiruzen he would have attacked with everything he had even summoning manda and shit or just got Tobirama to st to hiruzen and kill him or overwhelm hiruzen with numbers with no space to breathe he wouldn't have been able to handle that at all)

 

[soulreaper11]

hiruzen #1 people just needs to come to term with it. You cant erase what kishi did that would mean that the manga it self is not accurate.