Who was the best water release (suiton) user?

[regii sanguinis]

Him using the molecules in the air gets the same job done as creating to from the mouth. Kisame, Mei, Kakashi, and Tobirama have all used suiton jutsus without water. This is not a valid reason why Tobieama is better suiton user. Kisame created a jutsu that absorbs chakra.
Can Tobirama do that?
Nope.
creating to from water molecules or from chakra inside the body gets the job fone either way. Tobirama has not been said to have created different suiton jutsus, whereas Kisame has created 1000 hungry sharks, Great Shark Missile, Water Dome, Ect.

For someone to become a great suiton user not only do they have to show stong suiton feats, they also have to show enough skill and mastery of suiton to create original jutsus
Kisame show all of these characteristics

well as they said, does the end, justify the means.. getting the work done is irrelevant in discussing one level of skill.. as you said, most suiton users expel water from their mouths (Tobirama, Kisame, Mei, Darui, etc.) so deffinitely, that means is the routinary way of using water based jutsus.. with that, Tobirama is clearly the most skilled in water based jutsus as he is the only one shown of utilizing suiton techniques in such means.. in response to your query, what is the reason why Kisame is better than Tobirama, when it is clear that Kisame can't perform jutsus done by Tobirama..

Kisame may have displayed that wider array of suiton techniques, but does not necessarily makes him the best.. Tobirama's feats are limited as we all know, yet on that very limited showings, he has shown mastery of water techniques better than anyone in the series..

as you have said, for someone to become a great suiton user not only do they have to show strong suiton feats, they also have to show enough skill and mastery of suiton to create original jutsus.. Tobirama has exactly showed that by creating water justus in a manner that none since him has displayed.. Kisame has given the chance to show many of his jutsus while Tobirama has not.. judging from what they have shown perform in their most basic, i cannot see how can a more advanced water user be considered weaker.. and as you have said, its not all about power, its about skill and mastery of the art..

 

[Zlad]

Readed all the comments and now I am pretty unsure. What I know is that Kisame would have won if they fought in the water, but we have to see more from Tobirama before judge

 

[NarutoKage2]

This is quite a hard one. By hype and character statements(like the anbu) etc it seems that Tobirama was the best suiton user. But then again looking purely at feats Kisame was a beast making that giant lake against Bee and when he first fought Guy. I go by feats as opposed to hype so id say Kisame .

 

[James Harrsion]

Why is this even a debate, Tobirama was stated to create water out of thin air that > any other water users.

 

[Owarij]

^ Never happened in manga, that was a anime filler feat

 

[badoera]

Tobirame takes this easily .. Performing high level suiton jutsu without handseals or water nearby .. nobody can match that.


second place ain't even Kisame in my books .. It would most likely be second mizukage cuz he's being called the ''battle tyrant'' / killed Muu (who possessed a kekai Touta) and he's from the Hoozuki clan (like suigetsu) so he has all those abilities .. he's second

3th place = Kisame.

 

[Retsu]

Tobirama could use that water dragon move with a single hand sign, and normaly it requires like 44, He is without a doubt the best water user. Manga stated it, he just has no screen time.

 

[Q of the Sharingan]

Kisame by feats.

Tobirama by hype



Did you forget when kisame flooded a desert against Gai and his team?

Kisame had to summon the water (from his mouth). He didn't make the water appear out of nowhere. There is a difference.

 

[regii sanguinis]

Tobirama could use that water dragon move with a single hand sign, and normaly it requires like 44, He is without a doubt the best water user. Manga stated it, he just has no screen time.

true enough.. but to be fair, Mei also created one with just one hand sign.. though i can't remember Kisame doing the same.. correct me if i'm wrong though..

 

[Retsu]

true enough.. but to be fair, Mei also created one with just one hand sign.. though i can't remember Kisame doing the same.. correct me if i'm wrong though..

tbh we don't really know how many signs she used, but the water dragon jutsu is the jutsu that requires the most hand signs, which is like 44, and tobirama lowered this down to one. Kisame doesn't have good water mastery, he just has a lot of chakra to dump behind his attacks. Mei is more known for her KG. Tobirama was said to be the best water user in the world. It doesn't get any clearer than that.

 

[regii sanguinis]

tbh we don't really know how many signs she used, but the water dragon jutsu is the jutsu that requires the most hand signs, which is like 44, and tobirama lowered this down to one. Kisame doesn't have good water mastery, he just has a lot of chakra to dump behind his attacks. Mei is more known for her KG. Tobirama was said to be the best water user in the world. It doesn't get any clearer than that.

couldn't agree more.. i think Tobirama is best overall.. Kisame might be the most powerful in terms of strength of attacks but i think Mei has more refined skill in the mastery compared to him..

 

[Retsu]

I would agree with Mei being better at water than kisame

 

[SSW Imp]

tbh we don't really know how many signs she used, but the water dragon jutsu is the jutsu that requires the most hand signs, which is like 44, and tobirama lowered this down to one. Kisame doesn't have good water mastery, he just has a lot of chakra to dump behind his attacks. Mei is more known for her KG. Tobirama was said to be the best water user in the world. It doesn't get any clearer than that.

What do you mean Kisane doesn't have mastery in suiton. he created 6-7 original jutsu while Tobirama has made 1 to none. Sure h can creatr water from air but what else can he do. all hype

 

[Retsu]

What do you mean Kisane doesn't have mastery in suiton. he created 6-7 original jutsu while Tobirama has made 1 to none. Sure h can creatr water from air but what else can he do. all hype

Kisame isn't even really that good with water, he's more dangerous from absorbing an opponents chakra, tobirama can't be compared to any users, because he's had very little screen time, but kisame has nothing on tobirama when it comes to water, never have I seen anyone say anything about his water release, the only thing that makes him a threat is the fact that he can suck chakra, and his high reserves, other than that though he's nothing special. Even tobirama's part 1 anime fight had more impressive water release moves than kisame, all he does is over power ppl with his absurd chakra levels and leaching there chakra to heal.

if kisame couldn't absorb chakra his water release moves wouldn't really be deadly, while tobirama was said to be the best at it in the world, without cheap gimmicks such as chakra absorbing. ppl said hashirama was all hype last year and now look how powerful he is, and tobirama is his brother, who was said to be almost as strong. if that's the case, then tobirama would make kisame look like a novice in water release, and the only thing that could keep him alive is his chakra absorbtion.

 

[Shadow Abyss]

Not this again. People, please, for the last time.
Tobirama didn't create water out of thin air during his fight with Hiruzen. That was only in the anime.
Here are the sequence of techniques he used and you can clearly see the water coming out of his mouth just like Kisame does. Just open the spoiler tag.

Spoiler

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See, the water is coming from his mouth, he is not pulling it out of air moisture or whatever you are saying. He is, indeed, making his own water, but from his mouth just like Kisame does.
By the way, there are many people that are expecting too much from Tobirama just because he happens to be Hashirama's brother. Having a familiar bond with a legendary character doesn't automaticaly Tobirama legendary as well. Familiar sucess doesn't equals strength.
We know too little from Tobirama's skills to say he is the strongest. So far Kisame outclasses him easily regarding water techniques, even if it is due to a lack of info on him and that may or may not change in the future, but until then he is nowhere near Kisame's level. And it is not his brother's strength that is going to make him a strong character, that must come from his own character.

 

[regii sanguinis]

What do you mean Kisane doesn't have mastery in suiton. he created 6-7 original jutsu while Tobirama has made 1 to none. Sure h can creatr water from air but what else can he do. all hype

its because based on their most basic, Tobirama is already leagues beyond Kisame is water mastery.. Kisame's use of water jutsu isn't all unique, they are indeed far more powerful, but does not differ much from others.. this is mainly because of his raw chakra reserves.. but not because of his mastery.. being able to survive against the Gold and Silver Brothers (take note, they are Kumo Ninjas meaning, most possible raiton user with Kyubi chakra) and only being killed by the Kinkaku Force which is made up of 20 highly skilled ninjas (possible Kakashi level ninjas, or safe to say, Darui lvl ones) says a lot of his power, while what has already shown proves his mastery..

 

[Retsu]

Not this again. People, please, for the last time.
Tobirama didn't create water out of thin air during his fight with Hiruzen. That was only in the anime.
Here are the sequence of techniques he used and you can clearly see the water coming out of his mouth just like Kisame does. Just open the spoiler tag.

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

See, the water is coming from his mouth, he is not pulling it out of air moisture or whatever you are saying. He is, indeed, making his own water, but from his mouth just like Kisame does.
By the way, there are many people that are expecting too much from Tobirama just because he happens to be Hashirama's brother. Having a familiar bond with a legendary character doesn't automaticaly Tobirama legendary as well. Familiar sucess doesn't equals strength.

the thread is about who's the better water user, manga stated tobirama was able to create water from thin air, and said he was the worlds best at water release, evidently the fights were not as flashy in part 1, limiting how powerful tobirama actually appeared, but it's obvious tobirama is the best water user.

 

[TouchMyMangos]

the thread is about who's the better water user, manga stated tobirama was able to create water from thin air, and said he was the worlds best at water release, evidently the fights were not as flashy in part 1, limiting how powerful tobirama actually appeared, but it's obvious tobirama is the best water user.

where it say this?

 

[Shadow Abyss]

the thread is about who's the better water user, manga stated tobirama was able to create water from thin air, and said he was the worlds best at water release, evidently the fights were not as flashy in part 1, limiting how powerful tobirama actually appeared, but it's obvious tobirama is the best water user.

The manga didn't say anything. A random ANBU fodder said and I doubt any of them ever saw Kisame fighting. An info coming from a character is not the same thing than an info coming from Kishimoto himself, Kisame wasn't even introduced in the manga when that fight happened
Remember these are the guys that get impressed by anything, you are taking them way too seriously. Tobirama was a great water user in the past and maybe this statement was true during his time, but I believe he got surpassed.

 

[Retsu]

where it say this?

Can't be bothered with trawling through part 1 manga pages for one little phrase, but it should be on narutopedia