Minato isn't stronger than EMS Madara

[Draegod]

Agreed, Minato is not as strong as Madara due to the fact that he entrusted Naruto to beat him. But I disagree with the fact that you said there other kages that are ahead of him, the only one that I could see ahead of him is hashirama.

and sarutobi, muu, 3rd raikage, 2nd mizukage those are the others taht i put above him

 

[Kisaragi]

hmm

 

[TheGr8Uchiha]

and sarutobi, muu, 3rd raikage, 2nd mizukage those are the others taht i put above him

Uhhh maybe the 3rd raikage, horrible match up for Minato dont think the others could compete.

 

[DigitalMonster]

I also think Sasori is one of Minato's worst match-up since he can manipulate kunai position with Iron Sand,and can switch to other body if tagged.

 

[TheGr8Uchiha]

I also think Sasori is one of Minato's worst match-up since he can manipulate kunai position with Iron Sand,and can switch to other body if tagged.

Yup! You have to take account of match ups also sarutobi would get killed by Minato, well according to what we have seen so far.

 

[DigitalMonster]

You're talking about old Hiruzen,right?

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

and sarutobi, muu, 3rd raikage, 2nd mizukage those are the others taht i put above him

That is because you are irrational and a fanboy. You hate every strong character so you do your best to belittle them for some reason.

Naruto beat the third raikage so if you think that Minato couldn't then you are just crazy.

Dust technique wouldn't work because Minato could use ST to just send it right back at Muu. And Minato is also a sensor ninja, and is way faster.

Hiruzen has literally nothing to beat Minato with and so I don't even know why you put him here. That is fanboyism and hype to the max.

The reason why Minato is so strong is because he can teleport and is the best at sealing jutsu and is incredibly smart. One of the smartest in the manga. He figured out Madara's plan instantly and still broke his plan up after Madara ambushed him during his child's birth.

Don't bother responding though as you will likely just flame me because you hate strong characters and you and I have never agreed about anything.

 

[eyesofthekyuubi44]

First of all if you are a Minato tard half the library get out.

[ALT + F4 at the same time]

Plot induced-stupidity

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People forget about Madara catching Minato's wrist really easily and almost-warping him, but conveniently deciding to warp him slower than he was capable of despite knowing of and already witnessing Hiraishin.

A division of his power

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The entire time that he was fighting Minato, he was also controlling the Nine Tails, you know, that animal that was fighting the village, that Minato had to give his life to seal, and that his badass wife had to chain up for him.

Madara was hurried

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Controlling the Nine Tails isn't easy. Minato himself was clear that Tobi needs to kill Minato fast, and it's that hastiness that allows Minato to defeat Tobi, as well as a hell of a lot of plot protection.

Sharingan Genjutsu

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Minato, like Konan, was staring at the Sharingan, but Tobi seems to actively choose not to use Sharingan genjutsu until the endgame, like Sasuke. That's pretty much plot-induced stupidity as well.

Complete Izanagi

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Madara made one Sharingan last five minutes. That's ten minutes of Danzō-style of invincibility and teleportation. Which can be used
intermittently with intangibility, rendering Madara invincible.

Kunai Placement

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Tobi's ability conveniently played to Minato's strength as well. Could you find a better position for a Hiraishin tag other than the back of somebody's head? It's too bad Tobi didn't use that feint that he used on Torune...

Minato's Strongest

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Tobi tanked and regenerated from Minato's strongest attack in a way that Orochimaru would. So he can be intangible for five minutes, use Izanagi, buy seconds with genjutsu, teleport seal-lessly, and tank

Madara didn't have prep

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This claim annoys me. Madara strolled in, murdered all of Minato's bodyguards and nurses with Minato in the same room, marched to Konohagakure, slaughtering many shinobi, and obliterated Minato's family. Akatsuki and him could have come back the next day and taken the Fox back if not for the plot.

Minato beats Madara.

You know why? Intelligence. It was Madara's fault that he didn't warp Minato into a space-time dimension. Madara, likely knowing the speed of Hiraishin, should have known to do that. Yet he was stupid, and wanted to have a funny line instead of win the battle. This shows lack of dedication for the cause of his fight. It was inferior to Minato, whose desire to protect the village gave him more determination to beat Madara.

Also, Madara had already witnessed Minato teleporting to a kunai, yet he was still stupid enough to let one of his Hiraishin-tagged kunai slip through him, KNOWING what it does.

Again, stupidity.

Then, Minato teleported to Madara, wounded him, pulled the fox free from his control, then teleported to Konoha, summoned Gamabunta, and teleported himself and the Fox away.

Yes he died against the fox, but he also stalled Madara for about 16 years....

All after holding the fox back in Kushina's stomach before Madara extracted it.

I doubt that Minato would beat Madara in his prime. I think that spot is reserved for the Sage, Naruto (if not now, then it'll happen), Sasuke (if not now, then it'll happen), and possibly Hashirama (if Madara was lying about him losing purposefully to gain his abilities).

Madara also had the whole fight with Minato planned out, seeing as he teleported behind him to battle him. Minato, on the other hand had his son kidnapped, the fox free'd and his wife in a ton of shit. He still won.

 

[DigitalMonster]

Seriously,IN.

Please provide objective reasoning on how Minato can beat the Raikage,because I thought that you were going to explain that thoroughly [considering that Raikage is also a speed-monster.]

 

[DigitalMonster]

Minato beats Madara.

You know why? Intelligence. It was Madara's fault that he didn't warp Minato into a space-time dimension. Madara, likely knowing the speed of Hiraishin, should have known to do that. Yet he was stupid, and wanted to have a funny line instead of win the battle. This shows lack of dedication for the cause of his fight. It was inferior to Minato, whose desire to protect the village gave him more determination to beat Madara.

Also, Madara had already witnessed Minato teleporting to a kunai, yet he was still stupid enough to let one of his Hiraishin-tagged kunai slip through him, KNOWING what it does.

Again, stupidity.

Then, Minato teleported to Madara, wounded him, pulled the fox free from his control, then teleported to Konoha, summoned Gamabunta, and teleported himself and the Fox away.

Yes he died against the fox, but he also stalled Madara for about 16 years....

All after holding the fox back in Kushina's stomach before Madara extracted it.

I doubt that Minato would beat Madara in his prime. I think that spot is reserved for the Sage, Naruto (if not now, then it'll happen), Sasuke (if not now, then it'll happen), and possibly Hashirama (if Madara was lying about him losing purposefully to gain his abilities).

Madara also had the whole fight with Minato planned out, seeing as he teleported behind him to battle him. Minato, on the other hand had his son kidnapped, the fox free'd and his wife in a ton of shit. He still won.

I can't decide really, whether you are against me or not.Because most of your statement imply that it was plot who favorized Minato and Madara's forcible-stupidity which was in the author's writing that made Minato win.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

Seriously,IN.

Please provide objective reasoning on how Minato can beat the Raikage,because I thought that you were going to explain that thoroughly [considering that Raikage is also a speed-monster.]

Well he can't physically hurt him. The way he would win is by using ST and a combination of sealing jutsu.

How did Naruto beat the 3rd raikage? What prevents Minato from doing the exact same? The 3rd raikage clearly isn't as fast as his son because Naruto was faster than him in Sage Mode and even the rubber guy was fast enough to get away.

But anyway Minato could seal him or just make him hurt himself. Naruto did it and Minato is much more intelligent than Naruto and has extremely fast reactions.

I know he likely wouldn't have any jutsu that would hurt him physically but there are other ways to beat the 3rd raikage. Genjutsu is one example, everyone seems to be forgetting about that. His armor wouldn't prevent him from being caught in a genjutsu. Just like Itachi did with Deidara, anyone with enough skill in genjutsu wouldn't even have to fight the third raikage, they could just make a genjutsu where the opponent thinks that they are attacking their enemy when in fact they are about to hit themselves.

So that is how he could win. Just because the third raikage is a tank does not mean he is unbeatable.

 

[Draegod]

Seriously,IN.

Please provide objective reasoning on how Minato can beat the Raikage,because I thought that you were going to explain that thoroughly [considering that Raikage is also a speed-monster.]

i wouldnt bother arguing with him. he is a fanboy of the highest degree. he thinks itachi and minato are the best and will/could never lose. so he makes up bull that has never been shown to make it seem as though it would happen.

it is obvious that to seal the raikage you have to keep him still, minato has yet shown a sealing tech that binds the other user to be able to seal. hell even using the reaper death seal required the fox and oru to be still and held down. he beleives minato is a auto kill with no proof what so ever on how he would win from what we have seen.

he says minato is a sensor taht could sense muu, but muu is unsenseable out side physical contact (i.e. sensor sand), plus the only sensor tech we seen him do was touching the ground with his finger, which is the weakest form of sensory.

he says minato could send any atk back at the user. but he has to throw a bunch of kunais tied together, then have a predeterined seal to take the atk at. (the reason he did that to the fox was because it was in his turf with predetermined seals around the village.) out side the village would be a differ story ofc

there is no way minato could defeat the 3rd raikage or muu that has been shown of minato. if anyone thinks so, post the possibiltys then ill counter everyone with what little has been shown so far.


the ninjas off the top of my head that i think could kill minato are

hanzou, sasori, 3rd raikage, nagato, naruto, tobi, madara ems, muu, 1st 2nd and 3rd hokages, maybe itachi, young onoki, and thats all for now. but he is still a beast non the less

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

i wouldnt bother arguing with him. he is a fanboy of the highest degree. he thinks itachi and minato are the best and will/could never lose. so he makes up bull that has never been shown to make it seem as though it would happen.

it is obvious that to seal the raikage you have to keep him still, minato has yet shown a sealing tech that binds the other user to be able to seal. hell even using the reaper death seal required the fox and oru to be still and held down. he beleives minato is a auto kill with no proof what so ever on how he would win from what we have seen.

he says minato is a sensor taht could sense muu, but muu is unsenseable out side physical contact (i.e. sensor sand), plus the only sensor tech we seen him do was touching the ground with his finger, which is the weakest form of sensory.

he says minato could send any atk back at the user. but he has to throw a bunch of kunais tied together, then have a predeterined seal to take the atk at. (the reason he did that to the fox was because it was in his turf with predetermined seals around the village.) out side the village would be a differ story ofc

there is no way minato could defeat the 3rd raikage or muu that has been shown of minato. if anyone thinks so, post the possibiltys then ill counter everyone with what little has been shown so far.


the ninjas off the top of my head that i think could kill minato are

hanzou, sasori, 3rd raikage, nagato, naruto, tobi, madara ems, muu, 1st 2nd and 3rd hokages, maybe itachi, young onoki, and thats all for now. but he is still a beast non the less

The only ones there that I see being able to beat him are Itachi, Madara, Nagato, and Sasori.

Sasori only because he is a bad match up for Minato. He is too fast for those other characters and is just too smart. Plus he is a master of the toad summons as well. (And most likely a sage although you will never admit it). He has at least one element that he is skilled with and has perfect chakra control and is awesome at sealing jutsu. And you can't deny his intelligence.

Dust technique. Even if he couldn't send it right back why couldn't he just teleport away? He has kunai in a bunch of different places and is still one of the fastest characters even without FTG. A kunai to the neck or a rasengan would take out Muu or Onoki.

Previous Hokages, they are all fairly slow. Minato makes them look like turtles. What defense do they have against his ST? And his summons are a whole lot better than Enma. Plus Hiruzen's finishing move was learned from Minato. The funny thing about being a ninja is that a blade in the back will still kill you, and Minato is fast enough to put it there.


You give him the least credit out of anyone. He was a goddamn hokage he probably had alot more than just FTG and rasengan. I mean he was a genius and invented his own techniques so it stands to reason that he probably knew some others. You can hate all you want but he is hyped up fro a reason.

 

[blazekev90]

Lol typical. Can't find a good counter argument so you make an excuse and leave.

First I never watched DBZ and second there are plenty of other ninja who have these three characteristics. And I define strong as being a well rounded in aspects, above the average level shinobi. This includes; speed, strength, smarts, and ability. But it’s also how you have to go along with these abilities; it has nothing to do with their personality, that’s how one gains fans/favoritism. Minato had speed and intelligence above the average shinobi that’s it, and he gained favoritism through his accomplishments and character, but he lacked IMO the combination of strong NINJA (this isn’t a uss lifestyle). His technique benefited him as it made him almost impossible to catch, idk you can assert this as him being strong?? It’s like saying Flash is stronger than Batman, Superman, and Green Marshen or someone. Also, as I stated I’m not a hater, I just like putting ppl in their place when they overestimate characters, especially when all they have going for them is what someone else had said for their main argument.

 

[Draegod]

The only ones there that I see being able to beat him are Itachi, Madara, Nagato, and Sasori.

Sasori only because he is a bad match up for Minato. He is too fast for those other characters and is just too smart. Plus he is a master of the toad summons as well. (And most likely a sage although you will never admit it). He has at least one element that he is skilled with and has perfect chakra control and is awesome at sealing jutsu. And you can't deny his intelligence.

Dust technique. Even if he couldn't send it right back why couldn't he just teleport away? He has kunai in a bunch of different places and is still one of the fastest characters even without FTG. A kunai to the neck or a rasengan would take out Muu or Onoki.

Previous Hokages, they are all fairly slow. Minato makes them look like turtles. What defense do they have against his ST? And his summons are a whole lot better than Enma. Plus Hiruzen's finishing move was learned from Minato. The funny thing about being a ninja is that a blade in the back will still kill you, and Minato is fast enough to put it there.


You give him the least credit out of anyone. He was a goddamn hokage he probably had alot more than just FTG and rasengan. I mean he was a genius and invented his own techniques so it stands to reason that he probably knew some others. You can hate all you want but he is hyped up fro a reason.

hanzou would rape the **** out of minato. if minato dont know the secret he's screwed. minto tele to hanzou, then breaths next to him while the mask is off... dead minato. or have the salamander poison the wholeeeeeee area ftw! dont sleep on hanzou as if he's weak. he is one of the best with a hidden secret. hashi would change the landscape, and or merge with the earth itself! and if you really think a kunai can kill every ninja, you really need to think again.

minato has no way what so ever of finding muu, or hurting the raikage. you make it seem as though every other character is retared and minato is god. he is good yes, but speed and seals dont auto mean victory. if you cant catch, touch, harm, last, damage then youll be waisting time when you yourself is as fragile as the next ninja.
minato's positives-
fast, smart, has many seals, barriers, frog summons, kunais, ftg, and rasengan

minatos negatives-
weak, cant take a hit, relys to much on ftg, his kill time is slow (he can tele or get to you true, but his kill time (hand motion) is slow, proven by killer bee), predictable if the fight drags on.

and just because he made ftg doesnt mean hes the best. muu was the 1st to mix 3 elements from scratch!!!!!! thats a way better feat and tech to bragg about. hashi had wood element, tobimaru invented edo tensei! i mean i can go down the list if you really want to brag about techs..

he is good, but not unbeatable. and its all about match up.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

hanzou would rape the **** out of minato. if minato dont know the secret he's screwed. minto tele to hanzou, then breaths next to him while the mask is off... dead minato. or have the salamander poison the wholeeeeeee area ftw! dont sleep on hanzou as if he's weak. he is one of the best with a hidden secret. hashi would change the landscape, and or merge with the earth itself! and if you really think a kunai can kill every ninja, you really need to think again.

minato has no way what so ever of finding muu, or hurting the raikage. you make it seem as though every other character is retared and minato is god. he is good yes, but speed and seals dont auto mean victory. if you cant catch, touch, harm, last, damage then youll be waisting time when you yourself is as fragile as the next ninja.
minato's positives-
fast, smart, has many seals, barriers, frog summons, kunais, ftg, and rasengan

minatos negatives-
weak, cant take a hit, relys to much on ftg, his kill time is slow (he can tele or get to you true, but his kill time (hand motion) is slow, proven by killer bee), predictable if the fight drags on.

and just because he made ftg doesnt mean hes the best. muu was the 1st to mix 3 elements from scratch!!!!!! thats a way better feat and tech to bragg about. hashi had wood element, tobimaru invented edo tensei! i mean i can go down the list if you really want to brag about techs..

he is good, but not unbeatable. and its all about match up.

Well Minato reaction speed and hands are not slow, he purposefully did not kill Bee. Had he wanted to I am sure he could have because in case you didn't notice Minato had all the advantage there. Bee was faced the opposite way and had his arm at a weird angle. All Minato would have had to do was move sideways and he could have stabbed him in the neck. He did not because he didn't want to kill them.

Where you missed how fast he is , is when Bee attacked him with the tail and Minato dodged it instantly and cut the tail nearly off. So yeah he is fast.

By the way Minato didn't make only FTG, he also made the death reaper seal and rasengan.

And it isn't like Hashirama invented Mokuton, he was just lucky enough to be born with a KG. Tobirama is also awesome and invented a bunch of cool stuff but he didn't take his jutsus as far as he could have.

And as for the 3rd raikage, well he can't hurt him but he could seal him or make him hurt himself. Naruto did it and Minato is as fast as him and much more intelligent. And the best way to beat the 3rd raikage is to use genjutsu, this doesn't apply to Minato since we haven't seen him use genjutsu, but if one were to do what Itachi did to Deidara and make them think they are the opponent then the 3rd raikage would just stab himself and the fight would be over.

 

[Draegod]

Well Minato reaction speed and hands are not slow, he purposefully did not kill Bee. Had he wanted to I am sure he could have because in case you didn't notice Minato had all the advantage there. Bee was faced the opposite way and had his arm at a weird angle. All Minato would have had to do was move sideways and he could have stabbed him in the neck. He did not because he didn't want to kill them.

Where you missed how fast he is , is when Bee attacked him with the tail and Minato dodged it instantly and cut the tail nearly off. So yeah he is fast.

By the way Minato didn't make only FTG, he also made the death reaper seal and rasengan.

And it isn't like Hashirama invented Mokuton, he was just lucky enough to be born with a KG. Tobirama is also awesome and invented a bunch of cool stuff but he didn't take his jutsus as far as he could have.

And as for the 3rd raikage, well he can't hurt him but he could seal him or make him hurt himself. Naruto did it and Minato is as fast as him and much more intelligent. And the best way to beat the 3rd raikage is to use genjutsu, this doesn't apply to Minato since we haven't seen him use genjutsu, but if one were to do what Itachi did to Deidara and make them think they are the opponent then the 3rd raikage would just stab himself and the fight would be over.

whoaaaaaaa. you are clearly taking what itachi did to oru and deidara out of context. he clearly made them believe they were about to kill him, but in reality they were in the same spot doing there move on them. not ima mind control deidara to selfdestruct, or make oru cut his own head off. let alone make raikage stab him self.

keep in mind no one has ever figured out how he recieve that scarr. the only reason naruto had a chance to think about it was becasue of the intel the rubber dude was telling naruto. and naruto talking to 8 tails on what happend. if you dont know his back story, you will never figure him out. and add the fact he was being controlled, if you think thats how he would fight, your crazy!

when he was about to stabb raikage, bee had enuff time to interfere. the speed im taliking about is when you dont see anything happen, just a head on the grond and blood everywhere. and minato cannot do that. he is just fast, but his hands are no where near the speed of say neji hyuga. his muscle speed is the same as naruto and any other ninja.

fighting a uchia is common knowlege not to look in there eyes, the only genjutsu that anyone should fear is tsukuyomi and mizu and shisus gen. any other gen like itachis finger gen is useless and easy to get out of. jman stated on how to cancle a gen. if you have great chakra control, you can escape, simple as that..
and btw, you never commented on the hanzou fight.

 

[blazekev90]

I really dont understand how Minato fans can keep on going after great arguments have put theirs to shame.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

whoaaaaaaa. you are clearly taking what itachi did to oru and deidara out of context. he clearly made them believe they were about to kill him, but in reality they were in the same spot doing there move on them. not ima mind control deidara to selfdestruct, or make oru cut his own head off. let alone make raikage stab him self.

keep in mind no one has ever figured out how he recieve that scarr. the only reason naruto had a chance to think about it was becasue of the intel the rubber dude was telling naruto. and naruto talking to 8 tails on what happend. if you dont know his back story, you will never figure him out. and add the fact he was being controlled, if you think thats how he would fight, your crazy!

when he was about to stabb raikage, bee had enuff time to interfere. the speed im taliking about is when you dont see anything happen, just a head on the grond and blood everywhere. and minato cannot do that. he is just fast, but his hands are no where near the speed of say neji hyuga. his muscle speed is the same as naruto and any other ninja.

fighting a uchia is common knowlege not to look in there eyes, the only genjutsu that anyone should fear is tsukuyomi and mizu and shisus gen. any other gen like itachis finger gen is useless and easy to get out of. jman stated on how to cancle a gen. if you have great chakra control, you can escape, simple as that..
and btw, you never commented on the hanzou fight.

I am only going to respond to the bolded parts as I know you will never admit that I am right ever.

"Minato's muscle speed is the same as everyone else's. "
That sir is a complete lie. What did Shee say when the A turned on raiton armor?" His reaction speed is on par with the 4th Hokage's when he has the raiton armor on" That is a direct quote from the manga. He can move faster than Madara can bring his arm down too. In case you forgot that part. And he was like fifty feet away from kakashi when Kakashi was about to use chidori for the first time and to use chidori you have to be moving very fast, and Minato still got there in time to save kakashi and kick and tag the other guy.

I'm sorry but you have to admit you are wrong here. I don't even know what made you think this. Minato has the fastest reactions of all the characters.

Now on to the next bolded part, genjutsus are actually not that easy to be dispelled and you have to know that you are in one first. Oro has a five in genjutsu but could not dispel Itachi's genjutsu (which wasn't Tsukuyomi) because he didn't know he was in one. Same with Deidara and Sasuke, and Danzo.

Genjutsu is useful to change little things about the battle that make all the difference. The trick is to make it seem like reality, not be stupid like Kurenai. How many of Itachi's opponents have known they were in genjutus? And of those how many are kage level ninjas? Genjutsu if used correctly is the best, you just have to make it seem like reality.

And the reason I did not respond to the Hanzo part is because I was up in the air about Minato vs. Hanzo.

 

[Venus]

First of all if you are a Minato tard half the library get out.

[ALT + F4 at the same time]

Plot induced-stupidity

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People forget about Madara catching Minato's wrist really easily and almost-warping him, but conveniently deciding to warp him slower than he was capable of despite knowing of and already witnessing Hiraishin.

A division of his power

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The entire time that he was fighting Minato, he was also controlling the Nine Tails, you know, that animal that was fighting the village, that Minato had to give his life to seal, and that his badass wife had to chain up for him.

Madara was hurried

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Controlling the Nine Tails isn't easy. Minato himself was clear that Tobi needs to kill Minato fast, and it's that hastiness that allows Minato to defeat Tobi, as well as a hell of a lot of plot protection.

Sharingan Genjutsu

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Minato, like Konan, was staring at the Sharingan, but Tobi seems to actively choose not to use Sharingan genjutsu until the endgame, like Sasuke. That's pretty much plot-induced stupidity as well.

Complete Izanagi

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Madara made one Sharingan last five minutes. That's ten minutes of Danzō-style of invincibility and teleportation. Which can be used
intermittently with intangibility, rendering Madara invincible.

Kunai Placement

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Tobi's ability conveniently played to Minato's strength as well. Could you find a better position for a Hiraishin tag other than the back of somebody's head? It's too bad Tobi didn't use that feint that he used on Torune...

Minato's Strongest

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Tobi tanked and regenerated from Minato's strongest attack in a way that Orochimaru would. So he can be intangible for five minutes, use Izanagi, buy seconds with genjutsu, teleport seal-lessly, and tank

Madara didn't have prep

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This claim annoys me. Madara strolled in, murdered all of Minato's bodyguards and nurses with Minato in the same room, marched to Konohagakure, slaughtering many shinobi, and obliterated Minato's family. Akatsuki and him could have come back the next day and taken the Fox back if not for the plot.

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