Itachi and Nagato CANT be compared...

[arv993]

i personally did not say nagato was immune to genjustu, what i did indicated was that nagato was caught in a soundbase gen-jutsu, and not a vision base, like that of tsukuyomi so declaring that nagato's defeat by tsukuyomi is guaranteed is pure assumption made in to a fact itachi fanboys.

fyi most of us actually had facts as to support our claims.

how is it an assumption when it has been said that it cannot be broken unless you are of the same flesh and blood, nagato might break it but it has not been proven wrong so far so it does have a good chance to work on nagato. and no most of you did not but no one is saying that it is you who does have logical points.

 

[ackeem1992]

yea sure believe what you want idc but how did nagato fans win no one did this is a thread where ppl use logic to see who is better or use proof from the manga which many nagato fans did not do and said things like nagato is unbeatable ppl have no one has ever really concretely proven it wrong, he is the strongest chracter and is immune to pretty much everything but he is very strong i acknowledge that. but not good enough to beat Itachi IMO but also has the ability to be beat itachi but madara in the current form is just ridiculous and some ppl believe it blindly and for counter arguments just use stupid reasoning and make him seem unbeatable like nagato can catch madara with his human path even though the attack is slow or his asura path when all those things are actually gonna just pass through him.

first off man i did not say nagato was unbeatable, second man i did not say he could beat madara what i did say is that itachi cannot take him alone and win.

 

[arv993]

first off man i did not say nagato was unbeatable, second man i did not say he could beat madara what i did say is that itachi cannot take him alone and win.

i did not say you did I but i meant nagato fans who are the ones in many threads say stuff like that i did not mean to direct it towards u man i am srry about that. and i was referring to them becos u said ppl pawned others in the itachi vs nagato threads all i was saying is that a good number of them just used bad logic, pure assumptions and with absolute certainty that he is unbeatable but did not target it towards you in any way.Many itachi fans also said bs things not denying that either.

 

[kadowade]

i personally did not say nagato was immune to genjustu, what i did indicated was that nagato was caught in a soundbase gen-jutsu, and not a vision base, like that of tsukuyomi so declaring that nagato's defeat by tsukuyomi is guaranteed is pure assumption made in to a fact itachi fanboys.

fyi most of us actually had facts as to support our claims.

Just because the Genjutsu is delivered by the eyes, you think NAgato is immune to it. Which is a Complete assumption. Genjutsu is Genjutsu. Nagatos Rinnegan dosent make him immune to any genjutsu. ALl madara said was, "The rinnegan has better insight than the sharingan" Ok Nagatos rinnegan may help him realize that he's in a Genjutsu, BUT it will NOT make nagato escape, since the ways of escaping Tsukiyomi is already stated.

IMO i believe a Sharingan Is a Better counter for Genjutsu, than the Rinnegan, since the Sharinga posses Genjutsu abilities, and the Rinnegan Dosen't.

Kakashi had insight that he was in a Genjutsu (Tsukiyomi) Yet did he escape.....NO. Even though he was FULL aware he was in it.

The Rinnegan posses NO such ability that makes it immune to Genjutsu not even visual genjutsu. If so please explain why.

(Im not talking about the SO6P's Rinnegan)

 

[Avani]

When Nagato tech. was first introduce and we saw 8 tailed kyuubi trying to escape but couldn't I thought that attack was amazing. We than later, found out that it can be brought down, as recent manga states. My point is, the manga hasn't said that it cannot be brought down with one attack but it also doesn't state it can, so when someone says Itachi, Bee or Naruto can bring it down alone, it's just an assumption/opinion, as we don't know and when you deny it, also an assumption/opinion.

No manga hasn't said that. it just showed that Naruto needed 8 tails of Kyuubi to break free of it.. that's quite a power. Itachi, decided to use maximum force was a wise decision unless his own attack was equal to eight tails of Kyuubi attack at least..

Answer this for me, manga states (by Zetsu), Itachi Susano'o with shield is invincible and can repel any attack, but Nagato fan think otherwise and have their assumption but yet cry over the fact that Itachi fan post an assumption they believe in.

Zetsu said Itachi is invincible along with totasuka and yata and Susano.

You must be registered for see links

Susano itself is not nvincible as Raikage broke into it.

But the arguing over it is just blah.. comparing apples to orranges..

 

[ReLax -]

No manga hasn't said that. it just showed that Naruto needed 8 tails of Kyuubi to break free of it.. that's quite a power. Itachi, decided to use maximum force was a wise decision unless his own attack was equal to eight tails of Kyuubi attack at least..

Exactly, not only 8 tails but Minato also had a small part in it or Naruto was gone, Nagato was also surprised by Kyuubi's strength. I though that attack was amazing than to see the Naruto, Bee, Itachi, used there strong attack to bring it down, 1-2 chapters later Naruto uses RS but doesn't even put a scratch on the 3rd Raikage.

Zetsu said Itachi is invincible along with totasuka and yata and Susano.

You must be registered for see links

Susano itself is not nvincible as Raikage broke into it.

But the arguing over it is just blah.. comparing apples to orranges..

Thats what I said, Itachi Susano'o with shield and sword was pretty much invincible. Even than Nagato fans think he can bring it down, despite it saying that he was invincible. I know there is a weakness, Itachi himself said it best, "every attack has a weakness, every person has a weakness." I think we will see, his Susano'o weakness VS either Tobi or Kabuto (I don't want to see it VS Kabuto but it will happen).

Sasuke Sasuno'o (It was his first time using it) and you can't really compare Itachi's Sasuno'o with Sasuke's, Raikage would have been sealed long before, if he battled like that against Itachi. I still assume Sasuke Sasuno'o wasn't fully developed. Susano'o is extremely powerful tho, Tobi did state to Gaara that he had Sasuke around due to Sasuke's eyes holding Sasuno'o which was a rare tech to get.

 

[ackeem1992]

how is it an assumption when it has been said that it cannot be broken unless you are of the same flesh and blood, nagato might break it but it has not been proven wrong so far so it does have a good chance to work on nagato. and no most of you did not but no one is saying that it is you who does have logical points.

very valid point, but at the same time one cannot asume nagato has no means of breaking this illusion, for the manga also stated that amaterasu is unavoidable which was proven wrong. sharingan was derived off rinnegan thus a rinnegan user countering tsukuyomi is not so far-fetched, if itachi could've simply defeated nagato with tsukuyomi why didn't he do it.

i did not say you did I but i meant nagato fans who are the ones in many threads say stuff like that i did not mean to direct it towards u man i am srry about that. and i was referring to them becos u said ppl pawned others in the itachi vs nagato threads all i was saying is that a good number of them just used bad logic, pure assumptions and with absolute certainty that he is unbeatable but did not target it towards you in any way.Many itachi fans also said bs things not denying that either.

ok

Just because the Genjutsu is delivered by the eyes, you think NAgato is immune to it. Which is a Complete assumption. Genjutsu is Genjutsu. Nagatos Rinnegan dosent make him immune to any genjutsu. ALl madara said was, "The rinnegan has better insight than the sharingan" Ok Nagatos rinnegan may help him realize that he's in a Genjutsu, BUT it will NOT make nagato escape, since the ways of escaping Tsukiyomi is already stated.

IMO i believe a Sharingan Is a Better counter for Genjutsu, than the Rinnegan, since the Sharinga posses Genjutsu abilities, and the Rinnegan Dosen't.

Kakashi had insight that he was in a Genjutsu (Tsukiyomi) Yet did he escape.....NO. Even though he was FULL aware he was in it.

The Rinnegan posses NO such ability that makes it immune to Genjutsu not even visual genjutsu. If so please explain why.

(Im not talking about the SO6P's Rinnegan)

read my post and tell me where i said the guy is immune

kakashi does not possess rinnegan, nobody is saying that nagato is immune to gen-jutsu, but the fact still remains that nagato was caught in a sound base illusion and not a sight base like tsukuyomi. and correct me if i'm not mistaken didn't killer be break out of saskue's tsukuyomi, saskues tsuku induces paralysis, bee was paralyze for a brief moment before the hachibi broke free of the illusion. the same method can be used by nagato as a means to escape, being he has shown perfect control over his chakra and posses quite alot, like what you just said the rinnegan has better insight, thus he would realize he is an illusion.

 

[NarutoSensei]

finally someone with sense

 

[Inception]

How about I simple call you an idiot? Saracasms have to be understood or left alone.

Half of the things you write are worded so badly that they never make any sense. You're calling me an idiot yet you made so many errors in those 2 sentences alone. Idiot.

We do not have much info about Nagato's tactical abilities. In his battle with Jiraiya he did alright as well as with Naruto who is a tactical genius himself. He was running Akatsuki quite smoothly and handling hardenned criminals quite well and effectively. On can argue that Madara was behind the idea of the organisation but, there is nothing to prove that it was he accepting planning or carrying out the mission.

I wasn't even talking about Nagato in the context you took out of my paragraph. As for your argument; I disagree. Nagato did not use any sort of tactics vs. Jiraiya or Naruto. They were both simple battles. He even went as far to let Jiraiya activate Sage mode. It takes a lot of time for Jiraiya to activate it and Nagato basically let him use it. Nagato was never running Akatsuki, Tobi was behind everything Nagato did. And yes, there is a lot of proof that shows that Nagato was like Tobi's lap dog. The obvious one is the part where he's talking to Zetsu right after he kills Jiraiya. He claims that Jiraiya appeared out of nowhere right after Madara "ORDERED" him to capture the 9-tails.

Because you cannot analyze anyone's abilities unless you understand them. Nagato's goal was different than kabuto so his action and implementation of his tech was according to that.

Yes you can. Itachi analyzed Nagato's ability in a matter of seconds and he barely knew Nagato. He even found the Rinnegan's weakness, not just Chibaku Tensei and it was his first time fighting it.

And Nagato having a different goal than Kabuto? Are you reading the same manga? Nagato wanted to capture the 9-tails just as Kabuto did. His actions were EXACTLY the same rofl. Are you really that stupid?

Nagato wanted Naruto the moment he stepped in. He may or may not have destroyed kOnoha- he went for shinera tensei when he saw Tsunade gathering chakra at her feet- basically going for attack.

No. You're completely lost. He used Shinra Tensei to make Tsunade and the rest of the Leaf feel his Pain. You're telling me to read the manga and you haven't even read half of Pain's Invasion.

As for rest.. If you are set for an argument nothing can be said.. to each his own. I have my own opinion. you keep yours.

This is what one usually uses when he's out of ideas or arguments. It was fun talking to you. If you have any more arguments, feel free to bring them up .

I'm sure puppets are better anyday. :| Especially if there is a chance that they have a consicous. Nagato did better by himself the first time - he had taken better safe guard and strategy. I wonder if you realise that even Konan could have captured Naruto at that point for he was exhausted as well. Nagato didn't need to sacrifice himself for konoha and all that..He didn't lost. He chose to die.

Not really. He still lost and to Naruto that time. He was fighting ONLY Naruto. Bee wasn't there to help him out, no one was. This time, he had all his abilities in one body. He was faster and stronger as stated by Naruto himself. How are you still claiming that he did better the first time around? He actually did lose. His God Realm was killed, he had used a lot of chakra on Chibaku Tensei and all his other abilities, he was bleeding ffs, he was done. He sacrificed himself but he obviously couldn't go on much longer. His limit was nearing as compared to recent chapter where Nagato captured both Bee and Naruto in a matter of seconds. THIS WAS THANKS TO KABUTO'S STRATEGY.

Because of Nagato's skills and nobody elses and Kabuto got him sealed. Too bad that Itachi had fed Naruto Shisui's eye with "save Konoha program".

I don't get this ^.

 

[Inception]

very valid point, but at the same time one cannot asume nagato has no means of breaking this illusion, for the manga also stated that amaterasu is unavoidable which was proven wrong. sharingan was derived off rinnegan thus a rinnegan user countering tsukuyomi is not so far-fetched, if itachi could've simply defeated nagato with tsukuyomi why didn't he do it.



ok



read my post and tell me where i said the guy is immune

kakashi does not possess rinnegan, nobody is saying that nagato is immune to gen-jutsu, but the fact still remains that nagato was caught in a sound base illusion and not a sight base like tsukuyomi. and correct me if i'm not mistaken didn't killer be break out of saskue's tsukuyomi, saskues tsuku induces paralysis, bee was paralyze for a brief moment before the hachibi broke free of the illusion. the same method can be used by nagato as a means to escape, being he has shown perfect control over his chakra and posses quite alot, like what you just said the rinnegan has better insight, thus he would realize he is an illusion.

Nagato is not immune to any genjutsu. If Jiraiya's sound genjutsu effected him, so can the strongest genjutsu, Tsukiyomi. Fact is, Nagato was caught, he couldn't move until Jiraiya ended the genjutsu. He attacked after the genjutsu was lifted meaning all of his bodies were paralyzed, not just the ones effected. Of course his real body did not take any sort of damage as Jiraiya only killed the three he caught.

Bee only managed to break out of Sasuke's Tsukiyomi is because 1. Bee has a beast to help him. 2. Sasuke sucks at using Tsukiyomi as stated many times. 3. Nagato is not Bee so idk why you're comparing them?

 

[kadowade]

read my post and tell me where i said the guy is immune

kakashi does not possess rinnegan, nobody is saying that nagato is immune to gen-jutsu, but the fact still remains that nagato was caught in a sound base illusion and not a sight base like tsukuyomi. and correct me if i'm not mistaken didn't killer be break out of saskue's tsukuyomi, saskues tsuku induces paralysis, bee was paralyze for a brief moment before the hachibi broke free of the illusion. the same method can be used by nagato as a means to escape, being he has shown perfect control over his chakra and posses quite alot, like what you just said the rinnegan has better insight, thus he would realize he is an illusion.

Only Itachi's Tsukiyomi can be broken by flesh and blood. were not talking about Sasukes Tsukiyomi. Which Danzou even said was a Far cry from Itachi's Tsukiyomi. Itachi's Tsukiyomi alters Time and Preception and can only be broken by an Uchiha with the same bloodline limit as him.

So nagato Won't be breaking Tsukiyomi since he dosent share the bloodline limit as Itachi, nor does he have an 3 tomoe mastered sharingan.

Even Though Nagato's Rinnegan has better insight, and might help him realize that its an Illusion, He still won't be able to escape. Remeber when Itachi Got Kakashi in Tsukiyomi, Kakashi was FULL aware that it was an illusion and a Genjutsu, even itachi told him. Yet he still couldn't escape ,because he dosent share the same blood as Itachi.

So Nagato figuring out that it's an illusion, will do NO good. He would just be getting tortured, while he knows it's an illusion, until he dies.

 

[ReLax -]

Nagato is not immune to any genjutsu. If Jiraiya's sound genjutsu effected him, so can the strongest genjutsu, Tsukiyomi. Fact is, Nagato was caught, he couldn't move until Jiraiya ended the genjutsu. He attacked after the genjutsu was lifted meaning all of his bodies were paralyzed, not just the ones effected. Of course his real body did not take any sort of damage as Jiraiya only killed the three he caught.

Bee only managed to break out of Sasuke's Tsukiyomi is because 1. Bee has a beast to help him. 2. Sasuke sucks at using Tsukiyomi as stated many times. 3. Nagato is not Bee so idk why you're comparing them?

IMO, Sasuke doesn't having Tsukiyomi. Also Itachi control S/T in his Tsukiyomi (VS Kakashi, what we saw). If Itachi fought Bee and used Tsukiyomi, say every word said is half a second, Eight tails saying, "Bee snap out." 1.5 sec. Itachi genjutsu is over and Bee will be laying infront of him helplessly.

very valid point, but at the same time one cannot asume nagato has no means of breaking this illusion, for the manga also stated that amaterasu is unavoidable which was proven wrong. sharingan was derived off rinnegan thus a rinnegan user countering tsukuyomi is not so far-fetched, if itachi could've simply defeated nagato with tsukuyomi why didn't he do it.

I'd have to say you are a reasonable person, than most, Itachi and Nagato fans.

As much as there are some Nagato fan stating proof-less info, there are also Itachi fans doing the same. 90% of discussion regrading this battle is all assumption/opinions. Nagato maybe be able to break genjutsu, but the thing with Itachi is, his Tsukiyomi can control S/T (1 second in the real world feels like 72 hrs). Itachi couldn't use Tsukiyomi on Edo Nagato becuase it would have no effect he needed to seal him.

Tsukiyomi/genjutsu is not an auto win for Itachi with likes of Nagato. Itachi has owned the likes of Oro and Deidara within 30 seconds with a regualr genjutsu, and he didn't even try to kill them. It's a fact people bring in to play in Itachi's favor for them to think of an assumption or opinion on how they believe Itachi could win.

 

[NEvery]

Haha. Good idea's. But in pact they're all dead. kk. And we must memorize they met the different way's what Nagato was killed by Naruto and Itachi was killed by Sasuke. Hah Hah

 

[Avani]

Half of the things you write are worded so badly that they never make any sense. You're calling me an idiot yet you made so many errors in those 2 sentences alone. Idiot.

You started name calling when you called me a douche- which was an insult insult since you had failed to understand saracasm and go on commenting on typos to hide your comprehension problem.. really smooth, idiot and a Jerk.

I wasn't even talking about Nagato in the context you took out of my paragraph. As for your argument; I disagree. Nagato did not use any sort of tactics vs. Jiraiya or Naruto. They were both simple battles. He even went as far to let Jiraiya activate Sage mode. It takes a lot of time for Jiraiya to activate it and Nagato basically let him use it. Nagato was never running Akatsuki, Tobi was behind everything Nagato did. And yes, there is a lot of proof that shows that Nagato was like Tobi's lap dog. The obvious one is the part where he's talking to Zetsu right after he kills Jiraiya. He claims that Jiraiya appeared out of nowhere right after Madara "ORDERED" him to capture the 9-tails.

What I saw was a Tobi dceiving Nagato into thinking that they were after similar goal but, failing in the end in getting him to do everything his way.. it was not a happy Madara who wanted to know how Naruto could change Nagato's mind.

If Madara couldn't face MInato I don't think he would be able to go against Nagato that well either. He was also able to hide his abilities and details of his back up plans from Itachi and said so.

What was with " he claims so" .. do you think Jiraiya had sent him a telegram informing him that he was coming?

Yes you can. Itachi analyzed Nagato's ability in a matter of seconds and he barely knew Nagato. He even found the Rinnegan's weakness, not just Chibaku Tensei and it was his first time fighting it.

So? Nagato analyzed within a second that SM had a disadvantage and it needs to ballance the chakra. He nailed naruto with chakra rods and that was end to Naruto's SM. and this was the first time for him to see this weakness of sm as well.

BTW what is rinnegan's weakness which he found out just like that? Itachi has sharingan and knew how eye techs work.

And Nagato having a different goal than Kabuto? Are you reading the same manga? Nagato wanted to capture the 9-tails just as Kabuto did. His actions were EXACTLY the same rofl. Are you really that stupid?

Nagato had the most powerful tech but, he didn't have strong convictions like Itachi or that hunger for power or recognition etc which would motivate him like Kabuto or Madara.

You obviously are unable to understand that a person's personality affects when, how and to which extent he is going to use his abilities. "his actions were same" - how so? I didn't see puppet Nagato trying to communicate with Naruto. Nagato may have used shinera tensie on Konoha but he didn't really stabbed Hinata when she was down.. I doubt Kabuto would be so curteous if she was around this time..

No. You're completely lost. He used Shinra Tensei to make Tsunade and the rest of the Leaf feel his Pain. You're telling me to read the manga and you haven't even read half of Pain's Invasion.



This is what one usually uses when he's out of ideas or arguments. It was fun talking to you. If you have any more arguments, feel free to bring them up .



Not really. He still lost and to Naruto that time. He was fighting ONLY Naruto. Bee wasn't there to help him out, no one was. This time, he had all his abilities in one body. He was faster and stronger as stated by Naruto himself. How are you still claiming that he did better the first time around? He actually did lose. His God Realm was killed, he had used a lot of chakra on Chibaku Tensei and all his other abilities, he was bleeding ffs, he was done. He sacrificed himself but he obviously couldn't go on much longer. His limit was nearing as compared to recent chapter where Nagato captured both Bee and Naruto in a matter of seconds. THIS WAS THANKS TO KABUTO'S STRATEGY.

I don't get this ^.

You do not get a lot of things.. like not everybody is interested in posting in ridiculous vs thread for days . I post on whim and leave when bored. Neither nagato nor Itachi are paying me to advocate for them.

The only people lost are who feel the need to endlessly harp on this subject.

 

[kadowade]

Haha. Good idea's. But in pact they're all dead. kk. And we must memorize they met the different way's what Nagato killed by Naruto and Itachi killed by Sasuke. Hah Hah

lol Notice how the "MAIN CHARACTERS" won against them.
Kishi made the main characters beat them, because no sideline character was going to beat Nagato Or Itachi.

 

[NEvery]

lol Notice how the "MAIN CHARACTERS" won against them.
Kishi made the main characters beat them, because no sideline character was going to beat Nagato Or Itachi.

Haha. You're really good fan of them. But i like main character's bcoz kishi tried to tell through main character's what he want't to say our. And all sideline's character's are must be survive to them. kk

 

[khaydz5]

Did you mean "typical"?

If you're going to throw out insults, at least learn to spell before you do it, moron. Raging and insulting people with useless posts like those tells us how much more you have to contribute, it also shows how you treat others when threads don't go the way you want them to. Add something relevant or don't post at all.



"You're right".



The 3rd Hokage was known to be the strongest Hokage out of all 5. He was known as the "God Of Shinobi" and acknowledged to be the strongest in his prime by Kabuto, Orochimaru, Iruka and many others. He didn't defeat the dead Hokages, he simply sealed them and sealed himself with a super powerful jutsu that was only used in the manga twice. Were you surprised?

Nagato isn't too bright. Kabuto's intelligence helped him capture both Bee and Naruto and I know that Nagato couldn't have done this by himself. Why? Because he couldn't do it in the past, even with his 6 bodies and that was only going up against Naruto. We actually saw what Nagato was capable of when Kabuto was controlling him. His Edo form also allowed him to regenerate and escape death more than twice . I would stop crying about him being weaker as Naruto basically stated that he was way FASTER and STRONGER than when he previously fought him.

first off,when did kabuto captured bee and naruto?lol. kabuto failed countless times with his edo summons, alot being sealed and some edo even overcome it and released themselves..he has not yet killed any major characters in naruto.

2nd when nagato was hit with amaterasu, kabuto was in control.you have to understand that..we wont know what will nagato do to counter amaterasu if he is not controlled by kabuto, but one thing is for sure he CAN repel it.

I know you tried so hard but,you have to come back with better reasons to bring down nagato.. you failed with this dude.

 

[arv993]

first off,when did kabuto captured bee and naruto?lol. kabuto failed countless times with his edo summons, alot being sealed and some edo even overcome it and released themselves..he has not yet killed any major characters in naruto.

2nd when nagato was hit with amaterasu, kabuto was in control.you have to understand that..we wont know what will nagato do to counter amaterasu if he is not controlled by kabuto, but one thing is for sure he CAN repel it.

I know you tried so hard but,you have to come back with better reasons to bring down nagato.. you failed with this dude.

dude do you not kno how to read kabuto is the one who is controlling nagato not nagato himself that is what he is referring to his skills allowed naruto and bee to be captured in seconds when pain took forever to capture him. um what you're saying that kabuto edo's were sealed by many ppl obviously they are when you are fighting an army were ppl can take advantage of the numbers not to mention when naruto is running around.

 

[Kira was Righteous]

yes some ppl think he is better than even the current madara

He is hes mastered the rinnegan for 30+ years and has his 6 paths of pain , madara cannot do everything a natural rinnegan user can do or as well demonstrated by how he said using nagatos technique the human path to read yamatos mind would kill him.I think logically without bias despite my signature or signature and madara would not win

 

[arv993]

He is hes mastered the rinnegan for 30+ years and has his 6 paths of pain , madara cannot do everything a natural rinnegan user can do or as well demonstrated by how he said using nagatos technique the human path to read yamatos mind would kill him.I think logically without bias despite my signature or signature and madara would not win

ok i just find it hard to believe how nagato would even touch him since he can turn intangible and not to mention nagato is not like minato who is super fast and and can counterattack really fast and not to mention he also has gedo which he was controlling without even connecting to it so he can use the rinnegan but even if you don't include all the powers since he has not shown them he still has a last resort of izanagi which can help give an opening to kill or absorb nagato. nagato's chances are pretty low tbh.