Lol and this way of thinking is exactly the reason I made my last post.
Understand what Mihawk cutting Kaido means. It does not mean Mihawk is capable of killing Kaido. Therein lies your problem from the beginning.
[Discussion] Can Mihawk cut Kaidou?
- Thread starter TenseiganFTW
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Understand what Mihawk cutting Kaido means. It does not mean Mihawk is capable of killing Kaido. Therein lies your problem from the beginning.
chopstickchakra
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It doesn't matter if it ='s killing Kaido. The topic of can Mihawk kill Kaido wasn't brought up until you started bringing it up. The topic was can Mihawk cut him and the manga says no. The only thing saying yes is your feelings on the subject. The manga says outright the Marines were never able to kill him any of the times they sentenced him to death. Mihawk is a marine(tool) so if they couldn't kill him there's no logical explanation as to why they wouldn't call in Mihawk to do the job. So until you can refute the Marines(who have Mihawk at their command) are unable to cut him you have no stance.
You're the one putting extra stuff in here by bringing up Mihawks power levels and if he couldn't do (x) then no one could blah blah blah. I've never even said the word kill in this thread the only one talking about killing is you. You said Mihawk can cut him, the manga says the Marines set him to death but failed. If Mihawk is in the marines forces and they still can't execute Kaidou then that includes Mihawk. Get over yourself and this "no one understands the points I'm trying to make" you're not that deep, we've seen your points and countered most of them(the ones that are actually relevant to the issue "Can Mihawk cut Kaidou") I'm not arguing if Mihawk can beat Kaidou, he can't, I'm arguing if Mihawk is able to cut Kaidou then why have the Marines been unable to execute him? Until you can come up with an answer for that you're just blowing smoke.
No it's about this preconceived notion of yours that if Mihawk can cut someone you automatically thinks that means Mihawk > that character.
That is what is driving this whole argument from the start. Which is why I said drive that idea out of your head. You had no problem saying Whitebeard could damage/ scar Kaido without the use of hax, but a problem when its Mihawk.
Give me one good reason why the Gura Gura would be able to scar someones skin if Mihawk with haki intact can't even scratch said person? Not talking about Mihawk gutting Kaido here, not even a simple nick with his strongest slash? Ridiculous.
chopstickchakra
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Again I never said that, you attributed me saying that when I was ridiculing your stance on "if Mihawk can't damage him no one can because Mihawk is the pinnacle of attack strength in OP". Kaidou is (essentially) said to have unbreakable skin you said Mihawk can cut that unbreakable skin. I used extrapolation on your argument to show how ridiculous a claim it is because if Mihawk can cut the one person no one can cut then there's not a defense that could stop his slashes. If no defense can stop his slashes then no one could beat him. It's taking your idea to it's conclusion point, just because you hear it out loud and realize it's ridiculous doesn't change what it is.
Firstly I said maybe, go back and check I never said WB 100% could cut him, I said there's a chance based on that translation everyone quotes but we don't know how that scar got there. Secondly WB being able is more believable than Mihawk for 2 reasons, Mihawk wasn't as strong as WB when he died and IF WB made that scar(which is unlikely) he did so at a younger age than MF WB. So IF the sole scar on Kaidou came from WB(younger than MF) and you believe Mihawk can also make a scar then you are claiming Mihawk's power = to a younger than MF WB. That's not true, Mihawk doesn't = WB and he definitely doesn't = younger WB.
I never said it could scar his skin. I said it could damage him. You kept saying if Mihawk can't cut him then there's no way to damage him. WB was only brought up to show you there's other ways to damage someone with unbreakable skin. Kaidou is essentially Luke Cage. As long as Luke's powers are up he can't be cut, beaten yes but not cut.
Again, if Mihawk is able to cut Kaidou then why have the Marines been unable to execute him? Until you can come up with an answer for that you're just blowing smoke. So unless/until you can explain why Mihawk was never brought in for an execution of Kaido the only answer is he was and failed.
You know what I'll meet you half way and admit that in the future of the story Oda can introduce some way to cut him but as of now there doesn't exist a way and if Mihawk is the answer then the Marines are just a joke for sentencing him to death only to fail multiple times when they had Mihawk to call on the whole time. Hell I'll even meet you a little further and say just because mihawk couldn't cut Kaidou doesn't mean I'm saying he couldn't hurt Kaidou. His slashes could have enough force to still damage Kaidou even without breaking his skin. If that's too difficult a concept, imagine a blade hitting a 10" thick metal plate you're holding, it won't cut you but it's gonna make you sore.
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chopstickchakra
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Chapter 795
Where it says he was captured by the Marines and Yonko. Was sentenced to death 40 times(this means by Marines AND Yonko(presumably) but everytime their blades,spears or chain broke. Mihawk being a tool for the Marines means there's no logical defense against the fact the Marines had Mihawk as a tool to execute Kaidou with.
Now I know you may not agree but let me lay out a scenario. Say the Marines only sentenced him to death 5 of those 40 times, after the first 3 failures(a blade, spear and chain to be fair) you start to see that your means won't kill this man so what do you do? Reach out to other tools you have at your disposal(Shichibukai) yet the Marines despite their numerous attempts(more than 5 really, I was lowballing to prove a point) were unable to kill Kaidou. How many times do you think Sengoku or the WG for that matter will let Marines keep failing at executing a pirate before they start bringing out big guns(Mihawk)? To assume the Marines went through all the trouble of repeatedly capturing him and trying to execute them yet never once attempting to use the greatest swordsman in the world to finish the job is beyond naïve.
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chopstickchakra
Active member
I finished typing the post you just replied to. I wanted to get it up there before someone tried to chime in with "he's lying"
Anyway see details above.
or below
"Where it says he was captured by the Marines and Yonko. Was sentenced to death 40 times(this means by Marines AND Yonko(presumably) but everytime their blades,spears or chain broke. Mihawk being a tool for the Marines means there's no logical defense against the fact the Marines had Mihawk as a tool to execute Kaidou with.
Now I know you may not agree but let me lay out a scenario. Say the Marines only sentenced him to death 5 of those 40 times, after the first 3 failures(a blade, spear and chain to be fair) you start to see that your means won't kill this man so what do you do? Reach out to other tools you have at your disposal(Shichibukai) yet the Marines despite their numerous attempts(more than 5 really, I was lowballing to prove a point) were unable to kill Kaidou. How many times do you think Sengoku or the WG for that matter will let Marines keep failing at executing a pirate before they start bringing out big guns(Mihawk)? To assume the Marines went through all the trouble of repeatedly capturing him and trying to execute him yet never once attempting to use the greatest swordsman in the world to finish the job is beyond naïve. "
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chopstickchakra
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You mean the argument Oda set? That argument? It might affect the argument if we knew anything about how or when or by whom it got there. The manga explicitly stated what broke against Kaidou's body, it mentions weapons. It never mentions anything about DF's. For all we know that scar isn't from a weapon which would bolster the Mihawk can't cut Kaidou stance. We don't know when the scar came about or if Kaidou has been impenetrable for ever. Also the argument wasn't that he can't be hurt, it's he can't be cut. His slashes could have enough force to still damage Kaidou even without breaking his skin. If that's too difficult a concept, imagine a blade hitting a 10" thick metal plate you're holding, it won't cut you but it's gonna make you sore. One more thing about that scar since you brought it up, show me another sword scar in OP that looks like that. That's definitely not a cut scar at best it's a puncture scar.
Do elaborate how it's ridiculous, because most people here just throw around the word ridiculous when they don't have a retort. You know what's ridiculous the idea that the Marines wouldn't exhaust every available resource in their multiple execution attempts. It's ridiculous to think a Yonko and his crew were unable to cut Kaidou but Mihawk can. It's ridiculous to just automatically assume Mihawk can cut something the author said wasn't able to be cut in thousands of torture sessions and at least 40 execution attempts. That's ridiculous.
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Your Creepy Stalker
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The only ridiculous thing is the idea that kaido is completely invincible. Even ignoring the scar, if he was utterly impossible to hurt, how the hell does he get captured over and over? clearly, the guy can be beaten in a fight, and if the guy who can cut giant glaciers in half without touching them cant even scratch him, he couldn't have been captured.
Plus, we haven't seen pecicely what kaido can do other than "Is huge, seems to be invincible, has a massive scar, and beat the piss out of Kidd". Thats not really enough to argue on.
- Sidenote, HOW THE HELL IS HE EVEN ALIVE? After capturing him, did nobody think of dropping him in a massive tank full of water and let him drown?
chopstickchakra
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Nobody said completely invincible where'd you get that from? I've said multiple times he can still receive damage and feel pains his skin just can't be broke like Luke Cage's. If you have an issue with that assessment take it up with Oda since those are the words he chose to use.
You can get trapped and not hurt are you seriously claiming those two things absolutely have to be connected? That's not even the issue though since nobody is saying he can't be hurt. Kaidou could be knocked out it would just take a Kaido level person to do so. Him being able to be knocked out or get his bones broken through force isn't the same as overcoming unbreakable skin though. Luke Cage has gotten concussions before because the impact on his head(iirc from a shotgun blast) damaged his skull and brain but it never broke the skin
not a shotgun but still feeling pain though not breaking skin, given Oda's expo on him Kaidou seems to be of a similar type
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The page literally says he was captured by Marines and Yonkou and every time they sentenced him to execution his body broke their tools. Let me reiterate, it says THEY sentenced him to death, it doesn't specify only the Marines or only the Yonko, no it says every time they, meaning both Yonko and Marines, tried to execute him it failed due to their weapons being unable to break the skin.
I'm not arguing about what Kaidou can do though, I'm arguing on behalf of the point made in the manga that the Marines and the Yonko who captured him have been unable to execute him because they have been unable to break his skin to kill him. People seem to think after 40 attempted executions that the most obvious answers wouldn't have been tried. Plus Jack can hold his breath for over a day(unless shown to be part fishman) so drowning Kaidou would take so long they'd probably have given up.
How is he alive? Because we don't know a single thing about him how do you even know he can die like that? Because it would kill regular people? Well that doesn't apply in fiction. The only thing shown so far that shows any real signs of counter to Kaidou is BM's fruit. We all expect Luffy and BM to come together in some form or another with Lola. Maybe somehow Luffy gets BM and Kaido in a fight(over Caesar) and BM takes out Kaidou so we Oda spares us all a myriad of "he/she shouldn't have been able to win" arguments?
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Your Creepy Stalker
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It was the way that everyone was debating whether mihawk could cut him, and most people saying no. Any evidence he actually feels pain? because currently all we know about him is that he is really hard to kill.
Precicely how are you meant to capture someone who nobody can injure? If the sky island fall didnt knock him out, how the hell could anyone else? Sure, whatever caused that scar would have done it, but he cant have been captured that way every time.
As for the imposiibility of execution, to paraphrase some guy from bleach "No matter how badass you are, if you are held underwater for long enough, you will die". Even if he was able to breath underwater, he would starve after a few days.
Either way, the debate is meant to be "Can Mihawk scratch Kaido", not "Just what the hell can kill Kaido?". The answer is yes, because if he cant even nick kaido, then what the hell did.
chopstickchakra
Active member
Any evidence he can be cut because all we know is he has a scar(that doesn't resemble a cut scar, which is a point no ones brought a counter for yet) He must be more than just hard to kill as well seeing as bad as he wants to die he's still alive when he could just drown himself so it seems drowning himself isn't an option either or he'd have done so already. I mean we all give Oda so much credit for his planning of the story right? So you wouldn't try to say Oda didn't think about having Kaidou drowning himself when he thought up this whole Kaidou wants to die but can't thing right?
First I never said he can't be injured, why do you two keep using the word injured? He can be injured just not cut I feel like I've said this 30 times, it's like you're purposefully using the wrong words just so you can argue your own points. Any you can catch him with traps, DF powers like Aokiji's and Caribou's(though you'd need to be way stronger than Caribou, I am not saying Caribou could trap him since I have to spell stuff like that out for you two so you won't misconstrue it)
Take it up with Oda that's what he wrote, he doesn't have to follow Kubo's Bleach logic, I'm not claiming to know what it would take to kill him I'm just claiming what the manga said that in 40 attempts they've been unsuccessful, you're gonna say Oda's making all 40 times the same thing? Please. That doesn't even make sense, "we tried killing you with a sword 15 times let's try one more" no they'd keep trying new things each time one failed so obviously he's been through some shit and survives. That's not the point anyway the reason I brought up the executions was to point out that even the other Yonko crews that caught him were unable to execute him by blade.
That's what I've been arguing the whole time, I've never once been arguing what it would take to kill Kaido Tosh and you keep bringing that up. You two seem to be confusing the point of mentioning the failed execution attempts. I'm not mentioning them as what would it take to kill him, I mention them as a point that the executions failed because his skin couldn't be broken. The manga said Kaidou couldn't be cut, the manga said the Marines tried to kill him by cutting him and failed. The Marines have Mihawk as a weapon, to assume they wouldn't have attempted to use him in the execution is dumb. If the Marines had Mihawk at their disposal and were still unable to execute Kaidou because they couldn't break his skin then by default that means Mihawk wasn't able to cut him.
Something stronger than Mihawk, you two act like that's an impossibility. The manga's not done, there's still more to learn. You say what the hell did as if it's impossible he fought with Roger in the past, if that turned out to be the case would it be unreasonable to assume Roger could do damage Mihawk couldn't? I don't think so.
ArabianLuffy
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chopstickchakra
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No he doesn't because there's other ways to hurt someone besides cutting them. Just because Mihawk wouldn't be able to cut him doesn't = him not being able to be hurt it just means his skin won't break, Mihawk's slashes could hurt him they just wouldn't break his skin and cut him they would deal impact damage though as the force hits him. Think of Kaidou as Luke Cage and it's easier to understand that he can be hurt and beaten and still remain un cut. All Mihawk not being able to cut him would mean is that no one would be able to cut him, which no one is arguing because that is a fact, if Mihawk can't cut him nobody can cut him but that doesn't mean that nobody can hurt him.
Punk Hazard
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Chopstick makes sense. You don't have to break the skin to cause pain. The impact from a slash might not break the skin, but it can rattle his internal organs enough to cause damage.
Lawlermelon
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chopstickchakra
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Why thank you, that's all I was trying to say.
Brilliant. I see why your so renowned for your wit among the base. I see you lurking, waiting for this reply, you can go home now no need to wait anymore.