[Discussion] Religion

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Wabbit

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Fast forward by 3 years (now 7 years old). Rebeled against the Church, became a science ambassador. This continued until 9th grade Where I was like "f*ck this shit! " science went from hard to understand to sci-fi with string theories, multiverses that can never be proven, multi-dimensions I lost hope in it, since it was no different from religion now etc.
Those theories are made by scientists, people with research experience with physics and mathematics and vast knowledge of our understanding of universe behind them.
While in religion, it is fanfic. It is like baby playing doctor :|
If you don't understand those complex theories, it should not matter. Somethings might be beyond your reach or capacity of humanity at this point. But still 20 or so years of life and your observation, there is enough empirical evidence to make you realize that you are not special even if you are illiterate.
 

Marin

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Why aren't you saying the same thing to the guy who said he was a Muslim since he was born?
Because:

1) he didn't claim all babies are born in a certain ideology (his notion was personal and vague therefore I didn't bother to decipher what he meant)
2) I'm not oblidged to go around the forum and point out the fallacies in everyone's reasoning. I only correct those who I see and who catch my interest
3) not saying that to him doesn't mean I agree with him, my point is you can't be born into any worldview, regardless of what it is

The definition of atheism disagrees with what you said.
You want to play the dictionaries? Guess what, the debate is still ongoing how to properly define atheism, therefore you have dictionaries offering both definitions:

"Atheism is, in the broadest sense, the absence of belief in the existence of deities.[1][2][3][4] Less broadly, atheism is the rejection of belief that any deities exist.[5][6] In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[1][2][7] Atheism is contrasted with theism,[8][9] which, in its most general form, is the belief that at least one deity exists.[9][10][11]"

"noun
1.
the doctrine or belief that there is no God.
2.
disbelief in the existence of a supreme being or beings."

"a : a disbelief in the existence of deity
b : the doctrine that there is no deity"






Atheism classifies as both, wether you like it or not. Regardless, the definition of it doesn't matter as for one to hold it they must first posess the lack of belief or disbelief. To not believe in something you first must know what that something is. For if you cannot conceive something you cannot make judgement on it. Newborns don't know god(s) therefore they are completely indifferent about the existence of god(s).

Babies are unable to hold any ideological/religious/political position or any other worldview because the very concept of worldviews is unknown to them. That's on par with saying that all plants or animals are atheists or that all inanimate objects are atheists. Guess what Joe, my chair's an atheist, and so is my computer - none of them believe in god.

It sounds ridiculous. Ideological positions (atheism being one of them) are reserved solely for individuals capable of comprehending them. To advance the dictionary game, here's what a worldview is:

"A comprehensive world view or worldview is the fundamental cognitive orientation of an individual or society encompassing the entirety of the individual or society's knowledge and point of view."

"the way someone thinks about the world"

"a particular philosophy of life or conception of the world."

"The overall perspective from which one sees and interprets the world.
2. A collection of beliefs about life and the universe held by an individual or a group. In both senses also called"






As per universal agreement, worldviews are reserved for individuals capable of thinking for themselves. Beings that cannot do so (newborns fall into this category) cannot have a worldview. Since a newborn's cognitive ability hasn't developed to the extent that it can possess a worldview your argument makes no sense.

The only thing you could say is that newborns don't belong to any religion and that is true. They don't belong to any religion nor any worldview or ideology in general, until they are initiated by someone else or their own action.

In short: newborns don't lack belief, but the ability to believe. Unless you want to redefine atheism as "lack of ability to hold a belief" you're better off dropping the notion.
 
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Ansatsuken

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Because:

1) he didn't claim all babies are born in a certain ideology (his notion was personal and vague therefore I didn't bother to decipher what he meant)
2) I'm not oblidged to go around the forum and point out the fallacies in everyone's reasoning. I only correct those who I see and who catch my interest
3) not saying that to him doesn't mean I agree with him, my point is you can't be born into any worldview, regardless of what it is
@Bold part. You're wise member here, Good :)

I dont know why people quoted my post that was actually my personal declaration. :mad:_@:

And had nothing to do with them or other people here.
 

Marin

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After some googling, I found this article on Lack of Belief :

What is your and everyone's else opinion on it?
The notion of lacking a belief in god is synonimus to saying "I don't believe in god". The meaning stays the same, regardless of different formulations of sentences.

As soon as one says they don't believe in god, they immediatelly take on an ideological position of not believing in god. Much like the article says, it's simply trying to fool the other side into accepting a storm of fallacies that serve as a follow up. Basically putting the dictionary in place of logic, forgetting that those very dictionaries were built upon logic.
 

ROHAN

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The notion of lacking a belief in god is synonimus to saying "I don't believe in god". The meaning stays the same, regardless of different formulations of sentences.

As soon as one says they don't believe in god, they immediatelly take on an ideological position of not believing in god. Much like the article says, it's simply trying to fool the other side into accepting a storm of fallacies that serve as a follow up. Basically putting the dictionary in place of logic, forgetting that those very dictionaries were built upon logic.
Ah, no wonder I thought the definition had a loophole! :sdo:

You are right, I knew he had misinterpreted the definition. :snick:
 

Deadlift

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@Bold part. You're wise member here, Good :)

I dont know why people quoted my post that was actually my personal declaration. :mad:_@:

And had nothing to do with them or other people here.
We're on the internet, and even if in this forum we're more or less all "virtual buddies", to talk positively about religion only brings attack on yourself.
 

Ansatsuken

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Ah, no wonder I thought the definition had a loophole! :sdo:

You are right, I knew he had misinterpreted the definition. :snick:
People like to misinterpreted something intentionally or unintentionally to benefit them/for their own benefit.

Happen in here, NDS, GD etc :snick:

But I once said,

"I see with my naked eyes without any Genjutsu what you did there"
:sdo:
 

Made in Heaven

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Same thing with the vegetarian, he will tell you "Because the taste of fruit and veg satisfy me with its deliciousness while I don't gain any weights meanwhile my meat eating friends are obese and have heart diseases risks. " etc.

That's the exact same thing my mother always tells me about her faith: "if you approach my belief and faith with logic there is no constructive thing that will result from that. You won't comprehend it"

That's I am the mess I am today: Science fails to explains, religion runs away from answers by giving you the "you won't comprehend it" card :coffee:
But doesn't that make sense? I mean, our eyes and ears can't see or hear everything, so isn't it just as reasonable to accept that our brains too are limited and that there will forever be some things that we will never be able to comprehend?
 

HashiraMadara

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Those theories are made by scientists, people with research experience with physics and mathematics and vast knowledge of our understanding of universe behind them.
While in religion, it is fanfic. It is like baby playing doctor :|
If you don't understand those complex theories, it should not matter. Somethings might be beyond your reach or capacity of humanity at this point. But still 20 or so years of life and your observation, there is enough empirical evidence to make you realize that you are not special even if you are illiterate.
I study a theory before discriminating against it :| don't make me brag. You the very person saying that statement I am sure never done anything beyond bachelors degree physics yet you're telling me "it's beyond me"...
When someone tells you he's bringing you information that was researched by "experienced men" means he knows nothing about science and its curriculum.

Go back to university, enrol your self in Honours and drop out and go to another university. You'll see something "trend/curriculum".

A physicist that lectures you specialise in a certain field in physics and defends certain theories. If he supports a "controversial" theory then he is either told to follow mainstream or get fired".
Why am I telling you this: Whatever scientist that spends over whatever years in his research, when he's "finished" with his theory he teaches it others in 1 f*cking presentation.


so go way BOY you clearly have no scientific knowledge :|:|:|:|:|:|
 

Marin

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That just doesn't make any literal sense...
How can one not believe in "Religion". That kills English in a sense.
You either believe in what religion says or not.

change you statement to "I don't believe religion"
It would be more appropriate to say "I don't follow any religion" if we're gonna be nazis.
 

HashiraMadara

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"Santa Claus is the idea of God, dumbed down for children. He sees all, if you are not good you get coal (go to hell), if you are good you get presents (go to heaven), and the idea is to keep you under control for the people in power (the parents)."


"And when you get a little older you learn that Santa is a mythological creation meant to teach lessons but not be taken literally. So... completely similar."



Interesting
interesting until you ask your self where the story of santa was taken :coffee:
 
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