[Discussion] At what difficulty can Roger defeat an admiral?

[xanonymosx]

lower end of high diff seems logical based on WB`s fight with sakazuki

 

[Punk Hazard]

lower end of high diff seems logical based on WB`s fight with sakazuki

You mean the fight where Whitebeard sneak attacked Akainu and didn't even defeat him? While being caught off-guard, Akainu was still able to take half of Whitebeard's face, and then he fell underground because Whitebeard destroyed the ground. The second fight was incomplete, neither man defeated the other, as Whitebeard could keep going and Akainu then burrowed underground and was able to keep on fighting.

Before you say Whitebeard did defeat Akainu, he didn't. What happened to Jozu, that's defeat.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Yeah except whitebeard wasn't fighting akainu in his prime or at 100%. Akainu didn't earn that first blow, whitebeard was left stunned due to his injuries and his age and akainu took advantage. The second fight put akainu and whitbeard on equal footing after WB's "sneak attack" Akainu got a blow major blow but he still lost, had he not fell in that hole he would be dead. WB still had enough fight to confront Blackbeard and almost win if it weren't for blackbeard entire crew.

Now lets imagine a prime and full condition whitebeard fighting an admiral, he wins mid-high diff. Rogers beats WB so therefore he takes admiral at mid-high diff.

And Akainu still had enough strength to face Crocodile, several of Whitebeard's commanders, and Jinbei.

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This was the entire fight. Even after taking a Quake punch and being forced into the ground, Akainu was still able to get right back up and attack Whitebeard sufficiently enough to take half of his face. If the ground below him hadn't been broken, Akainu would have been able to get back up and continue fighting Whitebeard. If one swing was able to take half of Whitebeard's face, another blow just like that would have killed him.

With his illness, Whitebeard wasn't able to deal any damage to Akainu, and instead got a magma fist straight to the chest. While a 100% Whitebeard with no illness would have fared much better, it's not nearly as much as you're saying. With his illness and old age affecting Whitebeard, Akainu was having no trouble at all, so a healthy and 100% Whitebeard would give him a lot more trouble, but it would not be mid or high diff.

 

[ssjelf]

And Akainu still had enough strength to face Crocodile, several of Whitebeard's commanders, and Jinbei.

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This was the entire fight. Even after taking a Quake punch and being forced into the ground, Akainu was still able to get right back up and attack Whitebeard sufficiently enough to take half of his face. If the ground below him hadn't been broken, Akainu would have been able to get back up and continue fighting Whitebeard. If one swing was able to take half of Whitebeard's face, another blow just like that would have killed him.

With his illness, Whitebeard wasn't able to deal any damage to Akainu, and instead got a magma fist straight to the chest. While a 100% Whitebeard with no illness would have fared much better, it's not nearly as much as you're saying. With his illness and old age affecting Whitebeard, Akainu was having no trouble at all, so a healthy and 100% Whitebeard would give him a lot more trouble, but it would not be mid or high diff.

That was the whole 2nd fight, this was the major part of the first

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Whitebeard took squardo's attack, was suffering from old age, had a hole punched through him by akainu, and took several stabs by marines then faced akainu. The "sneak attack" basically leveled the field. Akainu was hardly having "no trouble" lol. he got his ass kicked. Getting his face blasted off didn't slow him down one bit. Akainu went on to face a bunch of weakened commanders who had already been fighting for a long time and are weaker than blackbeard. While whitebeard faced a fully rested crew. A whitebeard facing akainu alone at 100% would destroy him. Prime whitebeard is even stronger. Akainu was beat, he didn't "escape" lol. That hole in the ground saved him. he was so paralyzed he couldn't stop himself from falling into it. One or two hits woulda finished him off but luck saved him. Andi like how you say akainu took no damage, the heck kinda logic is that?

My argument still stands. Do you really think that a prime WB can't beat akainu. A tired, old, and half dead WB at least stalemated him. Prime WB beats akainu at most high diff, Roger is stronger than WB so he does better, likely mid-diff to low tier of high-diff.

 

[Zeta42]

Roger could never defeat Prime Garp, but we don't know if he's ever gone all out against him. I say extreme diff.

 

[Olorin]

Roger was about as strong as WB, Garp and Sengoku aka 2 top pirates and 2 top Marines and Admirals are almost equal

When has anyone anywhere in OP said that the strongest pirate is the one single strongest character in One Piece?

Pirates arent the only faction

 

[ssjelf]

Roger was about as strong as WB, Garp and Sengoku aka 2 top pirates and 2 top Marines and Admirals are almost equal

When has anyone anywhere in OP said that the strongest pirate is the one single strongest character in One Piece?

Pirates arent the only faction

Consider that Roger is stronger than WB and WB 20+ years later was still labeled the strongest in the world. Comparing him to garp and sengoku was besides the point of this thread, it was simply comparing him to an admiral (I think this means Akainu, Kizaru, Aokiji, Fujitora)

 

[Anduril]

Consider that Roger is stronger than WB and WB 20+ years later was still labeled the strongest in the world. Comparing him to garp and sengoku was besides the point of this thread, it was simply comparing him to an admiral (I think this means Akainu, Kizaru, Aokiji, Fujitora)

Don't bother they don't understand logic.

 

[YellowFang]

I'd say medium difficulty at max...

Admirals aren't ******s, and that trio pre-TS were really strong...

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

There is no way anybody is defeating an Admiral any lower than high diff. No way.

Roger wins in a similar fashion as Luffy would win against Zoro

 

[Olorin]

Consider that Roger is stronger than WB and WB 20+ years later was still labeled the strongest in the world. Comparing him to garp and sengoku was besides the point of this thread, it was simply comparing him to an admiral (I think this means Akainu, Kizaru, Aokiji, Fujitora)

No way!! I had no idea who the admirals were, thanks man, I need to re-read One Piece

 

[silmarill]

High difficulty (mid)

 

[Bogard]

There is no way in hell the current generation of admirals can push Roger past mid difficulty

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

There is no way in hell the current generation of admirals can push Roger past mid difficulty

I'll have what you're having

 

[Bogard]

I'll have what you're having

I already explained multiple times why i believe that and i'm not gonna bother explaining it again. If you believe otherwise so be it, but you'd be contradicting the manga portrayal

 

[bajram]

It wouldnt make sense at all if prime Roger can beat admirals mid diff, going by that akainu is probably one of the final or pre-final enemies on this manga and if the guy wants to match luffy at final fight he has to go from being mid diffed to going in the same ballpark as PK and considering he is 50+ I dont see such growth anymore and for me he is already as strong as he is supposed to be.

Admirals being mid-diffed would make a joke of the current era, and a joke of the marines a group who is possibly the main end-game villain on the manga and the admirals are the fighters to be beaten.

For me high-extreme diff its pretty reasonable.

 

[Kamui Sama]

I agree with mid-diff if we are talking about the current gen, maybe the admirals during Roger's time were different (including Garp). A 70+ year old Whitebeard who was already in a bad state beat Akainu (granted with a lot of difficulty). Then there is Rayleigh, who much passed his prime was capable of holding of Kizaru and intercepting his speed.

Assuming Prime Roger is quite a bit stronger than current Rayleigh and >= Prime WB mid-diff seems fair. Then again, Akainu and the others may have gotten stronger post-TS so who knows

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

I already explained multiple times why i believe that and i'm not gonna bother explaining it again. If you believe otherwise so be it, but you'd be contradicting the manga portrayal

Manga portrayal dictates that Admirals still need to be a threat to Luffy when he is the Pirate King. The same would be the case for Roger. A mid diff victory would mean Luffy would be almost twice as strong as an Admiral - RIDICULOUS.

It wouldnt make sense at all if prime Roger can beat admirals mid diff, going by that akainu is probably one of the final or pre-final enemies on this manga and if the guy wants to match luffy at final fight he has to go from being mid diffed to going in the same ballpark as PK and considering he is 50+ I dont see such growth anymore and for me he is already as strong as he is supposed to be.

Admirals being mid-diffed would make a joke of the current era, and a joke of the marines a group who is possibly the main end-game villain on the manga and the admirals are the fighters to be beaten.

For me high-extreme diff its pretty reasonable.

Exactly right.

 

[silmarill]

High difficulty seems reasonable but not higher
Roger , Whitebeard and Garp were said to be equal to eachother so if any of them would fight it would be an extreme diff fight..
With admirals never receving that hype they should be 1 tier below

 

[Punk Hazard]

That was the whole 2nd fight, this was the major part of the first

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Whitebeard took squardo's attack, was suffering from old age, had a hole punched through him by akainu, and took several stabs by marines then faced akainu. The "sneak attack" basically leveled the field.

All the more reason the second fight doesn't count in the context that people are trying to use it in. You can't list all the reasons why Akainu coming out on top in the first fight isn't legitimate, then go on to say that that fight is in the same light as the second, as they ¨even out¨, then use the second fight as a legitimate reason as to why Whitebeard low diffs Akainu.

Akainu was hardly having "no trouble" lol. he got his ass kicked.

I was referring to the first fight. Akainu wasn't damaged at all there, nor did he struggle.

Getting his face blasted off didn't slow him down one bit.

And getting punched to the ground by Whitebeard didn't slow down Akainu either. He was able to get back up and immediately land a major blow despite being in pain.

Akainu went on to face a bunch of weakened commanders who had already been fighting for a long time and are weaker than blackbeard. While whitebeard faced a fully rested crew.

Spoiler

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The only people who we know are injured in this picture are Marco and Crocodile. While fighting for a while, there's no indication any of the others are injured enough so that their merit is gone. And what? No, Blackbeard is not stronger than all of Whitebeard's commanders, along with the tons of other pirates standing behind them. His measly crew, the majority of which couldn't even handle Ace, definitely aren't stronger than WB's commanders at that time.

A whitebeard facing akainu alone at 100% would destroy him. Prime whitebeard is even stronger. Akainu was beat, he didn't "escape" lol. That hole in the ground saved him. he was so paralyzed he couldn't stop himself from falling into it. One or two hits woulda finished him off but luck saved him. Andi like how you say akainu took no damage, the heck kinda logic is that?

You can't stop yourself from falling into a cavern when all of the ground around you is falling with you.

Spoiler

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As can clearly be seen here, the bottom of the cavern was filled with water. If Akainu was too paralyzed to move, he would have fell into the water and died. Instead, he was able to burrow into the ground while falling and travel through the earth. Akainu wasn't too ¨paralyzed to save himself¨, saving himself is exactly what he did.
What's said is that you really think a sickened, old Whitebeard can't defeat Akainu in two hits Lol

My argument still stands. Do you really think that a prime WB can't beat akainu. A tired, old, and half dead WB at least stalemated him. Prime WB beats akainu at most high diff, Roger is stronger than WB so he does better, likely mid-diff to low tier of high-diff.

When did I say that? A Prime Whitebeard can beat Akainu, and Akainu can beat a Prime Whitebeard, and it's gonna be high-diff on both ends. You have no argument. Your argument is ¨Old Whitebeard didn't die against Akainu and made a hole for him to fall in, so obviously he can defeat Akainu in two punches and Roger can do the same.¨

Manga portrayal dictates that Admirals still need to be a threat to Luffy when he is the Pirate King. The same would be the case for Roger. A mid diff victory would mean Luffy would be almost twice as strong as an Admiral - RIDICULOUS.



Exactly right.

Right? People here are severely underestimating Admirals. The strongest fighters within the Marines and defenders of the WG can't hold off the Pirate King? I don't buy it.