Obito's willpower vs Madara's willpower

maniaoqan

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Terms of will powers.

Obito=Naruto>BZ>Madara=Sasuke

Naruto and Obito had the will of fire and they resisted BZ.
Madara and Sasuke tried to do thing on their own and had similar path and they couldn't resisted BZ.
 

HiddenSound

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Terms of will powers.

Obito=Naruto>BZ>Madara=Sasuke

Naruto and Obito had the will of fire and they resisted BZ.
Madara and Sasuke tried to do thing on their own and had similar path and they couldn't resisted BZ.
It's possible but I don't want to believe that. The Will of Fire is such bullshit.
 

Lia

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@Viserys Targaryen
If you want to compare their willpower, then compare their status as a Jinchuuriki. Obito nearly lost himself and got destroyed by Juubi while Madara sealed the beast inside him, like it was the easiest thing in his life.
Obito had the "will of Rin", very fitting to be honest, and this is one of the biggest asspull-powers you can have in this (meanwhile) shitty manga.
 

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But instead he just sat there like an idiot while Black Zetsu talked. Is that really what you want to say?

As for your other point, you think the Juubi wanted to fight Madara? Don't be dumb.
The Juubi is Kaguya. The Juubi/Shinju can think. Kaguya wanted Madara to advance her plans as much as possible before taking control. So the Juubi didn't resist Madara. Simple stuff.

Because he SHOCKED.

You had it twisted around. Juubi is Kaguya's will, and its purpose is to bring back the Chakra inherited to her sons back. Black Zetsu is Kaguya's will, and its purpose is to formulate plans to bring her back. Both of them have different mindset.
 

AlphaScythian

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Some can quit smoking with will power alone others dont
 

Zavage10

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Six Paths Ten Tails Coffin Seal (六道十尾柩印, Rikudō Jūbi Kyūin)

↓ The top caption says that when it seemed that Madara was making Obito use Rinne Rebirth, Obito was actually weaving the sings for the Six Paths Ten Tails Coffin Seal.

Kekkei Genkai/Ninjutsu used by Obito and Madara. Taking the ten bodies of the tailed beasts into oneself, becoming a Jinchūriki and gaining their power. It goes on to say that it's difficult to control the tailed beasts and that this can cause the user to have a psychological collapse, and needs to either have a suitably strong force of will, either inherently or by finding one, in order to gain control. If they do that, they'll obtain the terrifying/astounding power of a "god that shapes the land."

→ The caster condenses and absorbs the ten tailed beasts into himself, awakening ("blossoming") their original power (本来の力, primal power, essential power).

↑ To acquire the power of the ten tailed beasts is the same as possessing the power of the Sage of Six Paths, so it is accompanied by the same Truthseeker Orbs.


Madara was able to do easily because of his will power and psychological strength. Not because of the bs kaguya will fanon nonsense that some have been spouting.
 

HiddenSound

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Because he SHOCKED.

You had it twisted around. Juubi is Kaguya's will, and its purpose is to bring back the Chakra inherited to her sons back. Black Zetsu is Kaguya's will, and its purpose is to formulate plans to bring her back. Both of them have different mindset.
No. A guy like Madara wouldn't sit there doing nothing because he was "surprised". He did nothing because he couldn't do anything. Black Zetsu was too much for him, and as others said it was probably because Kaguya was resonating within him.

Both are Kaguya.
 

HiddenSound

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@Viserys Targaryen
If you want to compare their willpower, then compare their status as a Jinchuuriki. Obito nearly lost himself and got destroyed by Juubi while Madara sealed the beast inside him, like it was the easiest thing in his life.
Obito had the "will of Rin", very fitting to be honest, and this is one of the biggest asspull-powers you can have in this (meanwhile) shitty manga.
As I said before, why would Kaguya, the Juubi, stop Madara from absorbing her? She wanted Madara as a vessel, which is why she offered no resistance.
And I wasn't necessarily comparing their willpower at all. That's what others did. I wanted to know why Obito could resist BZ while near death and Madara couldn't at his strongest. I wasn't comparing the two.
 

Zavage10

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As I said before, why would Kaguya, the Juubi, stop Madara from absorbing her? She wanted Madara as a vessel, which is why she offered no resistance.
And I wasn't necessarily comparing their willpower at all. That's what others did. I wanted to know why Obito could resist BZ while near death and Madara couldn't at his strongest. I wasn't comparing the two.

The databook says that ease of using the the juubi jin seal depends on willpower. It has nothing to do with Kaguya's intentions.
 

Zavage10

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becoming a Jinchūriki and gaining their power. It goes on to say that it's difficult to control the tailed beasts and that this can cause the user to have a psychological collapse, and needs to either have a suitably strong force of will, either inherently or by finding one, in order to gain control.
 

HiddenSound

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The databook says that ease of using the the juubi jin seal depends on willpower. It has nothing to do with Kaguya's intentions.
Someone else also said the databook stated BZ was syncing with Kaguya when he stabbed Madara. Therefore Kaguya would've been aware when Madara absorbed her and would've offered no resistance as she did with Obito.
 

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No. A guy like Madara wouldn't sit there doing nothing because he was "surprised". He did nothing because he couldn't do anything. Black Zetsu was too much for him, and as others said it was probably because Kaguya was resonating within him.

Both are Kaguya.

Except Madara is exactly that type of guy. He seen the potential of the 8th Gates and went on acknowledging how Gai was close to killing him, yet did nothing before Gai making his attack to stop him. Just like how he was surprised to see Naruto growing more powerful after reversing the side-effects of the 8th Gates. In this case, he's surprised Black Zetsu betrayed him. If he knew his intentions, Black Zetsu wouldn't even touch him let alone transmit his will. You're comparing both cases, where Obito knew and Madara was ignorant about it. It's simple as that. And like the databook said, Madara has more powerful will than Obito.

They have Kaguya's mindset, doesn't mean they are Kaguya herself, because they're not.
 

Darth Uchiha

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Obito had to go through an entire phase where the Juubi was ripping apart his Mind and Physche while Madara never had to go through that.

The reason may be more complex than you realize. Madara and Kaguya's goals more or less aligned with each other, and Madara made the perfect vessel, it's likley that the Juubi simply chose not to fight Madara, unlike Obito.
 

HiddenSound

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Except Madara is exactly that type of guy. He seen the potential of the 8th Gates and went on acknowledging how Gai was close to killing him, yet did nothing before Gai making his attack to stop him. Just like how he was surprised to see Naruto growing more powerful after reversing the side-effects of the 8th Gates. In this case, he's surprised Black Zetsu betrayed him. If he knew his intentions, Black Zetsu wouldn't even touch him let alone transmit his will. You're comparing both cases, where Obito knew and Madara was ignorant about it. It's simple as that. And like the databook said, Madara has more powerful will than Obito.

They have Kaguya's mindset, doesn't mean they are Kaguya herself, because they're not.

That's insane. While Black Zetsu was monologuing Madara wasn't doing a thing. You say it's because he was surprised and only that. No Limbo, no Shinra Tensei, no Ash Fire Jutsu... just "UH UH UH UH". Countless battles and he just shits himself there because of a betrayal?
That makes him stupid.

I came to a decent conclusion earlier, I don't care about whatever else you have to say.
 

Zavage10

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The reason may be more complex than you realize. Madara and Kaguya's goals more or less aligned with each other, and Madara made the perfect vessel, it's likley that the Juubi simply chose not to fight Madara, unlike Obito.

Sigh that's not the reason...
 

Angelic.

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thing is, unless the juubi is stupid, theres no reason for it to fight madara if it wants to be revived as kaguya. so madaras strong willpower is irrelevant in the face of bzs plan lol
 

HiddenSound

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thing is, unless the juubi is stupid, theres no reason for it to fight madara if it wants to be revived as kaguya. so madaras strong willpower is irrelevant in the face of bzs plan lol

Exactly .
 

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That's insane. While Black Zetsu was monologuing Madara wasn't doing a thing. You say it's because he was surprised and only that. No Limbo, no Shinra Tensei, no Ash Fire Jutsu... just "UH UH UH UH". Countless battles and he just shits himself there because of a betrayal?
That makes him stupid.

I came to a decent conclusion earlier, I don't care about whatever else you have to say.

First off, he didn't go ''uhhh...''. He questioned Black Zetus that what is he doing, and how he is supposed to be his will. Then he goes by saying he couldn't move. Black Zetsu was disturbing his Chakra, most likely, by transforming him to Kaguya. That's why Limbo disappeared. But if you want to play this game, tell me why didn't Obito resist Black Zetsu from this point, [ ]?

You care enough to make a thread and question people's views, as well as reply to me.
 

BlacLord™

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Obito was aware and not punched through the lung, nor was he having the chakra of all shinobi in the worldwide Jukai Koutan forced into him.

The punch through the lung would have caused pmeunothorax and a panic attack (considering he wouldn't have expected) which leads to him vastly physically weakened and we know that you need stamina to mould and use chakra.
 
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