So basically, Sasuke wants to kill the innocent for the sake of symbolism?!

[TrollKing]

They are innocent when the people they killed were the people who started attacking them first. Kurama was only an embodiment of hatred because humanity treated him so poorly. Other murders were the result of people controlling the bijuus like Madara and Obito. It is humanity that is at fault. Not the bijuus. Therefore, fixing humanity would solve something. Killing bijuus would not.



That is why I said most of them (referring to the current 5 Kages that is). What did Gaara do? What did Tsunade do? What did Mei do?

Being a large creature and allow hatred takes over = killing many innocents

To be fair, the production of psychopath rapist murderers and scammers are all the fault of humanity. Biju turned out as murderous and as hateful(more hateful) as human

 

[chaos control]

No kages r innocent they haven't done anything wrong

Spoiler

the one dat odered kidnapping of hyuga and his kidnapping ofkushina got butthurt over 9000 for his brothers kidnapping drama

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

Most of those akautski members left their villages before their current Kages came into power. Sasori left under the reign of Gaara's dad. Kisame left under Yagura's (Obito's) reign. Itachi, Obito and Orochimaru under Hiruzen's. Hidan and Kakazu aren't from the 5 nations. Neither are Nagato and Konan. Deidara is the only one who left under the reign of a current kage and I did say most of the Kages after all. I did not say all of them. Onoki and Ay have some blame.

 

[Ansatsuken]

The previous Kages that did start the problems are dead at this point. Everybody is an individual, so the current kages' existences is not linked to the folly of their predecessors and therefore the problems of the world can not be attributed to them.

What about the situation between China, S.Korea and Japan

I'm sure if political peoples or general of army of this countries having their own superhuman power, we will see they will attacking Japan to destroyed it although current generations of Japan is innocent and not having anything over their past peoples deed

 

[SasukeTheViper EMS]

The previous Kages that did start the problems are dead at this point. Everybody is an individual, so the current kages' existences is not linked to the folly of their predecessors and therefore the problems of the world can not be attributed to them.

Did you even read my post? I very much acknowledged that they are not directly responsible for the faults of the system; however, they are still a very major (read: acting) part of it.

Also, some would argue that Ōnoki, for one, is not exactly "innocent."

 

[BLAZE]

Most of those akautski members left their villages before their current Kages came into power. Sasori left under the reign of Gaara's dad. Kisame left under Yagura's (Obito's) reign. Itachi, Obito and Orochimaru under Hiruzen's. Hidan and Kakazu aren't from the 5 nations. Neither are Nagato and Konan. Deidara is the only one who left under the reign of a current kage and I did say most of the Kages after all. I did not say all of them. Onoki and Ay have some blame.

some blame really Tsuchikage started 3rd worl war so whats ur point :|
Gaara was mass murderer,Mei was ready to kill Sasuke becoz he holded sharingan[dat hatred] and do i need to say about the Will of BS konaha

 

[chaos control]

The same Ninshuu dat no one uses even Ashura's transmigrants use Ninjutsu dat Hagoromo despised
yeh hid away in Dreamworld
what Nagato said was the best
and this post



Every Kage is Sucking there predecessors so called Will of Bull$#!t pretty hard :|

1. Yes a dreamworld. I don't know why you people look down on it so much besides that white zetsu thing. The genjutsu is permanent (disregarding zetsu transformation) which means it is everlasting peace. The tree was thought to keep you alive forever and everyone can have everything they want, which eliminates hierarchy amongst humanity and suffering due to uncontrollable factors that would always exist in the real world. That whole, "It's running away" excuse is just purely illogical and idiotic.

2. Will is fine. That is just philosophy. It is not the same as kidnapping little girls and sealing monsters in them (like with Rin).

 

[BLAZE]

1. Yes a dreamworld. I don't know why you people look down on it so much besides that white zetsu thing. The genjutsu is permanent (disregarding zetsu transformation) which means it is everlasting peace. The tree was thought to keep you alive forever and everyone can have everything they want, which eliminates hierarchy amongst humanity and suffering due to uncontrollable factors that would always exist in the real world. That whole, "It's running away" excuse is just purely illogical and idiotic.

2. Will is fine. That is just philosophy. It is not the same as kidnapping little girls and sealing monsters in them (like with Rin).

1. :| yeh Humanity should run away for more shortcuts of peace
2.it is a kind Nationalism dat causes conflict between nations

 

[Ansatsuken]

some blame really Tsuchikage started 3rd worl war so whats ur point :|
Gaara was mass murderer,Mei was ready to kill Sasuke becoz he holded sharingan[dat hatred] and do i need to say about the Will of BS konaha

Yeah because of that they getting schooled by Edo Madara. But Kishi keep them alive

 

[Rekudakune]

Sasuke wants to eliminate the past as he said today. Now we know that he can't literally do that, so the only other option is symbolically. Apart of eliminating the past consists of killing the 5 Kages according to Sasuke. This includes Gaara who logically couldn't have been at all responsible for the world's past conflicts considering that he wasn't even born! This includes Tsunade who wasn't even a kage during the past conflicts and therefore had no political power. This includes Mei who is young as well and probably wasn't a kage either. (Onoki and Ay are the only exceptions). Other than those two, the rest of the Kages are innocent.

Yet Sasuke wants to kill them so that he can symbollically eliminate the past?!!!

Even if he kills them so that there are no political figures to get in his way of taking over the world, it all ends once Sasuke dies and the world goes back to fighting! The infinite tsukuyomi is permanent!

Then there are also the bijuus. The innocent bijuus who only ever attacked when they were either being controlled or when shinobi came and attacked/provoked them first! Just for the sake of symbolism?!

Even if you argue that the nations have fought wars over the bijuus, eliminating the bijuus still won't stop the nations from fighting over land, natural resources, forbidden jutsus, kekkei genkai (such as the Hyuuga's byakugan during the Hyuuga affair), money, etc... Let us not forget that the Naruto world still does have real world issues (as evidenced by the first Kazekage asking Hashirama for some of Konoha's valuable land). Therefore, all that killing the bijuus will accomplish is killing 9 innocent creatures!

If you argue that killing them would prevent infinite tsukuyomi from ever happening again, he could also destroy his own rinnegan and then seal himself up forever so that nobody can gain access to Indra's chakara and obtain the rinnegan and summon the mazou and revive the juubi. Sacrificing yourself is a lot nobler than sacrificing other innocent people.

Yet Sasuke wants to kill the innocent just for symbolism?!

Sasuke also wants to kill Naruto just because he considers Naruto a friend?! Once again, that is just killing a innocent guy for the sake of symbolism!

Finally (and the worst part of all), Sasuke is just like Naruto in that he has no actual solution to the world's problems!! He just said in today's chapter, "I will bear all the hatred alone and come up with solutions to the world's problems".

Ever since the Pain arc, Naruto has been saying stuff like "I'll bear the burden and find a way to peace". That is basically the same thing that Sasuke is saying except Sasuke wants to do it alone. That is the only difference (that and the fact that Naruto's version doesn't involve killing the innocent for symbolism).

Both of them keep saying "I will find a way" basically. That means that they don't really have definitive solutions! Now they are only 17, so that is fine, or at least it would be fine if you weren't planning on killing innocent people for the sake of a peace that you don't even have a definitive strategy to obtain! Symbolism alone will not bring peace no matter how much "eliminating the past" you do.

Imagine if someone came to you and said, "let me kill you so that I can cure all diseases". You may ask, "How will killing me help cure all diseases?". Then they say, "I don't know, but I will think of a way in which it helps".

Would that really sound logical or acceptable to you?

Conclusion: Sasuke is planning on killing the innocent for the sake of symbolism and a peace that he has no definitive strategy to obtain!

P.S. Before anyone goes shouting out "Naruto doesn't have a plan either" or something like that, I already stated this within the thread (so don't call me a Sasuke hated or a Naruto fanboy).

sasuke is going to marry karin and have a son whos going to be the next hokage, thats my manga predictions

 

[AlphaScythian]

Which one of them is innocent again?
Tsunade who, is alcoholic gambler that killed lots in war?
Gaara, who slaughtered in mother's name?
Mei, who is delusional and threatens to kill cuz she0s hearing stuff?
Ohnoki ,who lived thought 3 wars and used to rent akatsuki?
Or ever enraged Ay who sure killed something too?

 

[chaos control]

some blame really Tsuchikage started 3rd worl war so whats ur point :|
Gaara was mass murderer,Mei was ready to kill Sasuke becoz he holded sharingan[dat hatred] and do i need to say about the Will of BS konaha

1. People were trying to kill Gaara, so it was self defense. Also, Sasuke is a mass murderer too. (Those fodder samurai, Danzou and his attempted murder of Bee).

2. Mei didn't try to kill him because he had sharingan. She tried to kill him because he attacked the 5 kage summit.

3. Yes I said some blame actually admitting that Onoki had fault. Ay does too.

 

[Ansatsuken]

Which one of them is innocent again?

Tsunade is innocent.

 

[chaos control]

Which one of them is innocent again?

All of them except for Onoki and Ay.

 

[BLAZE]

Yeah because of that they getting schooled by Edo Madara. But Kishi keep them alive

They should grow some b@lls and start the real peace stability thing rather than keep on blabbering my will of BS this my will of BS dat and do something about Child Soldier thing

1. People were trying to kill Gaara, so it was self defense. Also, Sasuke is a mass murderer too. (Those fodder samurai, Danzou and his attempted murder of Bee).

2. Mei didn't try to kill him because he had sharingan. She tried to kill him because he attacked the 5 kage summit.

3. Yes I said some blame actually admitting that Onoki had fault. Ay does too.

1.Gaara was feared mass murderer in his village :| and all shinobi's r killers
2.Ok i agree it was for her hate towards Akatsuki

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

3.U r hanging to some fault while he is the one caused a whole war

 

[AlphaScythian]

All of them except for Onoki and Ay.

Yeah, look at edit lmao

 

[chaos control]

1. :| yeh Humanity should run away for more shortcuts of peace
2.it is a kind Nationalism dat causes conflict between nations

1. It is better than making a teen who has no actual solution the world's dictator just for the "peace " to end when he dies. Also, tell me what killing the Kages and bijuus will do about people fighting over land and money.
Infinite tsukuyomi solves it all forever.

2. No, the will just means to never give up. The nations probably don't even know about the other nations' will philosophy. Besides, the leaf and the stone are the only ones with stated wills (will of fire and stone will). I never heard of a will of water or a will of sand or a cloud will.

 

[Ansatsuken]

They should grow some b@lls and start the real peace stability thing rather than keep on blabbering my will of BS this my will of BS dat and do something about Child Soldier thing

Yes they actually should create a treaty for united Nation that work for peace for all NV. Like our world that manage to stop the world war atlast and achieve unity, how many world war they need to create in NV.

That what I failed to see or read in the mind of all Gokage here. I hope after this they must understand about world wide organization and interest not just country wide organization and interest.

They can't put all thing on the shoulder of either Naruto or Sasuke here, because they just only will lead Konoha only not other countries.

But like our world beside it flaw of some organisation, but still able to achieve peace for a long time, put aside the current war that happen but we glad that world war is still not happening and we can live in harmony. And that what NV should follow. make a treaty and sign it, ban all activities related to war and if not to far ban the countries that prone to going war from creating or building arm force or armament like Japan

That some from me

 

[BLAZE]

1. It is better than making a teen who has no actual solution the world's dictator just for the "peace " to end when he dies. Also, tell me what killing the Kages and bijuus will do about people fighting over land and money.
Infinite tsukuyomi solves it all forever.

2. No, the will just means to never give up. The nations probably don't even know about the other nations' will philosophy. Besides, the leaf and the stone are the only ones with stated wills (will of fire and stone will). I never heard of a will of water or a will of sand or a cloud will.

1.U r the one misguided who thinks Sasuke wants peace or world peace.Stable system does not means bolded
2.So they follow there predecessor Kages bull$#!t.The r clinging to past thing a system that has created 4 massive wars in its existance all becoz ever villages selfish intrests

Yes they actually should create a treaty for united Nation that work for peace for all NV. Like our world that manage to stop the world war atlast and achieve unity, how many world war they need to create in NV.

That what I failed to see or read in the mind of all Gokage here. I hope after this they must understand about world wide organization and interest not just country wide organization and interest.

They can't put all thing on the shoulder of either Naruto or Sasuke here, because they just only will lead Konoha only not other countries.

But like our world beside it flaw of some organisation, but still able to achieve peace for a long time, put aside the current war that happen but we glad that world war is still not happening and we can live in harmony. And that what NV should follow. make a treaty and sign it, ban all activities related to war and if not to far ban the countries that prone to going war from creating or building arm force or armament like Japan

That some from me

clearly agreed +rep

 

[SasukeTheViper EMS]

Yes they actually should create a treaty for united Nation that work for peace for all NV. Like our world that manage to stop the world war atlast and achieve unity, how many world war they need to create in NV.

If you think we've managed to stop war and achieve peace and unity in the real world, then you are either wholly oblivious or just kidding yourself.

 

[KingHashirama]

1 problem, Naruto does have a plan.