Communism

[KillerbYo]

But if you look at it in asmaller perspectivelike a group of people, and they havecommunism they all helå eachother and do what is necesary to get things going, would itstill be worth it if it actually worked?

 

[Kisturb]

Join the organization? You mean the party?

Like I have always said. Communism is the perfect government for the perfect people that make the perfect decisions at the perfect time for the perfect reasons. Unfortunately humans are far from perfect so it can never work for us. If you had a society of Machines then communism might work since they do everything for logical reasons.

I agree.

Wow, I was somehow wanting someone from china/north korea here to debate, although I wasn't expecting one...

I don't live in china, so you know stuff from there better than me...

But I ask you, what happens if there's a group of people that are against the government ideas?

Believe it or not, it will be nothing if it's not serious.If the government's idea is actually wrong or the government treats people badly, people can call reporter for help or send a piece of weibo (Chinese twitter) to show what they encountered to be supported, which may forces the government to change the order. China is really democracy now. But you can never wish the Political mode in USA happens in China.

 

[Stencil]

Communism never has and never will work. It has been tested by many countries and look where it brought them. There is always a leader and no one will ever have to do anything because in Communism the governments takes everything away from the people and gives them back what they need when they need it. So theoretically they will never need to work and the economy will eventually crash.

Okay I thought this thread died but w/e. Anyway, that's not actually true at all. Communism has actually worked very well up until the leader has done something/is doing something wrong. All the countries that have had communism worked at the start, but because they were led by insane, maniac leaders, it always went to shit. Furthermore, who says that democracy works? Every country is in debt by a lot, I mean a lot, and they're going down one by one. Greece, Italy, Spain just to name a few European ones. The U.S is getting itself $50k more debt every second, the U.K has lost its triple A economic rating and so on.

You can see a correlation between the two though. Communism: Brutality & leadership. Democracy: Economy. However they both don't have to have those tags.

 

[King-Panda]

I agree.



Believe it or not, it will be nothing if it's not serious.If the government's idea is actually wrong or the government treats people badly, people can call reporter for help or send a piece of weibo (Chinese twitter) to show what they encountered to be supported, which may forces the government to change the order. China is really democracy now. But you can never wish the Political mode in USA happens in China.

Sounds way too easy, but if you say so okay... If the reporter would be willing to do so, and a single one would be able to have a great influence okay

Okay I thought this thread died but w/e. Anyway, that's not actually true at all. Communism has actually worked very well up until the leader has done something/is doing something wrong. All the countries that have had communism worked at the start, but because they were led by insane, maniac leaders, it always went to shit. Furthermore, who says that democracy works? Every country is in debt by a lot, I mean a lot, and they're going down one by one. Greece, Italy, Spain just to name a few European ones. The U.S is getting itself $50k more debt every second, the U.K has lost its triple A economic rating and so on.

You can see a correlation between the two though. Communism: Brutality & leadership. Democracy: Economy. However they both don't have to have those tags.

It's immortal....

I think democracy is still better... There are many debates, there isn't absolute power, there are other parties that influence them when they got a good idea, etc....

I don't think people have many freedom in communist countries

 

[ZK]

I don't think people have many freedom in communist countries

Why can't I hold all these freedoms?
Could you define what you see as 'Communism', please?

 

[Aim64C]

Why can't I hold all these freedoms?
Could you define what you see as 'Communism', please?

The reason freedom doesn't work in communism is exactly as I described, earlier.

How many girls want to become an actress?

In an ideal communist society, they could become an actress and have everything they need to live.

In a realistic communist society, there are not enough hair stylists to take care of the actresses, enough waitresses to feed the crowds of spectators, and far too many bar tenders trying to pick up on actresses.

In order to get around this, one must set up a sort of planned economy. You set a quota for how many workers of each variety are needed for a given population size, and you 'lock' people into a range of jobs they can fill (and fill those jobs according to the needs of the nation).

This is precisely how the military works. "Needs of the Navy" is the ultimate clause in your contract that means you will serve when and where they need you. If you're an especially adept person when you enlist - you get treated fairly well (they let you pick what you want to do - because they want people who will become technical experts in the field and serve a long tour of duty in that capacity); if you're average... you fill out a dream sheet and find out where a computer places you.

It doesn't work nearly as well as its proponents like to think. You get paid the same whether you put pride and professionalism into your work, or not. True - time in rate and promotions tend to go to those who work hard... but they also go to those with a good set of knee-pads. Further complicating the issue is that people will be promoted simply by virtue of "we need more people of a higher rank." I have, literally, seen people advanced to the next highest rank and pay-grade because they filled out their name correctly on the exam portion of the advancement process. They were among the lowest scoring percentiles the previous three advancement cycles and don't contribute much to the overall productivity of the unit.

I've seen entire shops over-report their man-hours and fluff some paperwork to make it look like they are working far more dilligently than they are. They get rewarded with additional manpower (because the paperwork says they are swamped). In reality, they are kicking it in the A/C and making up virtually every number they put into systems like NALCOMIS/OOMA - which are attempts at better oversight, but realistically fail with the lack of strong business-minded Staff and Senior NCOs (and officer ranks).

Then you run into troubles with introducing new innovations.

Who gets access to the next iPhone, first? Or does commu-Apple need to run up an inventory large enough to service the whole population?

Who gets 4G service first?

If I come out with a computer that uses an interface A, and someone else comes out with an interface B, and yet another with interface C... what motive do I have to conform to interface C if I get paid the same regardless of how well my computers sell (because most monitors are using interface C)?

That's where communism works on the small tribal structure levels. What is produced and consumed is done so within a tightly knit social unit that can adequately monitor each other for abuse of the system... and what is produced in the community is intended only for use within that community (and perhaps a few travelers passing through - and there would usually be a bartering process involved for such things - even if, in the olden days, information/news was the commodity exchanged) - it's unlikely that you're going to have three different blacksmiths producing assemblies that are mutually incompatible with each other. If someone was being the belligerant, they'd probably find the carpenter less willing to work on their home and the farmers a little more guarded about how much his family was consuming.

Communism falls apart on the larger scale of things. It is too easy for people to utilize the benefit of the doubt to prey upon the system. Which is why bartering has always been the natural system of exchange when dealing with people outside of your immediate social network.

 

[Kisturb]

Sounds way too easy, but if you say so okay... If the reporter would be willing to do so, and a single one would be able to have a great influence okay



It's immortal....

I think democracy is still better... There are many debates, there isn't absolute power, there are other parties that influence them when they got a good idea, etc....

I don't think people have many freedom in communist countries

There is no contradiction between freedom and communist country. What is the "democracy" you mean? Many debates may lead to inefficiency. I dare say that people in China mustn't insult the state in public but it doesn't mean there is such an absolute power. In the way which you don't like, the country can concentrate most attention on constructive tasks which is the most important to a developing country.

By the way, the political mode of the North Korea is really awful I think.

 

[King-Panda]

There is no contradiction between freedom and communist country. What is the "democracy" you mean? Many debates may lead to inefficiency. I dare say that people in China mustn't insult the state in public but it doesn't mean there is such an absolute power. In the way which you don't like, the country can concentrate most attention on constructive tasks which is the most important to a developing country.

By the way, the political mode of the North Korea is really awful I think.

North Korea is about to be "extinguished", will become just a hole

 

[Kisturb]

North Korea is about to be "extinguished", will become just a hole

How much can you understand what I say? I'm afraid my English is not standard to express myself presicely. XD I'm just studying in a senior high school now.

 

[King-Panda]

How much can you understand what I say? I'm afraid my English is not standard to express myself presicely. XD I'm just studying in a senior high school now.

I understood everything you said, was just saying

 

[Black Diamond]

democracy is the most effective atm I'd say