Nagato or BM Naruto?

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How could nagato not beat naruto. Nagato was beating him while he was fighting bee and itachi.
All BM narutos attacks are chakra based, they can be absorbed, it doesn't help naruto any because all nagatos attack are at full power since he is not using 6 different bodies. The only chance naruto has is his speed, which can be both intercepted and blocked.
 
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How could nagato not beat naruto. Nagato was beating him while he was fighting bee and itachi.
All BM narutos attacks are chakra based, they can be absorbed, it doesn't help naruto any because all nagatos attack are at full power since he is not using 6 different bodies. The only chance naruto has is his speed, which can be both intercepted and blocked.
Nagato doesn't have a chance in hell at reacting to Naruto's body flicker.

Bijudama arguably can't be absorbed.


Nagato vs Naruto with Bee and Itachi is hardly even an example of Nagato being able to beat Naruto.

Nor does Nagato have an awnser for frog song.
 

HadouKage

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KCM Naruto has received ZERO damage from prime nagato's shinra tensei, banshou tennin can easily be resisted by chakra arms. And he has to consciously use these techniques and thus would not be able to use them against an attack that he can't even perceive/react to.
In case you haven’t noticed, Shinra Tensei and Basho Tenin can be used at different scales and magnitudes. And when have we seen Nagato in his prime? You have absolutely no proof to back up this statement. Kabuto controlling Nagato without knowing about his abilities does not make Nagato prime


Once again, Nagato was barely able to react to V2 Bee's blitz which is why he was only able to activate preta path AFTER the attack made contact with him. BM naruto is tiers faster than V2 bee, nagato can't even react to naruto's speed, and thus preta path in no way absorbs naruto's chakra cloak when he blitzes nagato's head off. And naruto doesn't even have to make contact with nagato, he can slit his throat with a kunai instead.

Anyway bottom line is, by that feat, nagato in no way is reacting to naruto's blitz. .
You have proof?


preta path is CONSCIOUSLY activated by nagato, he has to first react to an attack then use preta path. Preta path does not authomatically spawn when an attack makes contact with nagato despite nagato not reacting to said attack. .
Again, do you have proof?

Oh really? So if I can show you a pure chakra attack that comes into contact with nagato and that is not only not absorbed by preta path, but damages nagato himself, will you concede this point? .
Yes I will, please show me


if you have no counterarguments, then it is a concession on your part, and thus I accept your concession on all the points that the post you have not responded to have made. .
I’m doing nothing of the sort, re-read the manga if you want to see what happened

really? So you promise that you will concede the argument if I show you a scan of a chakra attack damaging nagato after coming into contact with him? .
Stop twisting my words, I said show me proof where the Gakido could not absorb chakara


Gakido is in no way an antiblitzing tool, it is a defensive jutsu that is activated after Nagato reacts to an attack, if the attack is fast enough to blitz him before he can either react or put up preta path, then he will sustain damage from that attack. .
Facepalm. If everyone has chakara, how is it not an anti blitzing tool? As you can see Bee’s V@ blitz failed after Nagato sucked his chakara


Nagato only putting up preta path after he gets hit with lariat means that he was only able to put preta path up until after he was hit, which means that any attack that is faster than bee's lariat will hit nagato and he won't be able to put up preta path against it. Preta path is NOT activated as a reaction to nagato getting hit, it's activated by nagato consciously using the technique. .
Again, you are doing nothing but supporting my claim


All of those sensing feats are irrelevant as they have nothing to do with perceiving and reacting to extremely fast blitzing attacks. And Kabuto not knowing how to use nagato is irrelevant to Nagato's own displayed reactions. Nagato explicitly was unable to react to totsuka. .
WHAT? Seriously bro, are you a troll? If his sensing ability was irrelavent then how was he able to sense Amateratsu? Kabuto not knowing how to use Nagato is not irrelevant. Nagato did not display his own reactions. You have no proof (yet again to back your claims)


concession accepted as you are strawmanning my argument and feigning ignorance. Sasuke was absolutely NOT able to keep up with V2 ei even with his sharingan, he couldn't even track ei's shunshin, and nagato's rinnegan holds none of the sharingan's precognitive abilities. .
Rinnegan has shared vision which in some cases are > than Sharigans (however that’s subjective). And that’s how Sasuke was able to keep up with most ninja’s attacks. Seriously, do you read the manga?





, i don't even know what you bolded as your quotes got messed up.
You exclaimed Naruto was at 7% of his chakara, You got proof along with your other illogical fallicies?



That's completely and utterly irrelevant as you specifically were asserting and trying to back up the assertion that Deva path and ONLY deva path "wrecked" SM Naruto, and then used a scan of deva path beating BASE Naruto as evidence to support your assertion. That is explicit dishonesty on your part.
And with this post, you are blatantly attacking a strawman by bringing up how much stronger a full power Pain is than Pain arc Naruto is in order to try and dishonestly trick me into debating you about a completely different point.
I have no qualms about Pein arc Naruto being weaker than full power Pein, however I once again repeat that is absolutely NOT what you were trying to argue.

Oh and while we are talking about straw men, current SM Naruto would beat Pein.
Proof?

What is this rubbish logic of yours? Even if in no way shape or form gives the possibility of nagato reacting to BM Naruto. Even if shows that EVEN IF I nagato had the feats to react to BM Naruto/KCM Naruto's flash shunshin (since he does not have those feats) it still does not follow that he absorbs the cloak as preta path's activates even slower than nagato's own mental reactions. .

Let me show you what you posted. Stop contradicting yourself

? Even if nagato could react to an attack, preta path is still not activated instantly.
First of all, you don’t know how the Preta path works. First you claimed it could react, now you’re saying even if it react, he wouldn’t be able to put up the Gakido (which is one way Gakido CAN work). You have no proof to back your claims, none at all
 
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lanakui8

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How could nagato not beat naruto. Nagato was beating him while he was fighting bee and itachi.
All BM narutos attacks are chakra based, they can be absorbed, it doesn't help naruto any because all nagatos attack are at full power since he is not using 6 different bodies. The only chance naruto has is his speed, which can be both intercepted and blocked.
repeating the same old knocked down arguments is basically concessionary.

Nagato was beating a KCM Naruto who had less than 7% his max chakra, couldn't make clones, was not friendly with kurama, had no knowledge on the chameleon and wasn't even trying to fight nagato.
If you want to talk about raw outcomes of a fight as evidence for a victor of a fight without taking any details into account, then edo itachi > edo prime nagato.

Naruto has no reason to use his big guns against nagato if nagato can absorb them.

And naruto's BM and even KCM flash shunshin would blitz nagato easily based on nagato's reaction feats against V2 Bee's lariat, Susanoo's chop, and Totsuka blade.

In addition to that, you have failed to even mention how nagato actually beats Naruto, all you've said is that he absorbs naruto's cloak (which is nigh impossible since naruto is tiers faster than nagato and has easy counters for all of his grabbing abilities). You have not said how nagato goes on the offensive and kills him.

BM Naruto and even KCM Naruto wins via flash shunshin blitz punch, flash shunshin throat slash with kunai, frog katas with SM, forcing Nagato to absorb sage clones, and even blitzing him with a rasengan variant as we've seen preta only activates after nagato reacts to the attack.
 

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Nagato doesn't have a chance in hell at reacting to Naruto's body flicker.

Bijudama arguably can't be absorbed.


Nagato vs Naruto with Bee and Itachi is hardly even an example of Nagato being able to beat Naruto.

Nor does Nagato have an awnser for frog song.
Naruto doesn't have a body flicker jutsu, naruto is fast, he is not instantaneous.
If it's made of chakra, it can probably be absorbed

I would say it is since naruto was actively involved in that fight and got caught by Nagato
Ma and pa have to be use that juts, and they can be distracted by nagatos many summons.
 
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HadouKage

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Nagato doesn't have a chance in hell at reacting to Naruto's body flicker.

Bijudama arguably can't be absorbed.


Nagato vs Naruto with Bee and Itachi is hardly even an example of Nagato being able to beat Naruto.

Nor does Nagato have an awnser for frog song.
1. Chibaku Tensei > Body Flicker
2. Don't know where you heard this nonsense
3. You're right because if it wasn't for Itachi, Naruto would be dead
4. Shinra Tensei, Basho Tenin, Chibaku Tensei, Animal Summons,, need I go on? :|
 
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1. Chibaku Tensei > Body Flicker
2. Don't know where you heard this nonsense
3. You're right because if it wasn't for Itachi, Naruto would be dead
4. Shinra Tensei, Basho Tenin, Chibaku Tensei, Animal Summons,, need I go on? :|
Chibaku tensei is nowhere near as fast as body flicker ._.

Dude, Everything you've posted is rubbish. Not even gonna bother.
 

HadouKage

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Chibaku tensei is nowhere near as fast as body flicker ._.

Dude, Everything you've posted is rubbish. Not even gonna bother.
Says the guy that said a ball of chakara made by an entity of chakara can't be absorbed but the Gakido :|
When did I deny that? When did I say Chibaku Tensei was faster than Naruto? Once Nagato activates CT, GG Naruto
 
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Says the guy that said Bijuu Dama can't be absorbed :|
When did I deny that? When did I say Chibaku Tensei was faster than Naruto? Once Nagato activates CT, GG Naruto
Lol, You dont even know the explanation as to why. And its true, it arguably cant.

Chibaku Tensei gets raped by Bijudama, Continous Bijudama, or Flash Bijudama.
 

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repeating the same old knocked down arguments is basically concessionary.

Nagato was beating a KCM Naruto who had less than 7% his max chakra, couldn't make clones, was not friendly with kurama, had no knowledge on the chameleon and wasn't even trying to fight nagato.
If you want to talk about raw outcomes of a fight as evidence for a victor of a fight without taking any details into account, then edo itachi > edo prime nagato.

Naruto has no reason to use his big guns against nagato if nagato can absorb them.

And naruto's BM and even KCM flash shunshin would blitz nagato easily based on nagato's reaction feats against V2 Bee's lariat, Susanoo's chop, and Totsuka blade.

In addition to that, you have failed to even mention how nagato actually beats Naruto, all you've said is that he absorbs naruto's cloak (which is nigh impossible since naruto is tiers faster than nagato and has easy counters for all of his grabbing abilities). You have not said how nagato goes on the offensive and kills him.

BM Naruto and even KCM Naruto wins via flash shunshin blitz punch, flash shunshin throat slash with kunai, frog katas with SM, forcing Nagato to absorb sage clones, and even blitzing him with a rasengan variant as we've seen preta only activates after nagato reacts to the attack.
You're making up numbers to try to support your argument, please stop.
Naruto was rushing in at his fastest to try and help be, in the process he got caught... it doesn't matter if he were trying to "Fight" nagato since he magically wouldn't be going any faster.
I dont care what itachi can do, his sword makes him literally one of the strongest characters in this manga cause it can seal anything.

But narutos big guns is basically his chakra cloak at the moment

Based on Nagatos reaction he could simply absorb the chakra upon contact. also with the blade thing, Nagato... i mean kabuto was not paying attention to itachi.
Nagato beats naruto by pulling naruto to him and then sucking out his soul. If nagato absorbs narutos cloak he wont have that speed anymore, also what easy counters for his grabbing move, he's been hit by everyone.
Why are you assuming Nagato cant react to narutos attacks?
 

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Says the guy that said a ball of chakara made by an entity of chakara can't be absorbed but the Gakido :|
When did I deny that? When did I say Chibaku Tensei was faster than Naruto? Once Nagato activates CT, GG Naruto
Bijuu Dama can easily destroy the core of CT before it gets too large.
 
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KCM Naruto has received ZERO damage from nagato's shinra tensei, banshou tennin can easily be resisted by chakra arms. And he has to consciously use these techniques and thus would not be able to use them against an attack that he can't even perceive/react to.


Once again, Nagato was barely able to react to V2 Bee's blitz which is why he was only able to activate preta path AFTER the attack made contact with him. BM naruto is tiers faster than V2 bee, nagato can't even react to naruto's speed, and thus preta path in no way absorbs naruto's chakra cloak when he blitzes nagato's head off. And naruto doesn't even have to make contact with nagato, he can slit his throat with a kunai instead.

Anyway bottom line is, by that feat, nagato in no way is reacting to naruto's blitz.




preta path is CONSCIOUSLY activated by nagato, he has to first react to an attack then use preta path. Preta path does not authomatically spawn when an attack makes contact with nagato despite nagato not reacting to said attack.



Oh really? So if I can show you a pure chakra attack that comes into contact with nagato and that is not only not absorbed by preta path, but damages nagato himself, will you concede this point?


if you have no counterarguments, then it is a concession on your part, and thus I accept your concession on all the points that the post you have not responded to have made.



really? So you promise that you will concede the argument if I show you a scan of a chakra attack damaging nagato after coming into contact with him?


Gakido is in no way an antiblitzing tool, it is a defensive jutsu that is activated after Nagato reacts to an attack, if the attack is fast enough to blitz him before he can either react or put up preta path, then he will sustain damage from that attack.

Flower tree world makes bltizing nigh impossible since naruto will fall asleep if he tries to move within flower tree world while in human form. Susanoo is anti-blitz because regardless of how much faster naruto is than his opponents, he still won't be able to hit them when they have a 360 degree shield that defends against ANY physical direct attack.


Nagato only putting up preta path after he gets hit with lariat means that he was only able to put preta path up until after he was hit, which means that any attack that is faster than bee's lariat will hit nagato and he won't be able to put up preta path against it. Preta path is NOT activated as a reaction to nagato getting hit, it's activated by nagato consciously using the technique.



All of those sensing feats are irrelevant as they have nothing to do with perceiving and reacting to extremely fast blitzing attacks. And Kabuto not knowing how to use nagato is irrelevant to Nagato's own displayed reactions. Nagato explicitly was unable to react to totsuka.


concession accepted as you are strawmanning my argument and feigning ignorance. Sasuke was absolutely NOT able to keep up with V2 ei even with his sharingan, he couldn't even track ei's shunshin, and nagato's rinnegan holds none of the sharingan's precognitive abilities.


um... because in an actual battle he will have knowledge on it, and have clones around, and not be in free fall not trying to attack nagato. The chameleon won't know which is the real naruto, and if naruto summons ma and pa, they casually deal with the chameleon. If it grabs a clone, the clone turns around and ends the chameleon with a rasengan variant.


brotherin, i don't even know what you bolded as your quotes got messed up.



That's completely and utterly irrelevant as you specifically were asserting and trying to back up the assertion that Deva path and ONLY deva path "wrecked" SM Naruto, and then used a scan of deva path beating BASE Naruto as evidence to support your assertion. That is explicit dishonesty on your part.
And with this post, you are blatantly attacking a strawman by bringing up how much stronger a full power Pain is than Pain arc Naruto is in order to try and dishonestly trick me into debating you about a completely different point.
I have no qualms about Pein arc Naruto being weaker than full power Pein, however I once again repeat that is absolutely NOT what you were trying to argue.

Oh and while we are talking about straw men, current SM Naruto would beat Pein.


What is this rubbish logic of yours? Even if in no way shape or form gives the possibility of nagato reacting to BM Naruto. Even if shows that EVEN IF I nagato had the feats to react to BM Naruto/KCM Naruto's flash shunshin (since he does not have those feats) it still does not follow that he absorbs the cloak as preta path's activates even slower than nagato's own mental reactions.


brotherin, you gotta debate with more integrity. Gakido is activated by nagato consciously activating the technique. You can't attack strawmen after your argument faces a defeat, the very fact you brought up deva beating BASE Naruto as evidence to say Deva wrecks SM Naruto is blatant dishonestly on your part.
If naruto is not faster than nagatos reaction speed then Nagato won't get blitzed. Manga and anime proved that and his sensor abilities is another feat that supports this argument even more. Nagato was capable of stopping naruto in mid air with universal pull , immobilizing with no effort at all.
Totsuka didn't blitzed nagato , nagato sensed it but he couldn't dodge it because he was crippled. Kabuto who was in control confirmed that statement.
Also Nagato "barely" being able to react to v2 lariant is just your assumption. You have no proof for that. Was he KO-ed ? no , was he damaged? no .
You're example of anti blitzing tools fail miserably.They don't activate automatically so they are not anty-blitzing tools. If lest say naruto can blitz Hashirama or Madara then he will be able to decapitate them before they even think of using flower world tree or susanoo. Saying that it counts if they already have those abilities activated is the same as saying Nagato having universal pull activated before the fight starts. The same thing is applied to every blitzing conflict in anime history. If character A is faster than characte B's mental reaction speed he wins automatically unless the other one has: self defense system that is faster than the opponents speed/immortality/ambiguity-related abilities.
So if you don't have any proof (manga scans/anime ) that Naruto is faster than Nagato's reaction speed then Naruto is not capable of speed blitzing Nagato.
 

lanakui8

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In case you haven’t noticed, Shinra Tensei and Basho Tenin can be used at different scales and magnitudes.
so what? If nagato's super huge one does ZERO damage to even KCM Naruto then he isn't getting much damage from the bigger ones, and the burden of proof is on you to show otherwise.

And when have we seen Nagato in his prime? You have absolutely no proof to back up this statement. Kabuto controlling Nagato without knowing about his abilities does not make Nagato prime
Kabuto controlling nagato has no relevance about the strength of nagato's attacks, nagato's speed and his reactions. Prime Nagato is the most powerful version of nagato we know of and that is after he absorbed bee's lariat. If you want to assert nagato was stronger than that, the burden of proof is on you to do so.

You have proof?
For the last time, yes I have proof, and I am only going to show it to you if you will concede if I do so.
Again, do you have proof?


Yes I will, please show me
okay here it is.

Proof that nagato has to consciously activate preta path rather than it being activated as soon as an attack comes into contact with his body:

if it worked like how you said it would, nagato would have absorbed the susanoo arm when it made contact with him rather than it cutting right through him. In addition to that, we see nagato didn't even react to that attack as the "!" appears above his head after his arm gets cut off.

And here's more proof that preta path activates . The rasengan didn't touch him yet gets absorbed by the absorption sphere.


If that isn't enough evidence for you then I don't know what is.

I’m doing nothing of the sort, re-read the manga if you want to see what happened
telling me to reread the manga and not addressing the points of my argument, once again, is not an argument and thus it's a concession on those points since they have gone untouched. If you feel you are correct then SHOW it, don't just post 'reread the manga', as that is just as good as ignoring an argument.

Stop twisting my words, I said show me proof where the Gakido could not absorb chakara
Concession accepted, as that in no way is twisting your words around. You said gakido activates as soon as nagato gets hit by an attack, thus it would be impossible for nagato to be damaged by an attack if gakido activates as soon as he gets hit by it.


Facepalm. If everyone has chakara, how is it not an anti blitzing tool? As you can see Bee’s V@ blitz failed after Nagato sucked his chakara
Concession accepted, as I have explicitly explained why it would not be antiblitzing tool despite its ability to absorb chakra. Debate honestly don't strawman my arguments.

And V2 bee almost blitzed nagato, anything faster would have done so as we nagato was only able to activate preta path after getting hit by the attack.


Again, you are doing nothing but supporting my claim
concession accepted as I have explained exactly WHY my argument does not support your claim, yet you simply post an assertion backed by nothing as a response. Your assertion that I am doing nothing but supporting your claim is baseless if you do not back up your assertion with the reason WHY it supports your claim.


WHAT? Seriously bro, are you a troll? If his sensing ability was irrelavent then how was he able to sense Amateratsu? Kabuto not knowing how to use Nagato is not irrelevant.
his sensing abilities are irrelevant to reacting to any attacks faster than a V2 lariat since we have already seen that he could only put preta path up after he is hit by that attack

Nagato did not display his own reactions. You have no proof (yet again to back your claims)
Mental reaction, speed, durability, and power of jutsu have nothing to do with Kabuto controlling the edos, the only thing that kabuto controls is the decisions nagato makes using those mental reactions, speed, durability, and jutsu.

And it is YOU who has the burden of proof that says nagato's reactions that he displayed as an edo would be less or more than him alive.



Rinnegan has shared vision which in some cases are > than Sharigans (however that’s subjective). And that’s how Sasuke was able to keep up with most ninja’s attacks. Seriously, do you read the manga?
Brotherin STOP ATTACKING STRAW MEN!!! You made the assertion that Sasuke was able to keep up with Ei using his sharingan, now you are switching from keeping up with ei to "able to keep up with most ninja's attacks". That's a completely different point from what I am arguing. I don't care if he can keep up with most ninja's attacks, if he can't even see Ei when he moves with the sharingan, then its even worse when he's going up against KCM and BM Naruto.





You exclaimed Naruto was at 7% of his chakara, You got proof along with your other illogical fallicies?
If you think I have "illogical fallacies" (correct term is 'logical fallacies') then you have to back up that claim with evidence. What logical fallacies am I guilty of and why am I guilty of them? unless you answer those two questions then your claims are meaningless.

And explicit proof that Naruto had less than 7% of his KCM chakra:
- just holding the KCM cloak drains naruto's KCM reserves, and after holding it for just a chapter the drain is significant enough for kurama to tell naruto
- from that point on, KCM Naruto spams his chakra cloak for 12 hour straight, plays tag with ei and defeats the white zetsu army, then
- then he spends more time holding the KCM cloak and then arrives to fight edo itachi and nagato.

so if he starts at 100% at night, held that for 12 hours and divided his remaining chakra by 13+, you arrive at less than 7% chakra.

So if I show you proof of you trying to not only back up the claim that Deva path 'wrecked' SM NAruto using a scan of deva path beating base naruto, and then show you proof of you attacking a strawman by changing the subject to how the 6 paths of pein are stronger than pain arc SM Naruto. Will you not only concede this argument, but also leave Narutobase forever?

Let me show you what you posted. Stop contradicting yourself


First of all, you don’t know how the Preta path works. First you claimed it could react, now you’re saying even if it react, he wouldn’t be able to put up the Gakido (which is one way Gakido CAN work). You have no proof to back your claims, none at all
wow, you either went full retard or you have just been completely ignoring my posts up till now.

I claimed that in order to use preta path on something, Nagato himself has to first MENTALLY REACT to the attack and then activate preta path. Since preta path is not activated instantly after nagato mentally reacts to an attack, then it follows that even if nagato could mentally react to an attack, it does not mean that he will be able to activate preta in time to absorb the attack.

And the bolded is just hillarious. What evidence have you brought to the debate in order to back up your claims? ZERO!! You've basically ignored my claims, strawmanned my arguments, tries to force me to prove negatives, and yet CONSISTENTLY supported your claims with absolutely nothing.

Debate honestly boy, so far you have conceded most of the argument purely because you simply ignore my points.
 

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so what? If nagato's super huge one does ZERO damage to even KCM Naruto then he isn't getting much damage from the bigger ones, and the burden of proof is on you to show otherwise.


Kabuto controlling nagato has no relevance about the strength of nagato's attacks, nagato's speed and his reactions. Prime Nagato is the most powerful version of nagato we know of and that is after he absorbed bee's lariat. If you want to assert nagato was stronger than that, the burden of proof is on you to do so.


For the last time, yes I have proof, and I am only going to show it to you if you will concede if I do so.

okay here it is.

Proof that nagato has to consciously activate preta path rather than it being activated as soon as an attack comes into contact with his body:

if it worked like how you said it would, nagato would have absorbed the susanoo arm when it made contact with him rather than it cutting right through him. In addition to that, we see nagato didn't even react to that attack as the "!" appears above his head after his arm gets cut off.

And here's more proof that preta path activates . The rasengan didn't touch him yet gets absorbed by the absorption sphere.


If that isn't enough evidence for you then I don't know what is.


telling me to reread the manga and not addressing the points of my argument, once again, is not an argument and thus it's a concession on those points since they have gone untouched. If you feel you are correct then SHOW it, don't just post 'reread the manga', as that is just as good as ignoring an argument.


Concession accepted, as that in no way is twisting your words around. You said gakido activates as soon as nagato gets hit by an attack, thus it would be impossible for nagato to be damaged by an attack if gakido activates as soon as he gets hit by it.



Concession accepted, as I have explicitly explained why it would not be antiblitzing tool despite its ability to absorb chakra. Debate honestly don't strawman my arguments.

And V2 bee almost blitzed nagato, anything faster would have done so as we nagato was only able to activate preta path after getting hit by the attack.



concession accepted as I have explained exactly WHY my argument does not support your claim, yet you simply post an assertion backed by nothing as a response. Your assertion that I am doing nothing but supporting your claim is baseless if you do not back up your assertion with the reason WHY it supports your claim.



his sensing abilities are irrelevant to reacting to any attacks faster than a V2 lariat since we have already seen that he could only put preta path up after he is hit by that attack


Mental reaction, speed, durability, and power of jutsu have nothing to do with Kabuto controlling the edos, the only thing that kabuto controls is the decisions nagato makes using those mental reactions, speed, durability, and jutsu.

And it is YOU who has the burden of proof that says nagato's reactions that he displayed as an edo would be less or more than him alive.




Brotherin STOP ATTACKING STRAW MEN!!! You made the assertion that Sasuke was able to keep up with Ei using his sharingan, now you are switching from keeping up with ei to "able to keep up with most ninja's attacks". That's a completely different point from what I am arguing. I don't care if he can keep up with most ninja's attacks, if he can't even see Ei when he moves with the sharingan, then its even worse when he's going up against KCM and BM Naruto.






If you think I have "illogical fallacies" (correct term is 'logical fallacies') then you have to back up that claim with evidence. What logical fallacies am I guilty of and why am I guilty of them? unless you answer those two questions then your claims are meaningless.

And explicit proof that Naruto had less than 7% of his KCM chakra:
- just holding the KCM cloak drains naruto's KCM reserves, and after holding it for just a chapter the drain is significant enough for kurama to tell naruto
- from that point on, KCM Naruto spams his chakra cloak for 12 hour straight, plays tag with ei and defeats the white zetsu army, then
- then he spends more time holding the KCM cloak and then arrives to fight edo itachi and nagato.

so if he starts at 100% at night, held that for 12 hours and divided his remaining chakra by 13+, you arrive at less than 7% chakra.


So if I show you proof of you trying to not only back up the claim that Deva path 'wrecked' SM NAruto using a scan of deva path beating base naruto, and then show you proof of you attacking a strawman by changing the subject to how the 6 paths of pein are stronger than pain arc SM Naruto. Will you not only concede this argument, but also leave Narutobase forever?


wow, you either went full retard or you have just been completely ignoring my posts up till now.

I claimed that in order to use preta path on something, Nagato himself has to first MENTALLY REACT to the attack and then activate preta path. Since preta path is not activated instantly after nagato mentally reacts to an attack, then it follows that even if nagato could mentally react to an attack, it does not mean that he will be able to activate preta in time to absorb the attack.

And the bolded is just hillarious. What evidence have you brought to the debate in order to back up your claims? ZERO!! You've basically ignored my claims, strawmanned my arguments, tries to force me to prove negatives, and yet CONSISTENTLY supported your claims with absolutely nothing.

Debate honestly boy, so far you have conceded most of the argument purely because you simply ignore my points.
So lets go one by one bro

Chou Shinra Tensei does zero damage yet it broke everyone of Gamabunta's bones? Response?
 

lanakui8

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You're making up numbers to try to support your argument, please stop.
I have no reason to stop if you give no reason why the numbers are wrong.

Naruto was rushing in at his fastest to try and help be, in the process he got caught... it doesn't matter if he were trying to "Fight" nagato since he magically wouldn't be going any faster.
absolutely positively false, debate freeking honestly, naruto was in completely free fall when that happend, when naruto rushes in at his fastest no one can perceive his movement.

I dont care what itachi can do, his sword makes him literally one of the strongest characters in this manga cause it can seal anything.
concession accepted as you have completely ignored the argument that if you want to evaluate a character by the mere outcomes of a fight and leave out the details, then it follows that edo itachi > edo nagato.

But narutos big guns is basically his chakra cloak at the moment
that's completely and utterly irrelevant if he has ways to beat nagato WITHOUT THOSE BIG GUNS.

Based on Nagatos reaction he could simply absorb the chakra upon contact. also with the blade thing, Nagato... i mean kabuto was not paying attention to itachi.
absolutely positively false, Kabuto not paying attention is completely baseless and also irrelevant as he only gives orders to nagato while edo nagato's raw mental reactions, speed, stamina, strength remain the same unless you can prove otherwise.

Nagato beats naruto by pulling naruto to him and then sucking out his soul.
naruto resists the pull with a chakra arm, and once it's over bamflashes nagato's face into a bloody pulp or slashes his throat with a kunai.

If nagato absorbs narutos cloak he wont have that speed anymore, also what easy counters for his grabbing move, he's been hit by everyone.
I've listed all of his easy counters for his grabbing moves, chakra arms for banshou tennin and kills the chameleon. NAgato won't absorb naruto's cloak because he's never getting near naruto with naruto's speed.

Why are you assuming Nagato cant react to narutos attacks?
I'm not assuming anything. I've given you THREE reaction feats by nagato himself that show that he can't react to a flash shunshin, and I've repeated them over and over and over again. They are:
- only able to put up preta path after bee's lariat hits him
- not being able to react to susanoo chop
- not being able to react to totsuka blitz

The next time you say that I'm assuming he can't react, it is a concession on your part as you are blatantly ignoring my points.

In addition to that YOU have the burden of proof to show that nagato CAN react to naruto's flash shunshin, as no one has been able to do so as of yet, and people who have better reaction feats than nagato (MS SAsuke) can't even see V2 Ei's shunshin who is far slower than KCM Naruto or BM Naruto.
 

lanakui8

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So lets go one by one bro

Chou Shinra Tensei does zero damage yet it broke everyone of Gamabunta's bones? Response?
shiinra tensei is gravity manipulation, it affects bigger targets worse than smaller ones.

Tsunade survived CST without even healing from the technique and pouring all her chakra into katsuya.
 

HadouKage

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I have no reason to stop if you give no reason why the numbers are wrong.


absolutely positively false, debate freeking honestly, naruto was in completely free fall when that happend, when naruto rushes in at his fastest no one can perceive his movement.


concession accepted as you have completely ignored the argument that if you want to evaluate a character by the mere outcomes of a fight and leave out the details, then it follows that edo itachi > edo nagato.


that's completely and utterly irrelevant if he has ways to beat nagato WITHOUT THOSE BIG GUNS.


absolutely positively false, Kabuto not paying attention is completely baseless and also irrelevant as he only gives orders to nagato while edo nagato's raw mental reactions, speed, stamina, strength remain the same unless you can prove otherwise.


naruto resists the pull with a chakra arm, and once it's over bamflashes nagato's face into a bloody pulp or slashes his throat with a kunai.


I've listed all of his easy counters for his grabbing moves, chakra arms for banshou tennin and kills the chameleon. NAgato won't absorb naruto's cloak because he's never getting near naruto with naruto's speed.


I'm not assuming anything. I've given you THREE reaction feats by nagato himself that show that he can't react to a flash shunshin, and I've repeated them over and over and over again. They are:
- only able to put up preta path after bee's lariat hits him
- not being able to react to susanoo chop
- not being able to react to totsuka blitz

The next time you say that I'm assuming he can't react, it is a concession on your part as you are blatantly ignoring my points.

In addition to that YOU have the burden of proof to show that nagato CAN react to naruto's flash shunshin, as no one has been able to do so as of yet, and people who have better reaction feats than nagato (MS SAsuke) can't even see V2 Ei's shunshin who is far slower than KCM Naruto or BM Naruto.
You say debate honestly and you're making up numbers.
 
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